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  1. #1
    Community Member Arshan's Avatar
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    Default Francis' turtle : First-life/beginner & gear friendly end game tank

    Realising slowly that i'm the only real epic Lord of Blades tank of my guild, i decided to make a "simple to gear" build, which doesnt require a bunch of past life to work awesomely.
    Very similar versions by way better builders than me have probably already been made, however, this build is based on the http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=344637, that i play myself with some nice efficiency (thanks to the build of course ^^) on epic Lord of Blades.
    As you can read on the link i posted, my toon is AC built, however, i realized how much DR and damage mitigation was more important than AC once you get deeper in the very end game content of DDO.
    As far as my toon owns a eSOS, his dps are rather weak, to not say real weak for a fighter. Even though i can pass in THF mode, i still feel that he is only dedicated for pure tanking, and i dont see the point of bringing him to do anything else.
    That's why i tried to focus a bit more on a decent dps output, without real gear requirement. Indeed, people have usually real issue to build an efficient tank because they try to focus on AC. I had all the gear required before i decided to make a 4th life tank on that toon, but even if i got the required AC to tank the lord of blades on hard, even on elite with ideal setup, going for pure damage resistance and mitigation is way ahead for many reasons :

    - You don't need to ask for buffs like the paladin aura or a bard song, you are really much more self sufficient
    - You can choose a gear setup that allows you a better damage output as soon as your shield is blocking as much damages as possible.
    - You are tankwise efficient for almost any raid as soon as you got enough intimidate and a DR breaking shield/weapon.

    In addition, if you are purely dedicated to DR tanking, you can totally focus on HP and dps as soon as you got your enhancement and shield feats requirements filled.

    RACE : Half-elf
    I know this is a P2P race, however, it grants in my opinion 2 great things for this build :

    - 2 intimi clickies : the normal version with the 15 seconds timer, and a half-elf version with a timer i would evaluate around 45 sec-1 min (would have to compute it, correct me if you got the actual duration).
    - Best self healing amp possible thanks to the monk dilletante (20% from human ascendancy, 20% from monk dilletante), which grants you 40% base healing amp for only 12 AP (against 30% for the same cost if you are human) <= thanks ubonhgwah for the correction there.

    IMPORTANT NOTE ABOUT THE DILLETANTE : To get the monk dilletante without the need of starting with 13 wisdom, you can take any dilletante at start, and go for 12 wisdom + 1 tome, or 11 wisdom +2 tome (depending on what you can afford), and swap the dilletante feat with Fred as soon as you reach 13 base wisdom.

    SPLIT : 18 fighter 2 monk

    Why 18 fighter ?

    - Because it grants stalwart defender III, fighter prestige associated to the tanking as the name subtly suggests it.
    - Not going to capstone, even if 10% doublestrike is nice, i dont think what it actually grants worth a 2 monk splash (for the incoming reasons)

    Why 2 monk ?

    - The class feats of the monk allow you to take thoughness, while on fighter levels, you can't take thougnesses on fighter class feats, and you may want to save non class-related ones to take particular feats like dragonmarks (if you plan to use epic chimera's fang, which i will speak about later).
    - Way of the tenacious badger grants +1 intimidate, and every intimidate you can get is awesome to when you come to tank the lord of blades.
    - Evasion... first of all you have to know i NEVER build for evasion, and that's just a bonus on the build. However, when you come to tank the lord of blades on epic, saving a blade barrier or a cometfall damage is awesome (especially when you have to grab him away from the blade barrier, you have to cross it). It also saves some damages on various bosses (Horoth's spells...). And you can actually reach pretty nice saves even without maxing dexterity like the Zerjmoar does.


    General note for real beginners that can't access monk nor half elf : After some checking about the various tanks build on the forum, Shade's one seems simply in the same way of thinking as the one i'm presenting here. Here is the link : http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=344642
    I still value the half elf over the dwarf for its healing amp and double intimidate, but i guess dwarf and human remains real good tanks in any situations.

