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  1. #21
    Community Member shores11's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uska View Post
    Popular doenst = good its opium for the masses prime example

    WoW most popular MMO ever and it bites big time. Boring mindless and simple to play just like FR
    We are all entitled to our own opinions and I respect yours however it is my opinion and most of the D&D fans opinion that the Forgotten Realms is the bext the numbers just don't lie. I think FR is the best by far it was and still is an incredible and flexible realm.

    As for WoW I agree and don't care for it at all but they are doing something right with over 10 million plus subcribers. I respect what the players over there like even if I don't.
    Last edited by shores11; 03-27-2013 at 06:48 PM.
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  2. #22
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uska View Post
    Popular doenst = good its opium for the masses prime example

    WoW most popular MMO ever and it bites big time. Boring mindless and simple to play just like FR
    But Bliz is grinding most MMOs into niche status the minute they hit the market. WOW doesnt appeal as much to me as a player anymore, but it sure as heck has a stranglehold on the market, with its elevendy bajillion subscribers. Businesswise they are doing something right.
    Last edited by Chai; 03-27-2013 at 01:02 PM.
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  3. #23
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shores11 View Post
    We are all entitled to our own opinions and I respect yours however it is my opinion and most of the D&D fans opinion that the Forgotten Realms is the bext the numbes just don't lie. I think FR is the best by far it was and still is an incredible and flexible realm.

    As for WoW I agree and don't care for it at all but they are doing something right with over 10 million plus subcribers. I respect what the players over there like even if I don't.
    Two things happened that make the FR the most marketable, even 30 years after the fact.

    1. Most of the 12 year olds that were reading those books back in the 80s and early 90s are all grown up now, and many of those FR authors became best sellers.

    2. WOTC mostly didnt allow those authors to cross into Eberron. Eberrons fiction did not take off anywhere near as well as FRs did.

    As a marketable asset, FR dominates any other D&D universe, regardless of how much we personally like/dislike it ourselves.
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by shores11 View Post
    I corrected your short sited reply
    You don't know what "corrected" means, do you? Because that's not what you did.
    Quote Originally Posted by shores11 View Post
    is D&D not a business?
    No, it isn't. It's a game and a brand name. WotC is the business.
    The Forgotten Realms made so much money for D&D and was by far the most popular realm D&D every produced I only back this statement up with of lets see, FACTS, NUMBERS, DOLLARS.
    Of course, you're also neglecting a lot of facts in there, like how FR got to where it is and the situation with the company and people involved at the time, but hey, whatever. That's how it goes when people (i.e., you) argue in bad faith.
    Quote Originally Posted by shores11 View Post
    We are all entitled to our own opinions and I respect yours however it is my opinion
    Yes, we are. But don't make the mistake of assuming that all opinions are equal or equally worthy of consideration or respect. They aren't.

    FR is a simple, generic fantasy setting. That's one of the reasons it's so popular. And hey, more power to you for liking bland fantasy. If that floats your boat, good on you. Go find it somewhere else though. DDO is about Eberron.

  5. #25
    The Mad Multiclasser Failedlegend's Avatar
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    Forgotten Realms are popular for two reasons

    1 - R.A. Salvotore this is the major reason if him and the other famous DnD writers had written for any other setting chances are they would be the popular one

    2 - The realms are so generic that it's very easy to adapt in any campaign without rules lawyers calling BS where-as other setting are unique and have specific internal logics and rules so less campaigns work with them

    So in short IMO The realms isn't actually a campaign setting at all its a base (including a huge multitude of overpowered NPCs) in which you can build your own setting stuff like Krynn and Ebberon are already set-up for you.

    As for the person complaining about having to play the main characters in a Dragonlance campaign...that's nothing to do with the setting thats a group and/or DM issue.

    That said it seems these kind of sentiments are falling on deaf ears since the Devs have all but abandoned Ebberon (see the Pax Party interview their planning to fill out forgotten realms with quests of all levels. Thats gonna take alot of dev time...I'm sure they may release an occasional pack for Ebberon but 99% of focus will be on FR)

    Basically with every new announcement the devs seem to be moving further anf further to generic MMO #9153...the 3 tree system enhancement system reeks of it, dropping die notations and now their moving to a generic soul-less setting. Wildstar and Pathfinder Online are looking better and better. Here's hoping they implemented player suggestions into the new enhancement system, return dice notations and realize the mistake of abandoning Ebberon
    Last edited by Failedlegend; 03-27-2013 at 02:55 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan
    There is little value in getting into an edition debate; as with anything, we create what we believe works best for DDO.

