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  1. #1161
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    For me: normal and hard are both easy, and is fine so, just they should have to be a bit more different, if i don't read on XP table the difficult i cannot find any notable difference.

    Elite: i'm fine to zerg (with some diffs sometimes), but if i find a trap i die: monastery of the scorpion traps: 44+11= fail O.o how should i have 55+ reflex on heroic? Yesterday an arti with evasion and insightful died 7 times to disable von 5 traps (yes some ppl was healing him). Traps can deal 100+ damages at lvl 5 and 300+ at high lvl heroic. My suggestion is: yu can strong a bit more the mobs (expecially bossess that can be shotted expiacially at low lvls), but nerf a bit the traps.

    Scaling: last TR i run Elite invaders on a full party, ice reaver was dealing 200+ from polar ray, we wipped. I did it again in solo, this time they deals half and was easy. Now: what's the point to have a party if soloing is easier and faster? Usually i join in party just if splitting is a great advantage and just with good ppl, for the rest i prefer to solo. Great scaling = less party. My suggestion is to modify scaling, is fine if mobs got more HP (DPS is supposed to be higer), is fine if mobs are more, but the damage should not increase by 100% expecially for the skills/spells that can shot ppl.
    Last edited by FlameDiablo; 11-16-2013 at 04:30 AM.
    Leamos --> Completionist + Epic Completionist

    Arena PVP matchs are the only real end-game... still waiting that community will understand and let turbine to implement it.

  2. #1162
    Hero nibel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlameDiablo View Post
    monastery of the scorpion traps: 44+11= fail O.o how should i have 55+ reflex on heroic?
    You can disarm all traps in monastery without making a single reflex save.
    Main: Amossa d'Cannith, Sarlona, casually trying Completionist [<o>]

    Almost-never-played-alts: Arquera - Chapolin - Fabber - Herweg - Mecanico - Tenma

    I want DDO to be a better game. Those are my personal suggestions on: Ammunition, Archmage, Combat Stances, Deities, Dispel Magic, Epic Destiny Map, Fast Healing, Favor, Favored Enemy, Half-elf Enhancements, Monk Stances, Past Life, Potency, Potions, Ranger Spells, Summons, Tiered Loot.

  3. #1163
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    Maybe i don't wanna wait for party to drop barriers, BTW is just an example
    Leamos --> Completionist + Epic Completionist

    Arena PVP matchs are the only real end-game... still waiting that community will understand and let turbine to implement it.

  4. #1164
    Community Member donweel's Avatar
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    Default A Casual Viewpoint

    I have been a casual player since Eberon Beta I have played hardcore raiding in the game before this one and I settled on DDO cause of my fond P&P memories and the better community I found here.
    As far as difficulty I am generally satisfied with a few exceptions.
    As said by others penalty for wiping is extreme. Due to the length of some of the quests it means the end of the party and possible hard feelings. I would suggest that at least on normal change the leashing on your soulstone to allow a corpse run back to the nearest shrine. I expect to die the first time running a quest as I never research them I like to experience fresh. Also going in blind I am not aware that there may be a puzzle that could take three hours to solve in there somewhere. On normal there should be an option to get around the puzzle for a penalty or there should be a big warning at the entrance. I have had to break up a few parties due to getting stalled out for example Enter the Kobold. True there are solvers and spoilers but that is immersion breaking.

    Things like Greensteel crafting I never expect to do. It is just too complicated and the whole idea seems to lack pen and paper adventure feel. I like finding stuff in chests I just cant see flagging and rerunning the same map over and over again to craft something, it is fine for some players but my lifestyle, game style is not there. It would be nice if there where some alternatives to things like Shroud but more adventuresome in a P&P flavor. Maybe an epic story arc that gives similar rewards but is unique.

    Over all I like the game and never laughed as much in other games like when a trapped chest blows up in our face or like when we got wiped by a mimic last night in Army of Shadow. It was ok because I could reach the shrine and we carried on to defeat Casko.

