Page 20 of 27 FirstFirst ... 10161718192021222324 ... LastLast
Results 381 to 400 of 529
  1. #381
    Community Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    84

    Default

    If encumbrance goes spell/tatics that effect strength need to be adjusted to pentialize low strength characters.

    Or keep encumbrance and make everything in your inventory equal just the wieght of the bag of holding and what your wearing/using counts against your encumbrance. For this to work you would also have to lower the amount of wieght that each character can carry. So a halfing wizard that dumped strength would be right at the edge of being burdened when he has every item slot filled.

  2. #382
    Community Member DrawingGuy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    My place
    Posts
    410

    Default

    Well, as stated earlier, carrying limits are so high, it only really affects dump str characters - those likely being ranged based characters that already suffer the most under current mechanics. I have one such ranged char (if you call 18 str dump). However even with that, I still have to take my 200lb ing bags and transfer items back and forth between smaller lighter bags. Sure, it's realistic that my char can't easily run around with 400lbs and cries at the slightest str debuff... but find it more tedious to deal with the easily circumvented mechanic and thus outweighs the advantage of the flavor.

    So still stand with getting rid of it... that is unless you make it more harrowing that it's easier to happen (ie PnP 3.5 carry limits!) and affects more than just dex and movement speed. Mwahahaha!

  3. #383
    Community Member Calebro's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    In a van down by the river
    Posts
    5,706

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by B.Ogre View Post
    Like for example, anytime a character looses 6 or more str, he suffers a movement penalty, just off the top of my head...
    So a Wizard who has 8 Str can safely drop to a 3 Str while carrying 9000 lbs worth of ****, but a Fighter with 42 Str that drops to 36 Str becomes slowed even if he's only carrying 3 lbs worth of stuff?
    And that makes more sense to you? The Ftr with 36 Str and a 3 lb load is slowed while a Wiz with 3 Str and a 9000 lb load is not slowed, and that makes sense to you?
    .

  4. #384
    Community Member dkyle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Pittsburgh
    Posts
    5,477

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Calebro View Post
    So a Wizard who has 8 Str can safely drop to a 3 Str while carrying 9000 lbs worth of ****, but a Fighter with 42 Str that drops to 36 Str becomes slowed even if he's only carrying 3 lbs worth of stuff?
    And that makes more sense to you? The Ftr with 36 Str and a 3 lb load is slowed while a Wiz with 3 Str and a 9000 lb load is not slowed, and that makes sense to you?
    Yeah, I don't think that approach makes sense.

    What I suggested earlier in the thread makes sense I think:

    If any kind of STR penalty is being applied, and STR is now less than 8, then treat that as medium encumbered. If it's less than 4, that's heavy encumbered. And 0 is helpless, as currently. I think that models most of the actual gameplay implications of the current encumbrance system, without needing to actually track weights.

  5. #385
    Community Member somenewnoob's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    3,350

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Calebro View Post
    So a Wizard who has 8 Str can safely drop to a 3 Str while carrying 9000 lbs worth of ****, but a Fighter with 42 Str that drops to 36 Str becomes slowed even if he's only carrying 3 lbs worth of stuff?
    And that makes more sense to you? The Ftr with 36 Str and a 3 lb load is slowed while a Wiz with 3 Str and a 9000 lb load is not slowed, and that makes sense to you?
    He said "off the top of my head"......calm down there. That vein in your forehead is starting to stick out.
    I'm piking at work.
    I disarm traps........with my face!
    How do I know that I am better than you are? Because I'm in Thrudh's signature and you're not. That's how.

  6. #386

    Default

    this

    Quote Originally Posted by voodoogroves View Post
    Keep encumbrance ... but all those DDO-specific collectibles, ingredients, etc. zero out.
    and this

    Quote Originally Posted by Calebro View Post
    Exactly. The problem with the collectables isn't that they have weight. The problem with the collectables is the utterly ridiculous amount of them that have been added to the game lately. With the sheer numbers of stupid junk that we're expected to hold onto, we either need an entire character bank (not a tab, but an entire bank) devoted specifically to collectables, or they need to be weightless.

    IN THE NAME OF ALL THAT IS HOLY STOP ADDING MORE FREAKING COLLECTABLES AND INGREDIENTS TO THE GAME!

