Page 1 of 5 12345 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 401

Hybrid View

Previous Post Previous Post   Next Post Next Post
  1. #1
    The Hatchery CThruTheEgo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Some random rock hurdling through the universe to who knows where...
    Posts
    3,594

    Default Dubbell O'Seven - casting/ranged focused artificer

    Updated for U36.
    If you need info from the pre-U36 version, see post #366 for a copy of the OP prior to U36 changes.

    This is a casting/ranged/survivability focused artificer.

    Dubbell O'Seven
    Artificer 20
    True Neutral Warforged
    In-game name: Dubbell O'Seven on Sarlona


    Stats
    . . . . . . . .28pt. . .32pt. . .34pt. . .36pt . . Tome . . Level Up
    . . . . . . . .----. . .----. . .----. . .---- . . ---- . . --------
    Strength. . . . .8 . . . .8 . . . .8 . . . .8. . . . . . . . 4: INT
    Dexterity . . . 16 . . . 16 . . . 16 . . . 16. . . .+3. . . .8: INT
    Constitution. . 15 . . . 16 . . . 17 . . . 18. . . . . . . .12: INT
    Intelligence. . 17 . . . 18 . . . 18 . . . 18. . . . . . . .16: INT
    Wisdom. . . . . .6 . . . .6 . . . .6 . . . .6. . . . . . . .20: INT
    Charisma. . . . .6 . . . .6 . . . .6 . . . .6. . . . . . . .24: INT
    . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 28: INT


    Skills
    . . . . . 1. 2. 3. 4. 5. 6. 7. 8. 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
    . . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
    Concent . 4. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 23
    Repair. . 4. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 23
    Spellcr . 4. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 23
    Disable . 4. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 23
    Open Lo . 4. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 23
    Search. . 4. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 23
    Spot. . . 4. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 23
    UMD . . . 4. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 1. 23
    Balance . . . . . . . . . . . .½ .½ .½ .½ .½ .½ .½ .½ .1 .1 .1 .1 .1 . 9
    . . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
    . . . . .32. 8. 8. 8. 8. 8. 8. 9. 9. 9. 9. 9. 9. 9. 9 10 10 10 10 10



    Feats

    .1. . . . : Point Blank Shot
    .3. . . . : Rapid Shot
    .4 Arti . : Precise Shot
    .6. . . . : Empower Spell
    .8 Arti . : Maximize Spell
    .9. . . . : Spell Focus: Evocation
    12. . . . : Greater Spell Focus: Evocation
    12 Arti . : Improved Critical: Ranged
    15. . . . : Improved Precise Shot
    16 Arti . : Adamantine Body
    18. . . . : Insightful Reflexes
    20 Arti . : Quicken Spell
    21 Epic . : Overwhelming Critical
    24 Epic . : Intensify Spell
    26 Destiny: Epic Spell Power: Force
    27 Epic . : Ruin
    28 Destiny: Hellball
    29 Destiny: Arcane Pulse
    30 Epic . : Greater Ruin
    30 Legend : Scion of: Plane of Earth


    Spells
    1. Repair Light Damage, Inflict Light Damage, Conjure Bolts, Enchant Weapons, Admixture: Cure Light Wounds, Resist Energy, Grease
    2. Repair Moderate Damage, Inflict Moderate Damage, Elemental Weapons, Admixture: Cure Moderate Wounds, Byeshk Weapons, Toughen Construct, Reinforce Construct
    3. Repair Serious Damage, Inflict Serious Damage, Flame Turret, Admixture: Cure Serious Wounds, Insightful Damage, Adamantine Weapons, Stoneskin
    4. Repair Critical Damage, Inflict Critical Damage, Armor of Speed, Cold Iron Weapons, Lesser Globe of Invulnerability, Protection from Elements, Thundering Armor
    5. Prismatic Strike, Align Weapons, Silver Weapons, Radiant Forcefield
    6. Blade Barrier, Tactical Detonation, Deadly Weapons, Reconstruct


    Enhancements (80 AP)

    Battle Engineer (41 AP)
    • Battle Engineer, Infused Weapons, Infused Armor, Infused Weapons II, Infused Armor II, Master Engineer
      1. Crossbow Training, Field Scrapper III, Thaumaturgical Conduits III
      2. Crossbow Training, Caustic Shot I, Extra Action Boost III
      3. Crossbow Training, Intelligence
      4. Crossbow Training, Endless Fusilade, Shatter Defenses I, Agility Engine I, Intelligence
      5. Reconstructed Crossbows, Weapon Attachment, Thunder-Shock Weapon, Unlock Potential, Tactical Mobility

    Harper Agent (23 AP)
    • Agent of Good I, Intelligence, Agent of Good II, Intelligence
      1. Harper Enchantment, Traveler's Toughness I, Strategic Combat
      2. Versatile Adept III, Know the Angles III
      3. Versatile Adept III, Intelligence
      4. Versatile Adept I

    Warforged (16 AP)
    • Improved Fortification, Warforged Constitution
      1. Mechanist III, Construct Toughness
      2. Warforged Tactics III
      3. Adamantine Durability III, Memories of the Last War: Arcane Slinger
      4. Memories of the Last War: Front Lines


