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  1. #21
    Community Member Eilierie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tobril View Post
    Ah OK.

    Without a defined purpose I don't have much in the
    way of specifics to say.

    I will say that for me monks are lot easier to keep up and
    running than my barb, though there are skilled and geared
    barbs that can perform at a high level as well.

    It sounds like you're still trying to "discover" what you
    really like and I hope you find something that really
    sings for you.
    Well I love playing a Sorceror, haven't played it since the wail bug... probably should go ahead and TR... but yea I've trouble with finding a melee that fits me. I thought my halfling light monk would do the trick but I'm liking the Dark Monk better.

  2. #22
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    I have just TR'd my 12monk/7fighter/1 rogue WF Melee Tank build that was also built as a double stun tactics build.

    It was an awful lot of fun and as a Warforged Melee it was surprising how hard it was to kill.

    Going some sort of monk split Pyjama Tank still has some advantages over the Stock Standard Sword and Board Builds, these typically being: Shadow Fade, (this is awesome) Stunning Fist, (Fantastic Mob CC) in most cases DPS, superior Heal Amp and Improved Evasion.

    If I was building as a tank, I'm thinking 6 Fighter is superior to 6 Pally as your Pre from the Fighter/Pally should definately be either Stalwart or Defender. So best split is 12monk/6fighter/2pally. Two extra feats is just too hard to pass up.
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  3. #23
    Community Member Eilierie's Avatar
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    I wanted to leave some more feedback on this build.

    I'm about to take take level 13. When I hit 12 I was able to put on Garments of Equilibrium and upgrade to Vampiric Stonedust Wraps.

    I LOVE IT ! At level 12 I was able to guide a lvl 17 guildy through the Subterrane. I thought I would get wiped out ! so other than some spot healing from my guildy from when I took a big hit I was able to make it through the SubT.

    I then later guided a guildy through the Vale of Twilight - never made it to the Orthon/Devil area - but no issues at all running through the other areas of the Vale with a LEVEL 12 !!!

    I remember my first life 28 pt barbarian and first life 28 pt Sorc builds, that was a painful experience - I don't totally outright own the content with this Monk build but I can hang in there in over level content and I have an Elite BB streak of 60 or so while soloing content on Elite; did I say: I LOVE IT !!!

    So anyhow other major "twink" gear would be Cinder's Dance which I found at the Pawn broker for cheap ; GS goggles of smoke: +5 Reflex, +20 hp, 20% conceal ( still not sure if that stacks with Shadow Fade? ) +2 Exc Dex; unsuppressed Pale Lavender; Jidz Tetka and Charged Gauntlets round out what I'm using other than your standard +6 Wise +6 CHA

    So no stance and no buffs I stand at - 22/17/22/13/28/16. Fort/Reflex/Will are 22/19/22 can run through most Elite traps no problem. 287 HP unbuffed, highest I've hit so far was like 364 or something in Earth stance.

    Stunning Fist lands 80% of the time.

    So yea.... did I say I LOVE IT !!!

  4. #24
    Community Member Jingwei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eilierie View Post
    ( still not sure if that stacks with Shadow Fade? )
    Shadow fade provides miss chance due to being incorporeal. Other things that provide incorporeal miss chance: wraith form (Pale master) and ghostly items (cloak of night, cloak of invisibility, ring of the stalker, ring of shadows, etc).

    This stacks with things that provide miss chance based on concealment (blur, displacement, smoke/ GS, cloud spell effects, etc).

    So, for example, if you are using both displacement and shadow fade you'd have a 'hit' chance of .75 (shadow fade, incorporeal) * .50 (displacement, concealment) = .375 (or, if you prefer, a miss chance of 62.5%).

    Note that true seeing, which all raid bosses have, will bypass (illusion & concealment) miss chance, like blur and displacement. Though it won't bypass cloud based concealment, which is why you usually saw Harry with a couldkill on him.

