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  1. #1
    Community Member voodoogroves's Avatar
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    Oct 2009
    North Cackalacky

    Default What I'd do to epics

    Just a list of things I’d love to see made in the game, particularly epics

    (a) Remove or raise the HP limit on vorpals/smiters/banishers

    - I get the rationale about limiting those with no opportunity cost - but honestly, there is an opportunity cost - you’re generally making different weapon choices, you’re in their face getting hit back, etc.

    (b) Make AC useful in epics

    - Take any of the suggestions about making AC useful and apply them - like the 2d20 reduction from each epic mob, etc.
    - credit grodon9999 and many others - someone toss me a link?

    (c) Add some random components to epic mobs when they spawn

    - Equipment using types should have the possibility of spawning with any of the following assumed to be part of their worn gear: Deathblock, FOM, elemental resist/absorption, SR 30, blurry, fortification … low chance for each, possibility of a super stacked having many/most - consider these item-based and non-dispellable
    - Consider giving a new effect, +X to saves vs. spells ... possibly random in the above set, or possibly a set minimal amount (1 or 2) so that CC tactics are less impacted.
    - Named mobs have a chance to spawn with more fun effects - earthgrab guard, melodic guard, nightmare guard, air guard … low chance to spawn one of these … consider these item-based and non-dispellable
    - If possible, cycle a different AI set for epic casters, allowing some to act similar to IQ divines (spamming deathward, FoM, Holy Aura, etc.)
    - Ensure cast-buffs should be dispellable for a focused dispeller or a lucky person ... remember that CR and Hit Die/level are not the same thing, nor were meant to be.

    (d) Make more mobs stun, trip, sunder
    - Not just dogs and hobgoblins in Tear of Dhakaan - make more mobs hit us with DEX or STR checks. That interrupts casting, lowers our fort, etc.
    - (courtesy Vellrad)

    (e) Hate-amp instakills
    - When "hate" was added to instakills I remember the dev comment being something like "because trying to kill you is a hate-able offense" ... when asked the hate generated was equal to the amount of damage the spell does instead ... about d6/level before amping - I think instakills need to carry more hate than a boosted fireball. Not a guaranteed, and certainly shouldn't apply for mobs that are immune (bosses) so instakills can't be used as a cheap way to turtle, but for mobs who could be affected and make their save - more hate on the caster.

    (f) Add coup-de-grace as an active feat
    - Once mobs are helpless, introduce a coup de grace action to allow for faster melee killing.
    - Courtesy grodon9999

    (g) Enhance combat tactics
    - I mentioned this in the mob saves above - maybe increase their saves against magic, but we could also go the route of increasing their base saves and then boosting melee tactics
    - Introduce more +15 items in the game
    - Remove the slow animations
    - Allow all TWF to proc multiple tactic options (like unarmed)
    - Provide a chance for THF to proc multiples as well
    - courtesy of many others

    ... and I wouldn't be opposed to not making any changes to EXISTING content, and instead shaping these into future content.
    Last edited by voodoogroves; 12-07-2011 at 09:01 AM.
    Ghallanda - now with fewer alts and more ghostbane

  2. #2
    Community Member voodoogroves's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    North Cackalacky


    Ghallanda - now with fewer alts and more ghostbane

  3. #3
    Community Member Talon_Moonshadow's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Seminole, FL


    I don't think epics are as messed up as people seem to think they are.

    The number one thing that bothers me about epics, is that Hobgoblins are NOT epic monsters!

    Make new, real, epic quests.

    Second thing that bothers me also bothers me about elite difficulties... traps are rediculous. And I am talking about those traps that ae required to be passed through for completion..... and worse yet, have boxes that require the disarmer to pass through to disable them.

    Oh...that's what evasion is for...right?
    Not when they have DCs so high that even Dex specced builds can't get through them safely. (being a lag-free Mario Brothers expert doesn't count)

    But.... some of your suggestions "do" adrees some things that are issues.

    Ok...why were these nerfed again?

    Super mages can insta-kill.
    My Monk was even fairly successful on a few casters last night.

    Don't those poor weak melee guys deserve an insta-kill method?
    Don't they deserve to not feel totally useless?

    Yeah...I know they are not really useless. I know that trash is trash.... (and people would just find ways to run by them anyway. )
    But still...

    I think they should take another look at vorpals. (and some other ideas)(although th ebest ideas IMO is "epic" lvls and feats to allow melee guys to do things impossible for average mortals)

    But I actually don't see many problems with epics.

    Last night I was on a failed epic run though...and it got me thinking about a few failed epics I have seen recently.

    Epic casters are exceptionally brutal!
    Too brutal IMO.

    Yeah, many groups can still slaughter them with ease....but seriousy... they are really, really brutal!

    But I'm on the fence about whether I think they should be changed or not.

    Cause I still remember some brutal elite Kobold Shamen back in the day.... (before ship buffs and TRs anyway)

    I still remember a lot of caster heavy dungeons that people use to struggle to complete.
    When they actually had to use tactics (real ones, not exploits) to overcome.

    If you can believe it, we even had to "SLOW DOWN" sometimes!

    Sure was a horrible game back then, when you couldn't comlete everything at full charge.....

    I actually find current epics refreshing.
    But also frustrating since failures, and rage quits are very common.

    So maybe they need a change....

    I might find it fun to have a challenge, but not when my whole group leaves me to face it alone.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jandric View Post
    ..., but I honestly think the solution is to group with less whiny people.

  4. #4
    Community Member somenewnoob's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006


    I'll tell you what I'd do man, 2 epics at the same time man.

    Damn straight, I always wanted to do that.

    I'm piking at work.
    I disarm traps........with my face!
    How do I know that I am better than you are? Because I'm in Thrudh's signature and you're not. That's how.

  5. #5
    Community Member PNellesen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010


    Quote Originally Posted by somenewnoob View Post
    I'll tell you what I'd do man, 2 epics at the same time man.

    Damn straight, I always wanted to do that.

    +1 for gratuitous "Office Space" reference
    Quote Originally Posted by Ertay View Post
    While they were at it though, the devs decided to go on an incredible nerfhammer rampage and left nothing in their wake standing...

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