    The issue isn't that the items have weight. The issue is that there are WAY too damned many of them.
    Even if half of those listed ingredients are Canntih Crafting Shards, that still leaves almost a thousand different things that we're expected to hold onto, and that's not even counting all the junk that *should* go into bags but doesn't (like Shards of Power, Reavers Gems, Challenge Tokens, etc). That's ridiculous and utterly asinine.
    Having the encumbrance system is something I like to see. I think a character should be limited by what the character is capable of and not what the UI allows for in the inventory slots. It doesn't make sense to just be able to pack everything we want until the inventory slots are full.

    I do not see an issue with having an encumbrance system. I do see an issue with the sheer number of components, ingredients, and collectibles impacting the current encumbrance system. I would vote not to remove encumbrance completely.

  7. #387
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    6,451

    Default

    Dump stat characters NEED to have downsides... Yes, encumberance only comes into play every once in a while.. But so does any other "issue" How often are oyu curesed? How often are oyu level drained.. Each and every "issue" a character has to deal with no matter how infrequint adds to the diversity of the game. The characters that are properly prepared will have few problems , the ones that aren't will have more problems.... This kind of thinking, as in consdiering that I have a MIN/MAX build so I need to make sure that I'm preparred IF I get take a hit on one fo my dump stas, whether it be from carrying 47 sets of armor, or that my 10 str isn't enough to carry a bunch of junk...

    Removing it simply creates a situation where people can ignore yet another "issue" when building characters... And so the move towards generic 4E continues......

  8. #388
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    44

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Aashrym View Post
    Having the encumbrance system is something I like to see. I think a character should be limited by what the character is capable of and not what the UI allows for in the inventory slots. It doesn't make sense to just be able to pack everything we want until the inventory slots are full.

    I do not see an issue with having an encumbrance system. I do see an issue with the sheer number of components, ingredients, and collectibles impacting the current encumbrance system. I would vote not to remove encumbrance completely.
    While I agree that you should be limited to a number depending on your strength the numbers somehow get REALLY skewed. I prefer to play melee characters and most can carry an aircraft carrier while my clonk is unable to lift his own fists off the ground... The current system IS broken but still not sure I am 100% for scraping it.

  9. #389
    Community Member Phemt81's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    2,496

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by smatt View Post
    Dump stat characters NEED to have downsides... Yes, encumberance only comes into play every once in a while.. But so does any other "issue" How often are oyu curesed? How often are oyu level drained.. Each and every "issue" a character has to deal with no matter how infrequint adds to the diversity of the game. The characters that are properly prepared will have few problems , the ones that aren't will have more problems.... This kind of thinking, as in consdiering that I have a MIN/MAX build so I need to make sure that I'm preparred IF I get take a hit on one fo my dump stas, whether it be from carrying 47 sets of armor, or that my 10 str isn't enough to carry a bunch of junk...

    Removing it simply creates a situation where people can ignore yet another "issue" when building characters... And so the move towards generic 4E continues......
    Wow, it should have been so clear from beginning, you made realize what the real issue is! I feel silly not having thought that before;

    If you dump:

    Con. get few HP, low fortitude saves
    Dex. low Ac, low reflex saves
    Int. less skill points, can't use int. runes
    Wis. low will saves, can't use wis. runes
    Cha. harder to gain good plat amount, can't use cha. runes

    As you can guess by yourself, WHATEVER class you choose you will be affected by the downside of dumping a stat. But eliminating the encumbrance calculation it will be:
    Str. low to hit and damage bonus. That's all. Take a caster and /who cares?

    If you like to min/max you need to pay the consequences, this isn't some other game where all you need to do is to hold down the left mouse button...
    How to revamp past life reward system <--- working again
    Quote Originally Posted by Vargouille View Post
    We absolutely planned for Fighter to still have Haste Boost. It's absolutely a bug. Any similar issues that look "wrong" to any player should be bugged.
    Developers should fix this

  10. #390
    Hatchery Hero BOgre's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Middlonowhere, Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    3,065

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Calebro View Post
    So a Wizard who has 8 Str can safely drop to a 3 Str while carrying 9000 lbs worth of ****, but a Fighter with 42 Str that drops to 36 Str becomes slowed even if he's only carrying 3 lbs worth of stuff?
    And that makes more sense to you? The Ftr with 36 Str and a 3 lb load is slowed while a Wiz with 3 Str and a 9000 lb load is not slowed, and that makes sense to you?
    Yeah, actually, it doesn't take too much of a stretch for that to make sense. You debuff a str based character with str sapping spells and effects, which do little or nothing to int based characters, as in Ray of Enfeeb. You debuff an int based character with int sapping spells and effects, which do little or nothing to str based characters, as in Feeblemind. Think of Str as 'the thing that makes you hit hard' not as a real representation of strength.
    Quote Originally Posted by Towrn
    ...when the worst thing that happens when you make a mistake at your job is someone complains on the internet, you probably care a little less!