    A few other monsters also cast true seeing, I can think of the hobgoblins in gianthold, some of the wildmen in attack on stormreach?, and maybe some of the tieflings in shavarath.

  5. #25
    Community Member Therigar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eilierie View Post
    .... also I thought I needed 10 CHA for one of the Epic destinies - GMoF ? ( with +6 item, etc, etc )
    AFAIK there are no stat requirements for any ED. There are stat requirements for some epic feats and there are heroic feat/enhancement requirements for some epic enhancements within trees (for example, Confront Any Foe in Unyielding Sentinal requires the ability to turn undead -- a class granted feat). However, AFAIK, there is nothing that will impact monks per se.

    However, if there were it is unlikely that items will stack to qualify the requirement. This is a fairly standard thing in DDO -- only base stats count (starting value + stat increases at level up + tome). Augmented stats via gear do not count. It is the pre-gear stat value that is measured.

  6. #26
    Community Member Eilierie's Avatar
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    Thank you Jingwei and Therigar for clearing those items up.

    I try to learn a little bit each day, even though I've been playing for almost 4 years I still feel like a total newb sometimes. Especially when they change stuff up and still have incorrect in game descriptions or some of the good old threads like threads about AC no longer apply.

  7. #27
    Community Member Eilierie's Avatar
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    I meant to update this more pre-19 but I basically haven't played in 6 months due to work. So this is little help now but this build rocked all the way to Lvl 22. Tharak wraps and Grave wraps were cleaning up the place. Could solo most elite content.

    Sooo.... bringing this back from the dead, I logged today for first time in 6 months - I was just getting used to the new PRR and AC system and now a new Enhancement system is here.

    After playing around a bit I see I lost my Greater Mountain Stance, lost a good bit of HP, etc, etc.

    I played with new enhancements some - did Half Elf Rogue Dilly, Kensai mostly, Sacred Defenders was nice for the extra lay on hands without much investment, and went with Henshin to get animal stance.

    Long story short, still trying to wrap my head around all the new enhancements - with what I quickly fleshed out already the build is a shell of its former self. If anyone can recommend new enhancements to get the same effects as I used to have that would be great. I didn't go for the new shadow fade because I don't want/need short swords with the new Ninja Spy - am I stuck taking that crud to get the Shadow Fade ( I know its not called Shadow Fade anymore but I'm not going to look it up ) ?

    Shall I burn my free +20 ? and go with ? I liked the pajama tank as it were before u19 - I was last man standing against Harry on a couple of occasions though my DPS was kinda weak ( lack of appropriate wraps for Harry ) so I wouldn't mind a build in the same vein as this - or maybe I'll just go ahead and TR now for the monk past life ( though I would like to grind a little more Epic Destiny.... )

    Thanks for any help ! it is appreciated

    *edit - guess it was more like 5 months.....

  8. #28
    Community Member Therigar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eilierie View Post
    I logged today for first time in 6 months - I was just getting used to the new PRR and AC system and now a new Enhancement system is here.

    After playing around a bit I see I lost my Greater Mountain Stance, lost a good bit of HP, etc, etc.
    Some things are not gone, just credited to the character differently.

    In the case of stances monks now get the starting stances at level 1 and then automatically get upgrades at levels 6, 12 and 18. To use the stance find the feat for earth, wind, water or fire and open the list box. Now pull the stance out to your hotbar. It will automatically activate the highest stance type that you have -- basic, adept, master or grandmaster -- depending on how many monk levels you have and which of the mastery feats you were auto granted.

    If you have a multiclass character with at least 1 level of monk you can choose adept, master and grandmaster forms as feat selections at levels 6, 12 and 18 respectively. Thus it is possible since U19 to have a level 1 monk and to also have grandmaster forms. Each form is a prerequisite to the next in the line, so you would have to select adept for master and master for grandmaster.

