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  1. #41
    Community Member Postumus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stainer View Post
    If that is true, that is a terrible mechanic. Levels 20-25 should be able to group together without issue. There are several reasons. Content is limited at those levels. Those levels are the end game. I could go on, but I hope you (someone) gets the idea.
    100% agree.

  2. #42
    The Hatchery MRMechMan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deadlock View Post
    This sounds like the sort of random decision that is floated in a meeting just so that everyone can disagree with it, and it's then withdawn as a highly visible act of "listening and taking your feedback onboard" that can later be referred to as the "see, we do listen to you" example.

    Unless I'm really missing something, this has to be filed under "Unnecessarily Convoluted" and buried somewhere. KISS.
    Yea....there is no way an idea this bad hits live. Your explanation sort of makes sense.

    On the other hand I would not be suprised if it DID hit live, either.

  3. #43
    The Hatchery danotmano1998's Avatar
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    Quick update:

    Leveling up XP not being able to be banked is a bug, confirmed by dev. Check the thread, too lazy to copy/paste.
    <-Curelite Bottling Company->

    Quote Originally Posted by Chilldude
    Dude, did you see they way that guy just pressed button 1? It was amazing! A display of skill unseen since the 1984 World Games where in the men's room, between events, a man washed his hands with such unbridled majesty that people were claiming the faucet he used was OP.

  4. #44
    Community Member voodoogroves's Avatar
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    I'm pretty dense and need this explained more clearly.

    Is this going to affect
    - BB / streak
    - level-based penalties
    - over-level / power-leveling
    etc.

    Just one? Multiple? all?
    Ghallanda - now with fewer alts and more ghostbane

  5. #45
    Community Member Sgt_Hart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadFloyd View Post
    # Heroic Levels + # Active Destiny Levels

    (or 20 + active destiny level)

    We do this to provide flexibility. This means someone that has, say, a level 4 destiny and TR's, once he hits level 20, if he makes that destiny active, he's considered level 24.

    Conversely a level 25 player can switch to a new destiny and be considered level 20 for the purposes of XP penalties.

    We welcome feedback on this, especially the constructive kind.
    Just to confirm.. that means that 1d5 epic levels will never be counted. While 1d6 EpiDes Level's will be?

    I'm not sure I like the potentially bigger range one can choose to be in. Frankly.. I think it could make Pugging epic stuff ini say.. 3 month's a right bloody nightmare to work out the level of everyone in the group, and what destiny their on, and what level it is.

    Intention: I approve of.

    Suggestion for improvement: Track Epic levels, and Allow a player(Case by case basis)to trade in 10% of XP to be treated as a lower level. Or not 10%, figure out whatever the bonus amount is to run it at level Vs the hit they would give the group.

    I.E. Tom(21 Ftr), ****(23 Clr) and Harry(24 Dvl) choose to run Quest X. It's 22 on selected difficulty, so Harry is a 2 level difference, **** is a 1. Let them choose to Take the XP hit PERSONALLY only, and spare the Tom(**** & Harry's choice)/****(Harry's choice) from it.
    Hart o Gold Hart o Song
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  6. #46
    Developer MadFloyd's Avatar
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    Thanks for the feedback.

    It's obviously clear that you prefer the simpler method so I will happily revert this change.
    The kobold cannot be marked as junk because it cannot be sold. You can destroy it by dragging and dropping it outside your inventory.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadFloyd View Post
    Thanks for the feedback.

    It's obviously clear that you prefer the simpler method so I will happily revert this change.
    That good to hear.

    But to clarify: If a lvl 25 toon ran a lvl 25 quest, with a fresh epic lvl 20 guy. No one would get an xp penalty correct?

    So no power level penalties just over level penalties?
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  8. #48
    Community Member Sgt_Hart's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadFloyd View Post
    Thanks for the feedback.

