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  1. #3961
    Community Member Phemt81's Avatar
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    I don't know if this was already asked/replied to.

    Will the capstone enhancements be changed/improved too?

    Will they be less restrictive? Could we have a chance to get a capstone per prestige class?

    Just throwing this idea in.
    How to revamp past life reward system <--- working again
    Quote Originally Posted by Vargouille View Post
    We absolutely planned for Fighter to still have Haste Boost. It's absolutely a bug. Any similar issues that look "wrong" to any player should be bugged.
    Developers should fix this

  2. #3962
    Community Member Artos_Fabril's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phemt81 View Post
    I don't know if this was already asked/replied to.
    It has been mentioned by a Dev (Eladrin)
    Will the capstone enhancements be changed/improved too?
    Even after they've all been announced, that is likely to be a matter of opinion
    Will they be less restrictive? Could we have a chance to get a capstone per prestige class?
    They are not likely to be less restrictive. If anything, it will be more restrictive in that (per latest information) you will need to invest 41 points into the PrE tree for which you desire the capstone. Which is also an answer to your Red question. To wit, "Yes" at least based on current information including the new Tempest capstone as different from the current ranger capstone, which might become either the new AA or DWS capstone.
    Just throwing this idea in.
    Answers in Greenish

    To anyone else joining this thread late. No one expects you to read 200 pages to see if something has been discussed, but you could at least check if there's been a dev post about it by using the search function. If you search for dev names in threads with at least 3780 posts, you'll only come up with dev replies in this thread.

    By the way, Turbine forums web designers, could we maybe have an option in the search to either enter multiple names, or to search for dev/turbine posts?

  3. #3963
    Community Member Asmodeus451's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Artos_Fabril View Post
    By the way, Turbine forums web designers, could we maybe have an option in the search to either enter multiple names, or to search for dev/turbine posts?
    *cough* dev tracker *cough*
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  4. #3964
    The Mad Multiclasser Failedlegend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Asmodeus451 View Post
    *cough* dev tracker *cough*
    He means specifically for one thread...also the dev tracker doesn't have the first few words of the post like a search does
    Last edited by Failedlegend; 03-14-2012 at 03:59 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan
    There is little value in getting into an edition debate; as with anything, we create what we believe works best for DDO.

  5. #3965
    Community Member Artos_Fabril's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Asmodeus451 View Post
    *cough* dev tracker *cough*
    Quote Originally Posted by Failedlegend View Post
    He means specifically for one thread
    Or an option to search within the dev tracker specifically. I'm not picky.

  6. #3966
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aelonwy View Post
    I find it disconcerting that they still have neither confirmed nor denied that we will see the complete Enhancment UI revamp on Lama before it hits live. We're all assuming we will but they haven't confirmed it. Yes, I am worry-wort.
    Confirmation on the office pool which will be on the topic of: How many threads moaning about the new enhancements will be started within the first 48 hours?

    Second office pool: How many pages will the longest thread reach in the first week?
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  7. #3967
    Community Member Phemt81's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Artos_Fabril View Post
    Answers in Greenish

    To anyone else joining this thread late. No one expects you to read 200 pages to see if something has been discussed, but you could at least check if there's been a dev post about it by using the search function. If you search for dev names in threads with at least 3780 posts, you'll only come up with dev replies in this thread.

    By the way, Turbine forums web designers, could we maybe have an option in the search to either enter multiple names, or to search for dev/turbine posts?
    Thank you very much Artos_Fabril for your accurate and fast reply!
    Have a +1 as sign of my gratitude for your patience.

    Also, i'm starting to like the enhancements revamp
    How to revamp past life reward system <--- working again
    Quote Originally Posted by Vargouille View Post
    We absolutely planned for Fighter to still have Haste Boost. It's absolutely a bug. Any similar issues that look "wrong" to any player should be bugged.
    Developers should fix this

  8. #3968
    The Hatchery bigolbear's Avatar
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    *Sticks his ugly mug back in to have a look.

    So where we at with this thread folks, I see Mad has popped back and vargoule made some comments. Any actual confirmation of plans yet?

