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  1. #1
    The Hatchery CThruTheEgo's Avatar
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    Default Dubbell O'Seven - casting/ranged focused artificer

    Updated for U36.
    If you need info from the pre-U36 version, see post #366 for a copy of the OP prior to U36 changes.

    This is a casting/ranged/survivability focused artificer.

    Dubbell O'Seven
    Artificer 20
    True Neutral Warforged
    In-game name: Dubbell O'Seven on Sarlona


    Stats
    . . . . . . . .28pt. . .32pt. . .34pt. . .36pt . . Tome . . Level Up
    . . . . . . . .----. . .----. . .----. . .---- . . ---- . . --------
    Strength. . . . .8 . . . .8 . . . .8 . . . .8. . . . . . . . 4: INT
    Dexterity . . . 16 . . . 16 . . . 16 . . . 16. . . .+3. . . .8: INT
    Constitution. . 15 . . . 16 . . . 17 . . . 18. . . . . . . .12: INT
    Intelligence. . 17 . . . 18 . . . 18 . . . 18. . . . . . . .16: INT
    Wisdom. . . . . .6 . . . .6 . . . .6 . . . .6. . . . . . . .20: INT
    Charisma. . . . .6 . . . .6 . . . .6 . . . .6. . . . . . . .24: INT
    . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 28: INT


    Skills
    . . . . . 1. 2. 3. 4. 5. 6. 7. 8. 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
    . . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
    Concent . 4. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 23
    Repair. . 4. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 23
    Spellcr . 4. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 23
    Disable . 4. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 23
    Open Lo . 4. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 23
    Search. . 4. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 23
    Spot. . . 4. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 23
    UMD . . . 4. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 23
    Balance . . . . . . . . . . . .½ .½ .½ .½ .½ .½ .½ .½ .1 .1 .1 .1 .1 . 9
    . . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
    . . . . .32. 8. 8. 8. 8. 8. 8. 9. 9. 9. 9. 9. 9. 9. 9 10 10 10 10 10



    Feats

    .1. . . . : Point Blank Shot
    .3. . . . : Rapid Shot
    .4 Arti . : Precise Shot
    .6. . . . : Empower Spell
    .8 Arti . : Maximize Spell
    .9. . . . : Spell Focus: Evocation
    12. . . . : Greater Spell Focus: Evocation
    12 Arti . : Improved Critical: Ranged
    15. . . . : Improved Precise Shot
    16 Arti . : Adamantine Body
    18. . . . : Insightful Reflexes
    20 Arti . : Quicken Spell
    21 Epic . : Overwhelming Critical
    24 Epic . : Intensify Spell
    26 Destiny: Epic Spell Power: Force
    27 Epic . : Ruin
    28 Destiny: Hellball
    29 Destiny: Arcane Pulse
    30 Epic . : Greater Ruin
    30 Legend : Scion of: Plane of Earth


    Spells
    1. Repair Light Damage, Inflict Light Damage, Conjure Bolts, Enchant Weapons, Admixture: Cure Light Wounds, Resist Energy, Grease
    2. Repair Moderate Damage, Inflict Moderate Damage, Elemental Weapons, Admixture: Cure Moderate Wounds, Byeshk Weapons, Toughen Construct, Reinforce Construct
    3. Repair Serious Damage, Inflict Serious Damage, Flame Turret, Admixture: Cure Serious Wounds, Insightful Damage, Adamantine Weapons, Stoneskin
    4. Repair Critical Damage, Inflict Critical Damage, Armor of Speed, Cold Iron Weapons, Lesser Globe of Invulnerability, Protection from Elements, Thundering Armor
    5. Prismatic Strike, Align Weapons, Silver Weapons, Radiant Forcefield
    6. Blade Barrier, Tactical Detonation, Deadly Weapons, Reconstruct


    Enhancements (80 AP)

    Battle Engineer (41 AP)
    • Battle Engineer, Infused Weapons, Infused Armor, Infused Weapons II, Infused Armor II, Master Engineer
      1. Crossbow Training, Field Scrapper III, Thaumaturgical Conduits III
      2. Crossbow Training, Caustic Shot I, Extra Action Boost III
      3. Crossbow Training, Intelligence
      4. Crossbow Training, Endless Fusilade, Shatter Defenses I, Agility Engine I, Intelligence
      5. Reconstructed Crossbows, Weapon Attachment, Thunder-Shock Weapon, Unlock Potential, Tactical Mobility

