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  1. #1181
    Community Member Fedora1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by intruder1 View Post
    Does Storm use items from the daily roll?
    The other two groups do not.
    No.

    Which is why I stated it won't affect THAC0 or STORM. I just tossed it out there for everyone in general, as most have other characters outside of these static groups.

  2. #1182
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    lmfao `you can only use auction house for selling and not buying`
    dragblood-khyber

  3. #1183
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    Default Death Consequence

    Mechanics to which an individual's death consequence might apply:

    1. XP: immediately release upon death. Is this valid given the VIP XP bonus?
    2. Items: sacrifice all equiped and backpack items, except 1 Heirloom item.
    3. Build: at next level-up your class is rolled randomly. this simulates PnP druidic reincarnation.
    4. Level-up timing: player will delay level-up for 1 rank. this simulates the PnP level loss from raising.
    5. Money: spend [x] platinum to raise after quest is done. this simulates the PnP idea of bringing the soulstone to an NPC cleric. a large cost prevents abuse.

    So each time a character died, he'd have to choose from the list.

    ----------

    Alternatively, we can keep the existing "individual death consequence" (i.e. soulstone drops but you stay in dungeon). And we add a "party consequence" on top of it. If all party members die, then all characters must destroy all equipped and backpack items (no heirloom). Bank remains unaffected. This simulates leaving the bodies behind. The extra harshness is added to offset the reduced probability of this happening.

  4. #1184
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magiker View Post
    Mechanics to which an individual's death consequence might apply:

    1. XP: immediately release upon death. Is this valid given the VIP XP bonus?
    2. Items: sacrifice all equiped and backpack items, except 1 Heirloom item.
    3. Build: at next level-up your class is rolled randomly. this simulates PnP druidic reincarnation.
    4. Level-up timing: player will delay level-up for 1 rank. this simulates the PnP level loss from raising.
    5. Money: spend [x] platinum to raise after quest is done. this simulates the PnP idea of bringing the soulstone to an NPC cleric. a large cost prevents abuse.

    So each time a character died, he'd have to choose from the list.

    ----------

    Alternatively, we can keep the existing "individual death consequence" (i.e. soulstone drops but you stay in dungeon). And we add a "party consequence" on top of it. If all party members die, then all characters must destroy all equipped and backpack items (no heirloom). Bank remains unaffected. This simulates leaving the bodies behind. The extra harshness is added to offset the reduced probability of this happening.
    After spending almost an hour following last night's adventure, a good picture developed as to players oppinion about instituting a Death Consequence.
    Generally, everyone agreed such a consequence would be acceptable, but the exact consequences could not be agreed upon.

    The above message recapped what are the current suggestions.
    They are just that....suggestions.

    At the end of the night this is what I perceived to be acceptable....
    A Death consequence would be OK.
    Players who die and couldn't be "raised" would recall out and forfit any XP for the quest.
    Two subsequent actions came from this.......
    The character that died would not be offered the opportunity to "catch up", all characters MUST adventure together, no soloing.
    (This would be just like sitting around a table in PnP. The only time character adventure is on "game night".
    The second action is that characters are allowed to gain levels independant of each other.
    The "consequence" of dying is falling behind in progression and missing out on Treasure obtained during the Quest.
    This is ONE option.


    Anopther option was the "Near Perma-Death" option of losing EVERYTHING the character owns, equiped and in bank, right down to Material Componants and Healing Kits.
    The Character retains his Level/Race/Class, but re-equips with purely non-Magic Items from his Platinum reserves.

    This option was soundly disapproved.


    Another Option was requiring that the next time the dead character leveled, they be required to halt advancement
    in the current Class and begin a New Class. Alternatively, the dead character would be required to take a RANDOM class on their next level progression.
    These options also were soundly disapproved of.

    The remaining options are new to me and would need to be examined.

    The Platinum cost idea has some potential. The exact cost would have to reflect DDO's ABUNDANCE of coin, and being unable to "pay" would result in a much more severe consequence.


    This is a good discussion, keep it up.

  5. #1185
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    Last nights adventures were both laughingly QUICK (first Quest), and satisfying (Second Quest).
    The first adventure ended maybe 5 minutes in with a retreat with 2 (maybe 3) deaths. (I truly don't remember)
    I'll let other players recount the tale cause I was dead!

    The Second Quest was Return to Deleras Tomb on Hard Difficulty.
    It was challenging and we just about depleted our resources by the end.
    We adopted a method of simulating 2nd Edition Treasure rules by everyone rolling a d10 and only the first two results were counted.
    If EITHER roll was a 1, the chest could be opened by all and distributed as players desired.
    If NEITHER roll was a 1, the chest was IGNORED and we moved on as if it was never there.

    Last night we found 3 chests, but only 1 was opened.

    Note that Magic Items found in breakables belongs to the finder and can do with it what they wished.

    I find this method very acceptable as it "naturally" places a Magic Limit on the characters in a very simple way.
    If the rest of the group feels the same way, I will suggest removing the "Minimum Level" restriction we currently have.
    Unfortunately, if this is done, it will require a VERY difficult action be applied to the current "inventory" of items that are owned.