    3 tree limit confirmation?
    general tab confirmation/denial?
    Class lvl /character lvl gating topic resolution?

    Any actual show and tell of the proposed enhancemnt trees yet?

    For the record ill state again, my personal preference for ease of useability + functionality is:
    3 tree limit + general tree + free floating trees with requirements (such as race or class 1 + class 2 or race and class). none of which has class lvl gating except for capstones and prestige special abilities, and relaxed limits on those to encourage splashes deeper than 18/1/1. CORE features to go in the general tab, specialisations to go in the prestige trees. 1 general 'tree' for all classes.

    Ill stress again a point ive made before. All characters irrelevant of class should have access to enhancements that benefit what they can do - this is particularly relevant in spell casters curently. Im talking pure, not multi class.

    Clerics should be able to enhance their fire magic for example (they get fire spells right, but no one uses them much because of no enhancements) People with dragon marks should get access to the relevant spell enhancemnts. All characters should be able to enhance any magic they have access to, and to do this in a future proof way the best bet is to make all spell damage enhancement types available to all classes via the general tab. Infact i see no reason why these options shouldnt be open to meles - is it so unreasonable that a mele that always uses a flaming weapon learns how to use a flaming weapon better?

    Its not just casters of course, why oh why does a ranger or rogue not get toughness? Growing up in the wild or on the mean streats not gona make you tough? I believe some one suggested toughness unlocks based on either BAB or base hit die? I concur.

    All characters should be able to enhance their standard adventuring abilities (be that hit points, sprinting, armour use, hiting things) you know the kind of things any adventurer may want to increase. again the best way to do this is via a general tab.

    Fighters realy need some love, infact its true for almost all mele - and i dont mean DPS! I mean more things to do, more buttons to press, more FUN, and some way to plan for self sufficiency out side of splashing for umd or silver flame pots.(this may not be solved by enhancements but could partialy be done so).

    If this enhancement pass does nothing else please look at these issues.
    Ex Euro player from devourer: Charaters on orien(Officer of Under Estimated & Nightfox): Wrothgar, Cobolt, Shadeweaver, TheMetal, Metaphysical, Allfred, Razortusk and many more.
    stuff by me: http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php...02#post4938302

  9. #3969
    The Mad Multiclasser Failedlegend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigolbear View Post
    *Sticks his ugly mug back in to have a look.

    So where we at with this thread folks, I see Mad has popped back and vargoule made some comments. Any actual confirmation of plans yet?

    3 tree limit confirmation?
    general tab confirmation/denial?
    Class lvl /character lvl gating topic resolution?
    We've been told nothing still...except that the mournlanders are getting all kinds of juicy NDA'd info that well be told about "Soon"...IOW it's impossible for us to give feedback...My C-Card is standing at the ready to Pre-Order but until I know more it's staying in stand-by

    Quote Originally Posted by bigolbear View Post
    For the record ill state again, my personal preference for ease of useability + functionality is:
    3 tree limit + general tree + free floating trees with requirements (such as race or class 1 + class 2 or race and class). none of which has class lvl gating except for capstones and prestige special abilities, and relaxed limits on those to encourage splashes deeper than 18/1/1. CORE features to go in the general tab, specialisations to go in the prestige trees. 1 general 'tree' for all classes.
    Personally I'd say the simplest solutions are as follows:

    1. Remove the Tree limit entirely the limited AP and Level gating is enough control (removing the level gating would be madness and a nightmare to balance)

    2. Only allow 3 of said trees to be chosen as "PrE Bonus Enabled"

    3. Add a general tab with stuff like spell damage, monk stance, favored enemy, Stat boosts etc. with the relevant class levels as pre-reqs (ie. Fighter,Barb,etc. X for Mighty Strength X) anything thats part of the "core" class and only stuff directly related to the PrEs should be in the PrE trees.