    Harper Agent (23 AP)
    • Agent of Good I, Intelligence, Agent of Good II, Intelligence
      1. Harper Enchantment, Traveler's Toughness I, Strategic Combat
      2. Versatile Adept III, Know the Angles III
      3. Versatile Adept III, Intelligence
      4. Versatile Adept I

    Warforged (16 AP)
    • Improved Fortification, Warforged Constitution
      1. Mechanist III, Construct Toughness
      2. Warforged Tactics III
      3. Adamantine Durability III, Memories of the Last War: Arcane Slinger
      4. Memories of the Last War: Front Lines


    Destiny (24 AP)

    Legendary Dreadnought
    1. Legendary Tactics III, Extra Action Boost III, Attack Boost I, Constitution
    2. Damage Boost III
    3. Critical Damage III, Haste Boost III
    4. (none)
    5. Advancing Blows, Devastating Critical
    6. Master's Blitz

    Twists of Fate (36 fate points)
    1. Energy Burst: Acid (Tier 4 Draconic)
    2. School Specialist: Evocation (Tier 2 Magister)
    3. Precise: Evocation (Tier 2 Draconic)
    4. Fey Form (Tier 2 Shiradi)
    5. Stay Frosty (Tier 1 Shiradi)


    Due to gear becoming outdated so quickly as well as the minimizing of power difference between named gear, lootgen, cannith crafted, and special crafting systems (e.g. slaver's), and me spending very little time playing at cap these days, I am no longer going to devise optimal final gear sets for any of my builds. I'll leave that work to others who are more familiar with final gear sets.

    ----------------------------

    Adding the following quote here for safe-keeping in case the Lamannia forums aren't available when it's needed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    The DC of Rune Arm spells is suppsed to be 10 + (Charge Tier + 1) + (INT modifier) + (Max Charge Tier - 1) + (Evocation Feat Bonuses). The Evocation Bonuses were not applying.

    With this fix, bonuses from abilities like the Spell Focus: Evocation feat, Arcanotechnician's Evocation Focus enhancement, and the Evocation Specialist ability from the Magister destiny should all contribute to a Rune Arm's DC.

    At the moment, item/augment based sources of Evocation DC bonuses do not affect the DC of Rune Arm shots.
    As of U29, per the release notes:

    Artificer Rune Arm DC's now include all sources of Evocation DC Boosts.
    Last edited by CThruTheEgo; 07-13-2017 at 01:13 PM.
    Unarmed monk guide with builds|The Arcane Warrior: wiz/fighter hybrids|White Feather Sniper: CC/dps focused deepwood stalker|The Divine Cuisinart: divine crusader tempest|The Count of Monte Cristo: swashbuckler|Hassan's Assassin: dex assassin|Dubbell O'Seven: WF artificer|Santa's Little Slayer: dragonmarked elf centered kensai

  2. #2
    Community Member wax_on_wax_off's Avatar
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    The long awaited build.
    Feats:
    Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot
    Feat: (Selected) Rapid Shot
    Feat: (Artificer Bonus) Precise Shot
    Feat: (Selected) Toughness
    Feat: (Artificer Bonus) Spell Focus: Evocation
    Feat: (Selected) Greater Spell Focus: Evocation
    Feat: (Artificer Bonus) Improved Critical: Ranged Weapons
    Feat: (Selected) Maximize Spell
    Feat: (Selected) Improved Precise Shot
    Feat: (Artificer Bonus) Quicken Spell
    Feat: (Selected) Insightful Reflexes
    Feat: (Artificer Bonus) Empower Spell
    21) Epic toughness
    24) ESF Evocation

    I'd swap Empower Spell for Precision. Empower adds a set amount to your spells now, I saw someone post it at being about ~+75 damage added to Blade Barrier (0.75 of base BB damage - 15d6 - only comes out to ~40 so not sure where 75 comes from.), just doesn't seem worth it considering the alternatives and a somewhat restricted SP pool.

