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  1. #61
    Community Member Artos_Fabril's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    My suggestion was to make heal kits work like they did in NWN where they heal a secific amount per heal skill mod, with a cooldown long enough where they cant be spammed and short enough to still be effective (like 10-15 sec give or take). I see other people wanting to involve heal kits as well as it would make them, and the heal skill, actually usefull.
    I don't often agree with you, Chai, but I do like this idea.
    My suggestion would be a 10 second timer, restoring an amount equal to resting at a shrine with the same heal (or repair) skill, plus whatever bonus the kit grants. Put a 1 minute cooldown on it, and with an interuptable 10 second cast and the "tie shoes" animation, it's not going to be viable for combat healing.

    Along with this, I'd double the speed (halve the time) of wholeness of body. And buff paladins and rangers. Seriously, they need it.

  2. #62
    Community Member Zenako's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrkGrismer View Post
    They had a "Heroic Surge" ability but I don't think it ever made it to live, or if it did it didn't last very long. I don't remember as to why.

    Edit: http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=228947

    Looong answer: http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=223571

    Wow, mega flashbacks to a pretty epic thread back then. Not to mention major interactions with developers in it too. Have not seen some of those names in a long time.

    This was one great example of player feedback seriously changing the course of game development for a feature that would have frankly borked the game.
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  3. #63
    Community Member Dagolar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dejafu View Post
    Say what you will about 4th edition D&D (which is now itself on the way out for 5th), it did have a very handy concept that should be adopted in this game: healing surges.

    The idea is pretty straightforward: every character has a number of "healing surges" equal to their constitution modifier per rest. These surges can be spent by a character to heal themselves 1/4 of their total hit points.

    Now, actual implementation in 4E is a bit more complicated than that (most characters can only spend one surge on themselves per encounter unless they have special class abilities that let them do it more than that, for example), but in DDO I think it should simply be an ability with a relatively long cooldown (1 minute or so) and a number of charges equal to Con modifier + a bonus based on class (basically give extra starting surges to the beefier classes that will most likely need it more). Let healing amp work on it as normal, and include various feats/enhancements/ED abilities/etc. that beef up the ability in some fashion or another.

    This wouldn't replace the importance of other sources of healing, but does give a little bit of extra breathing room to fighters and barbarians in particular and eases up a bit of the burden on divine classes.

    I'm sure this has been mentioned before, but it seems time to bring it up again. Thoughts?
    Between all the new epic abilities and the upcoming enhancement pass, the need to keep healing abilities relevant for healing classes [for party , paladins, and Dragonmarks of Healing..

    Absolutely not signed; Opposed, vetoed, rejected.

    Sorry :/

    If you want to assist character durability, push toward making racial pets meaningful, better variety for racial class options once the enhancement system comes out, the addition of cure critical pots, familiars, etc.
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  4. #64
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    I am not against to something like this myself per se, but am very against it being tied to an already OP stat like con. Con already grants HP it should not also help recover that HP in combat.

    If anything id say such an ability should be tied with wisdom, or a will save. Will powering your way through a bad injury to fight on so to speak.

    Id also be all for a self rez tied to a similar thing. For example whenever you would be killed outright make it be a will save to instead go to -1 giving time for your allies to save you.

    DPS and death are just too over board in a D&D based game, either make us more like diablo in other aspects, or start to slow the game down when it comes to us dropping. becasue TPK is always a sign of a bad DM not a bad group of players.

  5. #65
    Community Member Jay203's Avatar
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    or they could, you know, make the healing/repair kits useful by having the kits restore hit points based on repair/heal skill?
    PS: Greensteel RUINED the game! and you all know it!
    less buffing, more nerfing!!!
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  6. #66
    Community Member SealedInSong's Avatar
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    Default Heal/repair skill

    As others have mentioned, I wouldn't find it overpowering at all to have something like:

    [Heal or repair skill]/3 = 1 use per rest to use a heal/repair kit to heal [hp=heal or repair skill] for 10 seconds.
    Cooldown = 1 minute.

    Example: warforged fighter with 18 in repair skill can regenerate 18 hp over 10 seconds every minute, 18/3=6 times per day.

    Wouldn't be game-breaking, would give newer players and even vets a chance to do some reliable patching up in between combat, would incentivize the use of two ignored skills and items, etc.
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  7. #67
    Community Member dlsidhe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SealedInSong View Post
    As others have mentioned, I wouldn't find it overpowering at all to have something like:

    [Heal or repair skill]/3 = 1 use per rest to use a heal/repair kit to heal [hp=heal or repair skill] for 10 seconds.
    Cooldown = 1 minute.

    Example: warforged fighter with 18 in repair skill can regenerate 18 hp over 10 seconds every minute, 18/3=6 times per day.

    Wouldn't be game-breaking, would give newer players and even vets a chance to do some reliable patching up in between combat, would incentivize the use of two ignored skills and items, etc.
    I like the idea, but I'd remove the limit-per-day if the healing is going to be that minor, and bump up the timer.

    Or, alternately -

    2min timer, 20sec activation, you gain heal/repair skill + heal/repair kit modifier hit points.