    4. Make Stat boost into 2 Types Racial (Which is in your racial tab) and Class (ie. Mighty Strength or Incredible Intelligence..which should be in the general Tab)

    5. Add Hybrid PrEs...pre-reqs something likes this (Note: This can be a we've made room for it but will be adding it later thing)

    Quote Originally Posted by Failedlegend View Post
    Tier 1 Bonus: Arcane1/Martial1 Character Level 3
    Tier 2 Bonus: Arcane2/Martial2 CL 6
    Tier 3 Bonus: Arcane4/Martial4 CL 9
    Tier 4 Bonus: Arcane5/Martial5 CL 12
    Tier 5 Bonus: Arcane6/Martial6 CL 15
    Tier 6 Bonus: Arcane7/Martial7 CL 18
    Capstone: Arcane10/Martial10 CL 20

    This way its still a flexible PrE but if you want the Capstone (which should be equal in power/usefulness as any other Capstone) your locked into those two classes (which depending on the Hybrid PrE could be fairly flexible still like Swiftblade = Arcane+Martial...or could be pretty much locked in like Self-Forged = Mech+Master Maker)

    The PrE Tree's themselves would likely contain boosts to both related PrEs/PrE Types to offset the fact that your missing 10 levels in said class as well as a bunch of things to enhance their unique abilities
    6. Remove Carbon Copied Racial PrEs and either leave it as-is or add actual racial PrEs

    Quote Originally Posted by Failedlegend View Post
    Warforged: Reforged and Juggernaut (Let the player choose to embrace or shed their construct nature...oh and give Juggernaut an overhaul)
    Elf: AA and Bladesinger
    Dwarf: Dwarven Defender (Make it complement DoS & SD)
    Halfing: Talentia Rider (Dunno if a mount is possible...so just make it a companion)
    Human: Steelsky Liberator (Good at fighting Larger Enemies with a focus on Dragons)
    Drow: Scorpion Wraith
    Half-Orc: Kal'thaan Marcher (This is probably spelled incorrectly)
    Half-Elf: Soulbow? and Any Class PrE based on Dilly (Yeah I know this sort of breaks my no Carbon Copy rule but it fits)
    7. Add in the favored class system in the form of reducing any Level gating in the favored class (ie. Dwarf = Fighter) by 2. (possily just by 1) With the caveat that you need at least one level in said class. (This includes Hybrids so if a Dwarf Swiftblade is using Fighter as his "Martial Class" it's 0/0/2/3/4/5/8 instead of 1/2/4/5/6/7/10 but only for the martial side the Arcane side and the character level requirements are unaffected)

    8. Have about 60AP of worthwhile enhancements per PrE Tree

    9. Make the general tab have its own points system which is either gained at the same rate as AP or is gained based on which class you take that level (amount based on total GP available to said class) with the latter only being necessary if there's a big gap in amount of general enhancements for the different classes.

    10. Add a variable enhancement line to the Racial tab based on their chosen "Sub-class" (chosen at creation similar to LOTRO)

    11. Instead of AA (which is an Arcane PrE) Rangers should get the "Beastmaster" PrE which focuses on Animal Companions (similar to Arty dog), tracking skills (ie. can see enemies on minimap,etc.), terrain mastery (gets a different bonus based on terrain type or works similar to Monk "ways" and you get a bonus based on the terrain you choose) than give DWS a much needed boost to make up for the loss of AA.

    12. Rename Action points to Augmentation Points as it makes alot more sense :P

    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    Confirmation on the office pool which will be on the topic of: How many threads moaning about the new enhancements will be started within the first 48 hours?
    I hope the devs have payed attention to the droves of amazing ideas in the suggestions thread and even brought the section up a few times during planning meetings

    Alternatively they could show us a few PrEs at a time ie. Let's Talk: Wild Mage, Let's Talk: Purple Dragon Knight & Let's Talk: Master Maker....do 3 a week between now and the summer starting with the new PrEs, than the most heavily odified and than lastly the least modified...easier for them to deal with and gives us something to do even if their just a list of enhancements not in any tree-like forum or complete in any way...subject to change and all that jazz
    Last edited by Failedlegend; 03-15-2012 at 04:19 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan
    There is little value in getting into an edition debate; as with anything, we create what we believe works best for DDO.