    I'd consider swapping Insightful Reflexes for Adamantine Body. You get a nice chunk of PRR and AC from AB which might do more for survivability than a difference in reflex saves that might only be situational and could situationally be remedied with gear swaps (+10 reflex chaos docent, +4 insight, +8/+3 dex etc). To really know one way or the other it'd be best to work out what your reflex save will be and what sort of targets are reasonable (30ish was plenty in U13 but not sure how that's changed in U14 EE content).

    I'd swap Epic Toughness for Combat Archery. +1[Weapon Damage] on Needle gives 20+ DPS extra which is quite considerable. The 2% dodge is decent as well. The cost is -2 intelligence for the +2 dex to qualify which will give you better AB (you need ~70 AB to keep 95% hit rate with precision against all foes) and better reflex (so skipping IR becomes more feasible). I don't think a warforged artificer needs Epic Toughness, you've got quickened reconstructs, evasion, a solid HP pool already and ranged combat style, perhaps instead focus on forms of aggro management (Shadowdancer provides quite a few possibilities). I'd even consider changing base stats to 8/18/14/18/6/6 to have your cake and eat it too (and lose a total of 90 HP).

    For enhancements I'd look closely at Kinetic Casting and Deadly Kinetics. After the first rank in each you're getting only a little over +1% spell damage DPS per AP spent which isn't very cost effective. I'd definitely be wanting to have Wand and Scroll Mastery at least at rank III - realistically it should be IV. 1 rank in skill boost seems a no brainer (to get that resurrection scroll off to save the raid despite a death penalty or 3).

    Gear wise Windhowler Bracers should be on wrist slot, currently your bracers aren't doing much for you. For cloak slot I'd be looking at swapping in either of the Stealth Strike cloaks situationally (Wretched Twilight from Abbot or Magewright Cloak). Not sure if Manslayer is working on the smoke goggles, possibly only in SA range, I do hear it works fine on Epic Stalker Ring though so might want to stick with that until it's fixed.

    For the racial choice, I prefer helf or human myself but either works with its own set of pros and cons and you seem to have a good grasp on it. The bit that gets me is the +25% damage/Endless Fusillade combo with Versatility: Damage, it's just too good to miss.

    I wouldn't use a stone on a pure arti, too easy to level already, perhaps pick up a ranger life instead and then TR to artificer?
    Quote Originally Posted by Feather_of_Sun View Post
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  3. #3
    Community Member Skavenaps's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wax_on_wax_off View Post
    The long awaited build.


    I'd consider swapping Insightful Reflexes for Adamantine Body. You get a nice chunk of PRR and AC from AB which might do more for survivability than a difference in reflex saves that might only be situational and could situationally be remedied with gear swaps (+10 reflex chaos docent, +4 insight, +8/+3 dex etc). To really know one way or the other it'd be best to work out what your reflex save will be and what sort of targets are reasonable (30ish was plenty in U13 but not sure how that's changed in U14 EE content).
    heavy armor its a bad choice for a shadowdancer...

  4. #4
    Community Member wax_on_wax_off's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skavenaps View Post
    heavy armor its a bad choice for a shadowdancer...
    Oh true! Scrap that then. To think that I'd let myself be convinced of the value of AB on a WF Artificer without retorting with that gem :P

    Edit: Mithral Body is still an option.
    Quote Originally Posted by Feather_of_Sun View Post
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  5. #5
    The Hatchery CThruTheEgo's Avatar
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    Thank you for the very extensive and detailed feedback Wax.

    Quote Originally Posted by wax_on_wax_off View Post
    I'd swap Empower Spell for Precision. Empower adds a set amount to your spells now, I saw someone post it at being about ~+75 damage added to Blade Barrier (0.75 of base BB damage - 15d6 - only comes out to ~40 so not sure where 75 comes from.), just doesn't seem worth it considering the alternatives and a somewhat restricted SP pool.
    This build is first and foremost a casting focused artificer making empower a must have. If I find that I am burning through my SP too quickly or that empower is not doing much for me, I may switch it out for precision. To that end, I will probably switch empower and maximize so that I can more easily exchange empower if desired.

