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  1. #1
    Community Member whitehawk74's Avatar
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    Question Improved Critical or Greater 2 Weapon Fighting?

    I dont understand the crit range of handwraps.. i honestly never looked into it.
    At the moment I have Greater 2WF giving me 80% off hand attack.
    Do monks even have off hands? The wiki says that the mechanics for handwraps isnt the same as other weapons.

    So what is the crit range for handwraps and would I be better off with Improved Critical : Bludgeoning ?

    (just for a laugh, I am level 23 and only asking this now)
    My demands are simple. Ducks, penguins and tortoises as pets. I'll buy hats and bow-ties for them all.

  2. #2
    Community Member Munkenmo's Avatar
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    if you're a pure monk you should really be able to fit in both.

    what are your other feats?

    also gtwf > improved crit bludgeoning for a monk.

  3. #3
    Uber Completionist Ilindith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whitehawk74 View Post
    I dont understand the crit range of handwraps.. i honestly never looked into it.
    At the moment I have Greater 2WF giving me 80% off hand attack.
    Do monks even have off hands? The wiki says that the mechanics for handwraps isnt the same as other weapons.

    So what is the crit range for handwraps and would I be better off with Improved Critical : Bludgeoning ?

    (just for a laugh, I am level 23 and only asking this now)
    Yes GTWF gives you off hand attacks.

    Crit range is 20, 19-20 with IC. You can see it in your inventory.

    Like Mo said, you should really have both feats.
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  4. #4
    Community Member whitehawk74's Avatar
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    the only other feat I can swap out is Power Attack.
    I hardly ever miss, so I think the extra 5 damage is worth it, but im happy to be convinced to drop it if someone can explain the maths to me.
    My demands are simple. Ducks, penguins and tortoises as pets. I'll buy hats and bow-ties for them all.

  5. #5
    Community Member DrNuegebauer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whitehawk74 View Post
    the only other feat I can swap out is Power Attack.
    I hardly ever miss, so I think the extra 5 damage is worth it, but im happy to be convinced to drop it if someone can explain the maths to me.
    This is not true! It's not the only other feat you can drop, you clearly have more feats than just P.Attack, 2WF and I2WF.


    What other feats do you have? There's something else you can swap out for sure.

  6. #6
    Community Member Anthios888's Avatar
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    Greater two weapon fighting should come first. It gives you the most DPS for the feat, and is considered essential.

    Many monks fit in improved critical, because it is required for taking Vorpal Strikes. If you punch for 40 a swing, the feat gives 2 damage per swing under normal circumstances, in addition to boosting your bursts and some weapon procs. That only increases as your damage goes up.

    There are feats I dropped improved critical for before, but I won't give up vorpal strikes, because it gives at least an additional least 5 damage per swing.

    So, what else can you drop? Monks have 12 feats at minimum.
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  7. #7
    Community Member wax_on_wax_off's Avatar
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    Monk feats:
    7 base: TWF, ITWF, GTWF, IC:B, ?, ?, ?
    3 bonus: stunning fist, toughness, dodge or shintao prereq
    2 epic: vorpal strikes + either improved martial arts or overwhelming critical

    3 spare feats in the above layout that can be made up of:
    combat expertise
    improved sunder
    cleave/great cleave (for overwhelming crit reqs)
    past life: disciple of the fist (or any other useful PL)
    mobility, spring attack

    Yeah, GTWF and IC:B are both absolute must haves for a monk for a variety of reasons (IC:B isn't a must have for every unarmed character as the crit profile of monks is very shoddy but it's easy to fit in so definitely worthwhile on a pure monk).
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  8. #8
    The Hatchery Rawrargh's Avatar
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    Please say you don't have 6 tougness feats or something silly like that...
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  9. #9
    Community Member whitehawk74's Avatar
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    I havent played this guy in a while and sort of forgot about him. Then I ran some epics today and remembered how much fun he was.
    I have just checked and I havent used my free LR yet.. so thats something I can look into.

    The feats that i have at the moment:

    these 3 I can swap for Improved Critical.
    * Greater 2WF.
    * Improved Martial Arts.
    * Power Attack

    Luck of Heroes (I cant remember why I took that).. Im dark monk. Do I need this ?
    Fists of Darkness
    Spring Attack
    Stunning Fist
    Toughness (just the 1 )

    If my free LR is lost after a TR, I will use it, if not I would like to keep it.

    If I was to use the free LR, what would the best feats to take for a dark monk ?
    Last edited by whitehawk74; 10-24-2012 at 05:01 AM.
    My demands are simple. Ducks, penguins and tortoises as pets. I'll buy hats and bow-ties for them all.

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by whitehawk74 View Post
    I havent played this guy in a while and sort of forgot about him. Then I ran some epics today and remembered how much fun he was.
    I have just checked and I havent used my free LR yet.. so thats something I can look into.