  11. #391
    Community Member Gizeh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    819

    Default

    I haven't read all posts in this thread, so maybe this has been said before:

    In my opinion collectibles and crafting ingredients - basically everything that fits into a bag - should be weightless. The reason for this is that with cannith crafting, shroud crafting, trapmaking, epic crafting, suppressed power, nearly finished items, epic crafting, upgradeable items, house C challenge crafting and whatever else we have in the game by now is so much that players are already punished if they do not have large enough bags, so there is no need to punish us even more by adding a weight to them. Besides, a lot of those ingredients and collectables are from p2p quests, so by adding a weight to them you basically punish players who pay money for increased access to DDO.

    On the other hand everything else - scrolls, weapons, all other items basically - should not have their weight changed. This is questing equipment, and a well built character should be able to decide how many resources he needs to carry with him to succeed in quests.

  12. #392
    Community Member anatomyofaghost's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    105

    Default

    Wouldn't miss it in the slightest... though I'm kinda wondering how Enfeeblement and whatnot would work without it.

    Probably well! :P

  13. #393
    Community Member therobb's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    136

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Qzipoun View Post
    Like spell components it adds flavor to the game.

    You're running around on a high dex, low str halfling being dodgy and quick, then bam you get hit by symbol of weakness. Suddenly your ac drops, you need to alter your tactics

    Just one example where it makes the game a little more 'complex' (in a good way)

    What isn't good about it is useless stuff weighing you down. Gems, collectibles, ingredients, components etc. shouldn't affect your character's encumbrance
    I agree with this. It gives an extra element of complexity that I wouldn't want to "go away". D&D is and should be a game of trade-offs. Want an amazingly high amazing armor class? Or that absolute highest DPS? Sure you can do that but you should always have to sacrifice something elsewhere to get it.

    Want to drop your strength to the minimum so you can focus elsewhere? OK but there should be some consequence for that (beyond penalties to strength-based skills which are easily ignored with buffs).

  14. #394
    Community Member Gizeh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    819

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by therobb View Post
    Want to drop your strength to the minimum so you can focus elsewhere? OK but there should be some consequence for that (beyond penalties to strength-based skills which are easily ignored with buffs).
    With new crafting ingredients being introduced in each recent update ingredients should weigh nothing, at least as long as they are stored in a bag.

    Otherwise I agree with you (at least as long as I'm not required to get high level ship strength buffs to carry basic questing tools)

  15. #395
    Community Member Fomori's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Chicago - western burbs
    Posts
    1,232

    Default

    Encumbrance is meh to me. I'm fine with it in or out. Since we have a limited fixed number of slots to put things in, why does it really matter what they weigh. The inventory system cares about about quantity over size in that aspect.

    I understand that the inv slots option is simple and proven. However I wouldnt mind if they went to an open system. In this case you have effectively infinite slots, items are stored in a list rather than a container. However, you only have a certain volume and weight that you can carry based on dex and str. You can also have bags to help out your volume problems. but they have a volume restriction of their own. Also you can only manage so many bags. No carrying around 50 sacks because your str says you can!

    The down side is that its complicated to code and complicated to explain to newbies. People usually prefer to give up realistic and/or robust for extra simple... pljay moar now!
    Male Fairy: "Dont cry my dear. You know what I do when I'm sad?"
    Felicia Day Fairy: "Look douchy..."

    Quote Originally Posted by mournbladereigns View Post
    Actually, if this Nerf's one of Shade's barb's I doubly support this!

