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  1. #581
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    Default

    So far, 1 Guild member chooses "Elite Only".
    I,also, tend in that direction.

    If that ends up the concensus.....
    Playing 3 levels below on Elite gives us the same Quests, but we would have more HP, SP, Skills, etc.
    BUT, there would be an XP penalty.

  2. #582
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    Default Stress relief from all all the downtime blame turbine :-)

    taken from thread
    http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=394686

    Quote Originally Posted by Zorth View Post
    "We are working on our characters instead of playing them".

    Some one said it before me, but I thought it was such a powerful statement, that I put it here.
    Quote Originally Posted by alvarego View Post
    Well this is yet another stone in the foot of newcomers, and there're many ... the game has become really hostile to newcomers and the gap between experienced and newcomers have become much wider.

    IMHO there's yet another important issue here, it's all about Dungeons & Dragons Pen & Paper charm, what's attractive in the real game, simplicity in my opinion, only a few clear rules, balanced classes and easy to solve with a d20 situations, much of this feeling is gone, too many stacking-nonstacking, too many effects on weapons, too much STR (how much is max nowadays? 140-150?), too much damage from casters to balance the uber STR, too many HPs on monsters, too many stacking +hit/+dam/+crit-range/+crit-mult ... it's just moar and moar and moar and in the end it's just less fun.

    Too much WoW, each day less D&D.

    PS: happy to read such a thread, many have written about this thing just to hear the mockings about 'Can I haz your stuff?' ... yeah maybe people just rant and the looks are wrong, but still there's something rotten deep inside, and it won't get any better just looking the other way or going further into the sh*t
    and i comment some player said before entering a quest recently "do we do hard or suicidal"



    Here's Azzlorn's point of view .
    I begged and borrowed magic items, hired sword swingers, spent sleepness nights, to be part of the Thaco Fellowship. With this help i managed to complete the quests that Tukcc gave me so i would be able to adventure with them. The quests in the harbour were not much of a challenge and i saw these as a test. But I was beaten to death the 1st time i entered the fortress in Tangleroot. A favoured soul told me some tactics and soon 2 foray's into the fortress were under my belt.
    The items and hired help are gone in this band of adventurer's.
    Then the Strange-ness happened. A powerful Guards contingement was suddenly posted by a crack in the habour wall. Wolves, Bears began striding into the Pubs, playing domino's with a drunken bear can be kinda scary. More disconcerting was house Jurasco filled with the injured and dying. I myself helped tend to my friends terrible injuiries after failing in our quest. Hmmm some of them do seem to have a crush on a female friend of mine, and she know's why you make her climb the ladders 1st. After several weeks the Strange-ness calmed down but something had changed. Many adventurers disappeared into the crack in the habour wall, bringing back tales of another world. New magic started to be found. Things did'nt quite seem to work as they did before. Even now amongst populace there is much confusion.
    The taverns and streets of Stormreach abound with stories and good deeds to be done. I listen to them and think how wonderous it would be to attempt those gallant deeds with his friends. How much more fun it would be in 3 barrel cove than in the catacombs. How much more challenging in Tangleroot than the harbour.


    My vote is a BIG NO to normal(as we progress we may have to do a couple on normal when we meet a 'difficulty surge" so we can adjust.)

    I've never understood anyone's obsession with elite.
    I could do all the quests we've run so far on elite solo. What i'd like to play is the quests that NEED a group. The 1's you can't do 'wiv a hire'. Would we be able to finish those kind of quests on elite in 2 hours.

    Elite as we are now until we find we can't actually complete quests THEN My choice is Hard at level preferably, or 1 below.

    No i don't want to test difficulty levels unless its something like for example Irestone Inlet/Tangleroot/Delera's you know a real long or tough adventure that will sort us out once and for all with all this talk. My god do we have to resort to the crappiest quests.



    Why does anything needs to be changed?
    Last edited by SlowDM; 10-10-2012 at 01:22 PM.
    Just awestruck, wether it be a Dragon flying overhead Stormreach, that glowing character who just zoomed in'n'out of the Pub, or that i can drink a Beholder under the table and best of all rescuing Damsels in distress.

  3. #583
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    Default

    Nothing NEEDS to be changed, nor is intended to change.
    I felt there was discontent in some of you and am asking you all to express your oppinions.

    Now, I "feel" I've gotten my answer.

  4. #584
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    Default "We shall endeavor to persevere."

    =

    SlowDM: That is quite an interesting and thought provoking Forum Post. Thank you!

    Elite content is challenging. It truly is more fun to take on with our deliberately handicapped characters. Failure IS an option! After all, it is our unofficial Motto. Well... that, or "We shall endeavor to persevere."

