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  1. #341
    Founder Mellkor's Avatar
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    Looks like some big changes to this build coming based on the enhancement cahanges on Llamma. Looks like a switch to dex and dumping str is in order because now you can use your dex modifier for to hit and damage for kukris and daggers with just a few AP's. This will apply to all finessable weapons if you have the finesse feat, so I will have to work finesse in somehow, maybe, BUT we will have to see if daggers (Agony) with the all the other goodies it gets outclasses Balizarde before I decide on that. This will be a nice power boost overall to this build, while at the same time, it will have an even better assassinate DC.
    Cully Clonk, Culpepper Cleric, Culpeppa PvP spec Cleric, Azygoz Clogue
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  2. #342
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    This is the OP. Apparently they decided to arbitrarily change my forum name. I am taking a break from this game for the summer or until they fix this mad mess of a forum.

    Good luck all!

    -JR
    Last edited by hookey; 05-01-2013 at 06:43 AM.

  3. #343
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    Quote Originally Posted by hookey View Post
    This is the OP. Apparently they decided to arbitrarily change my forum name. I am taking a break from this game for the summer or until they fix this mad mess of a forum.

    Good luck all!

    -JR
    hope to see you back soon and hopefully with your original forum name. have been checking in on this thread frequently and was just about to TR my halfling into a helf-elf when they put all the enhancement changes on test.

    as you mentioned in an earlier post, looks like some of the changes may give this build a boost. but curious if things go live similar to what they are now, would you still go half-elf? halfling has some nice boosts to both yourself (guile, dodge bonus) and team (companion). the new half-elf dillie progression isn't as nice. really don't need spell boosts though it still does have good flexibility with stat boosts available

  4. #344
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mellkor View Post
    Looks like some big changes to this build coming based on the enhancement cahanges on Llamma. Looks like a switch to dex and dumping str is in order because now you can use your dex modifier for to hit and damage for kukris and daggers with just a few AP's. This will apply to all finessable weapons if you have the finesse feat, so I will have to work finesse in somehow, maybe, BUT we will have to see if daggers (Agony) with the all the other goodies it gets outclasses Balizarde before I decide on that. This will be a nice power boost overall to this build, while at the same time, it will have an even better assassinate DC.
    Iff you want to mess with dex builds on live just go with a pair of Rebellions, they do dex to hit and damage. Cant be beat, well Balizarde on a str build will do 1 pt more all things being equal, except you can go EE and EH versions and get armor piercing 15 and 20% and not need to wear the black armor

  5. #345
    Founder Mellkor's Avatar
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    This is the OP again. They finally fixed my login issues with the forum. Too little, too late as far as I am concerned.

    I am taking a break from this game. Too many recent disappointments (U18, forum "upgrade", etc) and the resulting lack of interest. So I am canceling my VIP membership today. I may occasionally pop into Argo to hang out with guildies and friends, but not much more than that for the foreseeable future.

    As far as this build goes, looks like some nice changes, coming soon™ from Turbines end. I may update this thread soon™ as well. But don't hold your breath for either.....good luck to all.


    The road goes ever on...

    -JR
    Cully Clonk, Culpepper Cleric, Culpeppa PvP spec Cleric, Azygoz Clogue
    Coyle evoker FvS, Ungoliant, Assassin, Angainor, WF Lord of Blades FvS
    Mellkor Wizard, Ferrari WF Sorc, ***Argonnessen*** ~~Ascent~~

  6. #346
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    Still curious as to what you plan to do when the new enhancement system comes out... plan on staying half elf? I know you're taking an extended break due to unfortunate circumstances.

    And if you change... or go more dex/int based, what your base stats would be?

    Hope all is well.

  7. #347
    Community Member Rogann's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hi_sa1nt View Post
    I know you're taking an extended break due to unfortunate circumstances.
    I can honestly see why he left. I did the exact same but a lot earlier. The only reason I even have DDO on my computer is due to my build post. I have to keep it updated.

    With the introduction of easy mode epics and Destiny's. It makes all level 20 content useless. We basically have u14 and u17 content wise. It's pitiful.

    You can even trade all the endgame items. I miss the seal/shard/scroll days when getting one item after months of grinding actually made you feel epic.

    Add in a terrible forum update and you got yourself a stale mmo not worth playing.

  8. #348
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rogann View Post
    I can honestly see why he left. I did the exact same but a lot earlier. The only reason I even have DDO on my computer is due to my build post. I have to keep it updated.

    With the introduction of easy mode epics and Destiny's. It makes all level 20 content useless. We basically have u14 and u17 content wise. It's pitiful.

    You can even trade all the endgame items. I miss the seal/shard/scroll days when getting one item after months of grinding actually made you feel epic.

    Add in a terrible forum update and you got yourself a stale mmo not worth playing.
    You do make some good points. Now it's whoever is willing to pay the most can get the best gear.

    The forum update was bogus... and killed a lot of the activity.

  9. #349
    Community Member Ghwyn's Avatar
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    What a bunch of whining. This is still the best game around. Change is good; it keeps things fresh. This game would be boring if you used the same build and gear year after year.