  16. #396
    Hatchery Hero BOgre's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Middlonowhere, Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    3,065

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by therobb View Post
    I agree with this. It gives an extra element of complexity that I wouldn't want to "go away". D&D is and should be a game of trade-offs. Want an amazingly high amazing armor class? Or that absolute highest DPS? Sure you can do that but you should always have to sacrifice something elsewhere to get it.

    Want to drop your strength to the minimum so you can focus elsewhere? OK but there should be some consequence for that (beyond penalties to strength-based skills which are easily ignored with buffs).
    What then is the tradeoff to Str based characters that dump Int? How does Feeblemind penalize a Fighter or Barb?

    I agree that stat damaging effects should matter, but do NOT agree that encumberance is needed for that to occur.
    Quote Originally Posted by Towrn
    ...when the worst thing that happens when you make a mistake at your job is someone complains on the internet, you probably care a little less!

  17. #397
    Community Member Calebro's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    In a van down by the river
    Posts
    5,706

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by B.Ogre View Post
    What then is the tradeoff to Str based characters that dump Int?
    One skill point per level. That's the trade off.
    .

  18. #398
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Baja
    Posts
    31

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by B.Ogre View Post
    What then is the tradeoff to Str based characters that dump Int? How does Feeblemind penalize a Fighter or Barb?

    I agree that stat damaging effects should matter, but do NOT agree that encumberance is needed for that to occur.
    Perhaps a counter measure for dumping int is needed, I gladly spent 2 points into strength on my wiz to avoid it; and yes fort saves are important but I did because I didnt want my palemaster to give up on potential plat just because he had no cargo capacity. Sure we take it away and then its all inventory space, but really does an enfeebled halfling with 6 str carrying 5 armor plates running around like nothing make any sense whatsoever?

    I know the argument has been fought to the death. Anyway Id say its basically to keep casters in line, and as far as Ive read in most posts (like say the "lets talk challenges" melee and wind elementals issue to give a recent example) casters are over powered. Why then make a casters life even easier (or set em up for another nerf, like firewall )?

    Id say the real issue is getting creative, but then do you really really want to give the melee another hit? And as for fixing this, would be nice but the to do list is pretty long... And since some do want it gone, if this system stays, I doubt it should be on the top of the list.

    In any case most collectables/ingredients while anoying, are really optional so I honestly dont see the harm in them having weight (throw em away then and farm with your melee).

    For the record though, the idea of having a dump str char isnt appealing to me anyway, I like well rounded chars but to each its own (the reason why DDO is such a great game anyway =D)

    So 1 vote for keeping em

  19. #399
    Community Member Zenthalas's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    239

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by EnjoyTheJourney View Post
    I'd be interested to see responses from those who think that encumbrance should stay in the game about the following issues:

    1. Please explain why all characters are so dumb that they would never bring along a pack animal or a device that allowed them to haul gear behind them.

    2. Further to question 1, please explain how a wizard with low or unexceptional strength can carry up to 9000 spell components, hundreds of collectibles, a plethora of ingredients, hundreds and hundreds of scrolls and other consumables, mix & match scepters and robes, and *not* use a pack animal or any other means (magical or mechanical) of organizing such a huge quantity of stuff.

    ..snipped the rest ...
    Pack animals have a survival instinct and run away from danger, if all your gear is on a pack animal and it runs away... your gear is gone. So you gonna chase that pack animal down while a mephit is chewing your face off??

  20. #400
    DDOWiki
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Japan
    Posts
    200

    Default

    it adds certain amount of DnD flavor to the game.
    and gameplay-wise i think its a good thing casters/monks/halflings etc need to consider it.

    but, ingredients/collectables/spell components/gems/cookies and such, all these kind of misc stuff, need to be weightless.
    personally i find it disappointing that i cant carry around my TP-bought cookie jar cuz it glows ultra-heavy.

    making these things weightless is too hard for you guys and eats up too much dev time?
    its kinda embarrassing but it obviously is, judging from what i've seen recently (ingred bag bug/struggle) isnt it?
    well then just go ahead, surrender, and remove the entire mechanic from the game.
    Last edited by yk49; 02-03-2012 at 02:42 AM.
    My HATE goes UNLIMITED!
    DIV on Thelanis

    Xorphitus*Xiaojjie*Xiaommei
    DDOwiki - Sharing DDO knowledge

Page 20 of 27 FirstFirst ... 10161718192021222324 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

This form's session has expired. You need to reload the page.

Reload