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  1. #161
    Community Member Yehediah's Avatar
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    Default Perhaps

    Perhaps some people are not interested in gnomes and find other new races more interesting. That's fine - to each their own tastes. BUT, these other races are not CORE. Gnome is core and SHOULD be in the game! After the CORE races are in, other races can be added!
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  2. #162
    Community Member Dalsheel's Avatar
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    I'd only prefer Gnome over Shifter and Kalashtar if it's going to be Svirfneblin (Deep Gnome) with the +4 racial dodge bonus. They'd fit nicely with the underdark enviroment in MotU.

    If not, then Shifter and Kalashtar are far more suited for Eberron.
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  3. #163
    The Mad Multiclasser Failedlegend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IxidorGR View Post
    I'd only prefer Gnome over Shifter and Kalashtar if it's going to be Svirfneblin (Deep Gnome) with the +4 racial dodge bonus. They'd fit nicely with the underdark enviroment in MotU.

    If not, then Shifter and Kalashtar are far more suited for Eberron.
    Alternatively they could add sub-races to DDO each with their own unique enhancement line

    ie.

    Dwarf - Shield Dwarf, Gold Dwarf, Duergar
    Elf - Valenar, Aelanar, etc.
    Drow - Tribal, Underdark
    Gnome - Tinker, Svir, etc.

    The Sub-race would be chosen at creation and would have slightly different creation options
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan
    There is little value in getting into an edition debate; as with anything, we create what we believe works best for DDO.

  4. #164
    Community Member Zachski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yehediah View Post
    Perhaps some people are not interested in gnomes and find other new races more interesting. That's fine - to each their own tastes. BUT, these other races are not CORE. Gnome is core and SHOULD be in the game! After the CORE races are in, other races can be added!
    Why does "Core" automatically give it priority over other races that would be far more interesting and contribute more variety than "healthier, slower halfling who gains a bonus to DC for one of the less used spell schools in the game"?
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  5. #165
    Community Member Yehediah's Avatar
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    Default High Time!

    Quote Originally Posted by Zachski View Post
    Why does "Core" automatically give it priority over other races that would be far more interesting and contribute more variety than "healthier, slower halfling who gains a bonus to DC for one of the less used spell schools in the game"?
    Here's a better question - why do those preferring other races ASSUME (quiet wrongly) that a gnome is a halfling (or dwarf) alternate? Clearly, your bias is behind your veiled attack posing as a false question. Plenty of stuff in prior posts here on how gnome is a great and different addition. BTW - PK is a commonly used spell and it's illusion. And, DDO adds spells with most expansions - here, it'd be illusion.

    Now, I shouldn't have to answer your question since it was based on false premises. But, since I'm a nice guy...

    * DDO promised to bring in all core races and classes (from prior to game release) and it's the only thing left.
    * Gnomes make great wizards, bards, and artificers - not to mention rogues.
    * Lots of players want gnomes in the game.

    Now, I didn't rain on all those asking for half-elf, half-orc, monks, and druids when all those wanting them asked for them - because they were core and since DDO is a D&D game, it should have the core stuff. Now, it's high time for DDO to complete that promise. So, dump the gnome hate!
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  6. #166
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    /signed to add gnomes and many many more races too
    CANNITH player. Recently returned to the game after 2 years, proudly back with Skunkworks my old crew. Starting completionist project on my 4th life character Pyrau. Have 10 other epic characters across all play styles, some TRs.

  7. #167
    Community Member EnjoyTheJourney's Avatar
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    Gnomes rock. Even when they're not rock gnomes, they rock.

    Gnomes have quite a different look and feel from other races. They're also core.

    And they rock. That's the most important thing.

    I think it's important for everybody *not* in favor of adding gnomes next to understand that all the garden gnomes in your neighborhood have been taking notes. You may (or may not) be safe. But, your lawn furniture will certainly be toast.

    Think about the well being of your lawn furniture before you make another anti-gnome post.

  8. #168
    Hero Silken-Akira's Avatar
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    /signed to add gnomes

  9. #169
    Community Member donfilibuster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zachski View Post
    Why does "Core" automatically give it priority over other races that would be far more interesting and contribute more variety than "healthier, slower halfling who gains a bonus to DC for one of the less used spell schools in the game"?
    It being a "less used spell schools in the game" is an issue of its own right.
    If we had the illusion spells the +DC from the gnome would be really desirable.

    That said, core is never a priority, in the strict sense, but it's a valid suggestion that needs not be reinvented and fits well with the setting.
    Gnomes would probably work best if released with the kobold, in the same way the half-elves were paired with the half-orcs.

  10. #170
    Community Member kilagan800's Avatar
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    /signed for Gnomes

  11. #171
    The Mad Multiclasser Failedlegend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by donfilibuster View Post
    It being a "less used spell schools in the game" is an issue of its own right.
    If we had the illusion spells the +DC from the gnome would be really desirable.

    That said, core is never a priority, in the strict sense, but it's a valid suggestion that needs not be reinvented and fits well with the setting.
    Gnomes would probably work best if released with the kobold, in the same way the half-elves were paired with the half-orcs.
    Also Turbine always adds a bunch of new spells when spomething specializing in it is made...ie. Palemaster came with more necro spells (and old one were tweaked) and Savants came with new elemental spells (and old ones were tweaked). logically Gnomes would come with new illiusion spells as well as some tweaking of older ones.

