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  1. #61
    Community Member Tirisha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Auralana7214 View Post
    One can find random loot that fits the bill, but, in an effort to stack multiple effects in one slot, I am finding it hard to fit in a random loot piece.

    Currently my Cleric is wearing the Gauntlets of Eternity which only carries a +60 to Spell Power, but it also has other attributes on it that I like. I could give up these Gauntlets for something else, but it would have to be something with better other attributes. For now I will be healing below my potential.
    are they the ioun stone of the xpack? I haven't seen any, just checked AH too, no devotion items that can be worn cept a crafted one (with low stat ofc)
    Real life is a worse grind than any MMO.
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  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ertay View Post
    30% healing amp is now a given on gloves slot. This item alone should be carried by everyone who expects to get healed, in every raid or higher difficulty party. 20% and 10% are also available on random loot now, which makes it far easier to fit them in. 30 Positive energy spellpower is easily twisted or taken from tier 1 of the fvs tree. There also are are a lot more free healing abilities from that same tree along with others as well.

    I agree there has been an hp inflation and this does not complete balance the changes out, but to say divine healing overall has been kept constant is not correct by a long shot. The heal spell has nearly been kept constant, while heal mass got buffed overall.
    <sarcasm>
    There are ml 12 gloves with 30% healing amp that I can wear when running an at-lvl VoN6 elite raid? Wow! I've must have missed the memo on that one. Can you please tell me in which quest I can find them?
    </sarcasm>

    You may be surprised by this, but not everyone bought the x-pack. In fact premium players that only usie Turbine points for their purchases can't purchase it at all yet.

    Heal is a lvl 6 spell, that is acquired by clerics at lvl 11 and some FvS at lvl 12. Superior Ardor clickies were usable at that lvl, and would give a 75% boost to the spell for use in mid-lvl content. For people who enjoyed playing a melee oriented divine at mid-high lvl heroic quests the changes to divine healing are horrific.

  3. #63
    Community Member Chette's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MRMechMan View Post
    So ONE, we need epic destinies to get back to where we were before? Even though every other class got MASSIVE buffs?
    This is the key point to take away from this feedback.
    Every other class in the game got a HUGE buff from epic destinies and new gear. Divines, at least as far as healing is concerned, need to get these items and destinies just to be as good as they were before at running level 20 content with heroic players, never mind running new content with epic players.
    ~ Cheara : Raizertron : Pozitron : Higgz Bowtron : Illudium : Staphe Infection : Abraa Capocus ~
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  4. #64

    Exclamation

    Have you guys been looking into the problems with Heal spells not going off at all?

    1) There's seems to be a possibility that cosmetic companions block the spell as healers are reporting blocked results on flat surfaces with no architecture in between.

    2) There is a definite issue with targets of heal not being on the same plane as the caster. This is noticibly terrible in many new quests like all demonweb areas, the caves in several quests, and the tiered platform at the end of the Portal Opens. The cool designs of the new zones are getting people killed due to the way Heal now checks for targeting.

  5. #65
    Community Member Rizzia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sirgog View Post
    My suggestion on healing and spellpower is simple: Change Healing Amplification from a "Heals hit you for X% more" to "Heals hit you for an additional X points". That latter would make Cure potions worth something at high level, keep Heal in check, and would be easier to understand too. Plus you could then add higher Healing Amp items without breaking the game. You would need to have a lower healing amp coefficient on Radiant Servant Auras and Druid HoTs possibly (getting hit for 125 a tick by an Aura might be silly), but that could be worked out on Lamannia.
    True the 30% and 10% are easier to get now, and with +2 insight on new set pieces more people can have 20% on a tod ring, but for max you have to build your character a certain way (taking h-elf instead of whichever race is better suited to the class/starting with min 13 wis etc). Not to mention those that grinded out 3 pally PLs.

    On my Fvs (which is not a healbot^^) with the devotion 102 helm I slotted in, I find healing in raids to be easier than before the expansion, sure hps have gone up, but more people are aquiring heal amp, those that dont..well they die more. (sorry if your a 1200 hp barb with little to no PRR and no heal amp, you aint worth wasting sp on).

  6. #66

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    Quote Originally Posted by morticianjohn View Post
    If you were to balance the spells at the base they would stay relative to each other in power no matter what you add to the game in terms of spellpower, feats, enhancements etc...