    Destiny (24 AP)

    Legendary Dreadnought
    1. Legendary Tactics III, Extra Action Boost III, Attack Boost I, Constitution
    2. Damage Boost III
    3. Critical Damage III, Haste Boost III
    4. (none)
    5. Advancing Blows, Devastating Critical
    6. Master's Blitz

    Twists of Fate (36 fate points)
    1. Energy Burst: Acid (Tier 4 Draconic)
    2. School Specialist: Evocation (Tier 2 Magister)
    3. Precise: Evocation (Tier 2 Draconic)
    4. Fey Form (Tier 2 Shiradi)
    5. Stay Frosty (Tier 1 Shiradi)


    Due to gear becoming outdated so quickly as well as the minimizing of power difference between named gear, lootgen, cannith crafted, and special crafting systems (e.g. slaver's), and me spending very little time playing at cap these days, I am no longer going to devise optimal final gear sets for any of my builds. I'll leave that work to others who are more familiar with final gear sets.

    ----------------------------

    Adding the following quote here for safe-keeping in case the Lamannia forums aren't available when it's needed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    The DC of Rune Arm spells is suppsed to be 10 + (Charge Tier + 1) + (INT modifier) + (Max Charge Tier - 1) + (Evocation Feat Bonuses). The Evocation Bonuses were not applying.

    With this fix, bonuses from abilities like the Spell Focus: Evocation feat, Arcanotechnician's Evocation Focus enhancement, and the Evocation Specialist ability from the Magister destiny should all contribute to a Rune Arm's DC.

    At the moment, item/augment based sources of Evocation DC bonuses do not affect the DC of Rune Arm shots.
    As of U29, per the release notes:

    Artificer Rune Arm DC's now include all sources of Evocation DC Boosts.
    Last edited by CThruTheEgo; 07-13-2017 at 01:13 PM.
    Unarmed monk guide with builds|The Arcane Warrior: wiz/fighter hybrids|White Feather Sniper: CC/dps focused deepwood stalker|The Divine Cuisinart: divine crusader tempest|The Count of Monte Cristo: swashbuckler|Hassan's Assassin: dex assassin|Dubbell O'Seven: WF artificer|Santa's Little Slayer: dragonmarked elf centered kensai

  2. #2
    Community Member wax_on_wax_off's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Brisbane, Australia
    Posts
    7,870

    Default

    The long awaited build.
    Feats:
    Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot
    Feat: (Selected) Rapid Shot
    Feat: (Artificer Bonus) Precise Shot
    Feat: (Selected) Toughness
    Feat: (Artificer Bonus) Spell Focus: Evocation
    Feat: (Selected) Greater Spell Focus: Evocation
    Feat: (Artificer Bonus) Improved Critical: Ranged Weapons
    Feat: (Selected) Maximize Spell
    Feat: (Selected) Improved Precise Shot
    Feat: (Artificer Bonus) Quicken Spell
    Feat: (Selected) Insightful Reflexes
    Feat: (Artificer Bonus) Empower Spell
    21) Epic toughness
    24) ESF Evocation

    I'd swap Empower Spell for Precision. Empower adds a set amount to your spells now, I saw someone post it at being about ~+75 damage added to Blade Barrier (0.75 of base BB damage - 15d6 - only comes out to ~40 so not sure where 75 comes from.), just doesn't seem worth it considering the alternatives and a somewhat restricted SP pool.

    I'd consider swapping Insightful Reflexes for Adamantine Body. You get a nice chunk of PRR and AC from AB which might do more for survivability than a difference in reflex saves that might only be situational and could situationally be remedied with gear swaps (+10 reflex chaos docent, +4 insight, +8/+3 dex etc). To really know one way or the other it'd be best to work out what your reflex save will be and what sort of targets are reasonable (30ish was plenty in U13 but not sure how that's changed in U14 EE content).

    I'd swap Epic Toughness for Combat Archery. +1[Weapon Damage] on Needle gives 20+ DPS extra which is quite considerable. The 2% dodge is decent as well. The cost is -2 intelligence for the +2 dex to qualify which will give you better AB (you need ~70 AB to keep 95% hit rate with precision against all foes) and better reflex (so skipping IR becomes more feasible). I don't think a warforged artificer needs Epic Toughness, you've got quickened reconstructs, evasion, a solid HP pool already and ranged combat style, perhaps instead focus on forms of aggro management (Shadowdancer provides quite a few possibilities). I'd even consider changing base stats to 8/18/14/18/6/6 to have your cake and eat it too (and lose a total of 90 HP).

    For enhancements I'd look closely at Kinetic Casting and Deadly Kinetics. After the first rank in each you're getting only a little over +1% spell damage DPS per AP spent which isn't very cost effective. I'd definitely be wanting to have Wand and Scroll Mastery at least at rank III - realistically it should be IV. 1 rank in skill boost seems a no brainer (to get that resurrection scroll off to save the raid despite a death penalty or 3).