    CHARACTER PLAN :
    Here is a quick guide, i did it quite too fast, and took the feats in a rather random order (which should work still, i just don't like to take cleave last). Note ALSO that it is meant to be used with epic chimera's fang, which isnt a difficult epic item to acquire at all, but grants real nice bonuses for stalwarts.
    If you plan to use pure intimidate tanking, thus a rather weaker threat generation, i would recommend to go for more thoughnesses instead of the dragonmarks, for 66 additional HP + 20%, for around 80 additional HP.
    Also note you can go for dual epic chimera's fang in dps mod, which would bring simply be done by replacing the 3 THF feats (Two Handed Fighting, Improved Two Handed Fighting, Greater Two Handed Fighting) by the 3 Two Weapons Fighting feats (and you would then need to start with 15 dexterity, could lower charisma or constitution and use enhancements to unodd it).

    Code:
    Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.11.02
    DDO Character Planner Home Page
    
    Francis 
    Level 20 Lawful GoodNeutral Half-Elf Male
    (18 Fighter \ 2 Monk) 
    Hit Points: 444
    Spell Points: 0 
    BAB: 19\19\24\29\29
    Fortitude: 18
    Reflex: 12
    Will: 12
    
                      Starting          Feat/Enhancement
    Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
    (32 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
    Strength             14                    24
    Dexterity            14                    16
    Constitution         16                    19
    Intelligence          8                     8
    Wisdom               12                    14
    Charisma             14                    16
    
    Tomes Used
    +2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7
    
                      Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                     Base Skills         Modified Skills
    Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
    Balance               2                     3
    Bluff                 2                     3
    Concentration         3                     4
    Diplomacy             2                     3
    Disable Device       n/a                   n/a
    Haggle                2                     3
    Heal                  1                     2
    Hide                  2                     3
    Intimidate            2                    19
    Jump                  2                     7
    Listen                1                     2
    Move Silently         2                     3
    Open Lock             n/a                   n/a
    Perform               n/a                   n/a
    Repair               -1                    -1
    Search               -1                    -1
    Spot                  1                     2
    Swim                  2                     7
    Tumble                n/a                   n/a
    Use Magic Device      n/a                   n/a
    
    Level 1 (Monk)
    Feat: (Selected) Bullheaded
    Feat: (Half-Elf Dilettante) Half-Elf Dilettante: Monk
    Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness
    
    
    Level 2 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Power Attack
    
    
    Level 3 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Shield Bash
    Feat: (Selected) Skill Focus: Intimidate
    
    
    Level 4 (Fighter)
    
    
    Level 5 (Monk)
    Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness
    
    
    Level 6 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Selected) Least Dragonmark of Storm
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Shield Mastery
    
    
    Level 7 (Fighter)
    
    
    Level 8 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Two Handed Fighting
    
    
    Level 9 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Selected) Lesser Dragonmark of Storm
    
    
    Level 10 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Shield Mastery
    
    
    Level 11 (Fighter)
    
    
    Level 12 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Selected) Greater Dragonmark of Storm
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Two Handed Fighting
    
    
    Level 13 (Fighter)
    
    
    Level 14 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Two Handed Fighting
    
    
    Level 15 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Selected) Toughness
    
    
    Level 16 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons
    
    
    Level 17 (Fighter)
    
    
    Level 18 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Sunder
    Feat: (Selected) Toughness
    
    
    Level 19 (Fighter)
    
    
    Level 20 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Cleave
    Enhancement: Fighter Armor Class Boost I
    Enhancement: Fighter Armor Class Boost II
    Enhancement: Fighter Armor Class Boost III
    Enhancement: Fighter Extra Action Boost I
    Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost I
    Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost II
    Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost III
    Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost IV
    Enhancement: Fighter Stalwart Defender I
    Enhancement: Fighter Stalwart Defender II
    Enhancement: Fighter Stalwart Defender III
    Enhancement: Human Adaptability Strength I
    Enhancement: Human Greater Adaptability Constitution I
    Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery I
    Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery II
    Enhancement: Human Versatility I
    Enhancement: Human Versatility II
    Enhancement: Human Versatility III
    Enhancement: Human Versatility IV
    Enhancement: Fighter Item Defense I
    Enhancement: Fighter Item Defense II
    Enhancement: Way of the Tenacious Badger I
    Enhancement: Half-Elf Improved Recovery I
    Enhancement: Half-Elf Improved Recovery II
    Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
    Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
    Enhancement: Racial Toughness III
    Enhancement: Improved Intimidate I
    Enhancement: Improved Intimidate II
    Enhancement: Improved Intimidate III
    Enhancement: Improved Intimidate IV
    Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
    Enhancement: Fighter Strength II
    Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I
    Enhancement: Fighter Toughness II
    Enhancement: Fighter Toughness III
    2 feats that people may ask the reason why i took them :

    - Improved Sunder : If you go for chimera's fang path, you'll get +10 shatter, which represents 10 additional DC to your Sunder attempts. With your rather high strength, you should be able to land it very often, and it's simply - 8 AC and a reduction of the fortification of the boss ; thus granting more critical hits chance to your party.

