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  1. #1
    Community Member DarkSable's Avatar
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    Default Help out a new guild leader with a lot to live up to?

    Heya Argo!

    This is DarkSable - a hardcore player by heart who's a casual player by restriction.
    Sadly, I'm also the only character left in my guild who remembers what it used to be. The Elite Guard of Eberron, when I joined, was purging the trolls (they all went to Mangar) and attempting to make something of itself. We were succeeding for a while, and then I was forced to take a short break due to school.

    When I came back, the guild was empty. During the interim, there had been apparently been some drama amongst the higher-ups, and many of them left. After that, the guild was on the edge of disbandment - we went through twelve guild leaders in as many months, and the task eventually fell upon me, mostly because I was the only one left who was there from before the trouble.

    Another half year passes, and I step down as guild leader due to starting college. I'm halfway through my second semester now, and the guild is level 54. We have all of four members: Glibb, who is the current leader, and an amazing guy (who sadly has a sporadic schedule), myself, and the other two members of my static group.

    We do just fine as a 3-man group, but recently when I think about what EGoE was when I first joined, I get a little sad - we were a damn fine end-game guild, even if we had more notoriety than fame.

    So I've been stuck with this niggily little thought in my head: I'm going to bring us back to where we were.

    Unfortunately, that's a good sight harder than I imagined, mostly because I don't have any contacts within the game. (Aside, of course, from the ever-amazing Aethoria, who taught me how to play a healer well, and Percius, who taught my friend how to play a DPS without standing in every trap he sees.)

    So here's my request: help me out a little. If you see Llyden, Darksable, or Aragorrn, let us run with you. We're all decent, mature players, and we're willing to follow orders. (I've trained Aragorrn to jump at the sound of a leaders' voice, as all good DPS should.) Once you've done a few runs with us, and are secure in the fact that we aren't going to cause chaos, anything you can do to help us out would be wonderful. Invite us on raids if you have an open slot, or invite us to the channels that are used at end-game. Because I mostly run with my static group, and am in a guild of four whole players, I don't have the contacts I need to find us raids on a decent basis.

    Finally... any advice you could give me here on how to be a decent leader of a guild, or how to gain contacts in-game, would be very, very appreciated.

    Thanks!

  2. #2
    Community Member scoobmx's Avatar
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    Just wondering what your definition of endgame is?

    It's difficult to join endgame channels unless your name is well known, which means you have to know the right people and get them to have a positive impression of you, or join one of the major endgame guilds. Since you want to hold onto your own guild, you are in the former situation so you need to start building a network of contacts. Some people don't have good sense and go down the wrong network of contacts, which can be hard to work out of. As your network gets wider channels open up to you, but I wouldn't want to get pushy, some people hate that. In the end what really matters is player skill and personality, as far as all endgame channels go. If you reach a point where channel content gets uncomfortably hard then you know you have to spend some time working on that before continuing on.

    It isn't easy, for sure. In that respect Argo endgame is kind of like a microcosm of a corporation, team, club, etc. Keep an open mind and remember that people are not out to get a power trip out of keeping the gates shut. They mostly just want to get things done quickly and efficiently.
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  3. #3
    Community Member Shmuel's Avatar
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    Shoot me a tell in game if you see one of the toons in mu sig on. I might have 1 or 2 useful suggestions but no time to type them now I have to go to work.
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  4. #4
    Community Member DarkSable's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scoobmx View Post
    Just wondering what your definition of endgame is?
    Epic elites and regular raids.

    Quote Originally Posted by scoobmx View Post
    It's difficult to join endgame channels unless your name is well known, which means you have to know the right people and get them to have a positive impression of you, or join one of the major endgame guilds. Since you want to hold onto your own guild, you are in the former situation so you need to start building a network of contacts. Some people don't have good sense and go down the wrong network of contacts, which can be hard to work out of. As your network gets wider channels open up to you, but I wouldn't want to get pushy, some people hate that. In the end what really matters is player skill and personality, as far as all endgame channels go. If you reach a point where channel content gets uncomfortably hard then you know you have to spend some time working on that before continuing on.
    That's exactly the trouble I'm having - my team is mature, friendly, and good, but since we don't get the chance to run with many other people, breaking the ice to get to the ocean below is difficult. Don't get me wrong - I'm not trying to beg my way into a channel, and in fact, wouldn't just flat out ask - I'm just asking for a contact to go to, to ask if we can run with, so we can start proving ourselves to the end-game community.


