Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 59

Hybrid View

  1. #1
    Community Member Dragavon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    1,512

    Default Extreme focus or versatility, what do the DDO community prefer?

    Just curious here.

    For myself, I prefer to build characters that have focus in one area, but still have some versatility. I like to keep UMD maxxed on all characters, and prefer to have some other option for selfhealing than chugging potions. I never start a melee character with 18STR, or 20 for an orc, for example.

    The only characers where I recommend maxing out a primary stat is wizards and caster focused clerics/fvs.

    And I also love multiclassing

    What do people think? Are those last 2 stat points worth putting 6 points into STR on every melee build?

  2. #2
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    90

    Default

    I only play characters as versatile as possible 3 of my 5 characters have a lvl of arty so can do traps, umd and some bonus sp. (cleric, druid and wizard.) and 2 monk (god gives so much for two levels! +2 feats,evasion and +3 saves) And either dwarf or half elf (trying to resist that paladin dilly grr...) for the saves boost. that leaves 17 wizard, druid or cleric. Still gets level 9 spells, and I never seem to die unless I'm really unlucky... My levelling mate is a pure barb or rogue, max dps he can all in strength with no care to living, there's been some quests where he made a nice backpack item.

    As long as you can do your role decent enough theres no harm in specing for more versatility. All my characters can kill just fine, instant kills or aoe dots its just a little slower but I dont need a healer hireling to keep me alive

    I do have 2 pure... a bard and an artificer... eps... dang well just call me jack.
    Last edited by idle1; 07-09-2012 at 01:34 PM.

  3. #3
    The Hatchery Scraap's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    2,503

    Default

    Adaptability. I'll take a slightly lower number on one end if it means better effects elsewhere every time.

  4. #4
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    17,462

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Scraap View Post
    Adaptability. I'll take a slightly lower number on one end if it means better effects elsewhere every time.
    Me too..
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gary_Gygax
    No single character has all the skills and resources needed to guarantee success in all endeavors; favorable results can usually only be achieved through group effort. No single player character wins, in the sense that he or she defeats all other player characters; the goal of the forces of good can only be attained through cooperation, so that victory is a group achievement rather than an individual one.

  5. #5
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    17,462

    Default

    nm - heh, old thread that I've already posted in.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gary_Gygax
    No single character has all the skills and resources needed to guarantee success in all endeavors; favorable results can usually only be achieved through group effort. No single player character wins, in the sense that he or she defeats all other player characters; the goal of the forces of good can only be attained through cooperation, so that victory is a group achievement rather than an individual one.

  6. #6
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    14,031

    Default

    I prefer what someone (sigtrent?) dubbed "skirmishers:" melee builds who sacrifice a little DPS (i.e., less than max STR or THF instead of TWF) for added versatility (e.g., trap skills, UMD, buffs) and/or survivability (e.g., Evasion, high saves, more HPs, self-healing).

    My favorite builds have been my melee bards, usually following the classic rogue 2 / ftr 2 / bard 16 split. I also have a pure WC bard (currently lvl 21), but I really miss having Evasion and the rogue skills, not to mention the feat shortage.

  7. #7
    Community Member redspecter23's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Toronto, Ontario
    Posts
    3,688

    Default

    My main is versatile and adaptable. He has a wide range of loot that I don't have the luxury of farming out on my alts. He is my primary toon for most things I do on a regular basis. I use my alts for specialty roles and that is where I tend to either min/max or specialize in one particular role exclusively. I prefer to play my main, but if the group situation really needs a healer or artificer, I can swap into that role with an alt. As I don't use them for multiple purposes, they don't need to do a lot of things well, just a few specific things.
    Kaarloe - Degenerate Matter - Argonnessen

  8. #8
    Community Member HastyPudding's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    1,480

    Default

    Adaptability is always good. Even a heavily enchantment- crowd control-focused archmage is going to need something to do against enemies immune to their enchantments.