    - Cleave : First it can be used as quickdraw to balance the lost swings when you are on the little attack block cooldown of a boost use, but it also grants you to keep shield blocking and still be able to hit with your weapon, while it is only letting you not blocking less than a second, if you try to swing while shield blocking, you'll need more time to be blocking again. Also grants you a circular attack around you, good to grab initial aggro in a pack of mobs.
    (that part isnt real clear, i can't explain it well, please apologize me).

    If you think you should replace these feats by feats enhancing your combat abilities like weapon focus, go ahead. However i can tell you that on my tank, even AC based, i am shield blocking most of the time (ok i mainly tank lord of blades nowadays).


    SKILLS :

    I dont like to apply the skill points on the character planner, though, the skill repartition is quite simple.

    4 skills are important to me, however you wont be able to max them : Intimidate, balance, jump and spot (in some extend)

    - Intimidate MUST be maxed. This is your main tanking ability, every single point you can get needs to be taken.
    - Balance is really important for tanks, however you can basically get a decent rank with a decent dexterity, an +15 item and some buffs
    - Jump is real great to flee a pack of mob, or to go to the mob you need to tank when others are blocking you the way, however, once again, you can get a decent jump with some strength and and item and/or buff
    - Spot allows you to see enemies on your way, allowing you to get them and not run across them letting them go on the party. I assume it can be replaced by some party setup with you well ahead, being sure aggro will be for you.

    Make sure you got 1 point in tumble, so that you can move easily while blocking.

    For the intimidate computation :

    Intimidate:
    23 Ranks
    1 Badger path
    6 Stalwart Defender III
    7 Charisma modifier
    20 Epic Brawn Spirit
    2 Good Luck
    4 Fighter intimidate IV
    2 Bullheaded
    3 Skill focus : Intimi
    2 Coin Lord Favor
    4 Greater Heroism
    1 Yugoloth Charisma potion
    6 GS charisma skills item
    ----
    81 intimidate (+2 bard, +2 monk - 84)
    + (5 Claw Gloves) => 86 (up to 90, overkill)

    Assuming epic Lord of Blade is no fail intimi on a 82-83, you should be fine without claw gloves, and starting with 14 CHA. However if you can afford epic claw gloves, it's +5 intimi right here, and you may want to then dump charisma at beginning, so you can put more points in strength.
    Thanks to unbongwah for making me add this useful part



    GEAR :

    As i said, i assume this build is NOT difficult to gear at all, and here are some ideas or recommendations, for the more BASIC version i could make.


    Head - Any + 6 stat helm, or anything you can slot there is fine. Minos Legens is awesome in itself as being a real easy item to get (ideally epic helm of frost)
    Necklace - Any + 6 stat you may need can be slotted here. Silver Flame Talisman isnt bad if you really have nothing else
    Trinket - Epic Brawn Spirit (not EASY to get, but some farming should do it.)
    Cloak - Anything you can slot here is good (ideally epic envenomed)
    Goggles - Could make a GS HP item there
    Gloves - Ideally epic gloves of the claw but THAT'S rather hard to get. Thus Frabricator gauntlets to finish your set with the bracers is a decent idea.
    Belt - ToD 6 CON GFL belt will work awesomely there. Easy to get. GS +6 CHA skills item isnt bad there for your intimi.
    Boots - Madstone boots will prolly do wonder
    Bracers - Could make a GS HP item there, otherwise you can check those new cannith bracers (Fabricators bracers), epic scorched are good to finish your Abishai set if you can afford it.
    R1 - Any ToD ring to max out the stats you want
    R2 - Any ToD ring to max out the stats you want
    Body - 30% 20% 10% Dragontouched healing amp would probably work awesomely, maxing your healing amp
    Shield : CRAFTED +5 holy burst(metal DR breaking what you tank) tower shield of greater (what you tank) bane will work awesomely, both for pure dps from shield and Damage resistance (25% damage mitigation).
    Weapon : Epic chimera's fang if you can afford it, otherwise a crafted +5 holy burst of Gw/eB is cool while waiting. (a +5 holy burst adamantine returning axe of Greater Construct Bane is really golden in Lord of Blades for aggro resets espeically on last phase, just saying).

