Umm Hi! This is my signature. If you don't like it I love you! Welp thanks for taking the time to read this!
As an aside instead of having treasure bags drop from kills have the item go immediately into the collectable bag if we have one. I hate having to stop to pick one up. I especially hate it on my monk to pick one up as it ends my chain.
Right now I have to decide is it worth it to break my chain to pick up that bag. Well ok I'll do it.
#!@$!@#$ I just picked up another string of prayer beads.
I just wanted to mention a couple of things. I have been running some new characters on new servers, with no plat, no twinking (bags etc). I think tis new system is really new player and new character to server 'unfriendly.'
*First off, collectables take up WAY too much space, the small bag you get (which holds twelve different collectables) cannot even hold everything you get in Harbor and Marketplace quests.
*Secondly, with the increase in number for conversion, I have been unable to turn in almost anything at all. I just do not get enough of any one the collectables to do so, except for two of the most common ones (prayer beads and muchrooms) - and even so the conversion rate now means I get far fewer rewards in return.
Because of #1, I just have given up on #2 - whereas before, I could at least get some useful items for *low* cost, now, I just am like "Why?" - if I feel that way, I can only imagine how a new player to the game must feel. In addition, filling your backpack and bank space with collectables feels tedious and not fun. If the idea is to provide a "quick" "extra" reward for players, especially new ones, the system has completely forsaken them.
Which begs the question - why would vets use this especially at low levels? Especially given the random nature of the reward. Generally, I would imagine most vets twink and don't need or use collectables anyway with rare exception. As for the valuable collectables (e.g., pure water, lightning splits), vets will hoard them anyway and not use this system because the collectable worth something or more valuable in other settings. When new players who might use the system gain enough xp in the game to understand its mechanics, I can only imagine their disappointment after trading a valuable set of collectables only to learn they needed it for something better later.
Overall, I like the idea and new interface, but I think the ratios need to go back to 1, 2, 3 - it was fair before OR you need to give a multiplier to collectables you find so you find them 10-20 at a time.
Here is what I was aiming for by constructive:
Current collector rewards, listed by collector (incomplete for times sake)Code:Harbor: ~Wash Pynoptis ~~Lvl 1 scroll - 3 Aber vials ~~Lvl 1 wand - 2 Vials of pure water ~~Random Robe with ~100 plat value (light fort, lesser false life, etc) - 1 Vial of contagion
Suggestions:Code:Harbor: ~Wash Pynoptis ~~Potion of Jump - 30 Amber vials ~~Minor petrify Runestone - 30 Amber vials ~~Augment - Sapphire - 30 Amber vials + 10 Vials of pure water + 5 vials of contagion ~~Sapphire of Natural armor +1 - 4 astral shards ~~Sapphire of protection +1 - 4 astral shards ~~Sapphire of resistance +1 - 4 astral shards ~~Sapphire of resistance +2 - 4 astral shards ~~Sapphire of false life +5 - 4 astral shards ~~Sapphire of ligh fortification - 4 astral shards
The either or for shards could be a second page essentially. Page 1 being collectables, page 2 being AS.Code:Harbor: ~Wash Pynoptis ~~Lvl 1 scroll - 1 astral shard ~~Lvl 1 scroll - 3 Amber vials ~~Lvl 1 wand - 1 astral shard ~~Lvl 1 wand - 2 Vials of pure water ~~Random Robe with ~100 plat value (light fort, lesser false life, etc) - 2 astral shards ~~Random Robe with ~100 plat value (light fort, lesser false life, etc) - 1 Vial of contagion ~~Random Robe with ~100 plat value (light fort, lesser false life, etc) - 4 Vials of water ~~Random Robe with ~100 plat value (light fort, lesser false life, etc) - 9 Amber vials ~~Potion of Jump (lvl 1 w/+20 jump) - 2 astral shards ~~Potion of Jump (lvl 1 w/+20 jump) - 9 Amber vials ~~Minor petrify Runestone - 2 astral shards ~~Minor petrify Runestone - 6 Vials of pure water ~~Augment - Sapphire - 2 astral shards ~~Augment - Sapphire - 3 vials of contagion ~~Sapphire of Natural armor +1 - 6 astral shards ~~Sapphire of Natural armor +1 - 9 vials of contagion ~~Sapphire of protection +1 - 6 astral shards ~~Sapphire of protection +1 - 9 vials of contagion ~~Sapphire of resistance +1 - 6 astral shards ~~Sapphire of resistance +1 - 9 vials of contagion ~~Sapphire of resistance +2 - 6 astral shards ~~Sapphire of resistance +2 - 9 vials of contagion ~~Sapphire of false life +5 - 6 astral shards ~~Sapphire of false life +5 - 9 vials of contagion ~~Sapphire of ligh fortification - 6 astral shards ~~Sapphire of ligh fortification - 9 vials of contagion
I know the idea is to get some raw data on the worth of these items. I totally understand the need for this. However, I think everyone in the community understands the worth of the items and will gladly and most willingfully share their opinions on the value on the forums or in game through turn ins or not turning in.