    Gear wise Windhowler Bracers should be on wrist slot, currently your bracers aren't doing much for you. For cloak slot I'd be looking at swapping in either of the Stealth Strike cloaks situationally (Wretched Twilight from Abbot or Magewright Cloak). Not sure if Manslayer is working on the smoke goggles, possibly only in SA range, I do hear it works fine on Epic Stalker Ring though so might want to stick with that until it's fixed.

    For the racial choice, I prefer helf or human myself but either works with its own set of pros and cons and you seem to have a good grasp on it. The bit that gets me is the +25% damage/Endless Fusillade combo with Versatility: Damage, it's just too good to miss.

    I wouldn't use a stone on a pure arti, too easy to level already, perhaps pick up a ranger life instead and then TR to artificer?
    Quote Originally Posted by Feather_of_Sun View Post
    Welcome to Dungeons and Dragons Online, and thanks for playing!
    Build Index

  3. #3
    Community Member Skavenaps's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    682

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by wax_on_wax_off View Post
    The long awaited build.


    I'd consider swapping Insightful Reflexes for Adamantine Body. You get a nice chunk of PRR and AC from AB which might do more for survivability than a difference in reflex saves that might only be situational and could situationally be remedied with gear swaps (+10 reflex chaos docent, +4 insight, +8/+3 dex etc). To really know one way or the other it'd be best to work out what your reflex save will be and what sort of targets are reasonable (30ish was plenty in U13 but not sure how that's changed in U14 EE content).
    heavy armor its a bad choice for a shadowdancer...

  4. #4
    Community Member wax_on_wax_off's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Brisbane, Australia
    Posts
    7,870

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Skavenaps View Post
    heavy armor its a bad choice for a shadowdancer...
    Oh true! Scrap that then. To think that I'd let myself be convinced of the value of AB on a WF Artificer without retorting with that gem :P

    Edit: Mithral Body is still an option.
    Quote Originally Posted by Feather_of_Sun View Post
    Welcome to Dungeons and Dragons Online, and thanks for playing!
    Build Index

  5. #5
    Community Member Loriac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    501

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by wax_on_wax_off View Post
    Oh true! Scrap that then. To think that I'd let myself be convinced of the value of AB on a WF Artificer without retorting with that gem :P

    Edit: Mithral Body is still an option.
    Mithral body is a great option with shadowdancer, if you take lithe 2 or 3. With lithe 3 and dex of 30-32, you end up slightly ahead of adamantine body for the high end armors. Lithe mitigates the issue of high end docents not scaling for dex for wf (vs. fleshie light and medium armor which does scale). Its also something you'd take anyway for the +6 to reflex saves, so its not even an opportunity cost.

    Its so good imo that I'd actually twist in lithe if I decided to use a different ED as my primary. Without it, you may as well not be wearing armor, with it you are competitive with other light/medium armor users.

    You lose out on PRR, which ends up being BAB / 2 for wf I think, but the defensive capabilities from shadowdancer should help out a lot.

  6. #6
    The Hatchery CThruTheEgo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Some random rock hurdling through the universe to who knows where...
    Posts
    3,594

    Default

    Thank you for the very extensive and detailed feedback Wax.

    Quote Originally Posted by wax_on_wax_off View Post
    I'd swap Empower Spell for Precision. Empower adds a set amount to your spells now, I saw someone post it at being about ~+75 damage added to Blade Barrier (0.75 of base BB damage - 15d6 - only comes out to ~40 so not sure where 75 comes from.), just doesn't seem worth it considering the alternatives and a somewhat restricted SP pool.
    This build is first and foremost a casting focused artificer making empower a must have. If I find that I am burning through my SP too quickly or that empower is not doing much for me, I may switch it out for precision. To that end, I will probably switch empower and maximize so that I can more easily exchange empower if desired.

    Quote Originally Posted by wax_on_wax_off View Post
    I'd consider swapping Insightful Reflexes for Adamantine Body. You get a nice chunk of PRR and AC from AB which might do more for survivability than a difference in reflex saves that might only be situational and could situationally be remedied with gear swaps (+10 reflex chaos docent, +4 insight, +8/+3 dex etc). To really know one way or the other it'd be best to work out what your reflex save will be and what sort of targets are reasonable (30ish was plenty in U13 but not sure how that's changed in U14 EE content).
    While I don't know exactly what the body feats offer with the recent changes (I'll have to look this up next time I'm in game since Wiki doesn't seem to have the changes yet), I'm fairly certain insightful reflexes will do more for the survivability of this build. This build is intended for EE content and extreme survivability is key for it. But let's do a reflex breakdown anyway.

    Reflex Save:
    8 base
    8 dex26 (16 base +3 tome +7 item)
    6 resistance item (stone heart)
    4 GH
    2 Good luck
    28 base (did I miss anything?)

    I'd rather not go up against EE casters with only a 28 reflex save. And while the gear swaps you suggest are fine for traps, they don't work for combat situations. As I showed in the OP, insightful reflexes will add 11 giving a base of 39 reflex save. I shouldn't have much trouble with a reflex like that. Adding in the gear swaps you suggest for traps will give another 10 for a 49 against traps. I'm pretty comfortable with those numbers. The only feat I give up for insightful reflexes is precision, which I think is well worth the sacrifice.