    In addition it would be easier for the players to figure out the effectiveness of each spell because even if you list the % of spellpower in the description (as you've said you want to do in some future update) they still have to take their overall spellpower subtract the spellpower they get from feats and then multiply by whatever % you give them to get the correct spellpower. Do this for 10-20 different spells with varying spellpower and you've essentially turned something very simple (spellpower) into one of the most complicated aspects of the game.

    In otherwords easier for the devs to balance (short term) but much less intuitive and more difficult for the players than balancing at the base.
    +1 for MorticianJohn!

    In my opinion in order for spellpower or a spellpower number on a character sheet to have any useful meaning it must be applied to all spells in the same way, no this much percentage for this spell and that much percentage for that spell. As has already been mentioned, if a spell is over or under powered adjust it's base damage values, don't adjust how spellpower affects it.

    I also agree with the posters that have pointed out that cure and healing are offensive spells. They are used to damage undead. As such not scaling them the same way that arcane caster damage spells scale is not fair to divine casters.

    "Healers", what are "Healers"? I play a divine caster and healing is only one part of what I do.

    Torin

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ertay View Post
    30% healing amp is now a given on gloves slot. This item alone should be carried by everyone who expects to get healed, in every raid or higher difficulty party. 20% and 10% are also available on random loot now, which makes it far easier to fit them in. 30 Positive energy spellpower is easily twisted or taken from tier 1 of the fvs tree. There also are are a lot more free healing abilities from that same tree along with others as well.

    I agree there has been an hp inflation and this does not complete balance the changes out, but to say divine healing overall has been kept constant is not correct by a long shot. The heal spell has nearly been kept constant, while heal mass got buffed overall.
    Heal amp is great for helping how much you get healed for yourself, not others. While I agree it SHOULD be in every build, it isn't. Just like heavy fort isn't. Just like a lot of things aren't. And healing amp doesn't do squat unless you can guarantee that everyone you are healing has that uber healing amp. Your healing burden is determined by the hardest to heal party member, not the best equipped.

    Everything got bigger this update. The damage that mobs deal has gone up. The hit points that players have has gone way up. The damage that our fellow party members do (melee and arcane spell damage) has gone up significantly. Everyone else's epic equipment and abilities are to do more than they are doing now. To get more potent. Except for divines. Now, the best devotion items are needed to make up for what heal lost, and EA healing boosts offer only a little bit more. Adding a meaningless boost to spells that remain poor second choices doesn't help. That's like nerfing khopeshes, but changing the base damage of daggers from 1d4 to 1d6 to compensate.

    I am underwhelmed by the divine experience this update:

    - The aforementioned heal issue, in which very few seem to understand that changing a $1.00 into $1.10 isn't a benefit when the price of bread just went up by half.

    - The complete lack of superior lore items for light and untyped damage. Only healing. (Again, reinforcing the healbot impression many of us have)

    - The focus of the epic destiny on complicated stacking to get unpredictable healing/light boosts, based on stack sizes that in many cases won't be approached in the course of normal questing.

    - An offensive caster ED that only benefits light damage spells and healing, when the class has only one relevant light damage spell, mainly used on bosses. No level-appropriate ray spell. No AOE spell. No benefits whatsoever to other divine damage spells (untyped, fire, etc.).

    - The one epic ray SLA for divines (Avenging Light) was cut in half during U14.1, with no comment. Meanwhile arcanes are getting elemental AOE damage options that do damage in the thousands.

    - Bonuses that are good only against undead and evil outsiders. Great, these EPIC abilities should come in handy next time I'm levelling through Necro and the Vale.

    - A raid with 12 unique weapons as potential loot, and not a single one of them a good fit for a divine caster.

    At this point, I'm putting my evoker on the shelf, unless I decide to TR into a sorc. I have pretty good gear too, but in this new world, mobs don't move through BB, you need umpteen past lives to have acceptable spell pen (and sadly, implosion still requires a SR check despite the description), so I cast, cast, cast again, then finally beat down stuff with a longsword.

    I am stil playing the helf melee FVS though. I did get some good healing amp, and that was good enough to heal ME. (Again, it takes ML 21-22 epic items just to heal myself as well as pre-update). But I've tried pugs, tried raiding, and I'm done doing that for now. I just run with guildies now, or solo. I've had it with having to actually drink pots in raids I long ago mastered, just because everyone's hit points and damage taken went way up, and my healing output didn't.
    Last edited by justagame; 07-18-2012 at 02:04 PM.

