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  1. #21
    Community Member zarthak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NancyD View Post
    Mmm, screenshot doesn't tell the whole story. He had a high killcount, dispatching the ads, which can be more than a distraction on ee. He also, weirdly, healed a lot. (I know, right? Pigs fly!) So I'd cut him some slack. Meh, my four deaths -- 2 were singleshots that, even with ring of djinn and energy sheath and what not -- I couldn't avoid. One was being danced and bitten to death by ads. Maybe should have avoided that. And the fourth was getting too close to the dragon's nose. That dragon doesn't move that fast -- it's always an error for the healer to be too close there. But two deaths were just gonna happen, the way the cards were dealt, unless we get a smoother start. It was a tough start. Smooth finish.

    Things I think I learned:

    PJ on Shamgar really rocks, and Cains is very clever as a wizard, and Norg is very good at not just the play but the leadership/maintaining order stuff. But all the pugs, including both monks and that bard, weren't playing around. So if you're gonna drink some pots, and I did, do it for players who aren't dialing it in! I'd be fussy about who I'd raid with on ee on this one. Doesn't seem liek a lot of room for weak spots. So that's the first thing I learned. I ain't pugging this on EE, nuh-uh.

    Second, in this raid, on my cleric, I'm always doing this on ee on exalted angel and because leap of faith and haste is essential to outrun stuff now and then.

    Third, every rule has an exception, and for this beautiful content, the rule that one shouldn't spec for one raid meets the exception. For now I do have on my 25 cleric enlarge, and I owe Naughty one flawless dragonshard for doing it, but for the healbot role in there it really does make sense. You can be as reflexive and hasted as you please, but there will be times that, but-for-enlarge, a key kiter or tank woulda died.

    All of gianthold rocks, and especially rocks on ee. It's tons of fun. Thanks Turbine!

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  2. #22
    Founder & Build Synthesis Battlehawke's Avatar
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    Nice job. Grats!
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  3. #23
    Hero NancyD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xTethx View Post
    Grats guys! Someone mind breaking the strat down for me? So when I log on eventually I'm not totally lost.
    LOl, not me, I'm still totally lost and we're still learning. That was my first guild run on ee for me, wasn't a party to the earlier efforts that didn't make it.

    Definitely first piece of advice is: PJ's right about everyone has to have eyes on the dragon and just avoid.

    I actually have at least one healbot with enlarge as a feat.

    Keep all the bosses aggro on someone so the stormreaver doesn't get too involved and instadeath people with major electrical damage. Energy sheath electrial and ring of djinn. Definitely break enchantment scrolls. (When I'm danced, harper's pin should undance me but it doesn't seem to work -- so there's times you need to call out for a break enchant on a web or a dance.)

    Also, expecct to heal anyone/everyone, and anyone who tells you they weren't healed in that raid, balderdash, they're just whining. There will be deaths and there will be a timer on them, so there are times when you're short-handed and you're gonna be just not taking down any more damage and in a holding pattern. Which means you have to plan on the fly. Which means you need strong leadership and very good discipline on when you should be talking in party chat on the quest. This isn't a good time to clutter communications with "I'll rez so-and-so -- just do it." Raise dead ("baby rezzes") are utterly useless, they just reset the player's timer, and someone in our group kept giving out such rezzes until finally the entire group was just saying over the mike whoever is doing that, stop it, you're just resetting them.

    As to position -- where to kite and how -- I think it's an open book what's best. As a healer I certainly feel safer on the rim and I've noted the architecture of the upper rim has little nooks. I wonder about those hoos: places to hide so you can be in healing range and peak out to heal? Places to capture and tank a boss?

    The great thing is that I don't think we've figured it out at all, and that means there is more to learn.
    /Nancy

    NancyPDoyle, Dubitable, Bluer, Perisher, NPD, OttoAttack, and others, all on Khyber

  4. #24
    Hero JOTMON's Avatar
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    Congrats on the successful run.