    Quote Originally Posted by wax_on_wax_off View Post
    I'd swap Epic Toughness for Combat Archery. +1[Weapon Damage] on Needle gives 20+ DPS extra which is quite considerable. The 2% dodge is decent as well. The cost is -2 intelligence for the +2 dex to qualify which will give you better AB (you need ~70 AB to keep 95% hit rate with precision against all foes) and better reflex (so skipping IR becomes more feasible). I don't think a warforged artificer needs Epic Toughness, you've got quickened reconstructs, evasion, a solid HP pool already and ranged combat style, perhaps instead focus on forms of aggro management (Shadowdancer provides quite a few possibilities). I'd even consider changing base stats to 8/18/14/18/6/6 to have your cake and eat it too (and lose a total of 90 HP).
    I don't understand how you get +20 dps. Do you have some numbers to back that up? I've haven't seen any new dps calcs. Also, as I've already mentioned, two of the primary goals of this build are extreme survivability and casting capability, and giving up epic toughness and -2 int for +1[W] isn't worth it imo. And you would lose 100 HP with the stats you suggest, which does make for more balance between survivability, ranged dps, and casting capability, but I chose greater survivability for a little less ranged dps.

    Quote Originally Posted by wax_on_wax_off View Post
    For enhancements I'd look closely at Kinetic Casting and Deadly Kinetics. After the first rank in each you're getting only a little over +1% spell damage DPS per AP spent which isn't very cost effective. I'd definitely be wanting to have Wand and Scroll Mastery at least at rank III - realistically it should be IV. 1 rank in skill boost seems a no brainer (to get that resurrection scroll off to save the raid despite a death penalty or 3).
    I know what kinetic casting and deadly kinetics offers, but there isn't really anything else that is a must have imo. I maxed these out because I had taken everything else I deemed necessary. If I decide to add in something else (electric line for Toven's for example), these would be the first to go for sure. Keep in mind also that these affect the rune arm as well, so that means more and bigger crits from both the rune arm and spells. One of the benefits of going WF, in fact, is being able to max these lines since WF have far fewer race enhancements that contribute to a build such as this. Wand and scroll mastery2 is enough imo. Skill boost isn't needed. This character was an artificer in his first life (which also adds a passive +1 to UMD) and the UMD was stupidly high, even a few deaths didn't matter. And I've played plenty of trappers before and skill boost is definitely not needed when you have the right gear.

    Quote Originally Posted by wax_on_wax_off View Post
    Gear wise Windhowler Bracers should be on wrist slot, currently your bracers aren't doing much for you. For cloak slot I'd be looking at swapping in either of the Stealth Strike cloaks situationally (Wretched Twilight from Abbot or Magewright Cloak). Not sure if Manslayer is working on the smoke goggles, possibly only in SA range, I do hear it works fine on Epic Stalker Ring though so might want to stick with that until it's fixed.
    I need at least 3 epic slots for the must haves: con6, GFL, and exc int1. It's nice to have good luck as well. The ring of the master artificer gives me con6 and GFL, so I have to keep either the cloak or bracers to fit in the exc int1. I don't really like having this on the cloak as there are some situations when I don't want fire shield hot to proc (though admittedly not very many) and would swap this out. But only losing 1 DC shouldn't be too much of a problem in those situations so it might be worth it to put exc int1 on the cloak and switch the epic wind bracers for the windhowler bracers. Though if I get Toven's then the epic wind bracers become more of a necessity. I don't think stealth strike is that much of a necessity. I'm not worried about pulling trash agro, and want to much of the time. And I didn't really have any problems with boss agro on my arti life before, even with human versatility damage boost and endless fusillade. Last I heard, manslayer on the smoke goggles was not working, but I have faith in Turbine

    Quote Originally Posted by wax_on_wax_off View Post
    For the racial choice, I prefer helf or human myself but either works with its own set of pros and cons and you seem to have a good grasp on it. The bit that gets me is the +25% damage/Endless Fusillade combo with Versatility: Damage, it's just too good to miss.
    For better balance between survivability, ranged dps, and casting capability, yes helf is probably the better choice, as I pointed out in my OP. But I chose to go with the best survivability and casting dps, which is WF. And I think I give up little crossbow dps (combat archery, precision, human versatility damage boost) for great gains in both survivability (HP, reflex saves) and casting dps (nearly max int and spell DC's, max force line). For me an artificer's primary dps is spells/runearm, not the crossbow. So imo, casting capability should be the arti's primary focus, not crossbow dps. At least that is the goal with this build.

    Quote Originally Posted by wax_on_wax_off View Post
    I wouldn't use a stone on a pure arti, too easy to level already, perhaps pick up a ranger life instead and then TR to artificer?
    The arti is fun and fairly easy to level, but I'm not a fan of the XP grind. To me, a 3rd lifer is a bit of a discipline and endurance test and I don't really enjoy it even with all the xp bonuses now. I've already gone through a 2nd life as a sorc just to get to a 36 point build to make epic toughness a viable option. And I wanted to use the stone on a 3rd lifer for the better xp gain from it. So there is no way I'm grinding out another life. I'm ready to be back at endgame as an arti and put this build to the test.

