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  1. #21

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    Not sure its a bug. From the release notes:
    "Monster behavior relating to stealthy players has been improved:

    - Monsters should no longer "slide" while investigating noises and searching for players
    - Sleeping monsters who are woken up by noises should no longer glitch out
    - Investigate behavior has been updated
    - Player characters should now display "hot footsteps" while sneaking in any direction, rather than just forward and back (this is a cosmetic change only, monsters could hear these footsteps before, but there was no feedback)
    - Critters are now more easily "spooked" by nearby noises "

    I think they just hear you run by much more easily. I invis farmed blockade buster, framework, and diplomatic impunity. I also used it to speed my runs through wiz0king and what not. It still definitely reduces the amount of attention you get, and the monster's are clearly still looking for you. But, unlike before, they raise the alert while doing it, which can make it a lot harder.

    I assumed from the release notes that the change is WAI, and was meant to promote rogue stealth (w/ move silently), as the changes are supposed to be based on noise.

  2. #22
    Community Member mrtreats's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kylstrem View Post
    This is horrible logic.

    It's not the customer's job to test a product before it is released.

    Not participating on Lama does not exclude anyone from complaining about a broken released product.

    Quit giving Turbine a free pass with this crappy mindset.
    its not a free pass and they are testing things then letting us test it more you complain they didnt test it its broke maybe they dont play like us so we should retest thing
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  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by anivaj View Post
    ^^^ This is why invis was nice. Forcing us to kill trash mobs in explorer areas for the 100th time we run to a quest is not what most people consider fun...
    They leash, so you can still do that if you want.

    That said I would like invis fixed.

  4. #24
    The Hatchery Roland_D'Arabel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slimkj View Post
    They leash, so you can still do that if you want.

    That said I would like invis fixed.
    I agree. The whole detection and invis thing needs to be fixed. They leash, yes, but red alert in King's forest with a full party trying to run to Unquiet Graves is not fun. Mob sizes of 20 to 40 can easily surround you, they don't leash and dying is very possible.

    Running to a quest in an explorer zone as big as King's Forest should NOT (IMO) require you to kill everything along the way. Sometimes you want to do a quest, not kill things for slayers. Another mechanism that leads to anti-grouping. Why take a full party somewhere when I can just solo or duo it without the hassle of red alert et al?

    This needs to be dialed back, big time.
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  5. #25
    Founder Kylstrem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrtreats View Post
    its not a free pass and they are testing things then letting us test it more you complain they didnt test it its broke maybe they dont play like us so we should retest thing
    The bugs that are being discussed are some pretty obvious things... and from what I've read in other threads and on the Lammania forums, many of them were brought up before U17 shipped.

    But still:
    1) A company should not expect its customers to test their game... if people want to volunteer for that, that's fine... but I'm not purchasing a product "to work on it". I don't want to see the content until it is "released"... I don't to spend my free time testing.

    2) And if I decide as a customer, not to work for free for them and they release a buggy product that I am paying for, then I certainly can complain without feeling like a hypocrite.


    Imagine if you bought a car or a TV and it was defective, and you took it back to the place where you bought it and they said "Well, no one in our QA team thought that a customer perform <X Action> with it... you should have volunteered to test this so we would not release a bad product"... well, I can imagine you would be flabbergasted at such a response.

  6. #26
    Community Member Aerendil's Avatar
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    You know, the odd part is they're sensing invis and such now, and yet when I'm not invised or making any attempt to be stealthy, the detection is horrific.

    Just took a brand new character (lvl 4) into Waterworks, and was going through areas where the kobolds are asleep, and could pretty much slaughter them one at a time. Out of, say, 10 kobolds or so, I think 2 woke up. The rest stayed asleep as I butchered their friends around them.

    Very odd, indeed.

    Either that, or someone added some extra alcohol into the kobold's diet.

  7. #27
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    Default Invis

    /signed.

    I like to solo - and part of the challenge for me (as a relative newcomer, and re-joiner of the game), is scouting a dungeon, checking out the mobs - then building an equipment / potion / spell loadout to get through. Key battles at places where I can't stay undetected.

    I like being able to solo and sniff the flowers in quests that last year I only saw fleeting glances of - rushing through in PUG's trying not to embarass myself with experienced TR's ploughing through in optimum fashion.

    In an ideal world, I'd like to see it situational. If I fire an arrow to break a barrel and pull something, and there is a caster there, maybe them casting True Seeing on their fellow mobs would be the smart thing to do.

    "Hey Fred, did you see that barrel break?"
    "Yah, go take a look "
    :casts TS:

    Maybe even a feature tied in with Dungeon Alert? Once there's enough hive activity to trigger a Green/Yellow, casters start dishing out True Seeing.

    Anyhow, I'm signing now out of selfish interest in my own play style.