    It's obviously clear that you prefer the simpler method so I will happily revert this change.
    I love the intent. I'm just preemptively ****ing my pants at the notion of the drama when setting up epic level raids and People wanting their Max XP, and their "Good" EpiDes...
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  9. #49
    Community Member Eladiun's Avatar
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    Is this calculated level going show on the LFM? Friends List? Guild List? Character?

    If no you are going to have some angry people when they take a giant unexpected XP hit because of this phantom level.
    “If at first you don't succeed, keep on sucking till you do succeed.”

  10. #50

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    Quote Originally Posted by MadFloyd View Post
    Thanks for the feedback.

    It's obviously clear that you prefer the simpler method so I will happily revert this change.
    Good to hear; it's not like unlocking all those destinies and leveling for millions of XP is enough grind - having to get penalized just because you can't hard or elite everything makes for frustration.

  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadFloyd View Post
    Thanks for the feedback.

    It's obviously clear that you prefer the simpler method so I will happily revert this change.
    Ok, you got me. What's the catch here? This was a pretty hasty retreat. So what exactly is "the simpler method" so everyone is on the same page now?

    Because right now it feels alot like this:

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadlock View Post
    This sounds like the sort of random decision that is floated in a meeting just so that everyone can disagree with it, and it's then withdawn as a highly visible act of "listening and taking your feedback onboard" that can later be referred to as the "see, we do listen to you" example.

    Unless I'm really missing something, this has to be filed under "Unnecessarily Convoluted" and buried somewhere. KISS.

  12. #52
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    I hope that's the case. The other explanation is they're throwing random ideas at the wall two weeks before release and hoping they magically won't be buggy messes.

  13. #53
    The Hatchery danotmano1998's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadFloyd View Post
    Thanks for the feedback.

    It's obviously clear that you prefer the simpler method so I will happily revert this change.
    Thank you ever so much.
    <-Curelite Bottling Company->

    Quote Originally Posted by Chilldude
    Dude, did you see they way that guy just pressed button 1? It was amazing! A display of skill unseen since the 1984 World Games where in the men's room, between events, a man washed his hands with such unbridled majesty that people were claiming the faucet he used was OP.

  14. #54
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    Uh, what just happened?

    1. So how exactly will levels be calculated now?

    2. Will there be xp penalties in grouping with 20-25, or not? (I vote not, for the record.)
    Graceana, 28 rogue (TRing like crazy) ~ Xiya, 12 ranger/8 fighter ~ Shinshi, 28 monk ~ Ayaxi, 20 rogue (TRing) ~ Saravi, 28 cleric ~ Talvi, 20 druid
    Zinzie, 18 sorcerer/2 paladin ~ Kishori, 20 bard ~ Sanziana, 20 ranger ~ Faunia, 9 druid/9 monk/2 fighter/8 epic ~ Viven, 16 bard/4 fighter/8 epic
    Cliodna, 18 wizard/2 rogue (TRing) ~ Serenwyn, 15 bard/3 fighter/2 rogue ~ Duisteri, 12 monk/5 wizard/3 rogue/4 epic
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  15. #55
    Community Member Aritukus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadFloyd View Post
    We do this to provide flexibility. This means someone that has, say, a level 4 destiny and TR's, once he hits level 20, if he makes that destiny active, he's considered level 24.

    Conversely a level 25 player can switch to a new destiny and be considered level 20 for the purposes of XP penalties.
    So, if I understand this correctly, then if I have settled down to my fully leveled and perfected epic destiny that I always wanted for my build, I will be <forced> either to swap my currently active, perfected and long-wished (in some cases) epic destiny to one of those I havent even xped before <IF> I want to play with my friend who just say capped his toon to lvl 20 and is starting advancing forth, or I am <forced> to log my other character (who may have the same problem) or I <may> simply ignore him, if I am to respect his xp gain from epic quests. This was not here before and it is, sincerely, very bad mechanism.

    I believe that some sort of XP penalty is in place, becouse fully advanced epic destiny is, as I understand, very powerful in, say, epic normal.