    Quote Originally Posted by wax_on_wax_off View Post
    I'd consider swapping Insightful Reflexes for Adamantine Body. You get a nice chunk of PRR and AC from AB which might do more for survivability than a difference in reflex saves that might only be situational and could situationally be remedied with gear swaps (+10 reflex chaos docent, +4 insight, +8/+3 dex etc). To really know one way or the other it'd be best to work out what your reflex save will be and what sort of targets are reasonable (30ish was plenty in U13 but not sure how that's changed in U14 EE content).
    While I don't know exactly what the body feats offer with the recent changes (I'll have to look this up next time I'm in game since Wiki doesn't seem to have the changes yet), I'm fairly certain insightful reflexes will do more for the survivability of this build. This build is intended for EE content and extreme survivability is key for it. But let's do a reflex breakdown anyway.

    Reflex Save:
    8 base
    8 dex26 (16 base +3 tome +7 item)
    6 resistance item (stone heart)
    4 GH
    2 Good luck
    28 base (did I miss anything?)

    I'd rather not go up against EE casters with only a 28 reflex save. And while the gear swaps you suggest are fine for traps, they don't work for combat situations. As I showed in the OP, insightful reflexes will add 11 giving a base of 39 reflex save. I shouldn't have much trouble with a reflex like that. Adding in the gear swaps you suggest for traps will give another 10 for a 49 against traps. I'm pretty comfortable with those numbers. The only feat I give up for insightful reflexes is precision, which I think is well worth the sacrifice.

    Quote Originally Posted by wax_on_wax_off View Post
    I'd swap Epic Toughness for Combat Archery. +1[Weapon Damage] on Needle gives 20+ DPS extra which is quite considerable. The 2% dodge is decent as well. The cost is -2 intelligence for the +2 dex to qualify which will give you better AB (you need ~70 AB to keep 95% hit rate with precision against all foes) and better reflex (so skipping IR becomes more feasible). I don't think a warforged artificer needs Epic Toughness, you've got quickened reconstructs, evasion, a solid HP pool already and ranged combat style, perhaps instead focus on forms of aggro management (Shadowdancer provides quite a few possibilities). I'd even consider changing base stats to 8/18/14/18/6/6 to have your cake and eat it too (and lose a total of 90 HP).
    I don't understand how you get +20 dps. Do you have some numbers to back that up? I've haven't seen any new dps calcs. Also, as I've already mentioned, two of the primary goals of this build are extreme survivability and casting capability, and giving up epic toughness and -2 int for +1[W] isn't worth it imo. And you would lose 100 HP with the stats you suggest, which does make for more balance between survivability, ranged dps, and casting capability, but I chose greater survivability for a little less ranged dps.

    Quote Originally Posted by wax_on_wax_off View Post
    For enhancements I'd look closely at Kinetic Casting and Deadly Kinetics. After the first rank in each you're getting only a little over +1% spell damage DPS per AP spent which isn't very cost effective. I'd definitely be wanting to have Wand and Scroll Mastery at least at rank III - realistically it should be IV. 1 rank in skill boost seems a no brainer (to get that resurrection scroll off to save the raid despite a death penalty or 3).
    I know what kinetic casting and deadly kinetics offers, but there isn't really anything else that is a must have imo. I maxed these out because I had taken everything else I deemed necessary. If I decide to add in something else (electric line for Toven's for example), these would be the first to go for sure. Keep in mind also that these affect the rune arm as well, so that means more and bigger crits from both the rune arm and spells. One of the benefits of going WF, in fact, is being able to max these lines since WF have far fewer race enhancements that contribute to a build such as this. Wand and scroll mastery2 is enough imo. Skill boost isn't needed. This character was an artificer in his first life (which also adds a passive +1 to UMD) and the UMD was stupidly high, even a few deaths didn't matter. And I've played plenty of trappers before and skill boost is definitely not needed when you have the right gear.