  8. #68
    Community Member PNellesen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by justagame View Post
    Lots of good stuff
    My experiences, reactions, and opinions are largely the same as justagame's. I was SO freaking happy to get an SLA that actually did some almost-Sorc-like damage, only to have it apparently cut in half for no reason I can discern.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ertay View Post
    While they were at it though, the devs decided to go on an incredible nerfhammer rampage and left nothing in their wake standing...

  9. #69
    Community Member Auralana7214's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tirisha View Post
    are they the ioun stone of the xpack? I haven't seen any, just checked AH too, no devotion items that can be worn cept a crafted one (with low stat ofc)
    For example, my FVS wears a helm, since she was not dependent on the Minos, that is +90 to Devotion. I found it on the Auction House. Maybe I was just lucky that day?
    When asked, "What are we going to do tonight?" the only acceptable answer is, "The same thing we do every night...Try to take over the world!"
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  10. #70
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by countfitz View Post
    At this point, you realize that you're ruining the gameplay experience of DIVINES, and that you're making it impossible for groups that require healers to play have any success in getting a PUG together because we're refusing to PUG anymore (FYI, it is easier to solo than try to heal PUGs because of your changes, most players DO NOT, like you think, try to make it easier for us, they just expect us to work harder for them) so you fix it by MAKING IT MORE COMPLICATED.
    I can heal PUGs just fine. Why are you unable to? My gameplay has not been ruined. Please don't say these changes ruin the gameplay experience of divines. Say it ruins YOUR gameplay and why.

    I'm no healbot. I cast offensively, and even melee trash with a greataxe quite often. I have no problems healing my groups. My gameplay has not been ruined.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago. Note - This was posted in 10/2013
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by TedSandyman View Post
    Some people brag about how fast they finished the game. I cant think of a stupider thing to brag about. Or in this game, going from level 1 to level 30 in two days, or however long it takes. I can't even begin to imagine what drives a person to think that is fun. You are ignoring all of the content and options and going for sheer speed. It is like going to a museum and bragging about how fast you made it through. Or bragging about how fast you finished a good steak.

  11. #71
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by countfitz View Post
    That is the major point of all this. The devs are actively trying to make "Divines" healers, nannybots, and stop us from doing anything else. At the very best we're supposed to carry some new thurmatuergy staff with devotion and radiance and blast stuff as a dps caster.
    There's plenty of wearable radiance and impact and devotion gear.

    There's new item called the Holy Symbol of Lolth... You should look into it. It takes care of your light spells and blade barriers. Slot devotion on your helm, and you'll never have to switch weapons again...

    And yes, that means you're going to have to shuffle your inventory... Don't tell me that's not fair, because EVERYONE has to shuffle their inventory set-up when new levels and new gear comes out.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago. Note - This was posted in 10/2013
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by TedSandyman View Post
    Some people brag about how fast they finished the game. I cant think of a stupider thing to brag about. Or in this game, going from level 1 to level 30 in two days, or however long it takes. I can't even begin to imagine what drives a person to think that is fun. You are ignoring all of the content and options and going for sheer speed. It is like going to a museum and bragging about how fast you made it through. Or bragging about how fast you finished a good steak.

  12. #72
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ertay View Post
    30% healing amp is now a given on gloves slot. This item alone should be carried by everyone who expects to get healed, in every raid or higher difficulty party. 20% and 10% are also available on random loot now, which makes it far easier to fit them in. 30 Positive energy spellpower is easily twisted or taken from tier 1 of the fvs tree. There also are are a lot more free healing abilities from that same tree along with others as well.

    I agree there has been an hp inflation and this does not complete balance the changes out, but to say divine healing overall has been kept constant is not correct by a long shot. The heal spell has nearly been kept constant, while heal mass got buffed overall.
    This. Good post.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago. Note - This was posted in 10/2013
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by TedSandyman View Post
    Some people brag about how fast they finished the game. I cant think of a stupider thing to brag about. Or in this game, going from level 1 to level 30 in two days, or however long it takes. I can't even begin to imagine what drives a person to think that is fun. You are ignoring all of the content and options and going for sheer speed. It is like going to a museum and bragging about how fast you made it through. Or bragging about how fast you finished a good steak.