    Quote Originally Posted by Shmuel View Post
    Shoot me a tell in game if you see one of the toons in mu sig on. I might have 1 or 2 useful suggestions but no time to type them now I have to go to work.
    I will, thank you.

  5. #5
    Community Member scoobmx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DarkSable View Post
    That's exactly the trouble I'm having - my team is mature, friendly, and good, but since we don't get the chance to run with many other people, breaking the ice to get to the ocean below is difficult. Don't get me wrong - I'm not trying to beg my way into a channel, and in fact, wouldn't just flat out ask - I'm just asking for a contact to go to, to ask if we can run with, so we can start proving ourselves to the end-game community.
    Look for groups posted by people from guilds like ChaosKnights, Imperial Assassins, Trolls Lair, Firefly, Ascent, Bloods Assassins, AoK, Synergia, Truth Seekers for Epic Elites. Groups are usually posted if it can't fill from guild or channels. There is a bit of an odd thing about Argo here which is that this can be difficult at peak times. There are tons and tons of people doing this stuff on Argo and it gets hard to actually have any free spots in runs. You mostly see people in guilds and channels stepping over each other to get into Epic Elite runs and whoever has the fastest trigger finger gets the spot (first come first serve).

    There might not be a whole lot in the way of 'regular raids' from some of these guilds.

    Also do talk to this Shmuel guy - I heard he's a good guy.
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  6. #6

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    Send a tell to Souless, leader of Ascent. The guild does EEs and raids regularly, and at least as far as raids go there are usually some open slots available.
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  7. #7
    Community Member DarkSable's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scoobmx View Post
    Look for groups posted by people from guilds like ChaosKnights, Imperial Assassins, Trolls Lair, Firefly, Ascent, Bloods Assassins, AoK, Synergia, Truth Seekers for Epic Elites. Groups are usually posted if it can't fill from guild or channels. There is a bit of an odd thing about Argo here which is that this can be difficult at peak times. There are tons and tons of people doing this stuff on Argo and it gets hard to actually have any free spots in runs. You mostly see people in guilds and channels stepping over each other to get into Epic Elite runs and whoever has the fastest trigger finger gets the spot (first come first serve).

    There might not be a whole lot in the way of 'regular raids' from some of these guilds.

    Also do talk to this Shmuel guy - I heard he's a good guy.
    Just curious, why do you say there might not be a lot in the way of raiding from them? And thank you for the insight as to how it all works - that explains a lot about why I haven't made many contacts in the few years I've been playing.


    Quote Originally Posted by Stanley_Nicholas View Post
    Send a tell to Souless, leader of Ascent. The guild does EEs and raids regularly, and at least as far as raids go there are usually some open slots available.
    I will, thank you for the tip.

  8. #8
    Community Member scoobmx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DarkSable View Post
    Just curious, why do you say there might not be a lot in the way of raiding from them? And thank you for the insight as to how it all works - that explains a lot about why I haven't made many contacts in the few years I've been playing.
    I mean 'regular' raids. There is usually a lot more of the difficult-to-pug raids. 'Regular' raids are usually just done on our own finding pug groups.
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  9. #9
    Community Member me_TOO's Avatar
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    Honestly, with 3 players, you can reasonably handle EE taking pugs. Be selective when you form them, even shortman them and your name will get out. When doing this make sure you are running quests you know you can handle, and know inside and out, so that when people run with you it goes smooth with out them having to break a sweat.

    Know your role... Speak up if you can kite the truthful one, or can do the swim in EE crucible and then dont screw it up lol

    Dont be be the loud guy, or the gear linking guy, or the build disector or the my other toon has/does... guy. The player who talks a little (not a mute or a blabbermouth), cracks the the odd oneliner at something funny that happens, is self depricating when appropriate and funny all the while handling their toon or their role effectively is remembered.