  8. #28
    Community Member squishwizzy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by voodoogroves View Post
    Many giants have had see invisibility for a long, long time.

    However, this is well beyond GH. It is essentially, everywhere. Their detection mechanics are not working properly.
    +1

    Giants in Gianthold have ALWAYS been able to spot invisible players. Trolls and Ogres, on the otherhand, notsomuch.

    However, after what I've read thus far, if this is the new "normal", it sucks. I like being able to hit most of the quests in GH virtually unmolested. Furthermore, I can guarantee you that this is going to be a HUGE impediment for newer players joining PUGs who don't know the map, and join the quest IP. Even for people who know the map, they'll probably be less likely to join a run IP as they will not want the hassle of spending 10 minutes hacking through mob after mob, and thereby taking an XP penalty because the group continued on to the end of the quest while the player in question was tied-up in the slayer area.

    So people will basically stop joining IP PUGs in GH. In G-Land, that's a rather sizeable chunk of the LFMs out there. Cripes, a lot of LFM listings these days are nothing more than publicized solo runs.

    It seems like Turbine is going out of their way to discourage grouping at every turn...
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  9. #29
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    No Dice (dev) said in the other thread it's not intended.

  10. #30
    Community Member Kalari's Avatar
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    I was wondering about this last night when I went out with my barogue (bard/rogue) I went invis and the giants were spotting her left and right. On the upside my fascinate was keeping them still left and right only one giant saved and got him on the next swing around. Then buffed up my panther was able to take them down one at a time and barely needed healing. So im meh about the invis so far it was fun running around messing with those giants
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  11. #31
    Community Member Jacobius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by No_Dice View Post
    Don't worry about debating the merits of stealth in DDO guys, an invisibility change was not intended!
    Its a bug

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    I think its reasonable that giants in a 20-25 zone can see through a level 2 spell.
    I'll accept that as a valid argument. For the spellcasters. I otherwise doubt the idea of every single giant out there having a see invisibility clicky.

  13. #33
    Community Member Talon_Moonshadow's Avatar
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    While, yes... Invis (sorta) is broken right now...

    Most of the Giants in Gianthold have always been able to See Invis.
    What you guys describe woul dbe no different if it weren't broken.


    Drow
    Duergar
    Most Reavers
    Most Giants
    Bezekira

    Have always Seen Invis.

    I believe some Trog and Hobgoblin Shamen buff themselves with True Seeing when agroed.

    Spiders, and Oozes have Tremor Sense
    Bats and Tharask Hounds have Blind Sense
    And Dread Wraiths have Life Sense.

    and... monsters tell each other when they are agroed! (and they give telpathic omni-knowlodge of your position when hurt!)



    of course.. that is not everything....
    You could run past quite a lot of stuff Invised and do ust fine.


    But Epic Giant hold has a ton more Giants than before... and many are on our old safe routes to the quests...

    Maybe there are new safe routes to take.... not sure yet.

    Good idea to stay together on the way to quests now.

    (well... that or sneak there. )
    Quote Originally Posted by Jandric View Post
    ..., but I honestly think the solution is to group with less whiny people.

  14. #34
    Community Member SealedInSong's Avatar
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    Default Not quite sure what OP is referring to

    If we're talking about giants in eGH, you can see in their buff bar that they can see through invis.

    But I'm also seeing replies that are referring to a more universal break in the invisibility mechanic. Can we get some empirical clarification on this?
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  15. #35
    Community Member Talon_Moonshadow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shortylegs View Post
    /signed.

    I like to solo - and part of the challenge for me (as a relative newcomer, and re-joiner of the game), is scouting a dungeon, checking out the mobs - then building an equipment / potion / spell loadout to get through. Key battles at places where I can't stay undetected.

    I like being able to solo and sniff the flowers in quests that last year I only saw fleeting glances of - rushing through in PUG's trying not to embarass myself with experienced TR's ploughing through in optimum fashion.

    In an ideal world, I'd like to see it situational. If I fire an arrow to break a barrel and pull something, and there is a caster there, maybe them casting True Seeing on their fellow mobs would be the smart thing to do.

    "Hey Fred, did you see that barrel break?"
    "Yah, go take a look "
    :casts TS:

    Maybe even a feature tied in with Dungeon Alert? Once there's enough hive activity to trigger a Green/Yellow, casters start dishing out True Seeing.

    Anyhow, I'm signing now out of selfish interest in my own play style.
    At DA Red, every monster can See Invis.
    (and for some reason most players do not seem to know this. )

    (which annoys the heck out of me when someone causes a Red alert and I am way behind.....luckily most of my characters are stealthy, but Red alert probably means monsters are bunched up at doors and shooting ranged attacks that may knock me out of stealth....)
    Quote Originally Posted by Jandric View Post
    ..., but I honestly think the solution is to group with less whiny people.

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