  10. #3970
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    Quote Originally Posted by orakio View Post

    tl;dr I like your ideas I just think that they should be directions for future development rather than a part of the initial DDO enhancement revision. Take things one step at a time
    Exactly, but thats why it was important to talk about them. With Druid on our way, we already have many classes (some may argue X really important class is still missing, but we do have plenty of choices). So naturaly there are two ways we could go in the future, add more or simply add new posibilities to existing ones. And we wont have them if the new system is built without them in mind.

    Not saying we go and build right away, just take the necesary precaution for future development of this and perhaps things like familiar traits and so on (this is why I liked Failedlegend's mockup so much, you can add many many features and still have a streamlined appealing approach; add dev-love and Im sure that UI would knock your socks off)


    So if any dev is reading this just consider building the a new UI open to possible hybrid PREs / familiar traits, and so on for future development.


    Thank you, and happy questing!
    Last edited by Aldured; 03-15-2012 at 10:36 PM.

  11. #3971
    The Mad Multiclasser Failedlegend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aldured View Post
    Exactly, but thats why it was important to talk about them. With Druid on our way, we already have many classes (some may argue X really important class is still missing, but we do have plenty of choices). So naturaly there are two ways we could go in the future, add more or simply add new posibilities to existing ones. And we wont have them if the new system is built without them in mind.

    Not saying we go and build right away, just take the necessary precaution for future development of this and perhaps things like familiar traits and so on (this is why I liked Failedlegend's mockup so much, you can add many many features and still have a streamlined appealing approach; add dev-love and Im sure that UI would knock your socks off)


    So if any dev is reading this just consider building the a new UI open to possible hybrid PREs / familiar traits, and so on for future development.


    Thank you, and happy questing!
    Those are pretty much my thoughts exactly. Although I wouldn't complain if they stuck a Hyrbid PrE or two on Lama/Mourn to test the waters with the disclaimer that they may be heavily modified/may not hit live with the rest of the Enhancement Update.

    Oh and please excuse the shoddy nature of my Mock-up it's literally just a bunch of barely edited C&Ped images from DDO to get my general idea across. Basically you take the enhancements tab out of the character sheet UI (Add a new button to the menu bar)....than you copy the multitab design of the character sheet (Currently would be Racial, PrE, General & Companion) but you also use the side tab setup similar to spell levels for any tab that needs it.

    For example a Druid/Arty would have a Tab for their Construct/Homunculus and their Animal Companion and of course there would be multiple tabs in the PrE section each with a smaller checkbox on them allowing for the "choose 3 trees to get PrE bonuses in" (If the 3 Tree limit is kept it would be three tabs each with an dropdown menu of any available Trees)

    You may notice "Moon Elf" mentioned and that's for good reason I think it would be cool if each race has a variable enhancement line (which we know the devs can do based on their comments about Savants) based on their sub race (ie. Dwarf could choose Gold Dwarf, Shield Dwarf, Duergar,etc. and Drow could choose Lloth or Vulkoor, and so on) it would allow some variety between members of the same race and add some flavor.

    Add that, some build sliders (ie. torso, height,build,etc.) and we'll start to see alot more variety in looks but of course this is a plans for the future thing but may as well be mentioned since it seems like the devs are planning to slowly replace old systems one at a time as opposed to a DDO2 (this is entirely speculation on my part)



    Note: Ignore the Familiar Tab at the side-bottom & the Racial Tab at the side-top those were old ideas that as I mentioned earlier would fit better as Top Tabs (I may make a new one when I get some time)

    Last edited by Failedlegend; 03-16-2012 at 12:38 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan
    There is little value in getting into an edition debate; as with anything, we create what we believe works best for DDO.

  12. #3972
    Community Member Cyr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadFloyd View Post
    Pardon my long absence. I'll spare you the ugly stories of how I was kidnapped and found myself in central america.

    As for the state of enhancements, we're currently in the process of getting the info into Mournland's hands for initial feedback. Apart from some classes that have been implemented in a rudimentary fashion, most of it is theoretical (tree diagrams, descriptions) as we don't want to go too far without feedback.

    Once that is done we'll start posting it here (I will start a separate thread so that it's visible).
    Huh, I would imagine this is not making it into the expansion.