    Chug pots when you have to without complaint, and I dont mean drink 25 on EN Tor, do it when appropriate, dont be cheap and run out of mana because you hesitated drinking a couple pots when things get tight. End game guilds have tons of pots and people dont think twice about drinking a couple to make things go smooth. Treat it as an investment, even if you have save up as a guild to buy a stack off the AH. As you run more and more content the pots will replenish themselves and most end game guilds will notice if something got tricky and you chugged pots and will at worst usually acknowledge what you did and at best send a few your way.

    Only run your "A" toon in these situations, save the 425hp rogue for static group runs where noone cares if you die 50 times, encourage your guildies to do the same. Make sure you have an "A" toon, that is decently geared. Save this toon/these toons specifically for making a good name for yourself. People remember names, if they see yours repeatedly performing, you will get invites. Eventually they wont care if you say hey can I bring my gimp ranger Im on timer on my cleric, because they know most of the time you pull your weight with your main.

    Add people to your friends list, not to pester with tells for invites, but so you can be ready when you see they are in a group doing something you want to run that has an lfm up.

    Hope that helps
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by me_TOO View Post
    Honestly, with 3 players, you can reasonably handle EE taking pugs. Be selective when you form them, even shortman them and your name will get out. When doing this make sure you are running quests you know you can handle, and know inside and out, so that when people run with you it goes smooth with out them having to break a sweat.

    Know your role... Speak up if you can kite the truthful one, or can do the swim in EE crucible and then dont screw it up lol

    Dont be be the loud guy, or the gear linking guy, or the build disector or the my other toon has/does... guy. The player who talks a little (not a mute or a blabbermouth), cracks the the odd oneliner at something funny that happens, is self depricating when appropriate and funny all the while handling their toon or their role effectively is remembered.

    Chug pots when you have to without complaint, and I dont mean drink 25 on EN Tor, do it when appropriate, dont be cheap and run out of mana because you hesitated drinking a couple pots when things get tight. End game guilds have tons of pots and people dont think twice about drinking a couple to make things go smooth. Treat it as an investment, even if you have save up as a guild to buy a stack off the AH. As you run more and more content the pots will replenish themselves and most end game guilds will notice if something got tricky and you chugged pots and will at worst usually acknowledge what you did and at best send a few your way.

    Only run your "A" toon in these situations, save the 425hp rogue for static group runs where noone cares if you die 50 times, encourage your guildies to do the same. Make sure you have an "A" toon, that is decently geared. Save this toon/these toons specifically for making a good name for yourself. People remember names, if they see yours repeatedly performing, you will get invites. Eventually they wont care if you say hey can I bring my gimp ranger Im on timer on my cleric, because they know most of the time you pull your weight with your main.

    Add people to your friends list, not to pester with tells for invites, but so you can be ready when you see they are in a group doing something you want to run that has an lfm up.

    Hope that helps
    Great advise; well said
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  11. #11
    Community Member DarkSable's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scoobmx View Post
    I mean 'regular' raids. There is usually a lot more of the difficult-to-pug raids. 'Regular' raids are usually just done on our own finding pug groups.
    Gotcha. That'll certainly be nice...


    Quote Originally Posted by me_TOO View Post
    Honestly, with 3 players, you can reasonably handle EE taking pugs. Be selective when you form them, even shortman them and your name will get out. When doing this make sure you are running quests you know you can handle, and know inside and out, so that when people run with you it goes smooth with out them having to break a sweat.

    Know your role... Speak up if you can kite the truthful one, or can do the swim in EE crucible and then dont screw it up lol

    Dont be be the loud guy, or the gear linking guy, or the build disector or the my other toon has/does... guy. The player who talks a little (not a mute or a blabbermouth), cracks the the odd oneliner at something funny that happens, is self depricating when appropriate and funny all the while handling their toon or their role effectively is remembered.

    Chug pots when you have to without complaint, and I dont mean drink 25 on EN Tor, do it when appropriate, dont be cheap and run out of mana because you hesitated drinking a couple pots when things get tight. End game guilds have tons of pots and people dont think twice about drinking a couple to make things go smooth. Treat it as an investment, even if you have save up as a guild to buy a stack off the AH. As you run more and more content the pots will replenish themselves and most end game guilds will notice if something got tricky and you chugged pots and will at worst usually acknowledge what you did and at best send a few your way.