    Roleplay was a major item in the original D&D concept. Getting to know the Characters you battled evil with was, and is, part of the experience of D&D. Each of our Characters have a personality and history that formed that "Person", and together they make up this wonderfully unique group of friends, whom we greet in Eberron each week. Let us not forget that RP element.

    intruder1: I will officially remove my objections to "Adjustments" from DDO Store, and Class Specific aids. It is difficult to argue with the positive results we have been experiencing.... and on Elite! Cogs is a lot more fun with his "Lucky Hat", than without! (Thanks LeadHero5... My hero! *Bats eyes adoringly*)

    Cogs is getting lots of suggestions, including hard numbers, in PM. Things are looking up, as his "training" advances to new "levels". Kierik has suggested some really fascinating options, which are in Ron's Planner now for review. *Winks at Kierik, as cogs ain't gonna bat his eyes at a sneaky lil Halfling pickpocket!*

    =
    Last edited by Fricko; 10-10-2012 at 03:35 PM. Reason: spieling and tpyos.

  5. #585
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    Default Made to eat my own words

    Irestone Inlet on Elite completed put that in your pipe and smoke it zergers :-) no shrines and extremely limited magic items. I have 3, a +70sp helm, a +1 scepter with +36 heal/+1 dc to 1st level spells and a cure moderate wand, no potions no scrolls.
    I'll write a story at weekend still tired after finally getting to sleep at 4.30 am this morning.
    Oh our roleplaying characters don't know what we have to do with that 'gun powder barrel' or where to to take it. Monsters don't respawn its a change of guard shift :-)
    Last edited by SlowDM; 10-11-2012 at 11:59 AM.
    Just awestruck, wether it be a Dragon flying overhead Stormreach, that glowing character who just zoomed in'n'out of the Pub, or that i can drink a Beholder under the table and best of all rescuing Damsels in distress.

  6. #586
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    Default Oppinions on Quests level 1-4

    (What follows is purely an opinion based on observance of our adventures)

    D&D on DDO (Thac0 Fellowship) is an attempt to play Classic D&D using DDO. What this absolutely demands is a guideline limiting the Magic Items usable relative to your characters level. Along with this is careful selection as to what Quests you adventure in.

    As we have adventured, I have kept a rough idea of character Armor Class, “To Hit” bonus, Hit Point, etc of both Party and Monsters.
    Generally, these stats have been roughly even. The grazing hit thing has pretty much insured that most hits do some damage.
    As with the Player Characters, a Monster Spellcaster is a FORMIDABLE opponent! This can change a Minor Encounter into a Significant one.

    Every Quest contains 3 types of Combat Encounters.
    Skirmishes: Lower level monsters, generally outnumbering the party, but no spell casters, but also providing no Encounter End Reward (Chest).
    Significant Encounters: Roughly equal level monsters, slightly outnumbering the party but containing one or more spell casters. These encounters mostly have a random appearance and do provide an Encounter end Reward (Chest).
    Major Encounter: Not much about this type you don’t already know. The combination of monster numbers and relative levels always exceed the party, a few or single strong monsters down to average level and numerous.
    The thing with Major Encounters is a Magic Limited Party is ALWAYS at odds.


    As the Guild is 6th level, up to now the most notable “turning of the tide” event in combat has been Critical Hits. It can be said that, without a lot of Magic Gear, Weapons that produce Critical Hits are the most important.
    Coincidentally, DDO provides quite a few “Normal” weapons that have this attribute. (Maybe NOT so coincidentally)

    Another factor that needs serious consideration for those using little or no Magic is the Dodge and Concealment factors. I’ll call them “Saving throws“.
    They can seriously bolster a characters Armor Class.
    Last edited by intruder1; 10-12-2012 at 01:25 PM.

  7. #587
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    Default "The Worg's supper responds."

    =

    10-10-2012

    The Cog Oiler was not pleased with his performance on the latest mission. Admittedly, it was not in an environment where his primary skills were needed. No locks to pick, or secret doors to locate, or traps to discover and disarm. None.

    On the bright side, his duties as Scout and information gatherer had been in almost constant use, with his listening skill very effective in detecting otherwise invisible patrols. He was also pleased that there had been a total absence of Undead (except for Grondley's Summoned Skeleton Warrior, may Olladra Bless it!), and that his weapons had proved capable of dealing damage in the few instances where such use had proved necessary.

    They had taken on a task suggested by Tuk, involving the rescue and recovery of the crew of the Banshee. That ship, under the command of Captain Niles Cage, had been sunk by Yaaryar the Pirate. Captain Cage's crew had been taken to the Irestone Inlet, where they were being held captive. The Captain had escaped, and was offering a generous reward for the recovery of his crew, and the destruction of Yaaryar and his savage cutthroats.