What most people are failing to see is the collectables changed in two ways. One they became a barter system. And the second is they changed the rewards. The cost is a third, but I consider it too minor to mention as a factor for the amounts. The new reward system where you pick the reward is part of the increased cost, and the rewards are significantly different and somewhat unique.
I think hoever, the rarity of said collectables is more in line with what I put down for that first collector. I could include more items, however, the collectors generally offer minor rewards; while the main utilization of collectables is for crafting. The whole thing is a loot tradeoff for players who don't want to craft. As such, I think keeping the random loot generation would be a solid feature/sell/draw of the collector.
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I like having the option of trading in collectibles for augments. Don't mind the randomness even, but the cost seems a little steep. Half the current cost might be reasonable, maybe even a third of the cost.
Using two characters stockpiled collectibles I traded in using random chance for a fear immunity, blindness immunity, and heavy fortification. While I received 2 fear immunity augments, getting 3 augments I wanted from random trade ins tore through *years* worth of collectables. Now I don't religiously grab every collectible pile I see, however one of those characters was created at the games original launch while the other is a few years old, over the course of that time both have clicked on enough nodes/treasure bags to have well stocked collectible bags. Neither of characters has enough of the rare collectibles for L8 topaz or sapphire augments, being able to blow through years of perhaps slow but steady growth in less than 5 minutes seems just a bit over the top to me.
You could argue I got a bunch of other augments in the process. Things is these L8 augments really aren't that useful. The things the offer are usually pretty easy to slot at lower levels (except perhaps the PRR) and honestly most of it doesn't even need to bothered with for anyone who's been playing the game for a while. I ended up with resist gems for the most part, which is a special kind of useless for anyone in a guild with a decent level.
Now I personally didn't really mind any of this, cause well, had this option not come along I probably wasn't going to do anything with those collectibles anyhow. Having done it though, seems to me the price for a random reward could be toned down some or perhaps tick up the price a bit but allow the augment selectable. Either would seem a bit more reasonable too me, yet still make the astral shard option a far more convenient choice.
The new Collectible system sucks.
Overpriced cost value turn-in.. yeah Cordovan said it was a technical issue.. but dont think anyone belives that.
Random augments... bah...why bother.
Remove the shard fragment cost from everything, it is a collectible turn-in.
Collectibles for Augments I can see....
Why have augments for Astral Shards from collectible vendors
Astral shards are just another form of DDO store currency.
we get astral shards by buying them from the DDO store and we can buy these same augments from the DDO store.
Centralize Astral Shard augment vendors and keep them separate from collectibles.
I could work with higher augment cost for the alchemical potions if they had a 10x duration.
Modorate Cure potions turn-ins is ****.. even on the old system.. revise this..make them 25 CMW potions based on the old turn-in.
BTW.. Where is the PaleMaster Collectible turn-in now?
Last edited by JOTMON; 03-21-2013 at 10:13 AM.
Jotmon - Let's not forget why we play these games - to have fun - ~
Guild: Degenerate Matter - 200 (Former Guilds: ChaosKnights, Big Damn Heroes, Shadowfiends, Order of the Drow, Unusual Suspects, Raided R)
Argo-Jotmon(Completionist - before the Otto's/XP pots easymode), Jotmonheals(Clr17/Rog2/Mnk1-Epic Completionist), Whatthetruck.. and many many more alts..
Update 24: Champions... "whew, it's ok, it's only a red name" .. sad day when trash spawn Champions and their one-shot ignore fort attacks instill more party fear than the Red named bosses.
I'd like to add a couple more thoughts, then it's time to let this go and move on to other issues.
