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  1. #1
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    Default Likely intensely newbie question about my Artificer!

    Hi! Really new player here. Unlocked Artificer today because I was super excited at the idea of playing one. I had a little question because I'm using the character generator and something is bugging me.

    I'm probably not going to be able to afford any stat tomes, sadly Just not something I'll be able to do (unless you can buy them/find them in-game? That would be wonderful!) I keep reading the Artificers need to have 19 DEX for Improved Precise Shot around level 16 or so. Obviously, the feat looks amazing and seems very important so I hashed out a few ideas!

    You should have seen the little new guy lightbulb go off over my head! I would take Elven Dexterity and Half-Elf Rogue Dexterity enhancements to hit 19! Then I could pour all of my points into intelligence! Brilliant!...?

    Perhaps not. I'm running the character generator now and even though I have 19 DEX, I cannot access Improved Precise Shot. Are my dreams shattered? Do the elf/dilly enhancements not count towards feats? I have all the other prereqs so it's really frustrating.

    So yeah. I suppose this boils down to two questions (and I'll toss in some other newbie ones on the end that are more general and less Artificer if anybody wants to help)

    Question 1: Do the Elven Dexterity/Half-Elf Rogue Dexterity Enhancements count towards feats such as Improved Precise Shot? Is the character generator just being goofy?

    Question 2: If not, is IPS really necessary? It looks great and I don't want to miss it. Is there any other way to get the 19 DEX without spending a ton on a tome? I'm a new player that only has access to 28-point builds as well : (

    Question 3: Is it worth getting the +4 stat buff spells if I'll have +4 or better equips? They don't stack, do they?

    Thanks so much in advance for any and all help! If somebody answers my question I'll throw my build up here and see what you guys think : D

    Thanks!

  2. #2
    Community Member RTN's Avatar
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    It only counts your starting score, level ups and tomes. Enhancements don't count towards those types of prereqs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RTN View Post
    It only counts your starting score, level ups and tomes. Enhancements don't count towards those types of prereqs.
    Oh, bother. Alright! Looking on my server AH (Cannith) the +2 tomes are about 100-200k pp X-x guess I better get to work on that...

  4. #4
    Community Member fco-karatekid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bertemusdorsi View Post
    Oh, bother. Alright! Looking on my server AH (Cannith) the +2 tomes are about 100-200k pp X-x guess I better get to work on that...
    And yes, up to +5 tomes drop within the game. I have had +2 dex tomes drop in Red Fens rare encounters chests, so those are not very hard to find. Of course, by that time, 100-200k plat should be attainable as well... start with GuntherBovine's guide here http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=351343 as a primer, there have been other guides on the forum, but his gets you into the right mindset as a new player.

    Also keep in mind that you also have to meet BAB requirement - so although you might have 19 dex, if you're not up to the minimum BAB, you might have to wait a level or two.

    EDIT:

    Is IPS really necessary?

    No, but once you've played with IPS, you will NEVER play another ranged character without it. Once you get the hang of lining up the mobs, it REALLY shows ranged capability. ESPECIALLY down below 17-18 where crowd controllers like stat drainers on hit or poison will have almost every trash mob your bolts touch helpless or asleep.

    Question 3: Is it worth getting the +4 stat buff spells if I'll have +4 or better equips? They don't stack, do they?


    No and No; but given they're level 2 spells, it's also not harmful to do so, with one caveat...

    You can buy all those buff scrolls in spell shops like the arty vendor in cannith (Take a right as soon as you walk in the door from the marketplace).

    You SHOULD (this is the caveat) consider taking Curative Admixture: Cure Moderate Wounds (it's in the same level as the stat buff spells) during one of your level ups. It is only found in chests and cannot be bought in the stores. That said, if you HAVE to have one of the stat spells, don't stress it - Curative Admixture: Cure Moderate Wounds WILL more than likely drop in a chest before you get level 8.

    See http://ddowiki.com/page/The_Rare_Artificer_Scroll_List for other scrolls that only drop in chest which you should also consider taking during level ups.