  6. #26
    Community Member shores11's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Failedlegend View Post
    Forgotten Realms are popular for two reasons

    1 - R.A. Salvotore this is the major reason if him and the other famous DnD writers had written for any other setting chances are they would be the popular one

    2 - The realms are so generic that it's very easy to adapt in any campaign without rules lawyers calling BS where-as other setting are unique and have specific internal logics and rules so less campaigns work with them

    So in short IMO The realms isn't actually a campaign setting at all its a base (including a huge multitude of overpowered NPCs) in which you can build your own setting stuff like Krynn and Ebberon are already set-up for you.

    As for the person complaining about having to play the main characters in a Dragonlance campaign...that's nothing to do with the setting thats a group and/or DM issue.

    That said it seems these kind of sentiments are falling on deaf ears since the Devs have all but abandoned Ebberon (see the Pax Party interview their planning to fill out forgotten realms with quests of all levels. Thats gonna take alot of dev time...I'm sure they may release an occasional pack for Ebberon but 99% of focus will be on FR)

    Basically with every new announcement the devs seem to be moving further anf further to generic MMO #9153...the 3 tree system enhancement system reeks of it, dropping die notations and now their moving to a generic soul-less setting. Wildstar and Pathfinder Online are looking better and better. Here's hoping they implemented player suggestions into the new enhancement system, return dice notations and realize the mistake of abandoning Ebberon
    FR was already the most popular realm before RA Salvatore.

    Business wise it is no mistake to leave Eberron (I don't think they are) but smarter to launch in FR since it is the biggest money maker for all D&D products. I have been polling random players on Khyber and almost 7 to 1 thus far favor FR over any other realm ever launched by D&D.
    Last edited by shores11; 03-27-2013 at 06:56 PM.
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  7. #27
    The Mad Multiclasser Failedlegend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shores11 View Post
    FR was already the most popular realm before RA Salvatore.

    Business wise it is no mistake to leave Eberron (I don't think they are) but smarter to launch in FR since it is the biggest money maker for all D&D products. I have been polling random players on Khyber and almost 7 to 1 thus far favor FR over any other realm ever launched by D&D.
    1 - I said Salvatore AND other authors there were only a few non-FR book series if as many books were pput out for say Ebberon it would be far more poplular

    2 - I didn't say it wasn't popular, I said it 's popular because of its lack of personality/uniqueness allowing people to project w/e vision and/or internal logic of the world they wanted. IMO it's not a campaign setting its a blank slate with a few prominent NPCs and locations to give you something to start with...no unique rules or mechanics, settings or events to get in the way of YOUR world. It has it's uses if you don't want a setting and/or have your own ideas the other settings have things that are s[ecial and unique about them.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan
    There is little value in getting into an edition debate; as with anything, we create what we believe works best for DDO.

  8. #28
    Founder & Hero Uska's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shores11 View Post
    FR was already the most popular realm before RA Salvatore.

    Business wise it is no mistake to leave Eberron (I don't think they are) but smarter to launch in FR since it is the biggest money maker for all D&D products. I have been polling random players on Khyber and almost 7 to 1 thus far favor FR over any other realm ever launched by D&D.
    Hmm I play khyber as well and most I ask think anything but fr would be a good idea not saying most them would prefer eberron since most say sigil or darksun

    The ANTI-Realms FANBOI NUKE THE REALMS ITS THE ONLY REAL WAY TO BE SURE

  9. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by shores11 View Post
    The Forgotten Realms

    The Forgotten Realms is a campaign setting for the Dungeons & Dragons (D&D) fantasy role-playing game. Commonly referred to by players and game designers alike as "The Realms", it was created by game designer Ed Greenwood around 1967 as a setting for his childhood stories.[1] Several years later, Greenwood brought the setting to the D&D game as a series of magazine articles, and the first Realms game products were released in 1987. Role-playing game products have been produced for the setting ever since, as have various licensed products including sword and sorcery novels, role-playing video game adaptations (including the first massively multiplayer online role-playing game to use graphics), and comic books. The Forgotten Realms is one of the most popular D&D settings,[2][3] largely due to the success of novels by authors such as R. A. Salvatore and numerous role-playing video games, including Pool of Radiance (1988), Baldur's Gate (1998), Icewind Dale (2000) and Neverwinter Nights (2002).

    Is it my opininion that there are now two (2) MMo's being aunched in the Forgotten Realms. Is it my opinion that Turbine is expanding into FR even more and more in the future. Do your own research so that your coming from a better place to make your incorrect assessment.
    Did you notice neither of the references for "one of the most popular D&D settings" links properly?

    Wikis are fairly reliable sources of information but are not facts. They are subject to contributor error.

    Also, "one of the most popular" does not equal "the most popular". Turbine might want to ask themselves what the other competitors are in popularity based on a statement like that.

    Your facts are public contribution that appear to be more opinions, and your numbers and dollars are nowhere to be seen.


    I agree that the Forgotten Realms are a popular setting and many players wanted them. I don't agree that most is an accurate statement because we can't back that up one way or the other. I would leave that at "Forgotten Realms was a common request" because I think that's more factual.