    Passage to the Inlet was arranged, and it proved to be a rather quick trip, around the coast to a point almost due north of Stormreach. On opening the guard post gates, the group immediately found themselves in a bad situation. The "Zoo" charged a Hobgoblin Guard right outside, who was actually the only visible member of a Stealth Squad that included a Ray of Enfeeblement and Fireball casting Witchdoctor! Not taking the hint from that surprise, and the response of the Zoo to the aroma of Hobgoblin, the rescuers went down the trail, spotting a pirate camp with a prisoner just below and to their left. Cogs identified tracks in the three-way crossing's sandy pathways, that told a tale of frequent patrols running back and forth from below, from over the ridge they stood on, and from up the hill in front.

    Warning the group of the possibility, while trying to get a head count on the camp below, Cogs and Tuk quickly saw evidence of the reality and frequency of those Stealth Patrols. Groups of three or four were constantly on the move right in front of them, up and down the hill, back and forth across the ridge, each Stealth Patrol containing at least one Witchdoctor or Cleric. Cogs pulled back to see how Tuk wanted to handle the situation, but the discussion was cut short. The Zoo spotted a few of the creators of the tracks, and the party soon found themselves in rapid fighting retreat back behind the gates, with what appeared to be several Patrols attacking furiously with spells, blades, and arrows.

    Giving things time to settle down, and for them to recover from the serious wounds suffered in that Hobgoblin assault, the rescuers returned to the gates much more cautiously, this time leaving the Zoo behind. Cogs was not happy when licking wounds in defeat and retreat, and from the actions and expressions of his friends, neither were they.

    Working slowly, picking off the last man in a patrol, and working their way up the line to the caster in the lead, Tuk fine tuned a system to clear the area around the camp, then repeated in a similar fashion to thin the number of defenders in the camp where the first prisoner was being held. Naturally, the first attempts were less than successful, and a fighting retreat became the norm for a bit. Tuk quickly developed a plan similar to the one used in cramped sewers, whereby Cogs scouted for numbers and types of defenders, watched for wandering patrols, then Tuk moved to draw as few as possible back into an ambush provided by the rest of the party.

    Cogs seldom participated in the actual fighting, and actually remained hidden as Tuk ran past, followed by the furious targets of their ambush, who never saw the Tinker and Scout due to being so focused on putting Tuk in a stew pot! When he was spotted, it was generally by a Cleric or Witchdoctor, trailing cautiously behind the angry crowd. Only then was he forced to defend himself, and his best defense was to run and dodge back to the ambush location. When he used weapons against them, it was from behind, and in stealth, backstabbing unsuspecting targets so they died before they could strike back at him. That worked. Most of the time. When it did not, it hurt!

    The "Scout" was happy to watch them run past his studiously concealed form, as the rest of the party of rescuers seemed to have means and methods better suited to dealing with such rampaging evil. The Worgs were a bit of a problem, if they ran too close to his hiding place, sniffing him out with superior senses, as they were impossible to outrun. They also had a disturbing habit of knocking him off his feet, then pouncing on his prostrate and helpless body. He had been rescued several times by Tuk, Grondley, and Kierik drawing them off, coupled with an astute heal cast by Azzlorn just in the nick of time. Worg fangs are razor sharp, their smoking breath reeking of rotted corpses and sulfurous char, while those flaming red eyes added to the sensory terror as their victim helplessly looked up into them. Cogs was indebted to his friends, as they had prevented him from more than death. They had rescued him from being... literally!... eaten alive!

    It was thus that they worked their way around the Inlet, destroying Pirate Camps, releasing prisoners, and gathering information from crew members that had managed to remain hidden from Yaaryar and company. It was from the first mate of the Banshee, Stained-Tusk, that they learned about Dinks, the Ogre first mate of Yaaryar's schooner, and the need to discover the Pirates plans. Also hiding with Stained Tusk was "Mad" Anne Rackham, who told of Yaaryar's cook, a Kobold named Skartongue, and his stew pot of prisoner meat. Tuk was pleased to inform her that Skartongue had already been killed, and his stew pot of Banshee prisoner pieces destroyed.

    Moving on, they soon found Yaaryar's Schooner docked in the bay, and killed the guards aboard it. There were no plans to be found, and nothing of interest there but tar barrels stored on deck, so they resumed the tasks of locating more Banshee prisoners, Yaaryar, and Dinks. Their tactics were proving acceptable, under the circumstances, even though the Hobgoblins seemed to be reinforced with a scattering of Kobolds, Bugbears, Worgs, and even the occasional Ogre, with the two legged types coming in spell casting versions as well.