    My arty found every one of those scrolls in chests within 2-3 ranks of being able to cast them... patience is a virtue (for the frugal arty, heh).

    If you happen not to have a +4 item and have the spell slots available, knock yourself out - but also keep in mind at lower levels, the potion or scroll versions of each of these _can_ match or exceed the duration of the spell version for a level or two (couple more if you multiclass something). For those, it's a choice - conserve plat or conserve SP. Once you get plat built up, it starts becoming the sacrificial lamb so you can cast your turret more often. As does your backpack space
    Last edited by fco-karatekid; 01-19-2013 at 12:07 AM.

  5. #5
    Community Member Singular's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bertemusdorsi View Post
    Oh, bother. Alright! Looking on my server AH (Cannith) the +2 tomes are about 100-200k pp X-x guess I better get to work on that...
    You will get one +2 tome when you reach 1750 favor - so you can feel free to put your Dex at 17 or 16 and use one level up. You'll get to 1750 favor pretty quickly if you run each quest on elite up to level 14 or so. Plus, this is your first character and it sounds like you don't want to spend money, so I imagine you'll be doing runs for favor and xp.

    If you were on Thelanis, I'd just pass you a +2 Dex tome - they're unnecessary after you'll pulled one, so not super valuable, to be honest.

    Otherwise, as fco-karatekid wrote above, by the time you're level 16, you have enough plat to pick one off the AH.

  6. #6
    Community Member fco-karatekid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Singular View Post
    You will get one +2 tome when you reach 1750 favor - so you can feel free to put your Dex at 17 or 16 and use one level up. You'll get to 1750 favor pretty quickly if you run each quest on elite up to level 14 or so. Plus, this is your first character and it sounds like you don't want to spend money, so I imagine you'll be doing runs for favor and xp.

    If you were on Thelanis, I'd just pass you a +2 Dex tome - they're unnecessary after you'll pulled one, so not super valuable, to be honest.

    Otherwise, as fco-karatekid wrote above, by the time you're level 16, you have enough plat to pick one off the AH.
    I forgot about that, good call. I also assumed (s)he owned Red Fens, which was a bad assumption on my part. Dunno whatit is about Fens, but that rare vine monster has a tendency to drop tomes on my characters.

  7. #7
    Community Member Singular's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fco-karatekid View Post
    I forgot about that, good call. I also assumed (s)he owned Red Fens, which was a bad assumption on my part. Dunno whatit is about Fens, but that rare vine monster has a tendency to drop tomes on my characters.
    No kidding! That's good to know! Are they bound? If not, I'll make sure to hit it on my next TR

    If so, I'll hit it on my alts that are going unused b/c of my TRing...

  8. #8
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    Quick addenda to the answers others have already provided...

    -You can afford a +2 tome for a given stat. They cost ~100k or so, which you can easily make just running missions, selling your junk and occasionally putting something useful up on the AH for a couple K. My L6 TR already earned like 75k, just putting good starter weapons up for 5-10k apiece.

    You might also try running L~6-8 quests on hard/elite. You can sometimes get +1 to +2 upgrade tomes, which are BtA, but let you enjoy the benefit of a +2 tome while paying the much lower price for a +1. You just have to, obviously, get lucky to pull one at all, and then double lucky to get one you need. I pulled a +1 to 2 Wisdom and Constitution running Lair of Summoning in the last few days.

    There's even better ways to grind out money, too, if you wanted, and you have some idea what's in demand...eg, never sell items you can extract Cannith crafting supplies from. You get the same amount of money back when you deconstruct them, plus essences you can collect and sell for more profit.

    -You get ONE free respec per character, so if you're really stuck, you can reboot him once. Just make sure you actually know what you're doing the second time through

    -People swear by IPS but I myself, as a soloist, find it often proves more trouble than its worth, compared to Archers Focus. But thats just my experience, solo, so take it for what its worth...I find it takes too much time and attention to keep two monsters lined up, instead of managing your runearm and offensive spells and healing and pet and hireling and kiting smartly. If you like running with others, then I'd say its probably worth it then as the tank will take care of position. You'll have to go with 17 base DEX, so your +2 tome takes you to 19 and you can put all your level-ups into INT (or CON, as necessary).