    Quote Originally Posted by wax_on_wax_off View Post
    Gear wise Windhowler Bracers should be on wrist slot, currently your bracers aren't doing much for you. For cloak slot I'd be looking at swapping in either of the Stealth Strike cloaks situationally (Wretched Twilight from Abbot or Magewright Cloak). Not sure if Manslayer is working on the smoke goggles, possibly only in SA range, I do hear it works fine on Epic Stalker Ring though so might want to stick with that until it's fixed.
    I need at least 3 epic slots for the must haves: con6, GFL, and exc int1. It's nice to have good luck as well. The ring of the master artificer gives me con6 and GFL, so I have to keep either the cloak or bracers to fit in the exc int1. I don't really like having this on the cloak as there are some situations when I don't want fire shield hot to proc (though admittedly not very many) and would swap this out. But only losing 1 DC shouldn't be too much of a problem in those situations so it might be worth it to put exc int1 on the cloak and switch the epic wind bracers for the windhowler bracers. Though if I get Toven's then the epic wind bracers become more of a necessity. I don't think stealth strike is that much of a necessity. I'm not worried about pulling trash agro, and want to much of the time. And I didn't really have any problems with boss agro on my arti life before, even with human versatility damage boost and endless fusillade. Last I heard, manslayer on the smoke goggles was not working, but I have faith in Turbine

    Quote Originally Posted by wax_on_wax_off View Post
    For the racial choice, I prefer helf or human myself but either works with its own set of pros and cons and you seem to have a good grasp on it. The bit that gets me is the +25% damage/Endless Fusillade combo with Versatility: Damage, it's just too good to miss.
    For better balance between survivability, ranged dps, and casting capability, yes helf is probably the better choice, as I pointed out in my OP. But I chose to go with the best survivability and casting dps, which is WF. And I think I give up little crossbow dps (combat archery, precision, human versatility damage boost) for great gains in both survivability (HP, reflex saves) and casting dps (nearly max int and spell DC's, max force line). For me an artificer's primary dps is spells/runearm, not the crossbow. So imo, casting capability should be the arti's primary focus, not crossbow dps. At least that is the goal with this build.

    Quote Originally Posted by wax_on_wax_off View Post
    I wouldn't use a stone on a pure arti, too easy to level already, perhaps pick up a ranger life instead and then TR to artificer?
    The arti is fun and fairly easy to level, but I'm not a fan of the XP grind. To me, a 3rd lifer is a bit of a discipline and endurance test and I don't really enjoy it even with all the xp bonuses now. I've already gone through a 2nd life as a sorc just to get to a 36 point build to make epic toughness a viable option. And I wanted to use the stone on a 3rd lifer for the better xp gain from it. So there is no way I'm grinding out another life. I'm ready to be back at endgame as an arti and put this build to the test.

    Thanks for the feedback Wax.
    Unarmed monk guide with builds|The Arcane Warrior: wiz/fighter hybrids|White Feather Sniper: CC/dps focused deepwood stalker|The Divine Cuisinart: divine crusader tempest|The Count of Monte Cristo: swashbuckler|Hassan's Assassin: dex assassin|Dubbell O'Seven: WF artificer|Santa's Little Slayer: dragonmarked elf centered kensai

  6. #6
    Community Member FooWonk's Avatar
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    Re: ED, Feats & Enhancements

    I don't think Shadowdancer is the best destiny for a primary caster build. I'd suggest you try Red Dragon Initiate. The caster levels will help tactical detonation and prismatic strike.

    With 28 caster levels, Empower is a big hitter (adding nearly 300 average damage to tactical detonation considering crits). With 6d6+13 SA, Precision becomes a big hitter against high fortification enemies. Try out both destinies as you need the Fate points, and decide on which feat based upon which destiny you want to play.

    Until you decide, I'd keep Empower.

    Consider dumping Quicken. Most everyone will disagree with me, but I have 3 multi-TR self-healing casters that do not use Quicken. I have it on the Favored Soul because Mass Heal is too slow to be useful.

    Epic Toughness isn't useful on a ranged caster. Without it you'll be very robust.

    I also recommend maxing out the Wand & Scroll mastery.

  7. #7
    The Hatchery CThruTheEgo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FooWonk View Post
    Re: ED, Feats & Enhancements

    I don't think Shadowdancer is the best destiny for a primary caster build. I'd suggest you try Red Dragon Initiate. The caster levels will help tactical detonation and prismatic strike.

    With 28 caster levels, Empower is a big hitter (adding nearly 300 average damage to tactical detonation considering crits). With 6d6+13 SA, Precision becomes a big hitter against high fortification enemies. Try out both destinies as you need the Fate points, and decide on which feat based upon which destiny you want to play.

    Until you decide, I'd keep Empower.
    Yeah I'll be maxing at least magister, draconic, and shadowdancer just to get the fate points I need to twist the evocation dc's. So I figured I will see how I like each of them and go from there. Though I have to say I really like the possibility of getting evasion on a pure arti.