    Also, R.A. Salvatore won writing Forgotten Realms in July 1987, the same year the gaming products for Forgotten Realms were released, after submitting Echoes of the Fourth Magic to TSR. The first FR Trilogy was Icewind Dale with the first book in 1988. FR was not "the most popular realm before R.A. Salvatore". They came out together. Popularity stemmed from his books an the video games after he started writing.


    I'll sign on changing the forum name, however. Calling it the MotU forum either means another subset of forums with each expansion or mislabeled forums. If we're going to see more expansions then better organization could be done regardless of who like what better. We obviously have FR content now, I would have a hard time denying that it is a popular setting, and I don't think it makes sense not to allow for characters to have a starting point at low levels there now that we do have it.

    I still prefer Eberron and would pay for a Sharn expansion pack.
    Last edited by Aashrym; 03-27-2013 at 10:01 PM. Reason: sp
    Quote Originally Posted by Turbine
    a powerful ally able to play in any role that the group needs
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zonbLF-NMZg

  10. #30
    Founder & Hero Uska's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aashrym View Post
    Did you notice neither of the references for "one of the most popular D&D settings" links properly?

    Wikis are fairly reliable sources of information but are not facts. They are subject to contributor error.

    Also, "one of the most popular" does not equal "the most popular". Turbine might want to ask themselves what the other competitors are in popularity based on a statement like that.

    Your facts are public contribution that appear to be more opinions, and your numbers and dollars are nowhere to be seen.


    I agree that the Forgotten Realms are a popular setting and many players wanted them. I don't agree that most is an accurate statement because we can't back that up one way or the other. I would leave that at "Forgotten Realms was a common request" because I think that's more factual.

    Also, R.A. Salvatore won writing Forgotten Realms in July 1987, the same year the gaming products for Forgotten Realms were released, after submitting Echoes of the Fourth Magic to TSR. The first FR Trilogy was Icewind Dale with the first book in 1988. FR was not "the most popular realm before R.A. Salvatore". They came out together. Popularity stemmed from his books an the video games after he started writing.


    I'll sign on changing the forum name, however. Calling it the MotU forum either means another subset of forums with each expansion or mislabeled forums. If we're going to see more expansions then better organization could be done regardless of who like what better. We obviously have FR content now, I would have a hard time denying that it is a popular setting, and I don't think it makes sense not to allow for characters to have a starting point at low levels there now that we do have it.

    I still prefer Eberron and would pay for a Sharn expansion pack.
    Well put and I want sharn to

    The ANTI-Realms FANBOI NUKE THE REALMS ITS THE ONLY REAL WAY TO BE SURE

  11. #31
    Community Member silence383's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shores11 View Post
    With the further upcoming expamsion more into The Forgotten Realms and hopefully much more in the future there is a great solid footing and growing. I cannot say how much it means to me and I know many other players that DDO has launchedinto FR, major kudos.

    Should this forum be renamed to "The Forgotten Realms" and there be one created for "Eberron" for each worlds specific topics and conversation? I think that the forum name continued over one update should be more encompassing.
    Yay double the neg rep for each

  12. #32
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    Maybe they should rename the forums to "The 10%". I say this since in many threads I have read people saying that only a small percentage of the players evev read the forums.

    Another name could be "The Complainers of DDO". My reasoning behind this is that the majority of the post on here are always complaining about the way Turbine is doing things. Even if Turbine fixed everything I am 100 % positive that people will find something to complain about on these forums.
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  13. #33
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by justhavinfun View Post
    Maybe they should rename the forums to "The 10%". I say this since in many threads I have read people saying that only a small percentage of the players evev read the forums.

    Another name could be "The Complainers of DDO". My reasoning behind this is that the majority of the post on here are always complaining about the way Turbine is doing things. Even if Turbine fixed everything I am 100 % positive that people will find something to complain about on these forums.
    It goes the other way as well - even if they screwed up 100% of the game completely there are still those who would be telling us everything is fine, because they are still making money, right?

    One thing to note here, is right after the expansion, many of the "complainers of DDO" were starting to turn, and even supported the game by buying particular convenience mechanisms they favored, but then they saw that the bugs THEY want fixed dont get fixed no matter how muich they pay into the system, and no matter how much those who feel Turbine can do no wrong claim that they are ballin out of control financially. This leads them to ask where all the money is going, and when no satisfactory answer is received, most of your "complainers of DDO" went right back to "never pay another dime" mode.
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  14. #34
    Community Member shores11's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by silence383 View Post
    Yay double the neg rep for each
    Thank you for your negetive rep. whether positive or negative at least your contributing. As an FYI I have received 1-NEG REP and 6-POS REP for this post and as a result have broken 3,000 thanks for all of you Forgotten Realms fans.
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