    Speaking of Wheloon, that is another sticking point. The wilderness part is pretty much unplayable for me due to hitching, rubber banding etc mostly in the Netherese areas when everything turns pink. We had to resort to using shards to teleport to the quests. This detracts from the value of the Shadofell pack but the Iconics were a great idea and a great addition to DDO.

    One more thing. DDO is fun but a complicated game. It would be nice if the was better documentation. A central collection of how DDO works what effects stack what enhancements work together. What quests are in which pack. etc. A live real game manual .
    Last edited by donweel; 11-16-2013 at 05:56 PM.

  5. #1165
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlameDiablo View Post
    For me: normal and hard are both easy, and is fine so, just they should have to be a bit more different, if i don't read on XP table the difficult i cannot find any notable difference.

    Elite: i'm fine to zerg (with some diffs sometimes), but if i find a trap i die: monastery of the scorpion traps: 44+11= fail O.o how should i have 55+ reflex on heroic? Yesterday an arti with evasion and insightful died 7 times to disable von 5 traps (yes some ppl was healing him). Traps can deal 100+ damages at lvl 5 and 300+ at high lvl heroic. My suggestion is: yu can strong a bit more the mobs (expecially bossess that can be shotted expiacially at low lvls), but nerf a bit the traps.

    Scaling: last TR i run Elite invaders on a full party, ice reaver was dealing 200+ from polar ray, we wipped. I did it again in solo, this time they deals half and was easy. Now: what's the point to have a party if soloing is easier and faster? Usually i join in party just if splitting is a great advantage and just with good ppl, for the rest i prefer to solo. Great scaling = less party. My suggestion is to modify scaling, is fine if mobs got more HP (DPS is supposed to be higer), is fine if mobs are more, but the damage should not increase by 100% expecially for the skills/spells that can shot ppl.
    I agree trap and spell damage can get way to high. I guess part of the problem is in heroic it's stupid easy to maintain 50-60% miss chance and then put displacement on top of that and it's almost impossible to get hit. It also makes physical traps a complete joke unless they run a stupid amount of checks. I stopped doing elite quests while leveling as the trap damage is usually a 1 hit KO. I think traps should be used to run down a parties resources not flat out kill them. That should be the actual encounter or boss fights job. I am more afraid of traps in a quest than any actual fight. Hard seems to have the right amount of damage but the encounters aren't nearly as hard as they should be.

    Spells also get stupid scaling sometimes. Level 14 black dragon shaman kobalds can do 400+ lightning bolts damage. I have never been hit by lightning as strong as those even up to epic levels before I TRed. Polar rays from ice flencers in Brothers quest again did 400+ polar rays hardest I've been hit and these are heroic mobs. Some fire elemental also get pretty high with 200-300 fireballs. this is after protection from elements and flat resist. It's not consistent at all and the damage is always insanely high in these select few quests.

  6. #1166
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    Default My thought on some ship buffs.

    if your under lv 10 you should get a 5 ship bonus to resistances.. 11 to 19 you should get 10 and if your 20 to cap it should be a 15 bonus.
    Damage and other such buffs should be similar.

  7. #1167
    Community Member neain2008's Avatar
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    Default scaling

    <rant>

    Scaling seems a little out of whack.

    I will say that when I solo a quest on EH or HE i feel like my toon is awesome. but when i then get into a group and find the scaling changed the game so much that most mobs are saving or have so much HP that my spells that would almost one shot the mobs on my own wont even get the same mobs down to half hp.

    I dont notice this much at heroic levels (though there are always exceptions to any rule. most notably wheloon) but at epic levels I notice it far more often.

    and that does not even come close to what happened in Wheloon. while I agree that higher level quests should be more difficult than lower level quests, the scaling in wheloon is kinda crazy. I can take a toon that can work effectively in GH EE and depending on the quest in wheloon I will get creamed without seeming to add anything to the group. this seems to come from both the monsters saves (which is already higher in wheloon than in the rest of the game) and the fact that the monsters there seem to have more HP than their counter parts in same level quests.

