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  1. #1
    Community Member Darkstar1996's Avatar
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    Default Wiz/Sorc that can use Repeater?

    Since ive been playing my arti I LOVE HIM! Just i go on my sorc and love blowing stuff up. Can you take a wiz and give him a repeater so you can pretty much cast spells, lay down fire, cast some more? anything like that. I asked this last but i did it the other way. I would like to be major spell caster that can use repeater effectivly.

    Thanks, JW and please. Dont hate.

  2. #2
    Community Member tomatt72's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkstar1996 View Post
    Since ive been playing my arti I LOVE HIM! Just i go on my sorc and love blowing stuff up. Can you take a wiz and give him a repeater so you can pretty much cast spells, lay down fire, cast some more? anything like that. I asked this last but i did it the other way. I would like to be major spell caster that can use repeater effectivly.

    Thanks, JW and please. Dont hate.
    The best way of doing this without having to waste a feat is to take 1 lvl of Arti that way you get repeaters and a lever puller in your dog. that is what my buddy did.

  3. #3
    Community Member Therigar's Avatar
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    I think that it would work well on a wizard because of the synergy with INT. I can see a couple of ways to go, but maybe one of the most interesting would be with a rogue mechanic or artificer battle engineer/wizard pale master build.

    This is a rather deep splash of 6 levels with rogue or artificer but it could be very interesting nonetheless. If a player thought they could get away with only 12 or 13 levels of wizard there are a couple of things they might try.

    Artificer 6 battle engineer/rogue or monk 2/wizard 12 pale master gets all repeaters, endless fusillade, some (possibly) useful artificer spells, evasion, some extra feats and Tenser's.

    I sort of like rogue 6 mechanic/wizard 14. INT bonus to damage, evasion and more wizard spells to work with. Restricted to light repeaters unless a feat is used and no bonus feats. Sort of depends on how much a person feels they need the extra feats and on the value they put on artificer spells.

    Interesting concepts at the very least. Probably safest to go artificer 3/wizard 17 though.

  4. #4
    Community Member Deathdefy's Avatar
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    I tried a Wiz 13 (Evocation AM) / Arti 6 (Battle Engineer) / Fighter 1 (Bonus Feat yay) a while back with the intention of going Shiradi and playing off the Chain Missiles and Magic Missiles SLAs, as well as full crossbow feats including Improved Precise Shot.

    Wiz 13 also gets Prismatic Spray which has a non-terrible DC if you work at it since you're taking Evo AM and the SF: Evocation Feats.

    It wasn't my thing, but was decent enough. If you don't need the fighter feat, Wiz 13 Arti 7 would be much more enjoyable to level.
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  5. #5
    Community Member Therigar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deathdefy View Post
    I tried a Wiz 13 (Evocation AM) / Arti 6 (Battle Engineer) / Fighter 1 (Bonus Feat yay) a while back with the intention of going Shiradi and playing off the Chain Missiles and Magic Missiles SLAs, as well as full crossbow feats including Improved Precise Shot.

    Wiz 13 also gets Prismatic Spray which has a non-terrible DC if you work at it since you're taking Evo AM and the SF: Evocation Feats.

    It wasn't my thing, but was decent enough. If you don't need the fighter feat, Wiz 13 Arti 7 would be much more enjoyable to level.
    I was thinking more along the lines of the character playing essentially as an artificer/rogue but with the benefits (?) of wraith/vampire form and no-save dots plus shooting.

    Not exactly what OP asked for with powerful arcane side.

    This is why I concluded with arty 3/wizzy 17. Arty 3 gets insightful strikes for INT to hit letting the character be pure CON/INT. AM has some interesting possibilities if on a WF though. Synergy of INT, bonus spell points, SLAs, self healing, still all CON/INT but with CON and toughness enhancements.... Wizzy 17 still leaves you in pretty good shape for nuking options -- evo focus making good sense then -- and you still have dots.

  6. #6
    Community Member Deathdefy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Therigar View Post
    Not exactly what OP asked for with powerful arcane side.
    Mmm. True.

    You're right that 17 Wiz / 3 Arti is a more powerful caster. I'd go Elemental Weapons over Insightful Strikes for the one second level infusion though. Oh I suppose you could swap between them depending on how much you're hitting in your current content, then permanently settle on Elemental once you got the Doublecross Bow (with its freebie Int for attack).

    I'd actually be tempted to go 18 Wiz (for Pale Master Lich form) / 2 Arti (for Rune Arm Use) if I wasn't going to at least 6 Arti I think.
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  7. #7
    Community Member Therigar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deathdefy View Post
    Mmm. True.

    You're right that 17 Wiz / 3 Arti is a more powerful caster. I'd go Elemental Weapons over Insightful Strikes for the one second level infusion though. Oh I suppose you could swap between them depending on how much you're hitting in your current content, then permanently settle on Elemental once you got the Doublecross Bow (with its freebie Int for attack).

    I'd actually be tempted to go 18 Wiz (for Pale Master Lich form) / 2 Arti (for Rune Arm Use) if I wasn't going to at least 6 Arti I think.
    Assuming Doublecross then 18/2 is probably optimal.

  8. #8
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Are you looking for a truly effective build or just a flavor build which doesn't embarrass itself?

