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  1. #1
    Community Member Shade's Avatar
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    Default All Giants still knockback every hit, and CC effects still often lag

    Just a report that this release note isn't working:
    Giants now prefer sword swings to stomps, and non-named giants only apply knockdown on critical hits.
    Every swing still knocks back from all giants. In fact it's worse then before as they knock you back no matter what, even if you dodge/they miss/incorporeal.

    Also the DC on their knockdown from rock tosses is broken/ridiculously high - My 80+ strength barbarian failed every single save even on rolls of 15+. And this was versus standard epic normal trash giants.

    Blocking did correctly prevent the knock back.

    Also had several giants sliding around on their back after I tripped them (usually with lay waste since they seem to all have insane Str values that prevent me from landing any regular trips even with an extremely good DC).

    Leme check the release note on that:
    A number of steps have been taken to improve monster responsiveness to crowd control status effects, and reduce sliding:

    applying blind in addition to daze no longer allows monsters to ignore daze
    paralyze, stun, daze, stone, fascinate, mesmerize, etc.. now immediately stop monsters from moving.
    mm I guess trip wasn't listed, It should immediately stop them the same as those effects though.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
    Just a report that this release note isn't working:
    its much more efficient to just list things that are working in release notes. it will save you from carpal tunnel syndrome. just sayin...

  3. #3
    The Hatchery DarkForte's Avatar
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    Knockdown != knockback.
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  4. #4
    Community Member Jay203's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
    Just a report that this release note isn't working:


    Every swing still knocks back from all giants. In fact it's worse then before as they knock you back no matter what, even if you dodge/they miss/incorporeal.
    silly axer, you read knockdown as knockback
    PS: Greensteel RUINED the game! and you all know it!
    less buffing, more nerfing!!!
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  5. #5
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    Trying to use a STR DC (Trip) on Giants doesn't seem a good idea to me anyway. Aren't they GIANTS and supposed to have a hell high STR?

    And as others have said, Knockback isn't Knockdown.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
    Every swing still knocks back from all giants. In fact it's worse then before as they knock you back no matter what, even if you dodge/they miss/incorporeal.
    This aggravates the hell out of me, especially when it happens on a pure miss...Dodge, Concealment, Incorporeal...the wind of their mighty whiff blows me backwards?

  7. #7
    Lamannia Coordinator SqueakofDoom's Avatar
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    Thank you for bringing this to my attention. Unfortunately, it looks like this fix did not quite make it into this Lamannia build.

  8. #8
    The Hatchery CaptainSpacePony's Avatar
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    Great feedback, Shade.
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  9. #9
    Community Member Ovrad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
    Every swing still knocks back from all giants. In fact it's worse then before as they knock you back no matter what, even if you dodge/they miss/incorporeal.
    It's not worse than before, it's exactly the same. Every swings from giants always pushed you back regardless of miss/dodge/incorporeal/concealment. It never made sense of course, but that's not new.

  10. #10
    Scholar Of Adventure & Hero Missing_Minds's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ovrad View Post
    It's not worse than before, it's exactly the same. Every swings from giants always pushed you back regardless of miss/dodge/incorporeal/concealment. It never made sense of course, but that's not new.
    And it has always irriated the heck into me. If I'm not hit, I should NOT be knocked back.

    That visual bouncing is really irritating and I bet lag causing as it is forcing client/server position arguments.

  11. #11
    Hero nibel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Missing_Minds View Post
    And it has always irriated the heck into me. If I'm not hit, I should NOT be knocked back.
    They missed because your character jumped back at the right moment, of course.
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  12. #12
    Community Member Shade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay203 View Post
    silly axer, you read knockdown as knockback
    Perhaps, but they also still knockdown on non-critical hits too, so the report is still useful and accurate to the fact they note is wrong/not yet implemented.

    And they have changed.. Years ago their rocks never inflicted knockdowns at all, only their stomp did. Now they do on every toss.

    Plus they sped up all there animations, so the knockback is more annoying then ever as its more frequent.

    I do vaguely recall some years back fighting the threnal giants on my ancient ac wf, and occasionally not getting knockbacked.. Could be wrong, but a lot of things about the game were actually more polished back then.

  13. #13
    Community Member Shade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tid12 View Post
    Trying to use a STR DC (Trip) on Giants doesn't seem a good idea to me anyway. Aren't they GIANTS and supposed to have a hell high STR?
    When your a barbarian with 80+ Strength, a +15 vertigo armor and a total DC in the 70+ range, hell yea a str DC should 100% work against giants.

    On normal difficulty, monsters stats are meant ot be fairly close to pnp, and yea giants have high str, but not "hell" str:
    http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/giant.htm
    Hill Giant: Str 25, Fire Giant: Str 29, maybe add a few more the higher CRs, 36ish tops.. = +13, d20 +13 = 33 tops, yet they always save against a freaking DC 70+ -- Broken.