    Quote Originally Posted by FooWonk View Post
    Consider dumping Quicken. Most everyone will disagree with me, but I have 3 multi-TR self-healing casters that do not use Quicken. I have it on the Favored Soul because Mass Heal is too slow to be useful.
    Some say it isn't needed, but I have found it useful. I've died more than I prefer to due to failed concentration checks on my self-healing casters.

    Quote Originally Posted by FooWonk View Post
    Epic Toughness isn't useful on a ranged caster. Without it you'll be very robust.
    Epic toughness was a primary goal when I developed this build. And I'll admit it will be overkill for most content, but I'm looking to do EE with this build, and I certainly don't want to get there and find out I'm too squishy. If I find out it's overkill, changes can always be made.

    Thanks for the feedback FooWonk.
    Unarmed monk guide with builds|The Arcane Warrior: wiz/fighter hybrids|White Feather Sniper: CC/dps focused deepwood stalker|The Divine Cuisinart: divine crusader tempest|The Count of Monte Cristo: swashbuckler|Hassan's Assassin: dex assassin|Dubbell O'Seven: WF artificer|Santa's Little Slayer: dragonmarked elf centered kensai

  8. #8
    Community Member jakeelala's Avatar
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    everyone keeps trying to say not to do this with my WF arty.

    They are wrong. This is a fantastic build. I will work in a torc though since SP will be an issue in EE content. I also dont love empower. Its rare that i kite things in a BB and it isn't still spinning when they're dead. This means it's actually doing more damage than necessary for the SP cost. I'd rather kite them 2 or 3 more times through it and get to cast it more times on longer harder content. I think it's not a huge deal, just maybe a preference.
    Last edited by jakeelala; 08-02-2012 at 12:40 AM.

  9. #9
    The Hatchery CThruTheEgo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jakeelala View Post
    everyone keeps trying to say not to do this with my WF arty.

    They are wrong. This is a fantastic build. I will work in a torc though since SP will be an issue in EE content. I also dont love empower. Its rare that i kite things in a BB and it isn't still spinning when they're dead. This means it's actually doing more damage than necessary for the SP cost. I'd rather kite them 2 or 3 more times through it and get to cast it more times on longer harder content. I think it's not a huge deal, just maybe a preference.
    Glad you like the build. I'm not 100% sure about empower either, which is why I'll take it in a regular feat slot in case I decide to switch it out. One thing I like about the gear setup is that the shaman's beads are an easy item to lose when you need to swap in the torc for SP gain. I have yet to get a torc (or toven's), but SP shouldn't be a problem once I do. Thanks for the feedback jakeelala.
    Unarmed monk guide with builds|The Arcane Warrior: wiz/fighter hybrids|White Feather Sniper: CC/dps focused deepwood stalker|The Divine Cuisinart: divine crusader tempest|The Count of Monte Cristo: swashbuckler|Hassan's Assassin: dex assassin|Dubbell O'Seven: WF artificer|Santa's Little Slayer: dragonmarked elf centered kensai

  10. #10
    Community Member jakeelala's Avatar
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    The party forum line is that Artificers aren't good at end game.

    Exsqueeze me? With DC 46 Tactical and BB, and the most powerful BB in the game, this is not end game weaksauce. People just build them wrong most of the time. Xbow damage is just gravy. Plus with some of the better debuffing repeaters, crafted or looted this is just a silly POV by most people.

    I have a really high level crafter and I just hit 20 on my Arty TR (eventual) completionist. He has 2 Ranger PL's which makes using a repeater a little more compelling. But I've got my +8 stone heart waiting. I made him some +4 Attack, Greater Evoc goggles with a large guild slot for HP. I may never take those off him.

    I don't have an avi'thoul ring yet, so I'm using cove gloves for the sneak attack. When I'm torqing, I throw on DQ gloves for the greater spearblock. I do have a tier 2 manslayer, but no Master Arty ring yet. It looks great on paper, but is it as good as it seems?

  11. #11
    The Hatchery CThruTheEgo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jakeelala View Post
    The party forum line is that Artificers aren't good at end game.