    If Wheloon is the game developers idea of what players should be experiencing at those levels. you need to re-visit all the other heroic/epic content to make it the same. if all the other content is the correct experience, then shame on whoever came up with the wheloon.

    at the moment I will only ever run the heroic wheloon quests when I am far over level and probably epic. and then only because the end list includes the nice named items it does. if those items ever left the end reward list or I had to farm for them, I would stop running those quests at all.

    I do like the story line in wheloon, but the game play makes it hard to enjoy it. at the moment I will do the chain once possibly twice and a max of three times.
    once when leveling in epics if i get a bravery bonus. once on heroic elite once I hit level cap so I can get the favor. and once right before I TR so I can get some decent min level 15 items. and most of the time I will combine 2 and 3 for that final favor grind for the last tier favor stuff before I TR.

    and again im going to rant about the saves. even in heroics their saves are enough that my level capped caster druid with a past life of sorc and wizzy, with epic evocation focus and of course heighten, cannot keep all the mobs tripped with earthquake. I know that 20s happen, but on half the mobs, more than half the time? (ok, im exaggerating. but not by that much)

    I realize that I spent this entire post griping about wheloon, but with that one exception it feels like most of the rest of the game is balanced with itself.

    </rant>

  8. #1168
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    I think the issue i have noticed is with traps.

    Creatures are fine, but if you dont have a rogue in your party you are often screwed...While this is ok sometimes...it should not be the norm.

    I would like to see more traps on chests, and less traps on hallways. so that moving around and fighting is alot easier...but when you open a door or a chest....uh oh boom!

    Also...saves never work for traps...or at least very rarely....out of ten traps...you should be able to save maybe 6 times....or 8 or 9 times if you have bloated saves. But as it stands on hard or elite, saves are non existant, you may achieve 1 out of 10 saves.

    now the hard core players will say...your just being a wuss, or you can get around traps...and maybe that is so if you can handle playing the game and getting frustrated by traps for awhile. but for alot of people the traps are too much...not everyone wants to play a rogue, how about some love for the other classes.

    also gettiing more rewards as you go along would be much nicer. in case you fail you at least dont come out entirely empty handed.

    and the necro 3 quests are extremely frustrating...dont do that again.

  9. #1169
    2014 DDO Players Council ishr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadFloyd View Post
    What are your thoughts on the overall difficulty of DDO? Sure, we offer difficulty choices, but do you find yourself in a postion where even Normal difficulty feels too much like hard?

    If so, do you associate this with a given level in the game (e.g. 10+) or do you think there is just too much inconsistency throughout?

    What's the right balance of challenge vs success for YOU? Do you expect to never fail when playing Normal - or would that simply bore you?

    I'm raising this subject for a few reasons. I think a lot of people expect that when it comes to an MMO, if you put time in you must get progress/reward out of it - and that failure is just plain bad. Spending 45 minutes into a quest only to fail can be very frustrating.

    We have been accused (and perhaps there's truth to this) that we've been balancing the game for the uber-player. Are you finding this to be the case? It seems like a couple years ago the salient message from the community was 'enough with the easy button already!'

    Would love to know your thoughts on this. Feel free to reference specific quests.
    endgame raids are too easy, and EE does not offer appreciably better rewards than EH. please make the upcoming raids as difficult as LOB was at inception.

  10. #1170
    Community Member Connman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadFloyd View Post

    We have been accused (and perhaps there's truth to this) that we've been balancing the game for the uber-player. Are you finding this to be the case? It seems like a couple years ago the salient message from the community was 'enough with the easy button already!'

    Would love to know your thoughts on this. Feel free to reference specific quests.
    I believe that the difficulties in the game are for the most part spot on. In some places quests seem a little harder than others, but that is a good thing. Not every level 11 quest should be exactly as difficult. Some quests should be known for their extreme difficulty.