    (The Monday Night Group already plays like this)

  6. #1186
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    Quote Originally Posted by intruder1 View Post

    The Second Quest was Return to Deleras Tomb on Hard Difficulty.
    Do you mean Thrall of the Necromancer?


    Quote Originally Posted by intruder1 View Post
    It was challenging and we just about depleted our resources by the end.
    We adopted a method of simulating 2nd Edition Treasure rules by everyone rolling a d10 and only the first two results were counted.
    If EITHER roll was a 1, the chest could be opened by all and distributed as players desired.
    If NEITHER roll was a 1, the chest was IGNORED and we moved on as if it was never there.

    Last night we found 3 chests, but only 1 was opened.
    There are four chests in that quest, one for killing the wight in the East wing, and three at the end. Does that mean your rolls determined one of the chests was 'never there?'

    Just trying to understand the new loot mechanic.

    You guys have been beating the odds so far though. I think you got 1 out of 9 last time and 1 out of 4 this time. Have you run any yet where you had no 'found' chests? I can imagine a couple of quests in a row with no loot might be kind of disappointing.


    How many traps were you able to disable? Is this the L9 group?
    Last edited by Postumus; 05-23-2013 at 07:26 PM.

  7. #1187
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    Quote Originally Posted by Postumus View Post
    Thrall is the next one up, when we do return there.

    Quote Originally Posted by Postumus View Post
    There are four chests in that quest, one for killing the wight in the East wing, and three at the end. Does that mean your rolls determined one of the chests was 'never there?'

    Just trying to understand the new loot mechanic.
    Well, rather the chest was "Empty". Chests are a metaphor for the things you recover from the encounter.

    Quote Originally Posted by Postumus View Post
    You guys have been beating the odds so far though. I think you got 1 out of 9 last time and 1 out of 4 this time. Have you run any yet where you had no 'found' chests? I can imagine a couple of quests in a row with no loot might be kind of disappointing.


    How many traps were you able to disable? Is this the L9 group?
    Magic in this playstyle is VERY rare, just as it was in 1980's era D&D. Finding an enchanted item is one of the greatest things that can happen with this.
    Disappointing? Yes, in DDO terms, and probably from a computer "game" point of view.
    But this group has so much fun even without it that it's tough to have to stop for the night!
    I'm positive that if this was 20 years ago and we were all sitting around a tabletop, we'd end up watching the sun come up!
    It's THAT much fun! In spite of the lack of magic.

    Anyway, last night was the FIRST night we used this type of guideline for chests. Our characters have the ML limit equiped and a bank FULL of spare items!
    As we move closer to "Normal" difficulty, that will change. But then again, at Normal, there won't be a limit as to what you can have, just how much weight you can carry.

    Trapping has become a bit easier. Our Rogue has discontinued the use of the "Admin" Hood Item. Because of his dilligent study of traps, he has a high success rate.

  8. #1188
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    Quote Originally Posted by intruder1 View Post
    Unfortunately, if this is done, it will require a VERY difficult action be applied to the current "inventory" of items that are owned.
    What did you have in mind?

  9. #1189
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    Quote Originally Posted by Postumus View Post
    You guys have been beating the odds so far though. I think you got 1 out of 9 last time and 1 out of 4 this time. Have you run any yet where you had no 'found' chests?
    Since they actually roll a 1d10 and take the first two results, they have two "10%" chances to open a chest. Not exactly the same as 20%, but close enough statistacally. So 1 out of 9 was a bit less and 1 out of 4 was only slightly higher - which seems to meet the average. What is 2 out of 13, about 15%?

  10. #1190
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    Default Something for the "Archer" in all of us.

    A couple quotes about the "Archers Focus" Feat.

    "If you are not currently using the Manyshot ability and have been stationary for 3 seconds, while you are stationary you gain On Damage: Up to once every half second, you gain +2% competence bonus to missile damage. This effect can stack up to 15 times. "

    The quote below is commenting on how monsters react to Invisibility and sound in general.....

    "Yep, monsters' sound detection seems to be fixed."

    "But with the stealth fix another little change went live that made me really really happy: when you assassinate a monster the others in proximity don't autotarget you but investigate the dead body!"

    "A big THANK YOU! to the devs from a rogue assassin player. "

  11. #1191
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    Quote Originally Posted by intruder1 View Post
    A couple quotes about the "Archers Focus" Feat.

    "If you are not currently using the Manyshot ability and have been stationary for 3 seconds, while you are stationary you gain On Damage: Up to once every half second, you gain +2% competence bonus to missile damage. This effect can stack up to 15 times. "
    Do you really want to stand still that long?

  12. #1192
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fedora1 View Post
    Since they actually roll a 1d10 and take the first two results, they have two "10%" chances to open a chest. Not exactly the same as 20%, but close enough statistacally. So 1 out of 9 was a bit less and 1 out of 4 was only slightly higher - which seems to meet the average. What is 2 out of 13, about 15%?
    Right. For some reason I thought they had to roll once to 'see' the chest, then make another roll to loot it.