    -+4(/5/6) from gear does not stack with +4 from buff spells, so once you have buff gear, you can take the spells off your list. The only reason you'd still need the spells is to buff your hireling/pet to help with stat-based runes/levers/etc., but you can just carry wands for that. It is nice, though, that your average Arti can cover most Dex and Int checks, while your pet can cover Str and Con checks (and surprisingly, Cha checks), and a Cleric hireling will cover Wis. A decently equipped Arti can get all the Tears of Dhakaan, or deactivate security in Partycrashers, solo.
    Last edited by droid327; 01-20-2013 at 06:40 PM.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    -People swear by IPS but I myself, as a soloist, find it often proves more trouble than its worth, compared to Archers Focus. But thats just my experience, solo, so take it for what its worth...I find it takes too much time and attention to keep two monsters lined up, instead of managing your runearm and offensive spells and healing and pet and hireling and kiting smartly. If you like running with others, then I'd say its probably worth it then as the tank will take care of position.
    ^^This. When soloing, you have so much to manage as an artificer, my experience with IPS was that it wasn't as helpful as Archer's Focus (which comes with Precise Shot). I'd rather get a few shots off with my runearm than worry about lining up baddies. So, if I can get it, its nice for a few spots, but its not necessary.

  10. #10
    Community Member Singular's Avatar
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    Default IPS rocks :)

    Quote Originally Posted by smkalinowski View Post
    ^^This. When soloing, you have so much to manage as an artificer, my experience with IPS was that it wasn't as helpful as Archer's Focus (which comes with Precise Shot). I'd rather get a few shots off with my runearm than worry about lining up baddies. So, if I can get it, its nice for a few spots, but its not necessary.
    I have different experiences. On quests where you have distance between yourself and the baddies, then archer's focus is better. On quests where there's a lot of baddies, you just tab click to the end guy and do damage to each one running at you, thereby multiplying your damage output by each baddie.

    Another trick is to tab to the main bad guy, put some distance between you and it, and let the bad underlings run between you. The main baddie has the most hit points so can take your beating, but the underlings will fall - all the while you are doing damage to the main baddie.

    It takes a bit of practice, but for me, it's more fun maneuvering around opponents and hitting a whole bunch at once.

  11. #11
    Community Member Loriac's Avatar
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    Another way to get the rearmost mob quickly is to rebind tab to 'last target' rather than 'next target'; this will typically cycle through the mobs from back to front.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Singular View Post
    I have different experiences.
    More power to you and those you can use IPS effectively. I can see how its a powerful tool when its successful. But, I've tried the tabbing, and rekeying, and my bad guys just never line up right, I still only wind up shooting one guy.

    Anyway, my experiences were that trying to use IPS was like trying to photograph a two-year old. As soon as you pull out the camera, they start jumping around and screw up the shot.

  13. #13
    Community Member Loriac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smkalinowski View Post
    More power to you and those you can use IPS effectively. I can see how its a powerful tool when its successful. But, I've tried the tabbing, and rekeying, and my bad guys just never line up right, I still only wind up shooting one guy.

    Anyway, my experiences were that trying to use IPS was like trying to photograph a two-year old. As soon as you pull out the camera, they start jumping around and screw up the shot.
    The thing is, the advice not to slot IPS is very likely to cause problems down the road. Firstly, the temptation as soon as you decide to forego it is to drop dex down to free up build points. This is difficult to fix later on without an LR. Secondly, there are very few 'must have' feats in the game, but IPS almost certainly classes as one for a dedicated ranged character. Whilst at first it may be difficult to use it effectively (and it certainly isn't something that you can necessarily use most of the time) growing familiarity with playing a ranged character will increase ability with practice. To drop it entirely is to miss the opportunity to learn it through trial and error, and it will mean that you'll not be as good a player at endgame compared to someone who can use it effectively.