    It's the same with 'healers'; healing is all good and fine, but you need to provide semi-decent crowd control (command, greater command, cometfall) and back it up with some form of damage, whether it be melee or some offensive spells. Vice versa, those evoker FVS need to have some ability with healing; you have healing spells, you need to learn when it's necessary to use them.

  9. #9
    Community Member HatsuharuZ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    2,375

    Default

    I usually prefer single-classed characters, and I like builds that play to that classes' strengths. I am especially fond of the Artificer, which can do alot of things.

  10. #10
    The Hatchery sirgog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    17,195

    Default

    Almost all of the most impressive achievements in DDO have been done by multifaceted characters with uninterruptable self-healing, some source of slow and steady sustained damage, and some efficient ways to neutralise large packs of monsters.
    I don't have a zerging problem.

    I'm zerging. That's YOUR problem.

  11. #11
    Community Member fco-karatekid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    South Texas Hill Country
    Posts
    3,103

    Default

    I prefer maximum flexibility.

    one of the reasons I am liking DDO more now... for a while, it was min-max-or-fail... I really don't like being put into a bubble like that.

  12. #12
    DDO Catalog MrCow's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Merrimack, NH
    Posts
    7,316

    Default

    I lean more towards versatility.
    Server - Thelanis
    Diaries of a True Reincarnate (Wizard, Sorcerer, Melee, Divine, Artificer, Druid)

  13. #13
    Community Member Brennie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    California
    Posts
    3,509

    Default

    Up until i started playing Druid, i would have been indecisive abotu this question. After having played aroudn with druid a bit, my answer is a solid: Focused.

    I've come to realize that being semi-decent at a myriad of things means you can attempt to fill any role that is needed, but you simply won't be very good at it. Having a party made of people who are only "kind of" good DPS means your bos beatdown might take a lot longer, or might fail altogether. Even moreso if you're only "kind of" a good healer - there are definite benchmarks you have to reach to outpace enemy damage to your group, and if you can't hit them, your team loses. And obviously, being "kind of" good at trapping, or CC, or instakills or any other more binary specialties means you will likely fail more than you succeed, and failing at all can spell disaster for a quest.

    Most characters
    in DDO can fully spec for one type of role and still keep some versatility. Divine casters can easily spec to be excellent full-time healers, btu still maintain good caster DPS as necessary. Crowd Control wizards can also bust out some damage, and any damage oriented rogue or arti worth their salt can also handle any traps they come across.

    So, for me, Focus. Don't be okay at a few things, pick something useful and be GREAT at it. That doesn't mean you need to sacrifice absolutely everything else. Infact, outside of, say, pure Horc THF raging barbarians, most characters have the ability to build in some flexibility and utility that doesn't diminish their primary role in any way.

  14. #14
    Community Member Nuryam's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    121

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Brennie View Post
    Up until i started playing Druid, i would have been indecisive abotu this question. After having played aroudn with druid a bit, my answer is a solid: Focused.

    I've come to realize that being semi-decent at a myriad of things means you can attempt to fill any role that is needed, but you simply won't be very good at it. Having a party made of people who are only "kind of" good DPS means your bos beatdown might take a lot longer, or might fail altogether. Even moreso if you're only "kind of" a good healer - there are definite benchmarks you have to reach to outpace enemy damage to your group, and if you can't hit them, your team loses. And obviously, being "kind of" good at trapping, or CC, or instakills or any other more binary specialties means you will likely fail more than you succeed, and failing at all can spell disaster for a quest.

    Most characters
    in DDO can fully spec for one type of role and still keep some versatility. Divine casters can easily spec to be excellent full-time healers, btu still maintain good caster DPS as necessary. Crowd Control wizards can also bust out some damage, and any damage oriented rogue or arti worth their salt can also handle any traps they come across.

    So, for me, Focus. Don't be okay at a few things, pick something useful and be GREAT at it. That doesn't mean you need to sacrifice absolutely everything else. Infact, outside of, say, pure Horc THF raging barbarians, most characters have the ability to build in some flexibility and utility that doesn't diminish their primary role in any way.

    I think the OP was talking about stats mainly. Something like: Do you go for that 20/18 or is a 16 good enough so that you can raise that 10 to a 14 in your tertiary stat?