    Thanks for the feedback Wax.
    Unarmed monk guide with builds|The Arcane Warrior: wiz/fighter hybrids|White Feather Sniper: CC/dps focused deepwood stalker|The Divine Cuisinart: divine crusader tempest|The Count of Monte Cristo: swashbuckler|Hassan's Assassin: dex assassin|Dubbell O'Seven: WF artificer|Santa's Little Slayer: dragonmarked elf centered kensai

  7. #7
    Community Member Loriac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    501

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by CThruTheEgo View Post
    Thank you for the very extensive and detailed feedback Wax.
    This build is first and foremost a casting focused artificer making empower a must have. If I find that I am burning through my SP too quickly or that empower is not doing much for me, I may switch it out for precision. To that end, I will probably switch empower and maximize so that I can more easily exchange empower if desired.
    The only damage spell at end game that you'd use empower (or even maximise) for is BB; neither prismatic strike nor tactical detonation have useful damage beyond their cc capabilities. That said, the best case scenario for empower is as follows:

    Blade barrier is 15d6, which using DDO weighted dice gives base damage of 75 (as its really 15d3+45). Assuming a 18% crit chance and 2.5x crit damage multiplier (i.e. a 7/6/6 ap spend + greater arcane lore slotted somewhere), you end up with base damage of 95, which means empower is worth 95*0.75=72 at most. I found I wasn't using blade barrier so much in the expac, unless I was solo'ing (in which case scaling more than makes up for the loss of using empower).

    I don't think kinetic lore affects BB, hence greater arcane lore noted above. You could create an alchemical repeater with lacerating lore, however that seems to me suboptimal vs. making a dps based repeater instead.

    As you're levelling, I could see a use for empower and maximise, but my preference would be to take maximise first; on my arti, I found that anytime I was using blast rod say, I wanted stuff around me dead fast (if this wasn't the case, then I'd just use my repeater / runearm to do the job slowly but steadily). At the levels you use the lower level nukes, maximise tends to be sufficient (particularly if you slot in something like iron beads or bracers of wind). Also worth noting that you can slot in the level 8 tier 3 bracers of wind at level 6 using masterful craftsmanship, this would make a level 6 maximised blast rod pretty potent I should think.

  8. #8
    The Hatchery CThruTheEgo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Some random rock hurdling through the universe to who knows where...
    Posts
    3,594

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Loriac View Post
    ...snip...
    Thanks for the feedback Loriac. The only other feat worth taking is precision. It can be argued that both are only of marginal benefit, so it's really a personal choice between better spell or ranged dps. I'm taking empower at level 12 as a regular feat so that I can swap it out for precision and decide between the two from my own experience, which is also why maximize is taken at level 20.
    Unarmed monk guide with builds|The Arcane Warrior: wiz/fighter hybrids|White Feather Sniper: CC/dps focused deepwood stalker|The Divine Cuisinart: divine crusader tempest|The Count of Monte Cristo: swashbuckler|Hassan's Assassin: dex assassin|Dubbell O'Seven: WF artificer|Santa's Little Slayer: dragonmarked elf centered kensai

  9. #9
    Community Member jakeelala's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    3,205

    Default

    ill test it now. im pretty sure they're stacking

    My BB DC at 25 in Shiradi with 42 Int, no Evo DC twists: DC 37

    Draconic, 46 Int, and precise evocation: DC 41 (+2 DC Draconic and +2 DC from 4 Int)

    Draconic, 46 Int, with precise Evo AND Magister Evo SPecialist (+3 DC) twisted: DC 44.

    CONFIRMED: Stacking of Magister and Draconic DC.

  10. #10
    Community Member Valiance's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    618

    Default

    Looking forward to updates of this thread. Great info here.

    One question I have; do the levels of artificer you get from Draconic and Magister add directly to rune arm damage? i.e. will I be doing a d25 on those if you have those epic destinies? If so then I don't see how Draconic can be beat.

    V

  11. #11
    Community Member Valiance's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    618

    Default

    Also what do you guys think about this gear layout for a Arti very similar to the one in the OP:


    Goggles- Green Steel Conc Op
    Helm- Green Steel +45 hp, hvy fort
    Neck- Verik’s and swap (Noxious grtr arcane lore, torc)
    Trinket- Litany
    Cloak- Cloak of Wolf Exc Seeker 5, Dodge 4%, Attack +4 Diversion 20
    Belt- Con 6 of Dodge 2% Large Guild slot (+80 sp) (Cannith Crafted)
    Ring1- Stalker (seeker 6, exc sneak 2/4, manslayer, ghostly, exc int 1,)
    Ring2- Seal of Avithol (Dex7, sneak 5/8, exc sneak 3/5, improve deception)
    Gloves- Greater Evocation of good luck +2 (large guild slot +20 hp) (Cannith Crafted)
    Docent- +8 int, res 6, protection 6, toughness
    Boots- Rock boots (spr acid lore, stone guard, earth grab guard, acid res 10, grtr false life (slot), +1 exc con (slot))
    Rune Arm- Corrosion 114, potency 76, rough hide 6, insight int 3

    To me that gear layout should be incredible dps. Seeker +11, Sneak of 10attack/17dmg, very high int, and my guy has mithral body feat and it gives very nice AC as well.