    Quote Originally Posted by sugrcain View Post
    One last note for the Turbine guys, it’s a bummer clicking on the raid chest only to see some purple dragonshards assigned to your name. Please fix that, it's not going to be a great motivator for elite runs if people are worried they might get short changed at the end.
    This definitely sucks.

    On Argo...
    On our first run I got 700 plat, no commedations, nothing else.
    Not sure if anyone else got skipped over... was filling out a bug report.
    No Named Raid loot dropped for party.

    On the second run I picked up a raid bypass and went again...
    This time.. I got nothing in the chest at all.
    no commedations.. just an empty chest.
    Two other party members also had an empty chest
    I think 1 Raid item dropped for the party.. wassn't paying attention was filling out another bug report...

    had a +2 lootgem going for both runs so I dont know if this impacts anything or if it is just randomly broken.
    and still no notes on the Official known items list as to it being broken, no Dev response.
    You know its broken when you get no gems in your chest with the way gems have been dropping.

    Link to my Suggestions posts.
    http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=409462

    Getting much better results from the Epic hard runs if you are running for loot and commedations.
    Last edited by JOTMON; 02-26-2013 at 09:57 AM.
    Jotmon - Let's not forget why we play these games - to have fun - ~
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    Update 24: Champions... "whew, it's ok, it's only a red name" .. sad day when trash spawn Champions and their one-shot ignore fort attacks instill more party fear than the Red named bosses.

  5. #25
    2015 DDO Players Council Jevern's Avatar
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    Yes, I think it's a bug. I got 708 plat and a handful of gems. Nothing else. Didn't bug report because I was in it for the fun more than anything else, but I think most others would be pretty bummed to not get anything after slogging an EE run out.
    Jassial - 18 Druid/2 Monk

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  6. #26
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    Hey thanks for the great run folks. 8 guilds were represented on the completion which is always nice. A little on the strategy:

    We had half the people fall in the north and half in the east on the drop down. I ran and grabbed the Lies and Silent Giants with intimidate. Tianyi our sorc grabbed the Lies dragon and silent dragon and kited them. One of the things we really improved on this run was getting in position much quicker then our previous attempts. The melee worked on lies giant (had a monk and barbarian and myself). The ranged dps worked on the lies dragon. We prepped the lies dragon and silent dragon and the lies giant. We took down the first set (probably should have prepped the silent giant as well).

    Then the truthful one came down and we lost about half the group, but scrambled got back in control and took down the silent set. Then we prepped the crystal and prepped the confusion set. We took down the crystal and then took down the confusion set. We used melee dps on the giants for the most part and ranged dps on the dragons. Then tiyani kited the stormreaver and I tanked the truthful one, but we found out it is much more efficient to ranged kite and dps the truthful one. Tiyani and one of our ranged worked on the stormreaver and another ranged kited and the melee followed after dps the truthful one.

    Notes: I think it is really important in the first part of the raid to get things in control quickly. When the stormreaver goes down he loses aggro and everything gets loose. A tank can tank all the giants at once basically. Ranged dps is really important in the raid overall.
    Last edited by maddmatt70; 02-26-2013 at 11:10 AM.
    Norg Fighter12/Paladin6/Monk2, Jacquiej Cleric18/Monk1/Wiz1, Rabiez Bard16/Ranger3/Cleric1, Hangover Bard L20, Boomsticks Fighter12/Monk 6/Druid 2, Grumblegut Ranger8/Paladin6/Monk6, Rabidly Rogue L20, Furiously Rogue10/Monk6/Paladin4, Snowcones Cleric 12/Ranger 6/Monk 2, Norge Barbarian 12/FVS4/Rogue4. Guild:Prophets of The New Republic Khyber.

  7. #27
    Hero JOTMON's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jevern View Post
    Yes, I think it's a bug. I got 708 plat and a handful of gems. Nothing else. Didn't bug report because I was in it for the fun more than anything else, but I think most others would be pretty bummed to not get anything after slogging an EE run out.

    They say they do fix things if they are bug reported enough.

    There could be a link between Named Raid loot not being properly associated to the chest on Epic Elite.

    So that could have bee a Named item or a +5 tome that should have dropped for you but didn't because the link is not coded correctly.