    Exsqueeze me? With DC 46 Tactical and BB, and the most powerful BB in the game, this is not end game weaksauce. People just build them wrong most of the time. Xbow damage is just gravy. Plus with some of the better debuffing repeaters, crafted or looted this is just a silly POV by most people.

    I have a really high level crafter and I just hit 20 on my Arty TR (eventual) completionist. He has 2 Ranger PL's which makes using a repeater a little more compelling. But I've got my +8 stone heart waiting. I made him some +4 Attack, Greater Evoc goggles with a large guild slot for HP. I may never take those off him.

    I don't have an avi'thoul ring yet, so I'm using cove gloves for the sneak attack. When I'm torqing, I throw on DQ gloves for the greater spearblock. I do have a tier 2 manslayer, but no Master Arty ring yet. It looks great on paper, but is it as good as it seems?
    Yeah an arti can be great for endgame. They've really got a lot of tricks up their sleaves. One of my favorite aspects about the arti is that it is not totally reliant on the blue bar and has a very respectable backup with the crossbow. As far as viability, I haven't played this build to cap yet. I just hit 20 on my 34 pt sorc life so I will be TRing into this probably within the next week (I figure I might as well farm out some epic destiny xp while I'm a new 20 again). A lot of the gear is certainly negotiable. It is primarily the int items which are must haves to keep DCs high.
    Unarmed monk guide with builds|The Arcane Warrior: wiz/fighter hybrids|White Feather Sniper: CC/dps focused deepwood stalker|The Divine Cuisinart: divine crusader tempest|The Count of Monte Cristo: swashbuckler|Hassan's Assassin: dex assassin|Dubbell O'Seven: WF artificer|Santa's Little Slayer: dragonmarked elf centered kensai

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    Community Member silvac's Avatar
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    Fairly sure that Epic Toughness requires 21 Base con (Starting Con at level 1 + Level-ups) which your level ups are going into intelligence obviously. Also I'd suggest swapping out empower spell for something to increase ranged dps, maximize should be all you need, other than looks like an excellent build, very high DC's which I like. If you still really want empower then put it in where epic toughness was. Other than that it looks very solid, looking forward to seeing you level him up.

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    Quote Originally Posted by silvac View Post
    Fairly sure that Epic Toughness requires 21 Base con (Starting Con at level 1 + Level-ups) which your level ups are going into intelligence obviously.
    +3 tome with 18 base also give 21 Con.
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    Community Member silvac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nibel View Post
    +3 tome with 18 base also give 21 Con.
    Didn't catch that

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    The Hatchery CThruTheEgo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by silvac View Post
    Fairly sure that Epic Toughness requires 21 Base con (Starting Con at level 1 + Level-ups) which your level ups are going into intelligence obviously. Also I'd suggest swapping out empower spell for something to increase ranged dps, maximize should be all you need, other than looks like an excellent build, very high DC's which I like. If you still really want empower then put it in where epic toughness was. Other than that it looks very solid, looking forward to seeing you level him up.
    Thanks for the feedback silvac. It is actually quite easy to qualify for epic toughness on this build with 18 starting con and a +3 tome, which is why it is so hard to pass up. But I decided 652 HP was a bit overkill and to take combat archery instead of epic toughness. To fit combat archery requires losing either 50 HP from epic toughness and 2 int to put 2 level ups into dex, or dropping starting con to 14 and increasing starting dex to 18 for a net loss of 100 HP. Dropping the DC's on this build is simply not an option for me. So I decided 552 base HP will be enough. With the con ship buff and a rage clicky I'll still have 602.

    I will be keeping empower but will take it as a regular feat to swap it out for precision if I decide it is not needed. The only spell power boost from items for blade barrier will be the potency60 on the archaic device, so I'd like to keep empower for now and see how it performs. I may also swap precision in to see how I like that and decide after trying them both.

