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  1. #1
    Community Member Gizeh's Avatar
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    Default reason for higher artificer scroll umd difficulty?

    I have noticed that the umd requirements for artificer spells on scrolls are 50 percent higher than for other spells of the same spell level and caster level.

    I can see the reason for the different dcs of level 6 spells like reconstruct (wiz11/sor12/art15, dc 40) and deconstruct (art15, dc 60), because reconstruct has a minimum caster level of 11 (for wizards) while deconstruct has a minimum caster level of 15, and the scrolls are caster level 11 and 15, respectively.

    But I fail to see why this also applies to level 1 spells like grease and ablative armor. Grease (wiz1/sor1/brd1/art1) has a umd dc of 20, while ablative armor (art1) has a umd dc of 30. Both spells, if bought as scrolls, are caster level 1 and can be cast by the respective classes at class level 1.

    The same applies to level 2 spells, for example eagle's splendor (wiz3/sor4/clr3/fvs4/brd4/pal8/art3) and elemental prod (art3): caster level 3, class level 3 (for wizard, cleric and artificer), but dc 24/36.

    Is there an obvious reason for this or was this an arbitrary decision on behalf of the devs?

  2. #2
    Community Member Mrmorphling's Avatar
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    UMD for arti scrolls was quite lower when they released the class and was upped afterward.

    My guess is that by raising UMD req they are trying to make arti spells more 'exclusive' so if you want adamantine weapons during LoB you really have to bring a real arti with you and not a wizard/rogue/bard scrolling as it was before the change.

  3. #3
    Community Member Dendrix's Avatar
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    I think it was a terrible decision.

  4. #4
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    Turbine want people to buy the artificer class or the packs to unlock it.

  5. #5
    Community Member Gorbadoc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gizeh View Post
    Is there an obvious reason for this or was this an arbitrary decision on behalf of the devs?
    I suspect the devs made the decision themselves. As for the reason, I have two guesses:
    1) As Mrmorphling said, it makes artificer buffs more exclusive.
    2) It calibrates the UMD requirements according to current norms for a "high" UMD. As the game ages, I feel like more and more builds have "enough" UMD to use key utility scrolls. I don't know that this is good or bad, but it does make things like Raise Dead and Teleport feel non-specific in who can be expected to use them.

    Setting this higher bar theoretically helps caster bards, actually. They're the ones whose UMD will tend to be high enough to use these new scrolls. In a way, I'm glad to see that their higher UMD might now set them apart from melee bards and rogues.

  6. #6
    Community Member Gizeh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gorbadoc View Post
    I suspect the devs made the decision themselves. As for the reason, I have two guesses:
    1) As Mrmorphling said, it makes artificer buffs more exclusive.
    2) It calibrates the UMD requirements according to current norms for a "high" UMD. As the game ages, I feel like more and more builds have "enough" UMD to use key utility scrolls. I don't know that this is good or bad, but it does make things like Raise Dead and Teleport feel non-specific in who can be expected to use them.

    Setting this higher bar theoretically helps caster bards, actually. They're the ones whose UMD will tend to be high enough to use these new scrolls. In a way, I'm glad to see that their higher UMD might now set them apart from melee bards and rogues.
    I don't agree here. It still takes a lot of effort and dedication to get a rogue to a point at which he can use heal scrolls without failure - a combination of 1 or 2 rogue skill mastery feats, items, high enough starting charisma and/or skill focus: umd are required. I only managed to get to that point with my rogue after I tr'd (I started with a 28 pt build), and I'm both glad and proud that I can heal / reconstruct / raise party members.

    And don't get me wrong, I don't underappreciate bards - I've seen caster bards solo healing difficult quests, so I know what they are capable of when well played. But I think the rogue wand/scroll enhancement line was added for a reason - just like bards, rogues can be a very versatile class.

    As for higher umd requirements being good for bards: simply by gaining class levels an artificer automatically gets a +2 bonus on wand/scroll umd, and he can get an additional +4 on umd skill checks via enhancements. Unless I'm missing something, a bard can only offset this by getting another +9 to his charisma (in addition to the +3 cha the class gets anyway) in a way that an artificer can't. (Almost forgot the +4 umd a spellsinger II gets, but even then the artificer would still be +1 charisma / +0.5 umd ahead)

    But be as it may, I see neither class as a threat to each other - none of them fill the same role, and none of them are likely to replace a dedicated cleric or favored soul as a healer. But all three - rogue, bard and artificer - can mean the difference between success and party wipe if they are well played.

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