    As you might have understood it, the only items i REALLY recommend are :
    - Epic Brawn Spirit
    - Crafted Tower Shield
    - Epic chimera's fang if planning to use it

    For the rest, just try to find a decent setup to maximize what you wish to maximize.

    Hopefully i wasnt TOO unclear, i assume that many improvements and suggestions can and must be made, i'and m ready to answer any question of course =)
    Last edited by Arshan; 01-19-2012 at 09:47 AM.
    Tarnesh(GateauFRANCIS, Life 10/10+) / Thazok(GateauTUNES, Life 5/4) / Thaerom(GateauHJEALS, Life 3/3)
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  2. #2
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arshan View Post
    - Best self healing amp possible thanks to the monk dilletante (20% from human ascendancy, 20% from monk dilletante), which grants you 40% base healing amp for only 8 AP (against 30% for 10 AP if you are human).
    Shouldn't those both be 12 APs?

    HE: 2 + 4 + 2 + 4 = 12
    human: 2 + 4 + 6 = 12

    You still come out ahead on HE, with +10% heal amp for the same AP cost, it's just not as cheap as you state.

    Also, why so much base CHA? Is it just for the bonus to Intim?

  3. #3
    Community Member Arshan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    Shouldn't those both be 12 APs?

    HE: 2 + 4 + 2 + 4 = 12
    human: 2 + 4 + 6 = 12

    You still come out ahead on HE, with +10% heal amp for the same AP cost, it's just not as cheap as you state.

    Also, why so much base CHA? Is it just for the bonus to Intim?

    Aye it's indeed 12, i wasnt actually counting the first tiers. Made sense to me when i wrote it, reading you i realize it doenst make any ^^

    The base CHA is actually there to balance the lack of epic gloves of the claw (+5 intimi), which aren't REALLY affordable. I should have put a overall computation of the intimi.
    I personnaly don't use GS CHA item, managing to reach 83 w/o on my tank. However, i assume that for most of the people, GS CHA item is easier to get than epic gloves of the claw.

    Doing that now =)
    Tarnesh(GateauFRANCIS, Life 10/10+) / Thazok(GateauTUNES, Life 5/4) / Thaerom(GateauHJEALS, Life 3/3)
    Iccir's Badger Minsc and Boo approve this build

  4. #4
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    Think of new boots.

    Madstone are WORTHLESS to a stalwart defender. Your stance makes you immune to the madstone rage effect. So you can either forgo your stance bonuses till you are double madstones or just think of a different item to wear.

    I have a helf 18ftr/2rog with pallie dil and the boots never proc and the clickie gives me an immune message. If you are madstoned and then go into your stance you don't lose it though.

    Not sure if this is intended or a bug but its how it currently works.

    EDIT: ah ended up necroing it. Was following a link from a different thread and did not think to check the dates.
    Last edited by Ikuryo; 03-27-2012 at 07:02 PM.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ikuryo View Post
    Think of new boots.

    Madstone are WORTHLESS to a stalwart defender. Your stance makes you immune to the madstone rage effect. So you can either forgo your stance bonuses till you are double madstones or just think of a different item to wear.

    I have a helf 18ftr/2rog with pallie dil and the boots never proc and the clickie gives me an immune message. If you are madstoned and then go into your stance you don't lose it though.

    Not sure if this is intended or a bug but its how it currently works.

    EDIT: ah ended up necroing it. Was following a link from a different thread and did not think to check the dates.
    Either DOS stance or Stawart Stance do indeed stop you from gaining Madstone Rage proc but I wouldn't go so far as to call them worthless. An upgraded pair nets you 30% Striding and Dexteriy + 6 which to me seems half decent. Especially as it means you dont have to slot that Dex 6 somewhere else, thats 3 AC, and + 3 reflex save.