    One of the big advantages of the new enhancement system is that you can select characteristics from any of the prestige paths. It is very common to mix Ninja Spy and Shintao. Obviously other combinations are available depending on what a player wants from the character.

    As to using the +20 LR, that isn't necessary in all likelihood. If your class splits are what you want and your stats are solid then you should not waste the LR. Instead just make the adjustments in your enhancements. With U19 comes the ability to change enhancements on the fly by using CTRL R. This brings up the enhancement trees and, for a price, you can reset the enhancements. AFAIK this only applies in common areas, I don't think you can do this inside of quests. I could be wrong about that, I just have a vague memory of trying it during quests on Lamannia and it not working inside the quest.

    A bit of feedback on your current L22 build might help us to give better advice.

  9. #29
    Community Member Raoull's Avatar
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    Your build will largely do fine as is, you'll just need to redo enhancements in the new era.

    One important note on something that is confusing. You still have Tier 3 stances.... but they aren't separate abilities. Just go into Earthstance and if you check your stats you'll find you are automatically using the Tier 3 stance.

    Big gains:
    -stunning DC. You can now pick up +3 DC from kensai even with just a 2 fighter splash, and unlike before you don't need to take Stunning blow
    -DR breaking. You can, and probably should take Henshin up to the lvl 12 core ability. DR breaking and Hamp.
    -Shadow fade without being a dark monk. I've swapped my feat to light for the Healing curse ability to make everything Vampiric. very nice....
    -Some nice stuff from the Knight of the Chalice tree. You can get +1d6 to all evil monsters, and depending on your Cha, Divine Might is often much better now.
    -More PRR.... +15 PRR for guys who use earth stance

    Big losses:
    -HPs in defender stance. Defender stance seems to always get the shaft... I've stopped using it on the monk build I have that can. If I were to regear specifically to tank something I may go back to it... but maybe not. I can get +10 PRR and 3% HPs from a Tier 5 Shintao Enh... which is exclusive with Defender Stance (yet doesn't block rage).
    -Halfelves.... have taken a huge dive. They can still do what they used to, but it takes putting many points into your racial tree that you could better spend elsewhere. As I got to the point where most of my toons were Helf... I can't say I blame them. I don't think it is underpowered now necessarily, just not nearly as good as it was.



    Don't worry too much about taking crud enhancements to open up key things. While you can get out of hand, Ninja Fade is pretty easy to open up with all good abilities, if you ignore the true "core" abilities. So you need to waste 2 points, but then you need to spend 8 more to unlock Fade. You can put all those 8 points into Sneak damage, Dodge bonus and Reflex bonus, all of which are quite worthwhile. Honestly, you'll blow more points in the 4 points in KotC in wasted abilities (probably turns or smites) to unlock the +1d6 holy damage / Divine Might (and possibly Hamp and other higher things) than the 2 points "wasted" in Ninja.
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  10. #30
    Community Member Eilierie's Avatar
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    Therigar - sorry for the ramble but after browsing through the enhancements, that is how jumbled my brain is lol, will follow on more later as wrap head around changes, thank you.

    Raoull - that was a good summary and helped me follow the "big picture", I only opened up the Helf branches for the healing amp.... may rethink that though... thank you.

  11. #31
    Community Member Eilierie's Avatar
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    I'm getting ready to TR this into my 3rd life. I figured the new enhancements out... *kinda*... and the build has been good for most content, even ran some EE content with it. Legendary Dreadnought made the build pretty fun to *off-tank* with. Overall I still love the build, and though it is very survivable the DPS is a little anemic. I'm sure I can improve a lot of areas as far as DPS goes. Hardest thing to overcome is just learning all the new changes because I'm such a casual player (only a couple hours a week) ! This is the first time I ever spent any time leveling out destinies so I *kinda* got my head wrapped around how that works now too, though I am far, far, far from knowing what synergizes best. I am working on GMoF right now after grinding over from Fury of the Wild.