    I'd expect epic elite giants to often save against my DC, not not normal trash I can just 1 shot anyways. It's poor game design.

    They just pump the str to up there damage, which is pathetic anyways as it's then ultra scaled down by the EN dmg scaling code..
    When they could easily instead give them reasonable str values and just up there base damage.

  14. #14
    Community Member Jay203's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
    When your a barbarian with 80+ Strength, a +15 vertigo armor and a total DC in the 70+ range, hell yea a str DC should 100% work against giants.

    On normal difficulty, monsters stats are meant ot be fairly close to pnp, and yea giants have high str, but not "hell" str:
    http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/giant.htm
    Hill Giant: Str 25, Fire Giant: Str 29, maybe add a few more the higher CRs, 36ish tops.. = +13, d20 +13 = 33 tops, yet they always save against a freaking DC 70+ -- Broken.

    I'd expect epic elite giants to often save against my DC, not not normal trash I can just 1 shot anyways. It's poor game design.

    They just pump the str to up there damage, which is pathetic anyways as it's then ultra scaled down by the EN dmg scaling code..
    When they could easily instead give them reasonable str values and just up there base damage.
    yupz, i think we'll need to start weakening of enfeebling those giants just to see how much str they have
    and as long as i've played, their swings have always pushed back o-o

    though the rock throwing... may have been a side effect from the EDs
    PS: Greensteel RUINED the game! and you all know it!
    less buffing, more nerfing!!!
    to make it easier for those of you that wants to avoid me in game, all my characters are in "Bladesworn Mercenaries"

  15. #15
    Community Member die's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
    When your a barbarian with 80+ Strength, a +15 vertigo armor and a total DC in the 70+ range, hell yea a str DC should 100% work against giants.

    On normal difficulty, monsters stats are meant ot be fairly close to pnp, and yea giants have high str, but not "hell" str:
    http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/giant.htm
    Hill Giant: Str 25, Fire Giant: Str 29, maybe add a few more the higher CRs, 36ish tops.. = +13, d20 +13 = 33 tops, yet they always save against a freaking DC 70+ -- Broken.

    I'd expect epic elite giants to often save against my DC, not not normal trash I can just 1 shot anyways. It's poor game design.

    They just pump the str to up there damage, which is pathetic anyways as it's then ultra scaled down by the EN dmg scaling code..
    When they could easily instead give them reasonable str values and just up there base damage.
    When a player character, the size of a giants shin bone has double the str, of a giant then there is somthing really wrong with this game just stupid imo.

    Hell i think i have a wiz some were with the str of a Fire giant ...
    Last edited by die; 02-06-2013 at 11:04 PM.
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  16. #16
    Community Member Shade's Avatar
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    Yesterdays update:

    Most of the previously listed changes made it in I think:

    - Trash giants now only knockdown on critical rock throws. Didn't notice any on stomps or swings.
    - The DC is still brokenly high.. Trash giant in explorer area: Roll a 15 + 25 and failed.

    - My trips started to work well, so I think they lowered there str to more reasonable numbers. Still have to use my +15 vert armor to be effective, which is still a poor balance considering they were just epic normal giants, but oh well, at least it works.

    Also checked out my sorc - probably not changes from yesterdays update, but havent mentioned them before so ill jot them here:
    - Logged in and had no active destiny.. This bug will scare lots of players, as when I went to re-get one, it appeared I had no destiny xp.. But it showed up after i made shiradi active again.. I actaully still had acess to all shiradis abilties iwthout the destiny tho, so really weird bug.

    Tried it out in my usual test quest for him (EE VoN1) : Noticed the list of Double rainbow effects got updated..
    Overall it seems a bit weaker for the more common effects, but has mostly the same rare powerful effects, and some fun new effects:
    - Light of something: 1d2 neg lvls aoe to all other mobs when mob dies i think.
    - The gathering storm: Everytime you hit this monster you gain +1 damage, +1 str and +1 AC? iirc.. Didn't work for spells anyways, maybe melee only.

    These are most likely upcoming enhancements, as thats usually the source of shiradis effects.

  17. #17
    Community Member Shade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by die View Post
    When a player character, the size of a giants shin bone has double the str, of a giant then there is somthing really wrong with this game just stupid imo.

    Hell i think i have a wiz some were with the str of a Fire giant ...
    Players geared and experienced enough to deal with epic elite enemies should be comparable to epic elite enemies.. Not normal enemies.

    So yes I'd expect an epic elite giant to be stronger then my barbarian (well usually, he can hit ... 115 strength).. But normal ones? No.

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