    It is a choice of course for everyone to make based on their own playstyle, but it cannot be emphasised enough that IPS is one of the critical feats that brings ranged overall dps up to comparable levels to melee. As such the decision to drop it entirely shouldn't be taken lightly, particularly not by newcomers to the ranged classes.



    TL;DR: If an individual player doesn't want to use IPS, thats entirely up to them and I fully accept that as long as you're having fun, thats what counts. However, dropping IPS isn't good advice to newbies to ranged combat.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Singular View Post
    ...tab to the main bad guy, put some distance between you and it, and let the bad underlings run between you. The main baddie has the most hit points so can take your beating, but the underlings will fall - all
    It takes a bit of practice, but for me, it's more fun maneuvering around opponents and hitting a whole bunch at once.
    How do you keep the underlings in front of the boss? Honest question... I find they too often "pack up" where theyre side by side. Or behind. Or the boss is too tall to hit the adds hitbox. Or the adds are ranged and dont move, while the boss gets in melee range and circles around you.

    Also, kiting precludes runearms fully charging

    Quote Originally Posted by Loriac View Post
    Another way to get the rearmost mob quickly is to rebind tab to 'last target' rather than 'next target'; this will typically cycle through the mobs from back to front.
    Until you pull aggro from a second pack further down the hall because you had autoattack on

    Quote Originally Posted by Loriac View Post
    TL;DR: If an individual player doesn't want to use IPS, thats entirely up to them and I fully accept that as long as you're having fun, thats what counts. However, dropping IPS isn't good advice to newbies to ranged combat.
    Its a first life arti...hell prob TR him anyway. I agree give IPS a shot, but Id worry more about learning to be effective with runearms, healing, offensive spells, and pet/hire management first, in that order. You can always use your freebie respec to add in IPS before you TR to give it a spin

  15. #15

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    I wouldn't worry so much about IPS and I use two arti's myself - a human arti that can scroll heal himself and a warforged.

    The key to arti's as I see it is 3 fold - good repeater, super strong rune arm and a well balanced spell such as BB and tactical detonation.

    That means giving myself a good amount of Dex and great amount of Int in order to use all these features at a maximum. Naturally the Int being for DC is required to take advantage of max amount of rune arm damage (some of the best rune arms in the game can be reflex saved so ensuring a good DC won't just help the rune arm but also help with the knock down effect with tactical detonation.

    The problem with repeaters are the following - DPS will be good until late game, but it will not help you in the end game. Due mostly because the critters will have a lot of HP and repeaters don't have enough DPS to be the single point of damage. Sure, there are nice repeaters out there, some epic but most of the really good ones are random pulls with multiple DPS type damage. My personal favorite is a triple earth GS repeater since lots of stuff takes acid damage in Eveningstar.

    I mention this because even with situational use of IPS you will never have enough line of critters to get the kind of DPS you'd love out of a repeater.

    So that brings me to the most important feature of arti's and what really makes the differense.

    Rune arms. Always do 2 primary - I can max out elemental damage in 2 as a human arti and 1 as a warforged (due to the fact that I also need to split a lil' into reconstruct).

    First - primary. Acid or Electricity. Basically Corruption of Nature/Glorious Obscenity (or the new Epic acid one out of TOR dropping in U17) or Toven's Hammer. Backup - force based. Be it the Eveningstar or the Mindsunder one.

    If you Max the acid one out - currently 120 Spell power with EE Shadowmail paired with fully upgraded E Cannith Rock Boots (superior acid lore) you get something like 300-1500 damage per acid shot (max charge). For Impulse you'll get something like 90-500 but it's force so few things with resist).

    If you want to maximize both types of rune arms, go with EH or EE Shadowmail with Impulse. That's 114-120 spell power for impulse with the benefit of greater arcane lore on the armor. That'll boost your BB's (impulse) and rune arm.

    Go with EE corruption of Nature (114 spell power acid) for acid rune arm with the Epic fully upgraded Rock Boots.