    My thought would be this character would switch back and forth between Draconic, Shiradi and Shadow Dancer. The improved deception allows sneak attack to work more often, and the combination of the new Acid Rune Arm with Rock boots should give great damage. I of course will use force rune arm as well situationally.

    Thoughts?
    Last edited by Valiance; 08-21-2012 at 03:59 PM.

  12. #12
    Community Member Valiance's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    618

    Default

    Ya I really like the seeker 11 combined with the x3 crit of the new raid repeater. Also I don't want to use up my docent slot to try make the set bonus. It is nice but just uses up too many slots for me.

    Do you know if the arcane destinies add 5 levels of dmg to rune arms or do they cap out at 20. I'll be able to test this pretty soon but am curious about that.

  13. #13
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    3

    Default

    This is an awesome build, and pretty much the guideline for my character. The only changes I've made is precision for empower. I'm also thinking I'll drop the ESF: evo in place of epic toughness because when I started my character I did a 18 con, 16 dex, 18 int starting build. I'm having to put my lvl 16, and 20 stats into dex to make the epic archery feat as well.

    I really want to have that huge hit point pool from epic toughness so those full powered reconstructs can be hitting at about half life, and putting me to full. I went with precision because I see such a huge amount of my damage coming from my xbow while levelling, maybe when I'm all levelled up I'll change it out for empower, but I love having my xbow as maxed as possible, which is while I'll take the 1 pt hit to my evo DC for the combo of epic archery, and and epic toughness.

  14. #14
    Community Member Lorianus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    227

    Default

    500k more epic XP and I will reincarnate my 18arti/2monk Bladeforged into this build. PPR and MRR seems to make up for the loss of evasion to me. And I like the fact that I will have 4 level 6 spells then. I have a question: Manyshot was only mentioned as viable option in FotW but I would like to know if you/someone else has tried manyshot in LD. I have an epic raid box left and maybe manyshotting with a pinion would help to keep the blitz stacks up and is good DPS? The Int to Damage from Harper should work with bows too, right?

  15. #15
    The Hatchery CThruTheEgo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Some random rock hurdling through the universe to who knows where...
    Posts
    3,594

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Such755 View Post
    How is Legendary dreadnought the best epic destiny for this build?
    Let's take a look.

    Quote Originally Posted by Such755 View Post
    All con upgrades: Nice, but not crucial -at all-
    The con is just filler really, but getting more hp as filler is certainly not a bad thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Such755 View Post
    Extra action boost: Can be twisted
    I wouldn't bother twisting this if I wasn't in dreadnaught. This is more of a bonus, not a main attractor.

    Quote Originally Posted by Such755 View Post
    Damage boost: Will put Endless fusilade on timer and cannot be used with it at the same time. With a total of 10-12 action boosts per rest, will you really need more than just fusilade? Because they don't stack it seems useless.
    I use fusillade to build up blitz, for short battles, or when I want a lot of damage quickly. I use damage boost once I have several/max stacks of blitz built up or for longer battles. This is a nice balance imo – versatility ftw!

    I have 10 action boosts (5 base, 1 guild buff, 2 battle engineer, 2 dreadnaught) which is 20 total between fusillade and damage boost. I rarely get even close to finishing them all. But having that many means that I can constantly keep one up. That's a significant boost in overall dps.

    Quote Originally Posted by Such755 View Post
    Critical damage: Can be twisted
    What twist would you sacrifice for it?

    Let's quantify this to compare the damage from dreadnaught with shadowdancer. A Thunder-forged heavy repeater with overwhelming critical has a crit profile of 17-18x2, 19-20x3. So 6 from critical damage adds 6(2)(.1)+6(3)(.1)=1.2+1.8=3 average damage per hit. I'm not including +1 multiplier on 19-20 from devestating critical because I'll include this when I do those calcs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Such755 View Post
    Advancing blows: Melee only- useless
    The description states melee but it works for ranged also. I tested this personally. You get the buff icon and you can also see your damage modifier on the weapon section of your inventory sheet change with each stack. I did not test the actual damage output, but I'm convinced enough based on the other indicators. That's good enough for me, but feel free to test actual damage if you like and let us know the results.

    Quote Originally Posted by Such755 View Post
    Devastating criticals - I like it, but if you keep reading you might see how it's not THAT good
    Let's quantify this. A tier 3 Thunder-forged heavy repeater has base damage of:

    4.5[1d10]+12=4.5(5.5)+12=36.75
    +3 enhancement from battle engineer cores
    +1 harper enchantment
    +2 battle engineer weapon training tier 4
    +2[1d10]=11 from combat archery and deadly weapons
    +.5[1d10]=2.75 from weapon attachment
    +11 deadly
    +4 profane from Litany
    +24 from int 58
    +12 from know the angles with int 58
    +6 critical damage
    +12 seeker
    +5 exc seeker (I intend to recraft my GS boots to include fire lore on them so I can change the cloak to the Adamantine Cloak of the Wolf for exceptional seeker 5, I just haven't done so yet because lately I've been focusing my time on another character. But I'm going to include this because it's the more optimal setup.)