    Anyhow, I wish I was good enough to make these builds and *pick all the right feats, enhancements and destinies* but with my work load combined with school work load I just don't have enough time to really get my hands dirty and still have time to play.

    So I will have a barbarian past life and now a monk past life, next I want to do a pally past life - so if anyone can help me flesh out a path for my next life I would really appreciate it.

    I was looking at 12pally 6 monk 2 fighter ? Handwrap pajama tank build. Originally before all the changes to enhancements I was leaning towards Hunter of the Dead with all the immunities it used to give. I see that the immunities are still there but it seems like you have to go up a lot higher in the Tiers to get them now.

    Thanks !

  12. #32
    Community Member Jingwei's Avatar
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    For paladin/monk, hunter of the dead was about the extra healing amp, not about the immunities. If you are human, you can manage something like 300% healing amp. That means that if you are running both fists of light and vapiric stonedust wraps, you are getting about 6 or more hit points every time you hit something.

  13. #33
    Community Member Eilierie's Avatar
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    Took a few minutes of game time and tried to put something together. Not liking what I came up with, was going for Dex based damage to keep my reflex skills high... sigh... thoughts ? (as I said I'm not really good at this) basic objective - Pally past life, tanky DPSer self healing...

    Code:
    Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 04.19.03
    DDO Character Planner Home Page
    
    Murgod 
    Level 20 Lawful Good Human Male
    (2 Fighter \ 12 Paladin \ 6 Monk) 
    Hit Points: 320
    Spell Points: 224 
    BAB: 18\18\23\28\28
    Fortitude: 21
    Reflex: 15
    Will: 15
    
                      Starting          Feat/Enhancement
    Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
    (36 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
    Strength             10                    10
    Dexterity            16                    19
    Constitution         16                    16
    Intelligence          8                     8
    Wisdom               16                    18
    Charisma             12                    12
    
                      Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                     Base Skills         Modified Skills
    Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
    Balance               7                    16
    Bluff                 1                     1
    Concentration         3                     5
    Diplomacy             1                     1
    Disable Device       n/a                   n/a
    Haggle                1                     1
    Heal                  4                    27
    Hide                  3                     4
    Intimidate            1                     1
    Jump                  4                    12
    Listen                3                     4
    Move Silently         3                     4
    Open Lock             n/a                   n/a
    Perform               n/a                   n/a
    Repair               -1                    -1
    Search               -1                    -1
    Spellcraft            0                     2.5
    Spot                  3                     4
    Swim                  0                     0
    Tumble                4                     5
    Use Magic Device      2.5                   3
    
    Level 1 (Monk)
    Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Barbarian
    Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Monk
    Feat: (Selected) Power Attack
    Feat: (Monk Bonus) Stunning Fist
    Feat: (Human Bonus) Two Weapon Fighting
    
    
    Level 2 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Finesse
    
    
    Level 3 (Paladin)
    Feat: (Deity) Follower of the Sovereign Host
    Feat: (Selected) Past Life: Disciple of the Fist
    
    
    Level 4 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Focus: Bludgeoning Weapons
    
    
    Level 5 (Monk)
    Feat: (Monk Bonus) Dodge
    
    
    Level 6 (Monk)
    Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Harmonious Balance: Fists of Light
    Feat: (Selected) Power Critical
    
    
    Level 7 (Monk)
    
    
    Level 8 (Monk)
    
    
    Level 9 (Monk)
    Feat: (Selected) Cleave
    Feat: (Monk Bonus) Mobility
    
    
    Level 10 (Paladin)
    
    
    Level 11 (Paladin)
    
    
    Level 12 (Paladin)
    Feat: (Selected) Toughness
    
    
    Level 13 (Paladin)
    
    
    Level 14 (Paladin)
    
    
    Level 15 (Paladin)
    Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Bludgeoning Weapons
    
    
    Level 16 (Paladin)
    
    
    Level 17 (Paladin)
    
    
    Level 18 (Paladin)
    Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting
    
    
    Level 19 (Paladin)
    
    
    Level 20 (Paladin)

  14. #34
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    How badly do you need/want Defensive stance? I was thinking WIS-based monk 16 / pal 2 / ftr 2 would be a pretty nice hate-tank with good Stunning Fist & Quivering Palm DCs and high saves from Divine Grace (twist in Bane of Undeath if you want Div Might too). The main drawback would be losing the threat amp from Sacred D.