    Other Tank boot optons? Epic Boots of Corrosion, Epic Rock Boots, maybe something crafted, I think its as good as any other option.
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  6. #6
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    I would not recommend any tank to craft GS bracers, as the Levik's, Claw, and the new Bracers of Air out of the Challenges are going be superior to GS. Shoot, even the Tharaak Bracelet might be more helpful.

    For a Fighter, I'd say the best spot for HP GS is Goggles, best for CHA skills is belt (hot swap w/ Ravager for DPS mode).
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  7. #7
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    why helm of frost and not Epic Chimera?

    Here is what I am looking to equip for a similar build


    Head: Epic Chimera's Crown - SR25, +5 natural AC, Chimera's 20hp from 3 dragonmarks, Yellow slot: Greater False Life, Colorless slot: +6 Cha
    Neck: Epic Grim's Bracelet - STR +7, +3 dodge, green slot: toughness
    Trinket: Epic Brawn's Spirits - INT/WIS -1, +20 intim, 10% hate, +2 ex CON, Green slot: +6 Charisma
    Cape:
    Belt: Vorne's Belt - Belt: Constitution +6, Greater False Life
    Ring1: ToD +1con +6 Str + 20% healing Amp Set Bonus: +2 Exceptional Bonus to Will saves, +2 Exceptional Bonus to Reflex saves, Spell Resistance (22)
    Gloves: Fab Gloves
    Boots: Madstone +6 Dex
    Ring2: Ring of the Stalker
    Bracers: Fabicator's
    Goggles: Greensteel - 45hp, Smoke + 6 Dex Skills or GS Cha Skills +6 Cha +haste clickie

    Future need 1 more piece to finish the below items..
    Boots: Boots of Corrosion
    Gloves: Epic Claw - 30% healing amp, (set bonus 20% hate, 4 dmg) or Charged Gauntlets
    Bracer: Scorched Bracer or Claw bracer
    Cloak Epic Envonomed Resistance Save +5 Greater Poison Guard Con +7 Empty Green Augment Slot:
    Fist and Faith
    Musashi DragonClaw
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  8. #8
    Community Member azrael4h's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Musashiclaw View Post
    why helm of frost and not Epic Chimera?

    Here is what I am looking to equip for a similar build


    Head: Epic Chimera's Crown - SR25, +5 natural AC, Chimera's 20hp from 3 dragonmarks, Yellow slot: Greater False Life, Colorless slot: +6 Cha
    Neck: Epic Grim's Bracelet - STR +7, +3 dodge, green slot: toughness
    Trinket: Epic Brawn's Spirits - INT/WIS -1, +20 intim, 10% hate, +2 ex CON, Green slot: +6 Charisma
    Cape:
    Belt: Vorne's Belt - Belt: Constitution +6, Greater False Life
    Ring1: ToD +1con +6 Str + 20% healing Amp Set Bonus: +2 Exceptional Bonus to Will saves, +2 Exceptional Bonus to Reflex saves, Spell Resistance (22)
    Gloves: Fab Gloves
    Boots: Madstone +6 Dex
    Ring2: Ring of the Stalker
    Bracers: Fabicator's
    Goggles: Greensteel - 45hp, Smoke + 6 Dex Skills or GS Cha Skills +6 Cha +haste clickie

    Future need 1 more piece to finish the below items..
    Boots: Boots of Corrosion
    Gloves: Epic Claw - 30% healing amp, (set bonus 20% hate, 4 dmg) or Charged Gauntlets
    Bracer: Scorched Bracer or Claw bracer
    Cloak Epic Envonomed Resistance Save +5 Greater Poison Guard Con +7 Empty Green Augment Slot:
    You're showing +6 CHA on both your Chimera's Crown and Brawn's Spirits.
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  9. #9
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    I am thank you for pointing that out! Probably do +6 Wis
    Fist and Faith
    Musashi DragonClaw
    Thelanis Warclaws, DragonClaws, MusashiCLAW, Warsclaw
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  10. #10
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    Musashi, slot +2 Good luck(Inti/UMD/Balance) on one of those items. If you have UMD, preferably on a nonswap slot.
    ME BARB, ME SMA-ok I stand here with pretty blue lines around me. ok I take damage. ok bye.

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