    But in this certain situation (that I find myself often in), if im up to help a friend whos lvl (for purposes of XP penalty) is 21, I simply have to abandon epic destiny I want to play with my current character I want to help with if I am to respect his XP gain.

  16. #56
    The Hatchery danotmano1998's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grace_ana View Post
    Uh, what just happened?

    1. So how exactly will levels be calculated now?

    2. Will there be xp penalties in grouping with 20-25, or not? (I vote not, for the record.)
    1. I *think* this means that heroic level + epic level = character level.

    2. My *guess* would be yes, just like regular questing, but I strongly hope not.

    At least with levels calculated not to include epic destinies, the division between level 20 always (no destinies) and level 20-25 (with destinies) vanishes and becomes a non issue. The way it was initially proposed, actually TAKING your destiny would become a level and XP liability. Now we can feel free to pursue whatever path of power we choose without negatively impacting our ability to group or get experience.
    <-Curelite Bottling Company->

    Quote Originally Posted by Chilldude
    Dude, did you see they way that guy just pressed button 1? It was amazing! A display of skill unseen since the 1984 World Games where in the men's room, between events, a man washed his hands with such unbridled majesty that people were claiming the faucet he used was OP.

  17. #57
    Developer MadFloyd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eladiun View Post
    Is this calculated level going show on the LFM? Friends List? Guild List? Character?

    If no you are going to have some angry people when they take a giant unexpected XP hit because of this phantom level.
    It would have show up in these places as additional value in parentheses.
    The kobold cannot be marked as junk because it cannot be sold. You can destroy it by dragging and dropping it outside your inventory.

  18. #58
    Developer MadFloyd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oradafu View Post
    Ok, you got me. What's the catch here? This was a pretty hasty retreat. So what exactly is "the simpler method" so everyone is on the same page now?

    Because right now it feels alot like this:
    The simpler method is heroic level + epic level with the same XP penalties as on live servers today.

    We save a lot of work by reverting the change. The intent was to provide more flexibility for players, example you're level 25 and now you start a new destiny. You're less powerful and would prefer to play lower level content; you can do so without penalties.

    It was also the reason you can switch destinies as many times as you like.

    That said, there are some complexities with this scheme - appropriate feedback everyone is one of them - and it's a big one. The other complexity is that some people (as pointed out here) may not have epic destinies (a scenario we sadly have to support). There are a couple other complexities that I won't get into, but suffice to say reverting this is much easier and unless all of you were going to really appreciate the new scheme (which you don't), it's simply not worth it.

    And of course, there is a lot of value in 'KISS'.
    The kobold cannot be marked as junk because it cannot be sold. You can destroy it by dragging and dropping it outside your inventory.

  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadFloyd View Post
    The simpler method is heroic level + epic level with the same XP penalties as on live servers today.

    We save a lot of work by reverting the change. The intent was to provide more flexibility for players, example you're level 25 and now you start a new destiny. You're less powerful and would prefer to play lower level content; you can do so without penalties.

    It was also the reason you can switch destinies as many times as you like.

    That said, there are some complexities with this scheme - appropriate feedback everyone is one of them - and it's a big one. The other complexity is that some people (as pointed out here) may not have epic destinies (a scenario we sadly have to support). There are a couple other complexities that I won't get into, but suffice to say reverting this is much easier and unless all of you were going to really appreciate the new scheme (which you don't), it's simply not worth it.

    And of course, there is a lot of value in 'KISS'.
    You had a small response to the idea 2 pages personally I liked it, but didn't respond because it seemed like a good solution to the xp curve vs using epic levels - which don't scale your character power level as much as a full destiny - and never expected such a heavy we don't like it response ( need to respond to the haunting thread to make sure my view vote is thrown in too after this)

    I also suspect that most responses were thinking woohoo I can have someone else power level me through my epic destinies, which isn't really playing the game it's gaming the game.

  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadFloyd View Post
    It would have show up in these places as additional value in parentheses.
    This covers the one scenario I was concerned about.

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