    That said, I have been running an int based rogue for several years after using a str based one. I run mainly EE, and its still challenging enough to be fun. If this thread does not get updated, I will likely start a new one when the enhancement comes out.
    Gwhyn Saige - heroic and epic completionist, loving the EK build
    https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...elee-wizard-EK

  10. #350
    Community Member Rogann's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghwyn View Post
    This is still the best game around.
    You're entitled to your own opinion.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghwyn View Post
    Change is good; it keeps things fresh.
    By change you mean making 60% of the content useless and making epic items easy mode?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghwyn View Post
    This game would be boring if you used the same build and gear year after year.
    Are we talking about the enhancement pass now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghwyn View Post
    That said, I have been running an int based rogue for several years after using a str based one. I run mainly EE, and its still challenging enough to be fun. If this thread does not get updated, I will likely start a new one when the enhancement comes out.
    Int rogues get a decent buff from the new enhancements. You'll just put about 45-55ish points into Assassin then the rest into racial.

  11. #351
    Community Member Ghwyn's Avatar
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    After checking out the new enhancement system, it is a boon to the assassin. I won't say more til after it comes out.
    Gwhyn Saige - heroic and epic completionist, loving the EK build
    https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...elee-wizard-EK

  12. #352
    Founder Mellkor's Avatar
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    I had some time to mess around on Llamma land. (the helf racial tree really sucks as it is now for this build, IMO).

    Looks like halfling and int + dex, and con (dump most of the other stats) is the way to go now with this build. I liked dagger + kukri + thrown weapons (yes thrown weapons are not bad now). I was easily able to improve almost every aspect of this build with the new enhancements as they are right now on Llamma. 65+ assassinate DC was not too hard to get to. Question now is with Lev 28 coming, what will the (near) no-fail epic elite DC be? I am guessing 70+ based on what (little) playtime I had.

    I will update this build a few weeks after the enhancement changes go live, after I get a chance to try out the new stuff for a while. I encourage you all to discuss how the new changes work out, both the good and the bad.

    -JR
    Last edited by Mellkor; 08-12-2013 at 01:30 AM.
    Cully Clonk, Culpepper Cleric, Culpeppa PvP spec Cleric, Azygoz Clogue
    Coyle evoker FvS, Ungoliant, Assassin, Angainor, WF Lord of Blades FvS
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  13. #353
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mellkor View Post
    I had some time to mess around on Llamma land. (the helf racial tree really sucks as it is now for this build, IMO).

    Looks like halfling and int + dex, and con (dump most of the other stats) is the way to go now with this build. I liked dagger + kukri + thrown weapons (yes thrown weapons are not bad now). I was easily able to improve almost every aspect of this build with the new enhancements as they are right now on Llamma. 65+ assassinate DC was not too hard to get to. Question now is with Lev 28 coming, what will the (near) no-fail epic elite DC be? I am guessing 70+ based on what (little) playtime I had.

    I will update this build a few weeks after the enhancement changes go live, after I get a chance to try out the new stuff for a while. I encourage you all to discuss how the new changes work out, both the good and the bad.

    -JR
    Looking forward to your post.

    One thing, I can see the benefit of going halfling, saving throws, which will definitely help Will saves which Rogues lack in, throwing, sneak, sneak attack, and dexterity... but one ability I've been seeing come in handy more and more is Healing Amp.

    Don't get me wrong, they have the Heal Dragonmarks... but no heal amp to go with it.

    My question, human is looking like more of a viable choice, and I know it's all personal choice when picking races, but why isn't it a race option for you?

  14. #354
    Founder Mellkor's Avatar
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    Please comment here on U19 changes that you think work well with this build. Also let me know what U19 changes affect assassinate DC so I can update the max possible assassinate DC number in the OP (gear, enhancements, feats, etc, etc.).

    Human int/dex may also be a very good choice now, too. as well as dark elf.
    Last edited by Mellkor; 08-19-2013 at 02:00 PM.
    Cully Clonk, Culpepper Cleric, Culpeppa PvP spec Cleric, Azygoz Clogue
    Coyle evoker FvS, Ungoliant, Assassin, Angainor, WF Lord of Blades FvS
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  15. #355
    Community Member Auran82's Avatar
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    I've been looking at what to do with my rogue, I think a human Dex/Int rogue is the way to go, that way you get essentially the same character, with weapon finesse as the free feat, and more (easier to get) healing amp if you want. I don't really consider the +1 int from the Arti Dille to be a loss, as it was so expensive to get anyway it wasn't really worth it anymore in the half elf tree.

    Starting stats I was looking at was something like:

    Str: 8
    Dex: 16
    Con: 15
    Int: 18
    Wis: 9
    Cha: 9

    Str is so low because once you have Dex to hit and damage, its really not very useful past carry weight (and I guess some str checks) but with the amount of str you get naturally, items, tomes etc, it will be decentish anyway.

    Oh, forgot to mention, the 9 in wis and cha is just to even them out with tomes etc, lol, could probably just drop them to 8 and make Con 16.
    Last edited by Auran82; 08-19-2013 at 11:36 PM.