    I love to splash and multiclass. I have a pure cleric 20, pure Sorc 20 and a fvs 13 that will most likely remain pure. But the rest of them...usually 12/6/2 splits.

    So when IS it worth it to focus on an ultra-high stat?
    In my opinion it is when a lot of things that make your build work depend on it.

    But don't forget that you have more ways to boost a stat during a toon's life: tomes, level points, class enhancements, items, racial enhancements, spells, etc. Those can be used to make up for the lack of focus at the start. In rare cases you can even put all level points and all class/race enhancements in a single stat (Str and Dex are the two possibilities for that I think). It all comes down to planning the character. What do I want it to be able to do at level X? And what do I need at level X to be effective. Then you plan back from level X down to level 0. Along the way you have your prerequisites and preferences that make up the basis of your stat distribution.

    Some examples of my personal choices to focus or focus less.

    Focus!
    For example take a pure wizard. Spell DC's, Available spells and spellpoints all depend on Int. The DC value is so important in this game that it is worth going 18 or 20 Int and neglecting all other stats.

    Focus?
    Now take a pure melee damage fighter. Is it necessary to go 18 Str to get that extra +1 to hit and +2 damage (assuming 2hw)? Perhaps 13 Dex or Int is also important to get qualified for feats or Half-Elf Dilettante feats. It does affect all those thousands of swings you make. I think the to-hit part is less of a pain with the new system than the damage is. To hit you can easily repair with a feat or spell, but the damage part...
    And Str also affects your Combat Tricks (sunder, Stun etc). You will have to see if losing 1 point in the DC's of those is that bad. Will a 44 vs a 45 be that bad?

    It gets more interesting when you start to splash or multiclass. You often have to put points in other stats to make the classes you mix up synergize.

    No real focus...
    My ranger6/monk12/rogue2 Arcane archer/two weapon fighting ninja Spy. I have a 16 Str, 16 Dex, 14 con and 14 wis as a starter (2nd life). The damage is based on Str mostly (for bows and short swords) so all level points will go into that. But I also want a high dex for improved precise shot (and maybe combat archery?) and Greater Two Weapon Fighting. I also needed some Wis to get some results out of 10k-stars, but with 26 at level 20 I am content. According to the calculations made on these forums it gives me 60% extra attacks. Which is more than enough. So here I chose a concept (melee and ranged) which gives me some perks, but also means I have to sacrifice some other things. That translates to the stat distribution. In this case I believe that taking an 18 over a 16 will break more than it would add overall.

    Focus afterall!
    My erstwhile warforged Wizard8/Fighter12 Kensei II. It needed to be able to cast level 4 spells, they were for self buff and repair only, so no DC's needed. A GS item provides 200+ SP which is more than enough on top of the base SP of this build (650 SP or so total at 20). Int 14 would have sufficed. So basically I could survive with the 8 base int of a warforged (+6 item). I did choose to not be dependent on an item and went with 10 Int base +2 tome and +2 Wiz Enh Int II. Dex, Wis and Cha were totally ignored. Con was 14 base +2 of Race. So basically I had most of my points to put in Str. And leveling up was easy. The first 10 levels I took my 8 wizard levels in. Due to good equipment and high Str/Con I meleed all of it. Around level 14-20 you did miss 2 things: 1 BaB is 16 at cap and you are always 4 behind on most melees (unless you use Divine Power like I did all the time) and you have a big chunck taken out of your hps (8*6 = 48 hps is not small thing). So while it looked like I needed to focus in 2 stats (Str and Int and some in Con) I acually didn't have to at all. I might even bring him back now that Displacement is self-only.

    Multiclass with a focus!
    Last example...my Rogue12/Ftr1/Arti6. Here I did go for as high an Int as possible. Because it influences all I want to be able to do with this toon. It's a Mechanic II, Battlemaster I, repeater using, trapmonkey. Int affects: spell points, skill points, damage for repeaters, attack for repeaters and my bonuses on Search and Disable Device. I needed some Dex for precise/improved precise shot and Con I would never drop below 14.