First, I agree with Hafeal that the new collectables system is unfriendly to new players. It's yet another meta-game to learn how to manage, while learning the core game. I recall my characters' inventory slots quickly filling up with collectables, when I was still quite new, even when trade in values were far less onerous. This led to frequent trips to collectors (dispersed all over the place) because I didn't know what would best be thrown away and what shouldn't be thrown away. To be clear, I always had the free collectables bag, and so its absence wasn't the reason for spending a big chunk of "play" time doing what amounts to Fed Ex deliveries to NPCs.
I can't see how the recent changes to collectables will improve matters for newer players.
On that note, rather than requiring that players wander all over to make deliveries to different collectors, consider putting a "general collector" in each zone, a NPC who will take all collectables and who will dole out the appropriate rewards. It adds nothing to the game to have players play "spot the collector" on the mini-map, before visiting them, and then planning out a route to make the journey more time efficient. If I enjoyed that kind of thing, then I would have become a Fed Ex driver in real life. I don't, though, and wandering around from collector to collector isn't fun.
Second, and on a similar theme, there's a longer run trend toward increasing the number and complexity of meta-games that distract from engaging in the core game. That pattern is most appealing to vets, as they only need to learn a little more when something is added or made more complex and they might appreciate the novelty. For newer players, you just make the already very steep learning curve associated with the game look more and more like trying to climb the white cliffs of Dover in subzero temperatures, while buck naked, using only one's bare hands to make the climb.
Last edited by EnjoyTheJourney; 03-21-2013 at 09:33 AM.
Although Prayer Beads would arguably be more valuable due to Cannith Crafting recipes so...
I am often cynical and say mean things. It's a WAI "Feature".
A small increase in cost could have been appropriate. The great leap forward in prices was not appropriate. The rewards aren't unique and they aren't worth the effort of walking up to the turn-in vendors, much less the effort involved in actually picking up collectables.
To me the cost is soo high because of the changes to the system, which I outlined. It is a standard change to incite a response.
I stopped collecting collectables for the most part over a year ago because they aren't worth turning in, and their cost for crafting gear is low enough, that I will have enough to craft with when I go to level crafting and actually make gear. So I do not have nearly as many as is needed for some of these turn ins. If I nabbed every collectable, every time they dropped, I would have a few thousand of the commons, almost a thousand uncommons, and maybe a few hundred rares.
There are a lot of people who do vaccuum every drop. So I can see turns ins at the current exchange being out there. But the thousands of commons, a thousand uncommons, and hundreds of rares is not the true players median amount.
I think the current rewards list is ok, but not worth going for still. Even if the cos was what I suggested or lower.
I think the shard cost is irrelevant. I can see the ploy of making a cash to game content market. Makes fiscal sense in a free to play game world. I have a professional opinion that differs from this strategy, but I can see the reasons behind it. Not my call to make.
Someone seems to have missed the difference in availability between node only collectables and those that also drop from mobs.
The Barter Box for Collectables is the greatest part of the change.
The high cost for collectables is the worse.
Like many, I think the cost for the 'normal' collectables needs to be reduced for it to even be used at all.
Far as Augments, a set price for a random is ok by me. However, many do not want to take a chance at a random Augment. Leave the set price for random in but offer, in addition, a higher price turn in for a far less random choice. Thinking for the less random, have it set into 'classes'. Example, random Spell Power of 90. This way the player can pay a higher price but for a smaller random choice at what they are after.
Hard part might be putting augments into appropriate classes as it were to make sense. Combat, Defense, Casting, and Misc?
Hope that is clear.
But, my frustration is in the fact that:
- This topic was discussed and nerdraged on in the Lammania forums without much reassurance from Turbine about the future of the mechanic. The only thing we, the community, received was a generic "we told some people".
- These "Official Discussions" seem to get some Turbine attention for a month, maybe two, then they don't get any updates, resolution, or closure which often gives the community the perception that the "discussion" is either ignored or not a discussion anymore. Especially when the things that were discussed, or even the topic itself, is not implemented (i.e. Enhancement revamp, Difficulty, Renown Changes, etc.) and just left hanging.
Speaking of communication and resolution, FoS has said that Collectible Turn-In prices are being "corrected" for Update 18.
As a person who collects everything, I really do not like this change. I too, have been playing for almost 3 years. Most of the turn in's there is no way for me to ever gets to turn in much of anything. So now what is the point of turn in's?
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