    Otherwise a round at ML before live even gets to comment on it means pretty much no time to make major changes before it goes onto the live servers and hence no major changes from live feedback.

    So are we talking about update after the expansion then or later on this being soft targetted?
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  13. #3973
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    Quote Originally Posted by Failedlegend View Post
    Those are pretty much my thoughts exactly. Although I wouldn't complain if they stuck a Hyrbid PrE or two on Lama/Mourn to test the waters with the disclaimer that they may be heavily modified/may not hit live with the rest of the Enhancement Update.
    Glad to know where on the same page. Oh and for the sake of reducing time, you could always make a dummy enhancecenment tree consisting of 3 tiers of nothing. The only purpose would be to test the UI, which is in anycase the #1 goal.

    Also as food for future thought. Id say Hybrid PRE's with capstones aren't an issue at all, so long as you take the following into account. A barb loses AC, a thief with medium/heavy aromor loses evasion; perhaps a PRE will grant you some very strong abilities that strenghthen some chars aspects but inhibit others.

    Tradeof is the basis of character development, multiclassing is advanced character development. I believe that if tradeoff is included in hybrid PRE design you get many many more alternatives, because ignoring and embracing the PRE would then be equally appealing alternatives and provide radically different outcomes.

    In anycase, not saying that we do, but maybe when and if its done this could be a good way of doing it. Wed have more alternatives without cookiecutter/overpowered builds

    On a different topic, hope some unpolished stuff (thinking about pure PREs here) makes it to lamania. It sure would be fun to check them out and see the evolution process in itself (and of course help out with constructive criticism)
    Last edited by Aldured; 03-16-2012 at 06:40 PM.

  14. #3974
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey-Boy View Post
    Did I miss it anywhere in the 200ish pages of this thread . . . are elves getting any love to make them more viable at all?
    no, not really. I personally am so tired of Human/Helf is so awesome, they are the only races in the game. you know why? Because of something with only gave humans a slight edge in pen and paper, became a huge f-ing bonus in this game, while Half Elves get to take +3d6 sneak attack damage with minimal drawback.

    asto the level gating debate:

    Ok, lets actually compare the problems with levelgating on and off:

    Level Gating On: Mutliclassing really doesnt enjoy splashing with this, locking people out of rebuilt capstones that are now worth taking is even worse. pure class is basically the only option, because no multiclass combo is truely effective work.

    Level Gating Off: we get crazy situations where people splash single levels of another class, but get the capstone of that tree. this comes at an extreme price though. This problem though actually is a double edged sword, because it forces much better balancing of prestieges between classes, instead of making 1 rogue for Assassin 3+capstone a goto for building. it forces the devs to change and improve terrible prestieges like KotC/HotD or Warchanter for the better. This isnt too far off from one situation that already happens in game, the Fighter 18/9 / Caster 2/1 Elf/Helf Arcane Archer

    My Vote: Level Gating off, because it forces better game design

    other issues:

    In terms of the prestieges, we will have:

    Fighter: Kensai (Basically Exotic Weapon Master), Stalwart Defender (Unraced Dwarven Defender), Purple Dragon Knight (Buffer, kinda a left field prestiege, id much rather a combat maneuver guy)
    Barbarian: Occult Slayer (not bad, but i dont see how much value a dedicated caster killer could bring though), Frenzied Berserker (OP), Ravager (From the sounds of it, badass)
    Paladin: Defender of Siberys (Dwarven Defender again), Hunter of the Dead (Better then its PnP counterpart in some ways, but terrible), Knight of the Challice (should have HotD merged with it)
    Monk: Ninja Spy (more stealth, more sneak), Shintao (nothing new here), Heshen Mystic (no idea)
    Wizard: Palemaster (necromancer, needs better minions), Archmage (Spell DCs, WOO), Wild Mage (Crazy damage)
    Cleric: Radiant Servant (super healer), Warpriest (melee Anti-undead/outsider), Exorcist (Spellcaster Warmage)
    Sorc: Elemental Savant (woo), Acolyte of the Skin (Survivability?)
    FVS: Beacon of Hope (Healz), Angel of Vengeance (Tank), Divine Avenger (Offense)
    Ranger: Tempest (more DW), Arcane Archer (doing fine), Deepwood Sniper (needs sneak attack, other boosts)
    Rogue: Assassin (OP), Rogue Mechanic (needs better crossbow incentives), Theif Acrobat (needs to be better)
    Bard: Warchanter (Needs better everything), Virtuoso (good), Spellsinger (good)
    Artificer: Battle Engineer (needs to be finished), Runecaster (UMD focused?), Hominiculous Master (Do we really like the dog that much?)
    Last edited by toapat; 03-17-2012 at 06:58 PM.