    Only run your "A" toon in these situations, save the 425hp rogue for static group runs where noone cares if you die 50 times, encourage your guildies to do the same. Make sure you have an "A" toon, that is decently geared. Save this toon/these toons specifically for making a good name for yourself. People remember names, if they see yours repeatedly performing, you will get invites. Eventually they wont care if you say hey can I bring my gimp ranger Im on timer on my cleric, because they know most of the time you pull your weight with your main.

    Add people to your friends list, not to pester with tells for invites, but so you can be ready when you see they are in a group doing something you want to run that has an lfm up.

    Hope that helps
    Extremely good advice, thank you. However, I have to ask... how would you change it for a group that can 3-man the easier EE's? Our builds, and our playstyles, are designed to work as a team - Although I'm amenable to opening up the last three slots to pugs, I'm worried that most people out there aren't going to be willing to not charge into a room so that the healer can run in, grab aggro, pull the mobs back through a web at the door, and let the barbarian in LD grab the kills.

  12. #12
    Hatchery Founder Glenalth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DarkSable View Post
    Gotcha. That'll certainly be nice...


    Extremely good advice, thank you. However, I have to ask... how would you change it for a group that can 3-man the easier EE's? Our builds, and our playstyles, are designed to work as a team - Although I'm amenable to opening up the last three slots to pugs, I'm worried that most people out there aren't going to be willing to not charge into a room so that the healer can run in, grab aggro, pull the mobs back through a web at the door, and let the barbarian in LD grab the kills.
    Communicate that to them first.

    If they can't listen, let them die, clear the room, then raise them. Repeat until they learn.
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  13. #13
    The Hatchery landona54's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glenalth View Post
    Communicate that to them first.

    If they can't listen, let them die, clear the room, then raise them. Repeat until they learn.
    That explains why I am still waiting on my rez.....
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  14. #14
    Founder Osharan_Tregarth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by landona54 View Post
    That explains why I am still waiting on my rez.....
    Hey, those scrolls are expensive!!!
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  15. #15
    Community Member redspecter23's Avatar
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    Working your way up in Argo is like a social puzzle that you have to solve on your own. You want to show off your skills without being full of yourself. You have to actually have skills to show off. Never blame the healer, even if you really think it's their fault. It shows a lack of class that tends to get you ignored in the future. If you know the players to look out for, you can work your way into their LFM's as pugs. If you play well, they'll have no issue inviting you back and then you've got your foot in the door. If you're willing to play the divine role, you get extra brownie points off the start, even more if you're awesome at it.
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  16. #16
    Community Member scoobmx's Avatar
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    i've been running some epic elite gianthold pugs here and there. send me a mail or something with a list of toon names i should look out for. send it to scoobshot.

    my long term suggestion is a guild merger or acquisition. that is, unless you plan to entirely source your play from channels. be aware that most channels at endgame are in fact owned and operated by guilds. this means that it is their 2nd-priority pool of players to draw from and that almost all members from that guild are in the channel. i only know of 1 or 2 guild-neutral channels for endgame.
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  17. #17
    Community Member DarkSable's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by redspecter23 View Post
    Working your way up in Argo is like a social puzzle that you have to solve on your own. You want to show off your skills without being full of yourself. You have to actually have skills to show off. Never blame the healer, even if you really think it's their fault. It shows a lack of class that tends to get you ignored in the future. If you know the players to look out for, you can work your way into their LFM's as pugs. If you play well, they'll have no issue inviting you back and then you've got your foot in the door. If you're willing to play the divine role, you get extra brownie points off the start, even more if you're awesome at it.
    No worries of me blaming the healer - I play a favored soul, and am not half bad, especially when spell-tanking the red name.

    That being said, I found a group of small guilds who have a loose alliance, and after running with us a few times, offered letting us into the alliance. They're great folks, and it's more than enough for us to be able to find people with whom to run raids.

    (And thank you to everyone who posted in this thread - there's some very good advice in here.)

  18. #18
    Founder Osharan_Tregarth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DarkSable View Post
    (And thank you to everyone who posted in this thread - there's some very good advice in here.)
    Especially the part about not bothering to raise lando!
    Osharan, Esharan, Osharina, Usharina, etc... I'm the 'sharans. Epoxy. Notverysexy.
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