    Updated the OP with the changes.
    Unarmed monk guide with builds|The Arcane Warrior: wiz/fighter hybrids|White Feather Sniper: CC/dps focused deepwood stalker|The Divine Cuisinart: divine crusader tempest|The Count of Monte Cristo: swashbuckler|Hassan's Assassin: dex assassin|Dubbell O'Seven: WF artificer|Santa's Little Slayer: dragonmarked elf centered kensai

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    For the record, Precision feat is a very POOR choice for this particular build. It triples spell cool down times and this build is designed at least partly around it's spellcasting ability just to get a 5% bonus to hit with your repeater. This would very much gimp this build

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    The Hatchery CThruTheEgo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chyribdus View Post
    For the record, Precision feat is a very POOR choice for this particular build. It triples spell cool down times and this build is designed at least partly around it's spellcasting ability just to get a 5% bonus to hit with your repeater. This would very much gimp this build
    The feat description is currently bugged. It grants 5% to hit and bypasses 25% fort. See this post by Eladrin:

    http://forums.ddo.com/showpost.php?p...00&postcount=5

    Eladrin's description says nothing about a spell cooldown increase.
    Unarmed monk guide with builds|The Arcane Warrior: wiz/fighter hybrids|White Feather Sniper: CC/dps focused deepwood stalker|The Divine Cuisinart: divine crusader tempest|The Count of Monte Cristo: swashbuckler|Hassan's Assassin: dex assassin|Dubbell O'Seven: WF artificer|Santa's Little Slayer: dragonmarked elf centered kensai

  18. #18
    Community Member FooWonk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CThruTheEgo View Post
    The feat description is currently bugged. It grants 5% to hit and bypasses 25% fort. See this post by Eladrin:

    http://forums.ddo.com/showpost.php?p...00&postcount=5

    Eladrin's description says nothing about a spell cooldown increase.
    The triple cooldown is only for defensive stances (combat expertise, resilience, etc.)

    Precision is an offensive stance and does not increase cooldowns. I keep it on 100% of the time for my artificer with 9d6+13 SA damage.

  19. #19
    Community Member Loriac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wax_on_wax_off View Post
    Oh true! Scrap that then. To think that I'd let myself be convinced of the value of AB on a WF Artificer without retorting with that gem :P

    Edit: Mithral Body is still an option.
    Mithral body is a great option with shadowdancer, if you take lithe 2 or 3. With lithe 3 and dex of 30-32, you end up slightly ahead of adamantine body for the high end armors. Lithe mitigates the issue of high end docents not scaling for dex for wf (vs. fleshie light and medium armor which does scale). Its also something you'd take anyway for the +6 to reflex saves, so its not even an opportunity cost.

    Its so good imo that I'd actually twist in lithe if I decided to use a different ED as my primary. Without it, you may as well not be wearing armor, with it you are competitive with other light/medium armor users.

    You lose out on PRR, which ends up being BAB / 2 for wf I think, but the defensive capabilities from shadowdancer should help out a lot.

  20. #20
    Community Member Loriac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CThruTheEgo View Post
    Thank you for the very extensive and detailed feedback Wax.
    This build is first and foremost a casting focused artificer making empower a must have. If I find that I am burning through my SP too quickly or that empower is not doing much for me, I may switch it out for precision. To that end, I will probably switch empower and maximize so that I can more easily exchange empower if desired.
    The only damage spell at end game that you'd use empower (or even maximise) for is BB; neither prismatic strike nor tactical detonation have useful damage beyond their cc capabilities. That said, the best case scenario for empower is as follows:

    Blade barrier is 15d6, which using DDO weighted dice gives base damage of 75 (as its really 15d3+45). Assuming a 18% crit chance and 2.5x crit damage multiplier (i.e. a 7/6/6 ap spend + greater arcane lore slotted somewhere), you end up with base damage of 95, which means empower is worth 95*0.75=72 at most. I found I wasn't using blade barrier so much in the expac, unless I was solo'ing (in which case scaling more than makes up for the loss of using empower).

    I don't think kinetic lore affects BB, hence greater arcane lore noted above. You could create an alchemical repeater with lacerating lore, however that seems to me suboptimal vs. making a dps based repeater instead.

    As you're levelling, I could see a use for empower and maximise, but my preference would be to take maximise first; on my arti, I found that anytime I was using blast rod say, I wanted stuff around me dead fast (if this wasn't the case, then I'd just use my repeater / runearm to do the job slowly but steadily). At the levels you use the lower level nukes, maximise tends to be sufficient (particularly if you slot in something like iron beads or bracers of wind). Also worth noting that you can slot in the level 8 tier 3 bracers of wind at level 6 using masterful craftsmanship, this would make a level 6 maximised blast rod pretty potent I should think.

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