  15. #35
    Community Member Eilierie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    How badly do you need/want Defensive stance? I was thinking WIS-based monk 16 / pal 2 / ftr 2 would be a pretty nice hate-tank with good Stunning Fist & Quivering Palm DCs and high saves from Divine Grace (twist in Bane of Undeath if you want Div Might too). The main drawback would be losing the threat amp from Sacred D.
    that is basically what I have now

    I'm asking about next life where I want to knock out the pally past life

    guess i should have just made a new thread
    Last edited by Eilierie; 11-23-2013 at 03:38 PM.

  16. #36
    Community Member Jingwei's Avatar
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    What tomes have you eaten?

    Also, do you mean to just TR when you hit 20, or do you intent to play 'for a while' before TRing again?

    But, I'd go something like:
    Human

    S 14
    D 15 (needs at least +2 tome for gtwf)
    C 14
    I 8
    W 16 (level ups here)
    C 14

    Feat list, something like:
    mark of passage
    power attack
    twf
    itwf
    gtwf
    ic: blunt
    stunning fist
    master of forms
    gm of forms
    past life: monk
    dodge
    cleave
    great cleave (unless female, then mobility; unarmed great cleave animations for human and helf females is gimpy)

    Early level gear
    jidz-teka (fire stance)
    acid handwraps of bleeding
    robe of invulnerability

    Mid-levels
    Frozen tunic
    vampiric stonedust handwraps
    deception item (ring of lies, backstabber's gloves, etc)

    Lvl 14
    Lvl 16 frozen tunic with masterful craftsmanship
    (if switching to earth stance here, change to ML 15 masterful bracers of the wind)

    enhancements: rush up the human and shintao trees for 200% healing amp, so that you start getting 2 hp back from fists of light and lesser vampirism. Next objective is shadow fade.

    Being in fire stance with the jidz-teka lets you keep all your elemental attacks and stunning fist on constant cooldown. You should be throwing your elemental fist attacks constantly, and relying on fire stance to keep you in enough ki to do that. If in a group, then you might not be getting enough hits in, especially once you stun the target and they go down right away. If so, then just keep stunning fist on cooldown.

    You can think about switching to earth stance at level 14, if you can get 200% healing amp with paladin enhancements. Otherwise, you'll be in fire stance until you can equip the PDK gloves at 20.

    The mark of passage is useful for not needing to equip a striding item, plus the ddoor ability is always useful. In addition, it gives you something to spend in the human tree that you'll find useful.

  17. #37
    Community Member Eilierie's Avatar
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    Yes for pally life I will run to 20 and TR.

    I logged to check I have eaten -

    STR +2
    DEX +4
    CON +2
    INT +3
    WIS +4
    CHA +2

    I got most everything gear wise you talked about, got most named gear that a Monk would want.... still trying to get the right rune for Dragontouched heal amp.... ( if build works well, which is why im bothering to try and plan it out, I will pally x 3 )

    I see I selected Power Critical and Mobility vs GTWF and Great Cleave and I think I get that but...

    I took Weapon Finesse where you didn't ? I was thinking of putting build points into dex, wis or int instead of str I guess ( but i think that locked me out of GTWF ? ) because for build points into DEX instead of str I could get reflex and dps ?

    Thanks for the feedback
    Last edited by Eilierie; 11-24-2013 at 09:29 AM.

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