  13. #73
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Auralana7214 View Post
    Currently my Cleric is wearing the Gauntlets of Eternity which only carries a +60 to Spell Power, but it also has other attributes on it that I like. I could give up these Gauntlets for something else, but it would have to be something with better other attributes. For now I will be healing below my potential.
    Serious question. Are you having any problems keeping your groups healed even healing below your max potential?
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago. Note - This was posted in 10/2013
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by TedSandyman View Post
    Some people brag about how fast they finished the game. I cant think of a stupider thing to brag about. Or in this game, going from level 1 to level 30 in two days, or however long it takes. I can't even begin to imagine what drives a person to think that is fun. You are ignoring all of the content and options and going for sheer speed. It is like going to a museum and bragging about how fast you made it through. Or bragging about how fast you finished a good steak.

  14. #74
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atree View Post
    <sarcasm>
    There are ml 12 gloves with 30% healing amp that I can wear when running an at-lvl VoN6 elite raid? Wow! I've must have missed the memo on that one. Can you please tell me in which quest I can find them?
    </sarcasm>

    You may be surprised by this, but not everyone bought the x-pack. In fact premium players that only usie Turbine points for their purchases can't purchase it at all yet.

    Heal is a lvl 6 spell, that is acquired by clerics at lvl 11 and some FvS at lvl 12. Superior Ardor clickies were usable at that lvl, and would give a 75% boost to the spell for use in mid-lvl content. For people who enjoyed playing a melee oriented divine at mid-high lvl heroic quests the changes to divine healing are horrific.
    Are you saying you are unable to effectively heal level 11 and level 12 fighters (how many hps do they have?) with your heal spells?
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago. Note - This was posted in 10/2013
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by TedSandyman View Post
    Some people brag about how fast they finished the game. I cant think of a stupider thing to brag about. Or in this game, going from level 1 to level 30 in two days, or however long it takes. I can't even begin to imagine what drives a person to think that is fun. You are ignoring all of the content and options and going for sheer speed. It is like going to a museum and bragging about how fast you made it through. Or bragging about how fast you finished a good steak.

  15. #75
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Torin17 View Post
    I also agree with the posters that have pointed out that cure and healing are offensive spells. They are used to damage undead. As such not scaling them the same way that arcane caster damage spells scale is not fair to divine casters.
    This is a good point.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago. Note - This was posted in 10/2013
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by TedSandyman View Post
    Some people brag about how fast they finished the game. I cant think of a stupider thing to brag about. Or in this game, going from level 1 to level 30 in two days, or however long it takes. I can't even begin to imagine what drives a person to think that is fun. You are ignoring all of the content and options and going for sheer speed. It is like going to a museum and bragging about how fast you made it through. Or bragging about how fast you finished a good steak.

  16. #76
    Community Member Auralana7214's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thrudh View Post
    Serious question. Are you having any problems keeping your groups healed even healing below your max potential?
    On my cleric, no. I never implied I was. I am kind of a perfectionist, and would like for my toon to perform optimally, as I'm sure many others do.

    My FVS is a different story. She has struggled a bit, so I got her the Devotion Helm I spoke about before. That didn't increase it much, so I am looking into other options for her. She is my current project and is soon to be level 23. It's difficult to keep up with healing guildies that are 900+ HP on her sometimes.
    When asked, "What are we going to do tonight?" the only acceptable answer is, "The same thing we do every night...Try to take over the world!"
    Sarlona - Auralana, Orcalana, JuicyLucy, Aquani, Wistia, Aurabella, Guildy, etc. If you see the last name Hather, it's either me or the hubby.

  17. #77
    The Hatchery danotmano1998's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadFloyd View Post
    4. Why isn't Reconstruct on this list?

    This was missed and will be in Update 15.
    Wait.. what?
    <-Curelite Bottling Company->

    Quote Originally Posted by Chilldude
    Dude, did you see they way that guy just pressed button 1? It was amazing! A display of skill unseen since the 1984 World Games where in the men's room, between events, a man washed his hands with such unbridled majesty that people were claiming the faucet he used was OP.