    They finally located Dinks, and Tuk discovered notes and some plans that gave him an idea for using those barrels of explosives some of the Pirate camps had contained. Those plans detailed how the schooner was to be Yaaryar's means of escape from the Islet. Working fast, the party retraced their steps and gathered up the barrels of powder, then lugged them back to Yaaryar's schooner. The tar barrels were replaced by the barrels of explosive powder, and Cogs was elected to light the fuse, as he was the one who had found a suitable torch on the main mast.

    Everyone else ran for the high ground, while Cogs set things up and prepared his escape route. He suspected he'd not have a lot of time, and time was distance to a running vandal. He really needed a lot of distance. Those barrels contained a lot of destructive potential. He ran the "Fuse" of powder back to the boarding ramp, curling it across the deck, then back to the kegs. Lighting the torch, he stood on the ramp and gave it a toss toward the end of the fuse, then he ran without a backward glance. It would catch and blow, or it would not and he'd try again.

    It caught. The blinding flash hit his eyes, filling the world, then the crack and roar of sound hit his ears at the same instant the shock wave hit his back, and tossed him tumbling through the air to land face down in the sand! Spitting grit, and carefully wiping it from his eyes, he was finally able to see the shattered remains and smoking ruin of what had once been a fine sailing vessel. Yaaryar was not going to be a happy Pirate. His means of escaping the Islet was now charred wood and shattered timbers resting in shallow water beside the crumpled planks of the dock.

    Tuk allowed the celebration to continue for a bit, then cautioned that Yaaryar was still in the area, and there were still prisoners to rescue. Barely composed, everyone set out to complete their mission for Captain Cage and his surviving crew. With caution, but exchanging winks and grins when Tuk was not looking, the adventurers explored new areas for Pirate camps, keeping a wary eye open for a vengeful, and now stranded, Yaaryar. The stone "island" in the "sea" of sand that nestled inside the arms of the Inlet held two prison camps that were missed on the earlier circuit of the area. These last two prisoners were freed, and the camps looted. It was time to track down Yaaryar and his remaining crew of scoundrels and scallywags.

    Cogs retraced their route back toward the wrecked schooner, knowing that the ear splitting explosion and towering smoke must have drawn their target's attention. It just seemed reasonable that the Pirate Captain would be found close, attempting to salvage what he could of the disaster. Everyone tried to sneak as best they could, but some simply could not manage the task well. The Scout moved ahead, looking for members of the patrolling pirate crew who might lead them to Yaaryar.

    Two Hobgoblins, a Guard and an stealthy Infiltrator, were spotted on a small rise that contained a camp overlooking the bay. Cogs moved closer and spotted a Worg patrolling around it. He returned to report to Tuk, fearful of trying to get closer, when he was so far from assistance should the Worg get his scent. Tuk told him to remain close enough to watch the camp, but remain out of sight. He would try to lure them away one at a time back to an ambush point.

    It worked. Well, it worked up to a point. There were also a number of Spellcasters, Guards, Slayers, Archers, and more Worgs. Luring individuals only worked once. After that it was rather a free-for-all, with two, three, and more chasing after Tuk. Worse for Cogs, was the fact that his hiding place was right beside the trail they all ran past, and several times he was forced to break stealth to run for his life as well. Grondley's summoned Skeleton was a lot less of a horror, when it was standing tall and swinging at the Worg gnawing on your leg!

    In the end, they killed the insane Pirate Captain Yaaryar, destroyed his Crew and Followers, and put an end to the horrible depredations of such evil on the high seas. Captain Niles Cage, Stained Tusk, and the rescued members of their crew were pleased. The reward offered was more than satisfactory. The lessons learned by the Fellowship were even more valuable.

    Cogs knew he needed to increase his run speed as a matter of survival, along with better balance to maintain his footing around those hellish Worgs. Dodging Worg fangs is easier on the run, than on your back. He also needed to do a better job of sneaking and hiding from those who would do him harm. To move silently and undetected, while performing his duties as the Fellowship Scout, was critical to their success. Potentially, his friends lived or died based on the quality of information he provided. The closer he could get to their enemies, the more accurate the information he could acquire. The faster he could relay that information, while remaining undetected in his stealthy presence, the more likely that his information would still be viable when they acted on it.

    The young Tinker would have to speak with his Trainers about the problem, and develop both short term and long term solutions. It would have to be done soon. Speed, balance and stealth. Cogs smiled to himself. He had work to do. He had cause to do it. Now it was a matter of application. Like The Head taught him, "Your work needs a reason, much as the engine needs a piston to connect the cylinder to the wheel."

    =
    Last edited by Fricko; 10-16-2012 at 04:58 PM. Reason: the usual. *sigh*

  8. #588
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    Default Some facts about AC and the Combat System

    Last night spent some time experimenting with the Combat System. The findings should be something our group needs to keep in mind.
    (The findings were based on just one attempt, so can’t be considered “Average”)

    Using a single monster of generally equal Hit Dice, with a +10 BAB against my character resulted in these facts.