    That will maximize your force and acid damage. Also (alternative) think about what's coming in Update 17 and maybe add something like an Epic double crossbow. Add appropriate spell power augment (114) to the red augment slot in the repeater.

    Now THIS will give you he best option for arti as I see it.

    The reason why I mention this is that runearms together with repeater will make your journey towards 20 like a cakewalk. IPS or no IPS (I don't use it on my human arti since he's also my crafter so I use the 3 marks instead of some feats and he's still DPS king).

    However that's not true for level 20+ where repeater damage quickly becomes lackluster and where runearm DPS becomes super important.

    Now I mention spells. BB being one of the most iconic and best spells to use for kiting but where I think tactical detonation is one of the best 'crowd control' spells for a Arti. I say 'crowd control' - what I mean it'll disrupt mobs from being able to hit you effectivly and allow you to use rune arms and repeaters very effectivly.

    So to end my rant; don't worry so much about IPS - while tactical in nature I never had an issue with DPS or such using both repeater and rune arm together. And that's because I always maximized my rune arm DPS while levelling, making short work out of anything that tried to hit me. No need for feat based tactics.

    Here are two simple things you can use.

    Give your doggie all the aggro providing benefits. Through skill choice or even docent with intim or maybe adding a collar that increase aggro.

    Drop a fire turret now and then. They're like catnip to mobs. Then nuke the area with tactical detonation, drop a BB ontop of the fire turret and run in the peremiter of the BB.

    It works every time.

  16. #16
    Community Member Loriac's Avatar
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    I never said that IPS and ranged combat is the only thing an arti should concentrate on. As stated by patang01, an artificer has to combine ranged (50% of damage) with runearms (50% of damage) with spellcasting (battlefield control with tac det and prismatic). But the point is that an artificer has to learn to do all these things and combine them fluidly, which means learning to use ranged and runearm under pressure. If you want to split things up so you learn runearms in life 1, and then do a 2nd life to learn how to combine that with IPS/ranged, then sure do it that way, but in the end to play the class fully you have to learn all these things and use them together.

    I fully agree that runearms are critical to artificers - my view is that if you're not going to use the runearms to full effect, roll a different class. The runearms are quite strong, being essentially sp-free SLAs on a 6 second cooldown with varying effects depending on which one is chosen. Learning to use runearms takes a bit of patience and sometimes trial and error. If you're coming at it from a caster class, some of the techniques serve you well (jump firing in particular is very useful) whilst others not so much (kiting is much harder and less useful, as you move much more slowly when its charging, and it only goes to charge level 3 if you're moving).

    I also agree fully with spec'ing at least 2 different lines for your runearms, with one elemental and force being essential. Personally, I have spec'd force, acid and elec at 7/1/1 because against the relevant mobs, elemental runearms outdamage force so much its not even comparable.

    I think the dog is a bit of a dead end. It may be useful at low levels, but at high levels is much less so. If you do use it, my suggestion would be to make it as self-sufficient as possible (give it imp. evasion, full plating etc) and slot in a docent with heavy fort. Give it trip and an improved cursespewing of vertigo collar, and let it do what it wants. It will serve as a distraction and hopefully not die too quickly with that set up, but I find myself using it very infrequently at Level 23. I've also given mine intimidate and the sneak damage line, but he can't hold aggro once I start unloading into a mob.

    Things like flame turret are useful to around level 16, then watch them get swatted in two hits by angry mobs. Similarly, whilst blade barrier can be devastatingly effective, its not as useful for an arti as for a cleric or fvs. Their playstyles are much more mobile (particularly the fvs) and so kiting through blade barriers is easy. Artis have a choice: kite through BB, or use cc and runearms fully. For example, tac det and BB are mutually exclusive in that if you've put a mob on the ground, then your BB will be doing nothing to it for the duration. Thats not to say that BBs are to be avoided; far from it. But an artificer has to learn to use the right technique for the situation, rather than approach every problem in the same way. Thats why the class is fun.