    The Dev's claim ignorance because no one bug reports it and as far as they know it is working just fine.

    If we don't draw enough attention to it it will never get acknowledged or fixed.
    Jotmon - Let's not forget why we play these games - to have fun - ~
    Guild: Degenerate Matter - 200 (Former Guilds: ChaosKnights, Big Damn Heroes, Shadowfiends, Order of the Drow, Unusual Suspects, Raided R)
    Argo-Jotmon(Completionist - before the Otto's/XP pots easymode), Jotmonheals(Clr17/Rog2/Mnk1-Epic Completionist), Whatthetruck.. and many many more alts..

    Update 24: Champions... "whew, it's ok, it's only a red name" .. sad day when trash spawn Champions and their one-shot ignore fort attacks instill more party fear than the Red named bosses.

  8. #28
    2015 DDO Players Council Jevern's Avatar
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    True that. It is happening to others then? I thought it was a one off thing, but it seems not.
    Jassial - 18 Druid/2 Monk

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    Proud member of Crimson Eagles

  9. #29
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    Default Congrats

    Congratulations!

    I am just sad I wasn't a part of it, tried before with a few different guild's and some members that were apart of the raid. It really does remind me of the raid mechanics in WOW, seems like turbine is stepping it up a notch and I like that.

    Did you ever figure out what sent the random lightning through the raid?

  10. #30
    2015 DDO Players Council Jevern's Avatar
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    There was a theory floated that it's actually the small spirits sacrificing themselves once they hit a certain hp level (half-ish). It seems to be distance related (only getting zapped with aggro in melee range). Not confirmed though.
    Jassial - 18 Druid/2 Monk

    Also: ~Jetel ~ Jessoliel ~ Jevern ~ Jemerial ~ Jedriel ~ Jevern ~
    Proud member of Crimson Eagles

  11. #31
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    I'm not 100% sure but highly suspecting the decieved spirits (wraiths) are causing the massive electrical trap damage. They have an ability where you'll see 'catharsis' pop over there head followed immediately by massive electric damage if you're close that you need some absorption to survive unless you're really beefy, seems like there's some thresehold of lost hit points before they can do it too. Again, I'm not 100% sure as I'm really not the most analytical observer of the combat log but as the attempts build up I have been noticing the huge lightning damage happens when those wraiths are close by.

  12. #32
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    Well Lies makes the party more vulnerable to electrical damage. That is why he goes down first. I am not sure what the correlation is between the spirits and the trap damage. Players dying spawns more spirits so that is a bad thing as well.
    Norg Fighter12/Paladin6/Monk2, Jacquiej Cleric18/Monk1/Wiz1, Rabiez Bard16/Ranger3/Cleric1, Hangover Bard L20, Boomsticks Fighter12/Monk 6/Druid 2, Grumblegut Ranger8/Paladin6/Monk6, Rabidly Rogue L20, Furiously Rogue10/Monk6/Paladin4, Snowcones Cleric 12/Ranger 6/Monk 2, Norge Barbarian 12/FVS4/Rogue4. Guild:Prophets of The New Republic Khyber.

  13. #33
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    Default Huh

    I still wish there was an explanation for the traps. I tried this with your cleric Jacquiej and the only thing that kept killing people was the trap. The lightning was just virtual insanity! I really didn't feel like the raid was that hard but was just long which has you run into problems like: buffs falling off, running out of mana, and death effects. The raids seemed really clean until the magical happy lightning from completely random points. I know because I watched a few repetitions of the lightning.

    If this is working as intended and people are suppose to die to this mechanic then I think thats just a poor mechanic. This raid with properly geared people doing the raid a certain way should die with minimal deaths. Not saying your completion wasn't impressive, it definately was, but saying that this mechanic should have an answer or be reworked.

  14. #34
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raliar View Post
    I still wish there was an explanation for the traps. I tried this with your cleric Jacquiej and the only thing that kept killing people was the trap. The lightning was just virtual insanity! I really didn't feel like the raid was that hard but was just long which has you run into problems like: buffs falling off, running out of mana, and death effects. The raids seemed really clean until the magical happy lightning from completely random points. I know because I watched a few repetitions of the lightning.