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    In particular, will the enhancment redo help arcane archer at all as a PRE? I feel that in order to end up dealing meaningful damage, you almost have to class out of ranger, which seems rediculous.

    In addition, the PRE itself is (early levels) about as powerful as an artifacers added damage from a rune arm. Will that form of ranged damage in general get any love?

  16. #3976
    Community Member HatsuharuZ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toapat View Post
    Artificer: Battle Engineer (needs to be finished), Runecaster (UMD focused?), Hominiculous Master (Do we really like the dog that much?)
    Well, to be fair, the "holy trinity" of an Artificer is UMD/equipment usage, ranged dps and pets. And the dog is quite useful since it can draw aggro to itself and away from it's master. Furthermore, it can be controlled in the same way as a hireling. It can be useful so long as you know when to use it.

    It would be nice to see some of what the devs are thinking/planning, I think. We seem to be discussing ourselves in circles here...

    :P

  17. #3977
    The Mad Multiclasser Failedlegend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toapat View Post
    Artificer: Battle Engineer (needs to be finished), Runecaster (UMD focused?), Hominiculous Master (Do we really like the dog that much?)
    Actually it's Battle Engineer, Runic Champion & Master Maker unless there's been a recent name change

    The simplest explanations (based on assumptions) I can think of would be:

    Battle Engineer - Fairly Straight forward...you make things die.

    Runic Champion - Focuses mostly on rune arm usage will likely be the best for Melee Arty's although it may be their offensive casting PrE as well

    Master Maker - UMD, Crafting and Construct..will likely have bonuses to construct essence if the Devs stick to their current plans (otherwise it would be in the "Arty" Tree in the general section)
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan
    There is little value in getting into an edition debate; as with anything, we create what we believe works best for DDO.

  18. #3978
    Community Member Phemt81's Avatar
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    Talking

    Whatever! Let me get kensei + frenzy + defender of syberis and then we'll see those CASTERS CRY !!! MUhahuahuahuahuauh (very EVIL laugh mode)

    -i am just kidding, if you play a caster there is no intention to harass you, trust me-
    How to revamp past life reward system <--- working again
    Quote Originally Posted by Vargouille View Post
    We absolutely planned for Fighter to still have Haste Boost. It's absolutely a bug. Any similar issues that look "wrong" to any player should be bugged.
    Developers should fix this

  19. #3979
    Hatchery Founder Glenalth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Koechophe View Post
    In particular, will the enhancment redo help arcane archer at all as a PRE? I feel that in order to end up dealing meaningful damage, you almost have to class out of ranger, which seems rediculous.

    In addition, the PRE itself is (early levels) about as powerful as an artifacers added damage from a rune arm. Will that form of ranged damage in general get any love?
    It really depends on what enhancements they add/modify/delete, but in theory the Ranger as an archer should be buffed due to having access to Arcane Archer and Deepwood Sniper simultaneously. Though it may be a tough balancing act with wanting those two trees plus Tempest and racials.
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  20. #3980
    The Mad Multiclasser Failedlegend's Avatar
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    Well I finally obtained a new monitor cable so my screen is no longer blueish so I cleaned up my Enhancement UI Mock-up and added in recent changes.

    So I've used my Dwarven Wizard12/Fighter6/Rogue2 (PM2/SD1/Hybrid?) as an example. Notes about each Tab Below image....oh and ignore the fact that it says Elf on the racial tab. :P

    Note: The order of the tabs is mostly random...for ease of new players a certain order may be best (just don't ask me what that is :P) but to me it's honestly doesn't matter



    Note: Alot of the below statements are based on Forumites/my own suggestions very little is based off of anything the Devs have said mostly because they've said so little and because most of what they've said is fairly vague and probably out of date at this point

    Racial Tab

    - Contains any racial enhancements (ie. Human Versatility,Halfling Companion, Dwarven Constitution,etc.)