    Hope this helps you decide on what you like to build!

    Cheers Nuryam
    Last edited by Nuryam; 07-11-2012 at 11:27 AM.

  15. #15
    Community Member HastyPudding's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    1,480

    Default

    And yet, on the other hand, the more I play DDO the more I realize that the multiclass experience penalties were in place for a good reason. All of these exploiter and maximum versatility builds are freakish and unnatural in the spirit of D&D.

  16. #16
    Community Member janave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Earth
    Posts
    2,021

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by HastyPudding View Post
    And yet, on the other hand, the more I play DDO the more I realize that the multiclass experience penalties were in place for a good reason. All of these exploiter and maximum versatility builds are freakish and unnatural in the spirit of D&D.
    In DDO there is more than enough to worth going pure, with the enchanment pass, there will be even more, i suspect they wont even out the tier1-3 pre bonuses, i believe t2-t3 will be a good boost to have, not to mention capstone is really nice on many classes.

    For me the best feature of DDO is the near endless options for shaping your toons, make your character the way you want it. Not some diabloish/wowish choose a preset and be the very same as the other 99999*99999*99999 characters.

    They were very modest when they advertised something like 100 distinct play styles . You can be very very unique in DDO, and thats a huge attraction for me.

    Play the way you want, a very rewarding experience imho.

  17. #17
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    west coast U.S.A
    Posts
    1,300

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by HastyPudding View Post
    And yet, on the other hand, the more I play DDO the more I realize that the multiclass experience penalties were in place for a good reason. All of these exploiter and maximum versatility builds are freakish and unnatural in the spirit of D&D.
    LOL not in the spirit of 3E+ D20 era. Ever bother to look at any NPC listed in most source books, all are made fairly using the rules even elminster. Its the rule rather then the exception in the D20 system to have at least 4 or more core classes and at least 2 or more PRC splashed into by 20, go higher and so does the splashing.

    Its actually quite restricted and lame how we only have a 3 class limit in DDo, it makes a being like elminster not even be allowed to actually exist.

  18. #18
    Community Member FuzzyDuck81's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Berkshire, UK
    Posts
    4,947

    Default

    My approach isnt to go for totally focussed characters or completely versatile ones.. I usually go for a primary focus or theme, with a secondary ability & some handy tertiary capabilities, eg. my monkcher which is primarily an archer, has some secondary melee capabilities & tertiary backups through cleric dilly for self healing & some handy buffs (seriously, for those who like versatilty half elves were an awesome addition).
    I don't mean to come across as unsympathetic - but I am, so I do.

  19. #19
    Community Member wax_on_wax_off's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Brisbane, Australia
    Posts
    7,870

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dragavon View Post
    Just curious here.

    For myself, I prefer to build characters that have focus in one area, but still have some versatility. I like to keep UMD maxxed on all characters, and prefer to have some other option for selfhealing than chugging potions. I never start a melee character with 18STR, or 20 for an orc, for example.

    The only characers where I recommend maxing out a primary stat is wizards and caster focused clerics/fvs.

    And I also love multiclassing

    What do people think? Are those last 2 stat points worth putting 6 points into STR on every melee build?
    A man after my own heart. I agree with everything and would say that 17-18 strength is worthwhile if build points allow - but they rarely do except on a THF'ing build without any need for int/cha (so no combat expertise and not paladin). Especially with the changes to AC it's worthwhile on more characters than ever to have ~12-14 starting dexterity for better reflex saves and AC.
    Quote Originally Posted by Feather_of_Sun View Post
    Welcome to Dungeons and Dragons Online, and thanks for playing!
    Build Index

  20. #20
    Community Member janave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Earth
    Posts
    2,021

    Default

    Focused characters usually best at blaming the healer .

    Im 100% for versatility, and adaptability. Onetrickyponies are very low regard on my list. Minmaxing on a Wizard is a very easy to track behavior and often leads to very poor playing style (read: rotation between fod/wob).

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

This form's session has expired. You need to reload the page.

Reload