  9. #9
    Community Member Darkstar1996's Avatar
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    Im hoping this build would be good! I was thinking about doing it and with the Xbow and Rune arm with Wiz spells you get a VERY versatile character. The only thing is wouldnt you want Insightful Damage over Strikes? Cause On my Arti right now I have 24 int, 14 dex and i never get a miss. Jw. and Yes i was thinking on the 6/14 arty/wiz for a decent level on the characters.

    Thanks

  10. #10

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    Half-elf can go pure wizard and take the artificer dilettante for the weapon proficiency.
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  11. #11
    Community Member squishwizzy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkstar1996 View Post
    Since ive been playing my arti I LOVE HIM! Just i go on my sorc and love blowing stuff up. Can you take a wiz and give him a repeater so you can pretty much cast spells, lay down fire, cast some more? anything like that. I asked this last but i did it the other way. I would like to be major spell caster that can use repeater effectivly.

    Thanks, JW and please. Dont hate.
    For a wizzy, I don't see why not. You'd have to give up one feat for the repeater which means you'd probably have to drop:

    1) a spell pen feat,
    2) A mental toughness feat,
    3) Insightful Reflexes.

    I think Mental Toughness is required for both PrEs, so I think that is out. And, you definately don't want to pass on a spell focus feat, which is kinda your bread-and-butter. Some people can do without Spell Pen if they avoid Enchantment and to some extent Necro. So I think it is do-able.

    The only problem I see is that you'd be doing a lot of weapons changing. Most wizzys (and Sorcs, I believe) put their damage-enhancers in their weapons (Ice Lore, Nullification, etc.) which, if done with a repeater, would totally gimp your weapon altogether. So, you'd have to have one set of weapons for ranged combat, and another set of weapons available for casting.

    If anything, THAT would be a big hassle.

    Then there is the issue of lugging around bolts to handle DR breaking, Because if you are going to be even semi-serious with a repeater, you need to get past DR in many instances.

    I usually carry a bow with my wizzy for "emergency" situations. I rarely use it. And with the now caster-oriented staves, I can't see carrying a 2-handed bow all of the time when I can go dual-scepters (or whatever) or a staff for my spell damage enhancements.

    So, that's where I think the problems lie.
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  12. #12
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    Problem is that arti is horribly bad as a splash, everything is arti level dependent. Runearm damage wont scale, buff dur will be short, your arti spell DCs will suck... youre spending two levels for essentially two feats and Conjure Bolts, or six for those plus EF and one buff. And repeaters in general dont scale horribly well to endgame...artis supplement that with runearm dps but arti splashers cant

    I think if youre splashing arti you gotta splash 6 for insightful damage. If youre just splashing two, go fighter, bonus feats for repeater and rapid reload, and get more bab, fighter enhancements, etc.

    Then again, repeaters destroy ammo stacks....conjure bolts is kinda a must, right repeater rogues?
    Last edited by droid327; 02-14-2013 at 02:27 PM.

  13. #13
    Community Member Darkstar1996's Avatar
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    So it is Possible just there will be problems as of weapons and DC of spells. So probally my best option is to just have 1 arti to 20 and 1 wiz to 20. Hmmmm.... ok. Ill still try the Arti/Wiz see if it is possible and then i shall return with feedback. What do you think i should do for leveling AAWAAAAWWWWWWWWWWWWWW?

  14. #14
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deathdefy View Post
    I tried a Wiz 13 (Evocation AM) / Arti 6 (Battle Engineer) / Fighter 1 (Bonus Feat yay) a while back with the intention of going Shiradi and playing off the Chain Missiles and Magic Missiles SLAs, as well as full crossbow feats including Improved Precise Shot.
    As flavor builds go, this sounds interesting, though I might suggest wiz 12 / arty 6 / monk 2 instead; lose lvl 7 wiz spells but gain extra feat + Evasion while keeping AM III.

  15. #15
    Community Member Lonnbeimnech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkstar1996 View Post
    So it is Possible just there will be problems as of weapons and DC of spells. So probally my best option is to just have 1 arti to 20 and 1 wiz to 20. Hmmmm.... ok. Ill still try the Arti/Wiz see if it is possible and then i shall return with feedback. What do you think i should do for leveling AAWAAAAWWWWWWWWWWWWWW?
    I can tell you right now, without having tried it.

    It will work fine right up til you get to level 6, then your bow will not be doing enough damage to stop mobs and you will be back pedaling with 6 mobs chasing you and shooting one of them.

    once you get firewall/acid rain/icestorm you will find it difficult to slot glaciation/combustion etc items and will either need to swap out gear then wait a second for universal cooldown before casting a spell or cast without them and do really low damage.

    there is no synergy between kiting and dot-aoes, once you kite them out of the firewall they arent taking damage, and if you tank in the firewall and try to shoot, you will get 'you are not facing' error messages as the mobs circle around you.

    You will find the effectiveness of the xbow decrease more and more as you dont have insightful strikes, rapid reload, rapid fire, point blank shot, or precision and will stop using the bow in favor of spells like finger of death, mass hold, wail etc. except these will fail more often then you like as well, there is a reason people tr their casters so much, they want better dc and spell pen, and you would have less than you're average first lifer.

  16. #16
    Hero Gkar's Avatar
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    1 Arti for repeater and trapskills (especially if wiz) is the way to go. I've seen it played quite effectively.

  17. #17
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    I think it basically comes down to the added "free DPS" you get from a repeater you can just set on auto-attack while you fire spells is always going to be outweighed by the spell DPS you lose from fewer Wiz levels and feats not spent on metas and DC boosters.

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