    If this is working as intended and people are suppose to die to this mechanic then I think thats just a poor mechanic. This raid with properly geared people doing the raid a certain way should die with minimal deaths. Not saying your completion wasn't impressive, it definately was, but saying that this mechanic should have an answer or be reworked.
    This is the way raiding works over time we will figure out all the specifics of what causes what and the raid strategy will get refined until we can complete epic elite in 30 minutes. I would say welcome to raiding just because we do not understand it now does not mean will not understand it someday.

    The only thing that took a while was the truthful one with the undead dragon's hp, but everything else seems fairly quick so this will eventually be farmable on ee. Killing Lies and hopefully silent sets as well before stormreaver goes down the first time is definitely a good idea because I am pretty confident that the sets can magnify or increase the damage in some fashion of the electrical trap attacks.
    Norg Fighter12/Paladin6/Monk2, Jacquiej Cleric18/Monk1/Wiz1, Rabiez Bard16/Ranger3/Cleric1, Hangover Bard L20, Boomsticks Fighter12/Monk 6/Druid 2, Grumblegut Ranger8/Paladin6/Monk6, Rabidly Rogue L20, Furiously Rogue10/Monk6/Paladin4, Snowcones Cleric 12/Ranger 6/Monk 2, Norge Barbarian 12/FVS4/Rogue4. Guild:Prophets of The New Republic Khyber.

  15. #35
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    Was seeking a possible answer, thanks for the reply. I also have been raiding since 2000 in Everquest, so not new at all just curious if anyone has figured the mechanic out. Even if the Liar is killed the lightning with 33% absorption would still be hitting for 700-800 damage which would kill alot of the players. Unless of course everyone had over that amount in hps and for some classes this is a loftly thing to ask of.

  16. #36
    Community Member Tallyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kazeikan View Post
    Really? Norg is a good leader yes. Scain is a swell dude. But you lavish praise on a barbarian that beat on the back of things and a druid that healed you. I'm not saying they weren't necessary but how did I not even get a shoutout. I mean I only kite tanked 2 of the dragons at the same time, 1 of the giants, and the stormreaver in the end all while requiring no healing. Not to mention died only twice, once to electric trap and the other to someone bringing the undead dragon to my face, so I was clearly doing something during mass wipes. I'm freaking butthurt, but I believe I have a right to be.
    Do you really need validation on an internet forum for a computer game? If you're a good player, you know it...

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by sugrcain View Post
    .

    One last note for the Turbine guys, it’s a bummer clicking on the raid chest only to see some purple dragonshards assigned to your name. Please fix that, it's not going to be a great motivator for elite runs if people are worried they might get short changed at the end.
    Did you bug report that? I bugged mine and have been nagging others to bug theirs. It just doesn't seem right.
    ~Thelanis ~ Khyber ~

  18. #38
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    Does anyone know if you still go into sneak mode at the far right wall and only pull the lies dragon and giant without any other aggro? Then after they are down you can get confusion dragon and giant without aggroing the last pair? Just curious. Any answer appreciated.
    Teth - Revenants

    Babysittin Francine so he dont die 24/7. I used to be good at this game.

  19. #39
    Community Member DogMania's Avatar
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    I also got zilch in the chest like some of you and would have put in a ticket but as it was approx 5AM my time I just wanted to get to bed.
    Out of my 7 Deaths, 2 were insta lighning kills for just over 1k a pop, so i am now farming the ring which should (If I ever get invited again) save my life as hits should be down to be under 700. The other 5 I realy cant remember now what happened apart from The Truthfall One fireballed me when in flight and my repair did not cast in time.
    I am sure from what was learnt last night will mean a lot of future EE raids will be a success and the ammount fo deaths will decrease.

  20. #40
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    We did try the invis/sneak/feather fall in east thing one run but didn't work out for use we ended up with 3 red named and some trash. It may very well still work just fine, possibly just a coordination issue.
    Last edited by sugrcain; 02-26-2013 at 03:03 PM.

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