    Armor Class 14 resulted in 32 Hits, 4 Misses and 2 Critical Hits.
    Armor Class 25 resulted in 35 Hits, 27 Hits and 1 Critical Hit.
    Armor Class 29 resulted in 37 Hits, 74 Misses and 1 Critical Hit.

    In each case, I didn’t swing at the Monster until my Hit points got low.
    At Armor Class 14, I couldn’t score enough hits to kill it before the character died.
    At Armor Class 25, it took just 10 hits to kill it.
    At Armor Class 29, it took 8 hits and 1 Critical.

    My character has +9 BAB.

    Pay very close attention to the CR of the thing you’re fighting.
    Bottom line is if you have a low AC, either have a Good Dodge and/or Concealment factor or DON’T GET CLOSE ENOUGH TO BE HIT.

    Also, for our play style (without a lot of Magic), AC in the high 20’s is about as good as it gets.

  9. #589
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    Quote Originally Posted by intruder1 View Post
    (The findings were based on just one attempt, so can’t be considered “Average”)
    Update:
    repeated test 3 times (but only at AC 29).......
    34 Hits, 72 Misses and 1 Critical.
    32 Hits, 37 Misses and 2 Criticals.
    25 Hits, 78 Misses and 1 Critical.

    As can be seen, in an even fight (Lvl 6 vs CR6), 3 out of 4 times your character seems to get hit around 25-30% of the time.
    Also...monster "lucky" streaks seem to be present. In this case, getting hit 50% of the time PLUS 2 Criticals.

  10. #590
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by KGWiking View Post
    I've been following this thread for some time with interest.

    I was wondering if you if you would mind posting up your group's compendium.............
    Sorry it took so long to reply......
    Rarely has it been neccessary to retreat out any Quest. (Retreat away from an encounter? MANY times!)
    We don't use Bags or Quivers so Ammo is a concern, but most charactors that need ammo usually carry quite a few hundred.
    Except for Material Components, there really isn't any other consumables to run out of.
    Here's our compendium.....


    Charactors in THIS iteration of THAC0 were to begin at 4th Level.
    To do this they were instructed to grind all 1st Level and a few select 2nd Level Quests as many times as was necessary to reach 4th Level.
    Elite Difficulty was not required for grinding, but encouraged to get used to it.
    Once the Party begins to Adventure, once a Quest is completed it is not repeated. Characters that die, leave the Quest. If the Quest is then completed, the dead character gets no XP.
    All Party Adventures are done at Elite Difficulty only.

    1st Level Quests
    ALL (Pretty simple)

    2nd Level Quests
    Misery’s Peak, Millers Debt, Haverdasher, Bringing the Light, Arachnophobia
    Each Character was given the opportunity to also complete the 3rd Level Quest "Explosive Situation".

    Once the Party was 4th Level,
    These 2nd Level Quests were done (not in any certain order)…….
    Butchers Path, Sunken Sewer, the “Baudry Chain”, Recovering the Lost Tome
    Missing in Action, Kobolds’ New Ringleader, Information is Key, Garrisons Missing Pack
    Durk’s Got a Secret

    After reaching 5th Level,
    these 3rd Level Quests were done……
    Where there’s Smoke, Swiped Signet, Redfang the Unruled, Chapters 1 and 2 of the “Lost Seeker” Chain, Kobold Assault, The Captives

    Again, ALL Party Questing was done on Elite Difficulty.

  11. #591
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    Default Gme Night

    Wednesdays game night was a mixture of cheers and sadness.
    We completed the Lost Seekers chain, but not without loss.

    Firstly, we entered the Sewers 2 men short instead of 1, and the missing character was the Radiant Servant Cleric.
    Needless to say we were apprehensive.
    We did have a Cleric, though the Elf's powers were weaker. I gambled I could try to wear two hats.

    Generally, we did well, having to lengthen our regrouping efforts after an encounter in order for me to focus on wounds.

    Later on, we stumbled into a den of Scorpions and 2 of our number were poisoned and fading fast.
    My attention was on Kierik when I heard the muffled cry from Cogs asking for help.
    I didn't see him and wasn't aware just how close to death he was.

    Trying to concentrate on my powers to neutralize poison, my mind wandered to unexpected attacks and I couldn't initiate the spell before Cogs sighed and slumped to the ground, dead.

    I turned my attention to Kierik and gave what cures I could, He was OK, Cogs was dead.