  18. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thrudh View Post
    Are you saying you are unable to effectively heal level 11 and level 12 fighters (how many hps do they have?) with your heal spells?
    I ran an elite Lord of eyes on my lvl 16/2 FvS/Rog the other day. The WF barb had about 800 hp. My Heals, with a devotion 60 wand in hand, were hitting him for about 120-140 a pop. Incoming damage in that quest was far greater per-hit. There was absolutely no way I could keep him alive. I was relegated to a pure healbot in that run, which was definitely NOT fun for me, and after Pugging a few more elite at-lvl quests I realised that playing my melee-divine is not fun anymore.

    I'm currently leveling my fighter/bard, but due to the crazy trap/spell damage on even low-level elite quests I find that PuGs are much harder to come by, and more often than not just give up for the night and go watch television instead.

  19. #79
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atree View Post
    I ran an elite Lord of eyes on my lvl 16/2 FvS/Rog the other day. The WF barb had about 800 hp. My Heals, with a devotion 60 wand in hand, were hitting him for about 120-140 a pop. Incoming damage in that quest was far greater per-hit. There was absolutely no way I could keep him alive. I was relegated to a pure healbot in that run, which was definitely NOT fun for me, and after Pugging a few more elite at-lvl quests I realised that playing my melee-divine is not fun anymore.

    I'm currently leveling my fighter/bard, but due to the crazy trap/spell damage on even low-level elite quests I find that PuGs are much harder to come by, and more often than not just give up for the night and go watch television instead.
    WF Healer's Friend is bugged.

    That's why you couldn't keep him up. Not because of the healing changes. They really need to fix that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago. Note - This was posted in 10/2013
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by TedSandyman View Post
    Some people brag about how fast they finished the game. I cant think of a stupider thing to brag about. Or in this game, going from level 1 to level 30 in two days, or however long it takes. I can't even begin to imagine what drives a person to think that is fun. You are ignoring all of the content and options and going for sheer speed. It is like going to a museum and bragging about how fast you made it through. Or bragging about how fast you finished a good steak.

  20. #80
    Community Member ShadowFlash's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thrudh View Post
    There's plenty of wearable radiance and impact and devotion gear.

    There's new item called the Holy Symbol of Lolth... You should look into it. It takes care of your light spells and blade barriers. Slot devotion on your helm, and you'll never have to switch weapons again...

    And yes, that means you're going to have to shuffle your inventory... Don't tell me that's not fair, because EVERYONE has to shuffle their inventory set-up when new levels and new gear comes out.
    While I disagree with your point of view, as my personal gameplay has been dramatically reduced, I am not one of those resistant to re-gearing....in fact, I like it.

    Holy Symbol of Loth is nice...very nice...good suggestion.

    My problem is 100+ spell power is needed to reach status quo under the new rules. This, coupled with the ML restrictions on said gear, means a general nerf until epic levels and everything evens back out. Pre-21+, heal takes an impossible to out-gear nerf. There's just way to many things that hit melee-divines all at once for me to continue enjoying my preferred playstyle.

    6 posts all in a row is annoying...someone interrupted your spamming, or else it would have been 7....consolidate man...consolidate...

    Quote Originally Posted by Atree View Post
    I ran an elite Lord of eyes on my lvl 16/2 FvS/Rog the other day. The WF barb had about 800 hp. My Heals, with a devotion 60 wand in hand, were hitting him for about 120-140 a pop. Incoming damage in that quest was far greater per-hit. There was absolutely no way I could keep him alive. I was relegated to a pure healbot in that run, which was definitely NOT fun for me, and after Pugging a few more elite at-lvl quests I realised that playing my melee-divine is not fun anymore.

    I'm currently leveling my fighter/bard, but due to the crazy trap/spell damage on even low-level elite quests I find that PuGs are much harder to come by, and more often than not just give up for the night and go watch television instead.
    Similar experiences for me...and I too am working on my 12/8 Kensai II/ Virtuoso I. Fards FTW I'm very happy with U14 changes on that build, and choosing fatesinger or dreadnought is a delightfully tough descision. Just showing I'm not completely disgruntled with all of U14, in fact, on a whole, I'm quite pleased with most things non-divine related.

    ShadowFlash
    Last edited by ShadowFlash; 07-18-2012 at 04:06 PM.
    All the math your brain can handle concerning Divine Punishment
    http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=344769

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