    So that's an additional 130 damage on every 19-20, which is 10% of the time, so 13 average damage per hit.

    That doesn't include:
    +1[1d10]=5.5 from point blank shot
    +1 - 5 from advancing blows
    +6 vs evil from harper agent of good (they stack, tested by caprice, results somewhere in this thread iirc)
    So that's another 16.5 potential average damage or up to an additional 1.65 average damage from devestating critical if they are all applying. These are variable so I won't include them but more than likely at least one of them will be applying at any given time.

    I'm also not including ranged power in any of these calcs. That's just going to make the numbers go up though, and will favor dreadnaught since it offers higher raw damage than shadowdancer.

    Quote Originally Posted by Such755 View Post
    Blitz - Same as devastating criticals. It's nice, but if you keep reading you might find out it's not the BEST of the best.

    If you go Shadowdancer, you can twist in that critical damage and:
    +6 int which will be permanent +3 damage, not situational like the +7 from Blitz. Might ultimately cover for that and \ or Devastating criticals.
    Blitz adds 7 ranged power per stack up to 10, not 7 damage. 7 ranged power adds more damage than a straight +7 damage. We already calculated the damage this build gets above. Subtract the critical damage bonuses (23) to get the average damage on a non-crit.

    130-23=107, with up to another 16.5 potential from point blank shot, advancing blows, and agent of good. The formula for ranged power is:

    (100+ranged power)/100

    So 7 ranged power is (100+7)/100=1.07

    Multiply the base non-crit damage by 1.07 to see the average damage with 7 ranged power.

    1.07(107)=114.49

    Blitz stacks up to 10 times, which is 70 ranged power or:

    1.7(107)=181.9

    I'm not even including crit hits here. Just trying to show the amount of damage that dreadnaught actually provides. That's a boost of 7-75 damage depending on how many stacks and only considering non-crits. Then add to that the 13 average damage from critical damage. Altogether dreadnaught offers a bare minimum of 20-88 average damage per shot, and that's before factoring in crits, additional ranged power, point blank shot, agent of good, advancing blows, or the vulnerability debuff from Thunder-forged, all of which would simply increase these numbers and only widen the gap between dreadnaught and shadowdancer.

    Also, blitz is definitely not situational. You now start with 3 stacks instead of 1, and endless fusillade almost always gains you another couple stacks. It is extremely easy to get a blitz going and keep it up on this build.

    Shadowdancer's +3 damage from int will be slightly more than 3 average per hit due to crits, so let's quantify it assuming only missing on a 1:

    +3 on a roll of 2-16, or 75% of the time, so 3(.75)=2.25
    +3(2) on a roll of 17-18, or 6(.1)=.6
    +3(3) on a roll of 19-20, or 9(.1)=.9
    Added together that's an average of 3.75 damage per hit.

    Quote Originally Posted by Such755 View Post
    Also, +3 to all spell DCs of course.
    DCs are already a bit low on this build for reflex based saves unfortunately. But there's not much that can be done about that. I could gain another 3 from an int based destiny, 1 from Thunder-forged evocation focus, 1 from a +6 tome, and then there's store pots and such which I don't consider reasonable or sustainable so I don't include them. So that's another 5 for a 61 DC blade barrier. Energy burst DC is currently 58 and would be 62 with the above bonuses that apply (only the int). Rune arm DCs are borked because not everything applies to them, so they are stupidly low and nothing is going to improve them. So the DCs are not useless, but the extra I'd gain from shadowdancer would not push them into the no-fail range.

    As a hybrid build, damage comes from many different types of sources and you have to find the right balance between everything the build is capable of. The sacrifice in ranged damage to gain marginally better DCs, but still not no-fail, is not worth it imo. I have played this build in shadowdancer, fury of the wild, and dreadnaught. Based on my experience in each of those, it performs best in dreadnaught currently. In other words, I do more overall damage, when considering every source available (i.e. casting, ranged, and rune arm), in dreadnaught than I do in shadowdancer.

    Quote Originally Posted by Such755 View Post
    5d6 sneak attack.
    It's actually 6d6 sneak attack, 1 for each core. Sneak attack damage is affected by ranged power but since ranged power has not been fully implemented yet, this build only has 9 ranged power (from harper versatile adept) without blitz going. So let's quantify that.

    6d6(1.09)=21(1.09)=22.89

    This is dependant on not having agro. This build does a lot of AoE dps, so I like to get agro to gather mobs together. Also, as a ranged build you can hit mobs before melee can, which will get you their agro. So for my own playstyle, this is very situational damage.

    Now let's add the 3.75 average damage per hit from the 6 int gained in shadowdancer, multiplied by 9 ranged power.

    22.89+(3.75)(1.09)=26.9775 total average damage from shadowdancer, most of which is dependent on not having agro.

    Compare that to the 20-88 of dreadnaught (which does not include a lot that would only push it further ahead) and it should be pretty clear by now that dreadnaught adds significantly more dps than shadowdancer.