    Our Arcanes are more powerful than I expected. Our Fire Savant wields fire as if it were water in his hands.
    At one point, I was braced for a fight with a tough looking Shaman, only to have Kierik smirk and utterly vaporize the creature in a single instant.
    Both of our Arcanes are demonstrating similar abilities. Their only weakness is there paper-thin Armor. I would say that 80% of my Clerical efforts was healing their wounds.
    Last edited by intruder1; 10-19-2012 at 10:14 AM.

  12. #592
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    Default The Ending of the Lost Seekers Chain

    A question came up the other night that I initially accepted, but is all about “Computer Game” vs. the “Spirit of the Classic Game“ and after pondering, don‘t think I was correct “in the Spirit of D&D“.

    Guidelines require no repeats of quests that are completed.
    Players who miss a Quest because of absence do not “make up” the Quest because that would be “Grinding” for XP and/or End Reward.

    This experiment is not about progression, and we (should) resist “Meta-Gaming”.

    Guidelines also say that if a character dies and can not be raised from inside the Quest, that character must leave the party and not receive the XP.

    Since we don’t Grind, and are not about End-Rewards, and absent players do not “Make Up”, I don’t really see a character running a Quest again, THAT HAS BEEN COMPLETED by the Guild, just because that character died.

    I really would expect you to ask yourself…”Why do I want to complete this Quest?”
    A very common attitude in computer games is “I must get EVERY reward, break EVERY breakable, Kill EVERY Rare Monster.
    This attitude is Grinding.

    In Classic, there never was an option of re-running the Module that was completed just because “We didn’t get everything”.
    The Secret Room that was not found (as related by one player) comes to mind.
    Honestly, if my character ever died while adventuring (and he HAS) and the Party completed the adventure, I would see it as destiny and move on.

    In the future, there will be PLENTY of XP and Items to gather.

    My suggestion is “The Lost Seekers” module is closed, let’s move on to the next challenge.
    Last edited by intruder1; 10-19-2012 at 10:17 AM.

  13. #593
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    Default Grinding vs keeping up EXP

    My reasons for wanting to complete a quest where I die is NOT to get end reward, it is simply to maintain the same experience point level as the rest of the guild.

    If I do not complete after being killed, I am behind, and must run wilderness or otherwise spend time making up the lost experience.

    Perhaps, if you die, you can sit out as we are currently doing, tag along as a spirit for entertainment, then resurrect at a shrine to get experience, but NOT take chests/end rewards?

    By not allowing us to complete, you are sentencing us to grinding... or having everyone wait with a level ready, while the dead catch up. The last option seems unfair to those who live to end most frequently.

    As PnP DM, I "fugded" to keep everyone close in level. We are "Challenged", therefore we require fudge. It's not as if we are begging for chocolate! *Grin*

    Just sayin'
    Last edited by Fricko; 10-19-2012 at 11:19 AM.

  14. #594
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    Default "Competence, blessed by Olladra preferred"

    =

    10-17-2012

    "Competence, blessed by Olladra"

    Cogs sat in his hot tub of water, sipping a heady half-and-half mixture of herb infused elvish wine and apple cider, easing the pangs of residual poison in his system. Contentment was what he felt, tempered with more than a little amazement at lessons learned on the trail to locate poor Venn.

    One lesson was that they really did need Azzlorn, as his presence was sorely missed. Tuk may be a Holy Person, with the heart and skills of a Warrior Priest, but he was sorely unprepared to fulfill both roles for their Fellowship. Faced with two seriously injured members in Cogs and Kierik, and needing to keep an eye out for more threats, Tuk found himself in a situational overload. His lengthy struggle to recall basic Combat Medical training had allowed the venom to remain in Cog's body a little too long. That delay was the difference between their Tinker and Scout walking away, and his being carried away for a tavern Resurrection. Tuk did manage to heal Grondley, and save Kierik, so not all was a disaster.

    It was embarrassing to have Grondley drag his dead body out, after having been rendered so by a the venom of a medium sized scorpion sting. It was also deeply satisfying, even as it was quite humbling, to know you had friends who would do so for you. Still, the mission had been accomplished, although not in a pleasant way. Venn had been found, but found dead. Revenge had been extracted, and his tormentors sent on to seek judgment for their actions in a higher court. Cogs did hope that the sentence would be harsh, because atrocities such as they had found evidence of deserved to be severely punished by the Gods.