  16. #356
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    Quote Originally Posted by Auran82 View Post
    I've been looking at what to do with my rogue, I think a human Dex/Int rogue is the way to go, that way you get essentially the same character, with weapon finesse as the free feat, and more (easier to get) healing amp if you want. I don't really consider the +1 int from the Arti Dille to be a loss, as it was so expensive to get anyway it wasn't really worth it anymore in the half elf tree.

    Starting stats I was looking at was something like:

    Str: 8
    Dex: 16
    Con: 15
    Int: 18
    Wis: 9
    Cha: 9

    Str is so low because once you have Dex to hit and damage, its really not very useful past carry weight (and I guess some str checks) but with the amount of str you get naturally, items, tomes etc, it will be decentish anyway.

    Oh, forgot to mention, the 9 in wis and cha is just to even them out with tomes etc, lol, could probably just drop them to 8 and make Con 16.
    Good post... now, besides figuring out which class, enhancements have a lot less wiggle room now than they did before.

    Also, one thing to consider is that with elves they get the option to go dex to-hit with the Grace enhancement in the elf tree for Longswords, Rapiers, and Longbows.

    To me... I'd either go Elf or Human. Halfling seems like a trap that I don't think I'd enjoy getting stuck in, and Half-Elf... well, I'm working on getting a refund back... sarcasm.

  17. #357
    Founder Mellkor's Avatar
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    I am leaning towards human or dark elf. I don't think any other race is a real contender. I ended up taking nothing in the racial tree with my Helf. It is actually a pretty decent set up so far. I think I have 41 points into the assassin tree and the rest split almost evenly into the other two trees. I ended up with a 52 standing int and 40 standing dex at lev 25 (with just ship buffs). I even was able to get proficency with heavy repeaters via enhancements. And with the helf arti dili's bonus to int costing way too much and having to take too much junk to get it, that pretty much kills the biggest reasons to go helf prior to this update. I might be able to improve on those scores with a dark elf, but human offers the extra feat, so I will have to give both a try to see what works best.

    I LR'd him and took improved sneak attack instead of insightful reflexes. I dont really notice too much difference in DPS with this feat, so I am still of the opinion that the very small relative DPS it adds makes it not worth a feat, or at the very least, low on the priority list of must have feats for this build. Reflex ends up in the low 60's which seems OK so far. Assassinate DC is 65 which definitely is not high enough for a near no-fail DC in EE new quests. I still think 70 will be that new number. I should be able to get it to that number (even if just for testing) to see how it works at some point.

    Looks like another TR is in my near future

    Some random thoughts:

    Dex to hit and damage is a nice improvement and not nearly as restrictive as it once was. Balizarde still does more dps than agony tho. However, DPS is only marginally better than it was before, and maybe its not such a compelling reason to switch to dex secondary as I had hoped. Maybe this will change with new gear and lev 28.

    I gained around 10 AC with the update, nice, but not really all that important.

    It might end up being better to stay str secondary to free up some enhancement points to get more int.
    Last edited by Mellkor; 08-20-2013 at 08:21 AM.
    Cully Clonk, Culpepper Cleric, Culpeppa PvP spec Cleric, Azygoz Clogue
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  18. #358
    Community Member HuneyMunster's Avatar
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    I use your build for my 1st life 32pt build rogue. I had to drop Int to 16 and up Dex to 15 for the twf feats as didnt have the tomes at the time. I took 15 Str as well and was gonna balance my stats closer to Mellkor's when I TR.

    If TR him soon Im not sure if to use Dex instead. Main problem is that Im using Deathnip in my offhand for 10 seeker and 4x crit with Balizarde in my main hand and Deathnip crit damage is about equal with Balizarde. I guess I should wait until I find a different offhand that benefits from Finesse feat or if its certain that dumping Str for Dex is the way to go.

  19. #359
    Community Member Deathdefy's Avatar
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    Half-Elf isn't that bad for a (primarily ranged so not this build, but I feel someone should defend these hideous freaks) max-int rogue who only melees to assassinate. It wasn't my first choice either, but since there was a free LR+20 and I already was one, I decided it was better than TRing.

    My pessimism has been massively turned around after a day of play.

    The perk of h-elf (and I concede it's highly dependant on playstyle) is that the 5 core abilites give you +10m sneak attack range, so if you use repeaters enough, I think the race justifies itself.

    I also managed to net the 2 int from assassin (plus capstone), 2 int from mechanic, and make my way to the dilettante int point in the racial tree (in addition to the +1 racial core ability at T2) as well. It only left me 4 discretionary points to spend (which went to faster sneaking in acrobat), but if you're after max int, and again I totally concede it's not really the point of this build, but also a ranged focus, then I think half-elf is (maybe) the best choice.

    I will probably TR into a drow (or sun elf!) at some point to get truly max int, but h-elf at only one int point behind and with the interesting core perk of increased sneak attack range as well as +4% accuracy isn't a total write-off.
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  20. #360

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    Can't wait for the build :3

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