    My take on difficulties in general is this:

    1. First life characters, and new players, should find normal to have some challenge but not be overly brutal. Normal should be the option for the casual player with a casual amount of gear. I believe this should be the same for the epic content as well.

    2. Hard should be scaled to provide challenge for second life characters, and players with a fair amount of experience and gear. For example if you are going to be joining a quest on Epic Hard, you should need a few pieces of epic normal gear to find the quests challenging but not brutal.

    3. Elite should be scaled for third life plus characters, and those that have a serious amount of gear and experience. You should FEEL it when you go into an epic elite quest with a first life under-geared character. If you have no epic hard items, are on your first or second life and have never even done the quests before, you should get mutilated on epic elite. Epic elite should be scaled as the extreme challenge it is supposed to be. If you have a bunch of epic hard gear, are on your first or second life, and have the experience of having run the quest a few times you should be able to go into epic elite and find challenge, just not soul crushing challenge.

    So ultimately I believe that some difficulties should be brutally difficult for noobs with no gear. I mean that is what the normal and casual setting are for. New players, people with no serious gear should not even consider epic elite, they should farm epic normal and epic hard until they have the gear to compete in epic elite.


    Thanks and have a great day!
    Quote Originally Posted by Severlin View Post
    As an aside, our player concurrency numbers didn't show any kind of dip. Player numbers have been fairly consistent and healthy throughout the champions introduction. Sev~

  11. #1171
    Community Member barecm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadFloyd View Post
    What are your thoughts on the overall difficulty of DDO? Sure, we offer difficulty choices, but do you find yourself in a postion where even Normal difficulty feels too much like hard?If so, do you associate this with a given level in the game (e.g. 10+) or do you think there is just too much inconsistency throughout?What's the right balance of challenge vs success for YOU? Do you expect to never fail when playing Normal - or would that simply bore you?I'm raising this subject for a few reasons. I think a lot of people expect that when it comes to an MMO, if you put time in you must get progress/reward out of it - and that failure is just plain bad. Spending 45 minutes into a quest only to fail can be very frustrating.We have been accused (and perhaps there's truth to this) that we've been balancing the game for the uber-player. Are you finding this to be the case? It seems like a couple years ago the salient message from the community was 'enough with the easy button already!' Would love to know your thoughts on this. Feel free to reference specific quests.
    The "easy Button" is more so the case than it was 2 years ago when this thread was started. I have seen little if anything added to the game that keeps my interest. Top Tier loot is way too easy to obtain (Raiders Loot bags for crying out loud!), the quests are too easy and the thoughfulness of old raids is long gone. I can remember spending months as a guild trying to figure out how to complete The Titan raid. Not only was it fun trying to do so, it was so rewarding when we actually completed it. I remember when the VoN series was released how much of the population was stuck on VoN 3 for weeks I can remember the Demon Queen being pretty hard to beat. Now, raids are a joke at the time they are released, not offering even an initial challenge to complete like old raids did. The overall issue is that while it is easy to suck new players in for a week or two by making awesome loot readily available with limited difficutly in completing quests or raids, it is this same stategy that drives them away in a few weeks leaving the VIPs left footing the bill and carrying the game for months on end between content releases (which are only pay for expansions now). So what is the point? TR or Epic TR? Eventually, even that bell gets rang too many times to save things. We need challenges, not easy buttons. Keep the casual and normal levels as is, but we need more difficulty at hard and elite. Make raids Epic, fun and challenging. I would rahter have Abott type difficutly than CITW difficulty. Also, lets seperate the top tier loot out and make it harder to achieve. Certianly not giving it out for free via Raiders Bags. I don't mind there being a second tier of loot that is more easily obtained for the casual gamer, but the vets / grinders need something to strive for that satisfies the need to stand out. It is not everyone's goal in gaming, but there are those who are willing to put the time in if the rewards are in line with that dedication. As i stated in a different post, if the juice is worth squeezing, people will squeeze as long as it takes to get their juice. The shard, seal, scroll method was great until newer, laughably easy to obtain better stats loot was introduced. Now getting from 0 to Uber is a joke as is this game's difficulty level. The response to people leavign this game seems to be give more free loot, xp, or other bonuses that cut down on game playing time.
    Sarlona Server Mythical:
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  12. #1172
    2014 DDO Players Council ishr's Avatar
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    game is way too easy, especially at EE content. please make the hardest loot more difficult to acquire, this extends the longevity of your player base.