    Cogs was left content, and thanking the Goddess Olladra for their Luck, and the Plenitude of functional new battle tactics. There had been much evidence of teamwork, of a coming together in terms of how they thought, and how that thinking was applied. It was displayed from the moment of sighting, to the effective application of a weapon to their disgustingly evil opponent's demise.... or re-demise, as the case may be. In Cog's opinion, this melding of skills, talents, and powers was to be credited to their leader's unwavering focus on finding a better, safer, more efficient way of tackling their deadly opponents. Tuck's single minded dedication to seeing the Fellowship work as a team, in both attack and defense, was showing results that more than justified the time and effort he invested in developing and testing concepts

    Tuk chose the ambush location with an eye to keeping it close, but not so close it would draw more responders than they wanted to take on at one time. Generally, that was successful, but the team managed to hold their own, or retreat in good order, when surprises disrupted the best of their plans. When the enemy approached, Tuk and/or Grondley's Skeleton Knight moved to the front to attack, while Kierik and Grondley cast grief and destruction from concealed cover at ambush base point.

    Cogs waited in concealment as well, but in a location that placed him at the enemy's rear when Tuk and the Skeleton attacked. Once those two had the creature's undivided attention, he came silently up behind and often struck the killing blow with his powerful two weapon backstab. It really was a very effective tactic of everyone's combined skills and abilities in application, and the damage the Fellowship received in return was amazingly small. Everyone contributed, and the only thing missing was the Holy Man Azzlorn, with his Blessings, his ability to instantly strike the numerous Undead, blast the living, or to Heal their wounds in the midst of furious battles.

    Their Cleric could bolster their morale, their battle skills, and their strength of Will to Resist that of the Evil, with his fervent Prayers on their behalf. All was done from the rear, and usually unwitnessed. Then, when the situation eventually fell apart into total chaos, it is a helmeted Azzlorn, in his gauntlets and heavy armor, with his Holy Mace and Shield, that stands to fiercely protect those clad only in robes and leather. It was only in his absence, that the hole created was truly noticed. The Warrior Priest Tuk was their Captain, but it was Azzlorn who was both their lighthouse and their anchor, when the sea became roiled in the violence of a storm.

    The "Crew" noticed, as did Captain Tuk. Cogs made a note to purchase a Wand of Healing for his friend the Cleric, and present it before their next job of work.

    =

  15. #595
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fricko View Post
    My reasons for wanting to complete a quest where I die is NOT to get end reward, it is simply to maintain the same experience point level as the rest of the guild.

    If I do not complete after being killed, I am behind, and must run wilderness or otherwise spend time making up the lost experience.

    Perhaps, if you die, you can sit out as we are currently doing, tag along as a spirit for entertainment, then resurrect at a shrine to get experience, but NOT take chests/end rewards?

    By not allowing us to complete, you are sentencing us to grinding... or having everyone wait with a level ready, while the dead catch up. The last option seems unfair to those who live to end most frequently.

    As PnP DM, I "fugded" to keep everyone close in level. We are "Challenged", therefore we require fudge. It's not as if we are begging for chocolate! *Grin*

    Just sayin'
    I realize it might seem unfair and also I need you to understand that the post was not entirely taking about you, but about everyone game-wide.
    This group (if we know it or not) is trying to "set an example" to everyone who watches us. They want to see what we do and how we respond to situations. (They also want to read your stories ).

    In the beginning, we tried to keep everyone as close as possible in XP. As we went along, I noticed it didn't really matter as long as "in-party", we were all the same level.

    This suggestion also adds some roleplaying to our list of activities.
    When (if) Eajort comes back, if he is not at our current level he will have to adventure solo or with cohorts he met while in his absence until he catches up (level wise). This will form the backstory as to where he was when he wasn't with us.

    As for someone who dies, the XP loss can be easily recovered (if desired) wandering thru Searing Heights (for FtP players), Sorrwodusk and/or Red Fens (if VIP).

    That's what we intended Wilderness areas for.

    As for falling behind, I haven't heard any complaints so far. Even though XP leaders may have to wait to actually level up, you'll still get to use your rank points.
    And besides, we're not about how quickly we progress, right?
    Last edited by intruder1; 10-20-2012 at 07:51 AM.

  16. #596
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    Default Divine Gifts and Limited Wishes

    SlowDM and I spoke briefly about Items we may encounter in the furture that have no Potential Factor.

    Last week an Item surfaced without a Potential. Under our guidelines, this would be considered "Unique" and would not count towards a Magic limit. Initially I called it Gift to our Magic Limited Group.

    Now I will call it a "Divine Gift". It SHOULD be rare and HOPEFULLY I won't regret it's inclusion.

    Also, last week a character received an Imperfect Dragonshard during the Adventure. The character asked if it could be allowed in order to possibly change a feat.

    The consensus was to allow it and We'll refer to it as a "Limited Wish".
    Note that this "Wish" CAN be used for anothers benefit by giving the shard to them.
    Also understand that this "wish" must be found, not purchased or obtained by any other means.

    These two new things add a new facet to our game system.

  17. #597
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    Default "Why does my fudge taste like crow?"