    If an artificer or a rogue /w mechanic PrE, you may add your artificer/rogue level to the repair skill. An artificer with the Construct Essence feat will receive 50% effectiveness from this skil, but takes a 25% penalty to heal kit use.

    Artificers may create a "Self-Repair Mechanism" (trinket) using mechanical trap parts and a repair kit at a trapmaking station that heals a construct for 1-5 hit points (depending on modifier of repair kit used) HP per every thirty seconds for 5-15 minutes (increased duration = more trap parts/repair kits needed), at which point the trinket breaks. These trinkets are tradeable, but not auctionable.

    Paladins and rangers can add class level/2 to the hit points gained via use of a heal kit. A monk with the Shintao PrE may also add monk level/2 to the hit points gained.

    Favored Souls and Clerics can add their class level to the hit points gained via use of a heal kit. A Cleric with the Radiant Servant PrE can add 1.5x class level, and has the cooldown reduced to 1 minute.

    Barbarians cannot use this skill, or be targeted by this skill, while raged. Wizards in undead forms may not receive benefits from this skill. This healing is not affected by healing amplification as it does not stem from positive magical energy.

    Example: A level 1 cleric with a heal skill of 4 (max wisdom, no points invested), can recover 5 hit points using a basic heal kit. A level 2 paladin with a +2 kit, a +3 heal item, and 4 ranks in heal could heal for 10hp. Etc.

    ETA: The kits could be used either on yourself, or on a party member with line-of-sight in "touch" range (like for Shocking Touch, etc.). Thus, they don't replace using spells in combat, as the "healer" would have to be directly next to the target, unable to take any action, for 20sec.
    Last edited by dlsidhe; 12-19-2012 at 03:50 PM.
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  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by SealedInSong View Post
    As others have mentioned, I wouldn't find it overpowering at all to have something like:

    [Heal or repair skill]/3 = 1 use per rest to use a heal/repair kit to heal [hp=heal or repair skill] for 10 seconds.
    Cooldown = 1 minute.

    Example: warforged fighter with 18 in repair skill can regenerate 18 hp over 10 seconds every minute, 18/3=6 times per day.

    Wouldn't be game-breaking, would give newer players and even vets a chance to do some reliable patching up in between combat, would incentivize the use of two ignored skills and items, etc.
    Mechanics need to scale as you level. This idea does not. It needs to be a % of HP or based off of level.
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  9. #69
    Community Member FestusHood's Avatar
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    I'm in favor of improved healing potions, that are rarified in proportion to their power. Inherent, unexplained healing abilities available to all classes i'm not in favor of. That is homogenization, and i'm against that.

    How about if they rework heal amp so that the heal skill gives you heal amp exactly the same as your heal score? As far as what i've seen suggested so far regarding revisions to the heal skill, it doesn't seem worth it if it doesn't do anything except replicate the function of a cure serious potion, or less.

    Similar to regeneration items in the game, the amount of healing is completely negligible. Seriously like 12 hp a minute? Even out of combat nobody is going to wait around for that. In combat it's too little to even be worth considering.

    Vampirism weapons? If you are able to keep yourself up with these, you aren't at the point yet that cure serious potions aren't enough. They are a cool novelty. I have numerous ones myself. They work ok on normal difficulty. On elite, no.

    If you're worrying about brand new melees who apparently can't afford to buy any potions, hirelings are an infinitely better deal anyway. I learned about hirelings within 2 hours after starting the game. I've never met a player that didn't know about them. Better than an actual player? Rarely. Better and cheaper (much) than chugging pots? Always.

    I'm with the people that accept that there are already melee classes that can inherently self heal, at the cost of doing less dps. They are different. That's the point. If they weren't then why have multiple types of melees?

    As far as heal scrolls go, there is a reason you can't get items with plus 15 umd, and don't have enhancements to raise this skill. It's a powerful ability. It should be for those classes that have it as a class skill, or for people who splash those classes to be able to use it. I actually don't think classes which only have 11 points in it should be able to nail heal scrolls 100% of the time just through gear. This is more homogenization. If you can do that, there is little advantage to having it as a class skill.

    Yes to better healing pots that only drop in chests. No to inherent healing abilities for classes that have no business having them.
    Last edited by FestusHood; 12-23-2012 at 07:13 PM.

  10. #70
    Community Member Certon's Avatar
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    Healing surges? No.

    No.

    No!

    NO!!

    NOOOOOOO!

    just, no.

    I don't want to play 4th edition. It sucked.

  11. #71
    Community Member Indoran's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Artos_Fabril View Post
    I don't often agree with you, Chai, but I do like this idea.
    My suggestion would be a 10 second timer, restoring an amount equal to resting at a shrine with the same heal (or repair) skill, plus whatever bonus the kit grants. Put a 1 minute cooldown on it, and with an interuptable 10 second cast and the "tie shoes" animation, it's not going to be viable for combat healing.

    Along with this, I'd double the speed (halve the time) of wholeness of body. And buff paladins and rangers. Seriously, they need it.
    but you mean to make it more meaningful than a cure serious wounds pot? if not... we have the pots, ty!
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