  13. #1173
    Community Member brian14's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by exvanguard View Post
    The difference between hard and elite is night and day
    ^That

    Why is Brothers of the Forge EN (level 28) easier than Bargain of Blood EE (level 22)?
    "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder."

    "Of course it is. Are YOU going to question beholder's artistic sense?"

  14. #1174
    Community Member barecm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ishr View Post
    game is way too easy, especially at EE content. please make the hardest loot more difficult to acquire, this extends the longevity of your player base.
    ^This. 100% agree. I log in these days less frequently and, when I do log in, stuggle to keep myself interested beyond catching up with friends and maybe running a quest that someone needs help with. Then loggin off. Maybe an hour or so at a clip instead of the 4-5 I used to spend raiding and gear grinding etc... There is simply nothing left to strive for now that the easy button loot has hit the game.
    Sarlona Server Mythical:
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  15. #1175
    Community Member avepepix's Avatar
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    57 Pages its make me think if the devs gonna take something in clear...

    Lets see...

    Nomal its easy, you can have some complication in EN but its accesible

    Hard, its interesting, not so hard, not so easy (can be very easy in some classes) EH Much more interesting, but still if you are in a quest, with the wrong class you are in troubles.

    Elite Can be a pain in the A%% some HE are most dificult that an Epic....
    EE Its almost imposible. Why? Because actually the game its scaled to the best character class convination posible... so if you are not in that classes you are doomed.

    Like, EE its imposible if you are not a monk, im not a monk (noone of my char) so its imposible.

  16. #1176
    Community Member avepepix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soulfurnace View Post
    No offence, if disintegrate and polar ray are that bad, you aren't "skilled, ..., experienced" players.
    I went just fine going through Running With the Devils as a melee wizard - with only 10 wizard levels and no improved shrouding.

    I myself am a noob - but even I can take that sort of damage without an issue.
    Play that quest with a dwarf defender and then tell me... 6 spells and you are dead, 1 o 2 if its a critic.

  17. #1177
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by avepepix View Post

    Like, EE its imposible if you are not a monk, im not a monk (noone of my char) so its imposible.
    Wrong. Seriously, I'm of the mind that monks are over-powered and needing some quality time with Ike Turner and a Nerf-hammer but the above statement is just nonsense.

  18. #1178
    Community Member HungarianRhapsody's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by avepepix View Post
    Play that quest with a dwarf defender and then tell me... 6 spells and you are dead, 1 o 2 if its a critic.


    Jay Sherman hits you for 9000 damage. You have died of dysentery.
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    Everybody dies frustrated and sad
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  19. #1179
    Community Member avepepix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    Wrong. Seriously, I'm of the mind that monks are over-powered and needing some quality time with Ike Turner and a Nerf-hammer but the above statement is just nonsense.
    Maybe im too exagerated with that phrase, but EE its not made for everyone

  20. #1180
    Community Member barecm's Avatar
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    EE is not impossible, since many, many people run it exclusively and seem to survive. It is not a run through as you actually can get killed in one or two hits. That being said, the Loot aspect of this game has become somewhat of a joke. You can run a raid on normal and upgrade it to an elite version.... sad. Free loot bags given out, not once, but twice? Economy broken. Thanks.
    Sarlona Server Mythical:
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