    The feats that i have at the moment:

    these 3 I can swap for Improved Critical.
    * Greater 2WF.
    * Improved Martial Arts.
    * Power Attack

    Luck of Heroes (I cant remember why I took that).. Im dark monk. Do I need this ?
    Fists of Darkness
    Spring Attack
    Stunning Fist
    Toughness (just the 1 )

    If my free LR is lost after a TR, I will use it, if not I would like to keep it.

    If I was to use the free LR, what would the best feats to take for a dark monk ?
    That spring attack has at leat 2 more feats buried underneath it, loose it and you will be able to see what else you can get rid of besides luck of hero. A LR may be the best way to make a clean sweep though. Previous threads call out the most common feats and progression. You usually end up with one or two that can be swapped out per whatever tickles your fancy.

  11. #11
    Community Member whitehawk74's Avatar
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    Thanks.. yeah the free LR is looking pretty sweet at the moment, but if I dont use it do i lose it when i TR ?
    There is also the problem of using my LR because of the problems with Epic Destinies.
    Last edited by whitehawk74; 10-24-2012 at 05:22 AM.
    My demands are simple. Ducks, penguins and tortoises as pets. I'll buy hats and bow-ties for them all.

  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by whitehawk74 View Post
    Thanks.. yeah the free LR is looking pretty sweet at the moment, but if I dont use it do i lose it when i TR ?
    There is also the problem of using my LR because of the problems with Epic Destinies.
    If you are real close to TRing I would just wait and save the LR...then make the right choices on the next life unless it really hurts you eyes play the toon now. As to TRing messing up the ED all I can say is I have TR'd only one toon and have not had an issue and seems like alot of peeps are still doing it around me with no issues. Thats not to say you are the 1 in 5000 thats going to get hosed. But unless you have already grinded out such a huge amount of ED's for twists it would seem the risk is small vs the reward of playing a spanking new TR'd monk with past life perks.

  13. #13
    Community Member whitehawk74's Avatar
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    thanks.

    i was thinking the same thing.. i put up a quick question in General about losing the LR if I TR without using it.
    No replies yet.

    If I get to keep it then I will just power thru, TR and start again.
    My demands are simple. Ducks, penguins and tortoises as pets. I'll buy hats and bow-ties for them all.

  14. #14
    Community Member wax_on_wax_off's Avatar
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    You don't lose the free LR when you TR. Just swap spring attack for GTWF and you're sorted?
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  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by whitehawk74 View Post
    I havent played this guy in a while and sort of forgot about him. Then I ran some epics today and remembered how much fun he was.
    I have just checked and I havent used my free LR yet.. so thats something I can look into.

    The feats that i have at the moment:

    these 3 I can swap for Improved Critical.
    * Greater 2WF.
    * Improved Martial Arts.
    * Power Attack

    Luck of Heroes (I cant remember why I took that).. Im dark monk. Do I need this ?
    Fists of Darkness
    Spring Attack
    Stunning Fist
    Toughness (just the 1 )

    If my free LR is lost after a TR, I will use it, if not I would like to keep it.

    If I was to use the free LR, what would the best feats to take for a dark monk ?
    Unless you're taking Spring Attack as part of getting Whirlwind Attack, I agree with others that you should swap it out. Same for Luck of Heroes.

    As others might have explained, Improved Critical changes your chance to crit from only on a roll of 20 with handwraps to 19 or 20. Greater and Ultimate Mountain Stance also aids here.

    At least get Cleave, for which Power Attack is a prerequisite.

    Improved Martial Arts is less important. At your level, I'd use it for something else that others have noted.
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  16. #16
    Community Member Munkenmo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whitehawk74 View Post
    If I was to use the free LR, what would the best feats to take for a dark monk ?
    below is what i would do.

    if human

    Level 1 (Monk)
    Feat: (Selected) Power Attack
    Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness
    Feat: (Human Bonus) Two Weapon Fighting

    Level 2 (Monk)
    Feat: (Monk Bonus) Stunning fist

    Level 3 (Monk)
    Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Inevitable Dominion: Fists of Darkness
    Feat: (Selected) Past life (improved sunder if first life)

    Level 6 (Monk)
    Feat: (Monk Bonus) Dodge
    Feat: (Selected) Cleave (improved sunder if TR)

    Level 9 (Monk)
    Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting

    Level 12 (Monk)
    Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Bludgeoning Weapons

    Level 15 (Monk)
    Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting

    Level 18 (Monk)
    Feat: (Selected) Great cleave (stunning blow if second life)

    All other races.

    Level 1 (Monk)
    Feat: (Selected) Power Attack
    Feat: (Monk Bonus) Two Weapon Fighting

    Level 2 (Monk)
    Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness

    Level 3 (Monk)
    Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Inevitable Dominion: Fists of Darkness
    Feat: (Selected) Stunning Fist

    Level 6 (Monk)
    Feat: (Monk Bonus) Dodge
    Feat: (Selected) Monk past life (If first life take improved sunder)

    Level 9 (Monk)
    Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting

    Level 12 (Monk)
    Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Bludgeoning Weapons

    Level 15 (Monk)
    Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting

    Level 18 (Monk)
    Feat: (Selected) improved sunder (if first life take cleave)

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