  13. #1193
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    Quote Originally Posted by intruder1 View Post
    Thrall is the next one up, when we do return there.
    So you guys ran Free Delera? (Return to Delera's is not an actual quest, it is just the part where you run in, talk to Delera, then run back out).


    IIRC there are no disarmable traps in that one.

  14. #1194
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magiker View Post
    Mechanics to which an individual's death consequence might apply:

    1. XP: immediately release upon death. Is this valid given the VIP XP bonus?

    I don't like this option because, as others have stated, my play time is limited and the last thing I want to do is sit around for 20-30 minutes while everyone else completes a quest. I'd rather log off and do something else. Or solo.

    If I have to wait more than 5 minutes I'd rather get raised at the next shrine, continue to help the party, and finish out before the last fight. Or I'd rather everyone finish out and go run something else. That would be a group incentive to keep everyone alive.


    Quote Originally Posted by Magiker View Post
    2. Items: sacrifice all equiped and backpack items, except 1 Heirloom item.

    I like this option to PD. Maybe increase the number of Heirloom items you can keep every 10 levels so at L10 you can keep two items. L20 three items.

    OR, inversely, characters get to keep the number of items equal to their base CON score/2, and every time he dies that number decreases by one. This would simulate the AD&D mechanic of losing a point of CON every time a character is brought back to life.

    Cadrod has 14 CON, so if he died he could keep 7 items the first time he was revived, 6 the second time, etc. etc.


    Quote Originally Posted by Magiker View Post
    3. Build: at next level-up your class is rolled randomly. this simulates PnP druidic reincarnation.
    4. Level-up timing: player will delay level-up for 1 rank. this simulates the PnP level loss from raising.

    Don't like either of these. If you are going to delete and re-roll, just delete and re-roll. The level delay does not seem like much of a consequence IMO.


    Quote Originally Posted by Magiker View Post
    5. Money: spend [x] platinum to raise after quest is done. this simulates the PnP idea of bringing the soulstone to an NPC cleric. a large cost prevents abuse.
    What do you consider a 'large cost?' Cadrod already has over 20k plat at level 5 because he's had to sell everything he's ever found (lol). Plat is so easy to get it and we can't spend it on anything good on the AH anyway that losing it hardly seems much of a consequence. Plus what happens if a character dies twice in the same night and doesn't have the plat to cover the second resurrection?


    Quote Originally Posted by Magiker View Post
    So each time a character died, he'd have to choose from the list.
    I think the group should pick one consequence for everyone and stick with it. Allowing player choice of consequences means that some consequences are completely negligible. I for one wouldn't be bothered by losing all my plat, or delaying my level progression one bubble, or immediately releasing (since I would just go get a sandwich and another beer).



    ----------
    Last edited by Postumus; 05-24-2013 at 04:56 PM.

  15. #1195
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    Quote Originally Posted by Postumus
    Plus what happens if a character dies twice in the same night and doesn't have the plat to cover the second resurrection?
    If you die a 2nd time and you don't have enough money, you have to choose another option.


    Quote Originally Posted by Postumus
    I think the group should pick one consequence for everyone and stick with it. Allowing player choice of consequences means that some consequences are completely negligible. I for one wouldn't be bothered by losing all my plat, or delaying my level progression one bubble, or immediately releasing (since I would just go get a sandwich and another beer).
    The problem we're facing is that each person has a different reaction to each choice. You don't mind losing items, but you don't like losing playtime. Someone else feels the opposite. So what is neglible to you is awful to them, and vice versa. How do you pick one consequence if nobody agrees on its severity? That is why we've been trying to find choices that are (roughly) comparable.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Magiker View Post
    Do you really want to stand still that long?
    DDO players would make that statement. (In fact they did in the thread I was reading.)

  17. #1197
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    Quote Originally Posted by Postumus View Post
    So you guys ran Free Delera? (Return to Delera's is not an actual quest, it is just the part where you run in, talk to Delera, then run back out).


    IIRC there are no disarmable traps in that one.
    That's the one.

  18. #1198
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magiker View Post
    How do you pick one consequence if nobody agrees on its severity? That is why we've been trying to find choices that are (roughly) comparable.
    (laugh) And now HE doesnt accept the ONE consequence that all of YOU said was acceptable! Loss of XP and sit on the sideline.

    This is rich! lol

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    Quote Originally Posted by intruder1 View Post
    (laugh) And now HE doesnt accept the ONE consequence that all of YOU said was acceptable! Loss of XP and sit on the sideline.

    This is rich! lol



    What about this idea:

    If you die, your soulstone is retrieved if possible. You stay in the dungeon and gain XP if the party succeeds. If your soulstone is returned to the entrance, you get no further penalty. If your soulstone is left behind, you destroy currently equipped items and backpack items (but you keep banked items).

  20. #1200
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magiker View Post



    What about this idea:

    If you die, your soulstone is retrieved if possible. You stay in the dungeon and gain XP if the party succeeds. If your soulstone is returned to the entrance, you get no further penalty. If your soulstone is left behind, you destroy currently equipped items and backpack items (but you keep banked items).
    You have to hear from all players concerned and they ALL must agree before any guideline can be enacted.
    Good Luck!

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