    - The "Free Bonuses" are the Racial PrEs (ie. Talentia Halfling or Bladesinger Elf) they may be absent during initial Enhancement launch if Devs can't find time to make them (It's already a big undertaking to redo the enhancement systems so it's understandable... anyways see Here for my racial PrE suggestions)

    - Has a dropdown menu allowing you to choose alternate PrEs if availible ie. Reforged or Juggernaut..you may also opt out if you wish by choosing <None>

    - Has a variable enhancement line based on sub race (ie. Gold Dwarf, Shield Dwarf, Duergar,etc.)

    - This tab uses Augmentation Points (currently known as Action Points)

    - Level gating is based off character level (The "Favored Class System" has no effect on this)


    General Tab

    - Contains any enhancements that are core to the characters classes (IOW anything that isn't specific to PrEs...some examples include Spell damage lines and monk stances)

    - Uses general points which are gained at every character level (whatever amount the devs deem balanced)

    - Does not have any "Free Bonuses"

    - Uses Class Level for level gating (can be reduced by the "Favored Class" system ie. My Dwarf would be considered 2 levels higher for fighter...Humans/H-Elves would be considered 1 Lvl higher for any Level gating)

    - Has a separate Side-tab for each class

    - Any non-racial stat boosts are put here (can only take one of each stat) they are renamed as Mighty Strength, Incredible Intelligence,etc. once taken in one Class it becomes greyed out in the other (a Barb/Fighter who takes Mighty Strength in Barb will see it greyed out in the Fighter tab) viewing the tool tip will have a short explanation of why it's not available.


    Prestige Tab

    - Uses Augmentation points

    - Has a Side-tab for every PrE you have available to you

    - Can spend AP in every PrE if you wish

    - Can only choose 3 Tabs in which you gain the "Free Bonuses" from (see red checks in boxes) you can choose less is you wish...even none (A few people were upset that they were forced to take PrEs can't hurt to put this in)

    - The side-tabs shown are (In-order from top to bottom) Archmage, Palemaster, Wild Mage, Kensai, Stalwart Defender, Purple Dragon Knight, Assassin, Acrobat, Mechanic and Hybrids

    - The hybrid tab works like every other tab except that there's an extra dropdown menu allowing you to change to any Hybrid PrEs (It defaults to <None>) but you will be unable to spend any points until you meet the requirements (See Here for info on Hybrid Pre-Reqs) You may only have one Hybrid PrE at a time. (The Icon on the side tab changes to reflect the chosen Hybrid PrE) this may also be absent during initial release of the new enhancement system due to time constraints (which again is understandable...just don't forget )

    - Should have about 60AP of worthwhile enhancements to take in each PrE Tree (I would like 80 each but think that's an unrealistic to expect the devs to do that at least now during the initial release see Here for some good enhancement examples)

    - Use Class level to determine access (can be reduced by the "Favored Class" system ie. My Dwarf would be considered 2 levels higher for Kensai, Stalwart and Purple Dragon Knight...Humans/H-Elves would be considered 1 Lvl higher for any Level gating)


    Companion Tab (Not Shown)

    - Not shown as is not currently applicable to example build and will only show up if you have access to companions (to avoid confusion for new players)

    - Contains a Tab for each companion you have access to (ie. A Druid/Arty would have his Construct & Animal Companion)

    - Uses Class for level gating

    - Uses Companion Points (each companion relies on class level for these..IOW with a Druid12/Arty8 the Animal Companion would have more CP at Cap)

    - Will be the Tab used for Arcane Familiars (Wiz,etc.), Animal Companions (ie. Druid/Ranger), Constructs (Ie. Arty), Palemaster Minions and many more.
    Last edited by Failedlegend; 03-19-2012 at 06:41 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan
    There is little value in getting into an edition debate; as with anything, we create what we believe works best for DDO.

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