  17. #17

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    I personally don't use BB after 20. For most part a critter will take about 300-700 per tick (properly boosted). I reserve BB's for lots of small critters - like bats and scorps and such. Plus most upper end critters have evasion so unless you have REALLY good Evocation most of it will be saved. And one of the reason why I don't use my Toven's anymore.

    My personal choice is to use repeater and rune arm for as much as possible with tactical deto to disrupt and knock down critters. As mentioned you'll see the big numbers from rune arm and the dependable DPS from repeaters.

    And I fully agree with the sentiment that if someone don't want to use the rune arm then it's better to move to a different class; an arti without rune arm means sub par DPS and okay support.

    I found that acid and force is a perfect way of getting the best out of rune arms and make repeaters situational for damage. That way I can max (on my human) acid spell power, crit chance and crit boost. Together with item and Rock boots that means 21% chance to crit (that's most likely going to be 1-2 per max charged bolts) for 700-1500 acid damage per crit.

    The most you can get with impulse is 18% crit, which is not bad but per bolt damage is slightly lower. The good is that very few things resist force and it's super important against those annoying epic wisps.

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    As far as pup strategies, I dont expect him to hold aggro...he might snag a couple trash mobs, and so much the better if he does, but I think its better to spec him for survivability (imp evasion and DR) and sneak damage, then put a good CC/debuff collar on him (converted Cormyrian handwraps) and just enjoy the extra DPS and occasional DoT/nuke proc. I never had a problem, really, with keeping him alive except against instakills, though I didnt make it all the way to L25 EE before I TRed my arti.

    That being said, in EE (from what I've heard) most of this is moot as your pets dont last in any case, and you dont want to be pulling multiple mobs anyway - so, going back to the original question, AF becomes more desirable again and you want to focus on single-target damage with your RA

  19. #19
    Community Member Singular's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    How do you keep the underlings in front of the boss? Honest question... I find they too often "pack up" where theyre side by side. Or behind. Or the boss is too tall to hit the adds hitbox. Or the adds are ranged and dont move, while the boss gets in melee range and circles around you.

    Also, kiting precludes runearms fully charging
    I use a variety of tactics, based on the environment.

    First, if there's a lot of mobs, I usually tac det (or lightning sphere, or both) at the beginning of any engagement, drop a bb, then
    Second, I try to continue to select the furthest mob from me (thanks Loriac for the great suggestion about re-keying tab)
    Third, I constantly move to max the capabilities of IPS. The rune arm can build to 3 while you're moving, then stop for the last two and fire. Sometimes that's not always possible and I just fire at 3 - especially if whatever mob you are targeting is near death, level 3 is fine.
    Fourth, if/when they surround you, drop bb, jump back and out, fire off a tac det.
    Fifth, as you're backing up, drop bbs when they will do extra damage and tac det to finish everyone off

    So I am constantly moving around. It won't maximize your rune arm damage against an end boss (you'll want to stand still for those), but for trash, selectively firing the rune arm when you know it will drop a mob works out better than spending extra seconds waiting for a full charge and overkilling the mob.

    Tips:

    - I use ghostly, blur and displacement (yes, displacement replaces blur). Getting a high dodge will help, too
    - The dog can either grab aggro or sneak trip mobs. Both helps you out. When soloing I use the dog, panther and a fvs, all on attack. You can use them as shields - they'll get in the way of mobs and that allows you to max IPS and aoe spells. In a group, rely on the DPS to do that for you. If you have strong melee in your party, they'll grab aggro and you can multiply your damage output through IPS, aiding the party a lot
    - I could make more use of cloud spells and grease to slow mobs down, actually.
    - When nicely lined up, use EF to drop everyone

    This strategy doesn't always work. Sometimes you'll just have one mob or the environment just isn't conducive to it. And sometimes the mob in front of you will be doing so much damage you have to make it your primary target, thereby removing the benefit of IPS (though you can prismatic strike those guys, too - I also EF if being attacked like that, keeping my target on a distant mob; it usually brings down the one in front of you quickly).

    But it's a ton of fun to move around, constantly adjusting for the battle. Stationary fighting just isn't for me.

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