    Quote Originally Posted by Such755 View Post
    Nice boost to reflex save (+6 from Lithe and +3 from int)
    +9 reflex would give this build a 63 reflex save, which is no-fail in about 95% of situations. I'll return to reflex saves when I address adamantine vs mithal body.

    Quote Originally Posted by Such755 View Post
    10-15% fortification bypass
    Would be nice, but crits would be much less without critical damage, devestating critical, and blitz from dreadnaught, so the benefit of this would be minimized. Being in dreadnaught and twisting this would make much more sense.

    Quote Originally Posted by Such755 View Post
    Shadow form
    25% incorp is nothing to sneeze at, that's for sure. I'll return to this when I address adamantine vs mithal body.

    Quote Originally Posted by Such755 View Post
    Also, if you take Mithral body instead of adamantine you get a useful Evasion.
    Mobs do a huge amount of physical damage now. This is a much greater threat than magic/element damage. Adamantine body basically trades no damage from magic/element damage for significantly less physical damage. And the additional MRR means you don't really take much from magic/element damage either, so the loss of evasion is hardly noticed. Not to mention, to gain evasion I'd have to be in shadowdancer which, it should be pretty clear by now, I consider a suboptimal destiny for this build.

    The additional damage mitigation from heavy armor also means I don't miss the 25% incorp from shadow form. And the additional MRR from heavy armor means I don't miss the +9 reflex saves that shadowdancer would bring.

    Quote Originally Posted by Such755 View Post
    If not Shadowdancer, what about shiradi? It seems to be working for rangers, why not artificers?
    Shiradi is a horrible destiny for an arti imo. I hated leveling through it. Ranged rangers run in fury of the wild, not shiradi. Unless this was changed, shiradi procs are affected by metamagics when they proc from a spell, not from ranged weapons. Which means there is a huge disparity between the benefits of shiradi on a caster vs a ranged build.

    Also, shiradi casters are built to have a lot of cheap multi proc spells to spam through so they can get as many shiradi procs as possible. Artis do not have a selection of cheap, spammable, multi proc spells, so it's less than ideal for them in every way.

    Quote Originally Posted by Such755 View Post
    Can someone please prove me wrong?
    Hopefully this has been sufficient for you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Such755 View Post
    Other than that, I love this build very much! Kudos.
    Thanks. It is a lot of fun and very versatile.
    Last edited by CThruTheEgo; 02-12-2015 at 11:01 AM.
    Unarmed monk guide with builds|The Arcane Warrior: wiz/fighter hybrids|White Feather Sniper: CC/dps focused deepwood stalker|The Divine Cuisinart: divine crusader tempest|The Count of Monte Cristo: swashbuckler|Hassan's Assassin: dex assassin|Dubbell O'Seven: WF artificer|Santa's Little Slayer: dragonmarked elf centered kensai

  16. #16
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    64

    Default Let's Play series on YouTube using this build

    I've recently started a Let's Play series on YouTube featuring this build. Thanks for the work putting this build together. I look forward to its progression.

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCu5..._as=subscriber

  17. #17
    The Hatchery CThruTheEgo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Some random rock hurdling through the universe to who knows where...
    Posts
    3,594

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Oilfan73 View Post
    I've recently started a Let's Play series on YouTube featuring this build. Thanks for the work putting this build together. I look forward to its progression.

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCu5..._as=subscriber
    Nice! I hope you have fun with it.

    And you did get my name right!
    Unarmed monk guide with builds|The Arcane Warrior: wiz/fighter hybrids|White Feather Sniper: CC/dps focused deepwood stalker|The Divine Cuisinart: divine crusader tempest|The Count of Monte Cristo: swashbuckler|Hassan's Assassin: dex assassin|Dubbell O'Seven: WF artificer|Santa's Little Slayer: dragonmarked elf centered kensai

  18. #18
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Posts
    8

    Default

    Hi, Thanks for sharing, I have a question, why on Harper Agent enhancements
    Only Strategic Combat I, no Strategic Combat II?

  19. #19
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    17,677

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Zhijie View Post
    Hi, Thanks for sharing, I have a question, why on Harper Agent enhancements
    Only Strategic Combat I, no Strategic Combat II?
    Artificers can cast Insightful Strike (INT to-hit) and Insightful Damage (INT to dmg), but not both simultaneously. So you get INT to-hit from Strategic Combat I and INT to dmg from Insightful Damage spell.
    Revisiting the Classics: Axesinger / Dwarven Defender / Drow Ninja / Drow Paladin / Elven Ranger / Monkcher / Sacred Vanguard
    Other build threads: Cleric Domains / Kundarak Brigade / Iconic Builds
    My Build Index: a Motley Menagerie of Original Rapscallions, Pugilists, and Gimps!

  20. #20
    Community Member Iniquitous's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Posts
    6

    Default

    I had 1 question so far about the build. I am sure it is a stupid one that I am overlooking but how do you get rid of that 35% arcane spell failure with the adamatine plating?

Page 1 of 5 12345 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

This form's session has expired. You need to reload the page.

Reload