    =

    I know I seem to be creating controversy, and challenging basic concepts on a frequent basis, and it is almost always because of my dang busted memory recalling imperfectly, or confusion generated because the PnP game where I was DM, and the one's you young guys ruled over or played in were so very different.

    My game came in a thin folder, it was loose pages with printed spots you had to use a hole punch to poke out, in order to get them into a three ring binder. "Modules" had not been invented yet. There was a Players packet, and DM's Packet for purchase. It was D&D, not AD&D. It was 2.0, although it only said "Revised" on it, gleefully(!!!!) announcing new monsters, a new Class in the Paladin, and utilizing NEW! techniques for creating wilderness landscapes with octagon graph paper instead of the squares.

    Much of the "What do we do if..." was left to the DM, and the people who played in his (their!) game to work out, because there were no rules to cover every eventuality as the later games provided.

    We ate a LOT of factored "fudge"!

    When I step on your toes, just remind me to step back in line.

    =
    Last edited by Fricko; 10-20-2012 at 09:38 AM.

  18. #598
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    quote intruder1
    As for someone who dies, the XP loss can be easily recovered (if desired) wandering thru Searing Heights (for FtP players), Sorrwodusk and/or Red Fens (if VIP).

    Good luck with that, running away is a better description. It felt like Irestone on elite.

    Another aspect is that a lot of the upcomming content is a 'chain'. If someone misses part of Sharn Syndicate, can they continue on to the next part?

    quote intruder1
    This group (if we know it or not) is trying to "set an example" to everyone who watches us. They want to see what we do and how we respond to situations. (They also want to read your stories ).

    I always considered this an experiment, not an example. There is no 'correct' way to play, it's a tool to use the way the group wants. Maybe an example of how close to a set of rules we can stay. But I also thought that if a rule stopped us, not just 'got in our way' it could be revised. And our group is not for most people, else there would be a waiting list for spot 6. (If you want to give our group a try and have Wednesday night free, stop by. We could use someone with two digits in strength and con.) Remember that we are not 'flower sniffers' we are so slow we are gardeners.

    If we can't always be surprised by the content, we can be surprised by an unexpected strength. Kierik was astounding the way he fried the ogre.


    Originally posted by Aeryyn "I don't play this game for xp/min, I play for fun/hour. "

  19. #599
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fricko View Post
    =

    I know I seem to be creating controversy, and challenging basic concepts on a frequent basis, and it is almost always because of my dang busted memory recalling imperfectly, or confusion generated because the PnP game where I was DM, and the one's you young guys ruled over or played in were so very different.

    My game came in a thin folder, it was loose pages with printed spots you had to use a hole punch to poke out, in order to get them into a three ring binder. "Modules" had not been invented yet. There was a Players packet, and DM's Packet for purchase. It was D&D, not AD&D. It was 2.0, although it only said "Revised" on it, gleefully(!!!!) announcing new monsters, a new Class in the Paladin, and utilizing NEW! techniques for creating wilderness landscapes with octagon graph paper instead of the squares.

    Much of the "What do we do if..." was left to the DM, and the people who played in his (their!) game to work out, because there were no rules to cover every eventuality as the later games provided.

    We ate a LOT of factored "fudge"!

    When I step on your toes, just remind me to step back in line.

    =
    My friend. Nothing could be further from the truth.
    It is precisely the controversy that fuels debates that eventually result in a good decision.

    If this group weren't so diverse in it's view of gamestyle, we might well stumble into a "game-killer" problem.

    My number one goal is playing what Quests we can play with as little Magic as possible and CREATE sort of a Classic game within a game.
    If nobody presents any counterpoints, how would we know ideas are sound or not?

  20. #600
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeadHero5 View Post
    Another aspect is that a lot of the upcomming content is a 'chain'. If someone misses part of Sharn Syndicate, can they continue on to the next part?
    Good Question! Gotta think on that situation. Got any suggestions?

    Quote Originally Posted by LeadHero5 View Post
    I always considered this an experiment, not an example. There is no 'correct' way to play.....
    By example, I actually meant an example of NOT Power Gaming and Zerging. We ARE experimenting and when something does not work for us we change as much of it as possible, as long as it keeps up generally in the right direction.

    As a matter of fact, this group does NOT have a burly tough Fighter. Tukcc IS a fighter, but is more akin to a Paladin. Problem is with a Con of 9 (Elf?) he'd be more of a Ranged Asset.
    Everybody in this group chose the Class they wanted to play. Too bad no one chose the Classic Fighter.
    Our Combat Tactics are dependent on our capabilities.

    Our Arcane characters ARE really potent! We just don't have the "Meat Shield" you're looking for.
    Last edited by intruder1; 10-20-2012 at 09:21 PM.

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