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  1. #1
    Community Member barecm's Avatar
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    Default More Imbalance to Casters: Web Loot Upgrades

    So, I was looking at the upgrades for Pinion and see for 3 comms, I can do planar conflux. Already did that pre- u16. Now for 5 more comms, which in about 50 runs for citw I have 2, I can go from +7 to +8. Not terrible, but ok. Then for a mere 7 more, I can gain 1d6 sonic damage. Really? 1d6 for 7 comms? Then I look at all the others. .5 [W], not great but better than 1d6 sonic I think. 2-16 bleed to 3-24 bleed, also not great but slightly more damage against things that bleed. Then there is the caster item. Add a max potency skill of your choice. Now that seems like its worth 7 comms.

    I don't understand why the devs keep choosing to make casters far and away the most pwerful class to play, but I wish they would at least make a veiled attempt to give the other classes something comparable in terms of loot since we don't get it otherwise.
    Last edited by barecm; 12-07-2012 at 05:51 PM.
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  2. #2
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    They keep adding stuff that multiplies with crits to melee, but not to ranged, so while ranged can get closer to melee in base damage, it is still significantly behind melee due to terribad relative crits in comparison.
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  3. #3
    Community Member Kinerd's Avatar
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    The thing is though, Twilight still isn't a clear elite caster item. A regular Thaumaturgy staff will have the same 80/120/120, plus Superior Lore in a choice element instead of merely Greater in all, plus a nice Efficient Metamagic. It offers Major focuses, but the Staff of the Necromancer offers Major in Necromancy plus the set Spell Penetration 9, plus half of the Arcane Augmentation, plus it's a million times easier to acquire.

    I haven't scrutinized the melee items, but I think the devs did a reasonably good job of making a powerful caster item without relegating the rest of the previous game to trash.

  4. #4
    Community Member Tirisha's Avatar
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    I don't think I'd use a two handed weapon on my caster personally.

    Though it's mostly because I'm a fleshy sorc so I scroll heal alot and don't fancy losing my combustion item with scroll in hand.

    I'm fairly sure a wizard's orb with your primary damage type and a lob stick for arcane augmentation is not only easier to acquire but a better set up then the CITW staff for a lot of builds.
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  5. #5
    Community Member bbcjoke's Avatar
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    Two-handed caster weapons (staffs) are meant to be powerful for magic users. They'd lose a great deal of abilities otherwise.

  6. #6
    Community Member BladeTricks's Avatar
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    That qstaff is not even really appealing to me. How is it better than two 1-handers? On the contrary, I think this raid lacks in rewards for divine and arcane casters.
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  7. #7
    The Hatchery DarkForte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tirisha View Post
    I don't think I'd use a two handed weapon on my caster personally.

    Though it's mostly because I'm a fleshy sorc so I scroll heal alot and don't fancy losing my combustion item with scroll in hand.

    I'm fairly sure a wizard's orb with your primary damage type and a lob stick for arcane augmentation is not only easier to acquire but a better set up then the CITW staff for a lot of builds.
    Agreed on the scroll-healing count.

    On a divine, I'd favor either eSoS or +3 evocation stick/+2 alchemical wisdom lob stick.
    On an arcane, I'd rather have +3 ench or necro/wizard's orb or +3 ench or necro/arcane augmentation alchemical shield.

    Pinion is absolutely best in slot for a ranged toon. Nightmare/balizarde/celestia are arguably best in slot for thf. Twilight is a niche item that has its only utility in giving you a bit more sp.
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by BladeTricks View Post
    That qstaff is not even really appealing to me. How is it better than two 1-handers? On the contrary, I think this raid lacks in rewards for divine and arcane casters.
    Can easily do without this staff on any arcane/divine. The problem is, there's nothing else to do at cap so you might as well run CitW. Once the new raid is released, CitW will be forgotten just as LOB/MA were.

    My biggest gripe with CitW weapons: Why are these "best in slot" for killing trash mobs? Raiding should net rewards that make you better at raiding (i.e., killing bosses).
    Last edited by Carpone; 12-24-2012 at 07:43 AM.
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  9. #9
    Community Member Kirlian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tirisha View Post
    I don't think I'd use a two handed weapon on my caster personally.

    Though it's mostly because I'm a fleshy sorc so I scroll heal alot and don't fancy losing my combustion item with scroll in hand.

    I'm fairly sure a wizard's orb with your primary damage type and a lob stick for arcane augmentation is not only easier to acquire but a better set up then the CITW staff for a lot of builds.
    Exactly my thoughts
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  10. #10
    Community Member Eladiun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by barecm View Post
    I don't understand why the devs keep choosing to make casters far and away the most pwerful class to play, but I wish they would at least make a veiled attempt to give the other classes something comparable in terms of loot since we don't get it otherwise.
    Pure nuking casters are far from OP.
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  11. #11
    Community Member Zerkul's Avatar
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    Please stop talking about caster imbalance. Things are much better on melees and ranged toons right now: melee defenders, monks, zenarchers, barbarians max dps ... all builds that works extremely good in EE content. The game is quite balanced now, except for casters being extremely squishy unless you run some particular shielded build.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carpone View Post
    My biggest gripe with CitW weapons: Why are these "best in slot" for killing trash mobs? Raiding should net rewards that make you better at raiding (i.e., killing bosses).
    Isnt' the Balizarde the best "anti-Lolth" one-hander?
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zerkul View Post
    Please stop talking about caster imbalance. Things are much better on melees and ranged toons right now: melee defenders, monks, zenarchers, barbarians max dps ... all builds that works extremely good in EE content. The game is quite balanced now, except for casters being extremely squishy unless you run some particular shielded build.
    Casters SHOULD be squishier, this is a good thing.

    Other than that I think your assessment is pretty good, but some classes (bards, pally, ranger) need a little love.
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  14. #14
    Community Member Tirisha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ape_Man View Post
    Casters SHOULD be squishier, this is a good thing.
    it would be a good thing if it was true.

    The fact that they can preform at full capacity while kiting mobs makes them much more survivable than your run of the mill melee build. (not even counting the possibility for Quickened self healing which doesn't have the UMD lag attached to silver flame pots)

    for this reason I wouldn't consider anything but a specialized tank melee to have more lasting power than a caster.

    *to be clear I consider anything with a significant SP pool to be a caster*
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