    Also yes I am very much in favor of the "Little People Pack" (Gnomes & Kobolds) although only if we get "real" gnomes...the ones with +int..not con (only 3e dropped the int bonus for some reason) the kobolds in pnp suck to they have like -6 Str, +2 dex or something like that I'd say make them Gnome: +2 Int, -2 Str (or + 2int&dex, -2str&con) & Kobolds +2 Cha, -2 Str (or +2Dex&Cha, -2Int&Wis)
    Last edited by Failedlegend; 11-16-2012 at 02:44 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan
    There is little value in getting into an edition debate; as with anything, we create what we believe works best for DDO.

  12. #172
    Community Member Zachski's Avatar
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    Personally, if gnomes get a +2 to INT, I think elves should, too (perhaps as an option instead of dex)

    Why? Because elves are traditionally great wizards, but outside of some extra spell penetration (which is only really relevant for a first life) they really don't have much of anything going for them wizard-wise.

    I'm all for adding more illusion spells.

    (As far as them being halfling alternates, that's because all of the artwork depictions I've seen of gnomes in 3.5 and Pathfinder have them being essentially kender with funny hair colors or slightly shorter kender. And since DDO's halflings are kender and not hobbits, ergo, halfling alternates)
    Once I get my moods under control, I might actually get a character past level 7... ooh, shiny!

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  13. #173
    Community Member goodspeed's Avatar
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    forget those wierd gnomes. Unless they're G'home Gnomes then ok,

    Otherwise kender all the way baby! And damn it they better have a TON of inventory space as a racial ability.

  14. #174
    Community Member donfilibuster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zachski View Post
    Personally, if gnomes get a +2 to INT, I think elves should, too (perhaps as an option instead of dex)

    Why? Because elves are traditionally great wizards, but outside of some extra spell penetration (which is only really relevant for a first life) they really don't have much of anything going for them wizard-wise.

    I'm all for adding more illusion spells.

    (As far as them being halfling alternates, that's because all of the artwork depictions I've seen of gnomes in 3.5 and Pathfinder have them being essentially kender with funny hair colors or slightly shorter kender. And since DDO's halflings are kender and not hobbits, ergo, halfling alternates)
    You are entering into subrace territory there, on elves, dwarves, gnomes and halflings.
    Names and traits vary from world to world, specially on Krynn.

    Gray elves would be the great wizards, they get the said int bonus.
    For that matters it'd be good to have the wild and wood varieties too, which don't penalize con.

    The miner gnome is the rock gnome, the forest gnome is the smaller one that may look like a lawn gnome.
    Traits are about the same so both were changed to a con bonus for 3e and favored bard for some reason.
    Probably out of the need for skill points, since gnomes were described as crafters and tinkerers.
    Young gnomes are of course looking a lot like halflings, but would go on to a long life of looking eldery.

    Hobbits in LotR did had the original split, Bilbo and Frodo were strangers in Hobbitton, and Gandalf knew it.
    The Brandis and Tuks were kind of Tallfellows. Thus all three types were represented, later picked up by D&D.
    The MM somehow changed the stronghearts to deep halflings, maybe in an attempt to bury them out of sight
    Faerun is where they use that name, but changed the name of tallfellows to ghostswise halflings.

  15. #175
    Community Member drathdragon's Avatar
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    what about the Kobold race as next ?

    lol

    stats with starting -4 on int ? ^.^

  16. #176
    The Mad Multiclasser Failedlegend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zachski View Post
    Personally, if gnomes get a +2 to INT, I think elves should, too (perhaps as an option instead of dex)
    Well actually Elves are famous for mixing magic with martial prowess but the reasoning for +Int on gnomes is not because I feel like it, it's because there supposed to be +Int, 1e,2e,4e & 5e all have gnomes as +Int 3e changed that for some reason and people were upset until they released Tinker Gnomes which people just treating as the regular gnomes.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan
    There is little value in getting into an edition debate; as with anything, we create what we believe works best for DDO.

  17. #177
    Community Member donfilibuster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Failedlegend View Post
    Well actually Elves are famous for mixing magic with martial prowess but the reasoning for +Int on gnomes is not because I feel like it, it's because there supposed to be +Int, 1e,2e,4e & 5e all have gnomes as +Int 3e changed that for some reason and people were upset until they released Tinker Gnomes which people just treating as the regular gnomes.
    The current material of the 5e testing doesn't include gnomes yet.
    The latest packet tentatively change the int elves from gray elf to high elf and the dex elves from high elf to wood elf.
    So far the racial stat bonus is by 1 with no penalty.

  18. #178
    The Mad Multiclasser Failedlegend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by donfilibuster View Post
    The current material of the 5e testing doesn't include gnomes yet.
    In the released material no, but the devs said Gnomes will be +Int during a Gencon panel (it's during the Q&A)

    The latest packet tentatively change the int elves from gray elf to high elf and the dex elves from high elf to wood elf.
    Which IMO it makes total sense that wood elf would be more dexturous than their royal brethren who it also makes sense would spend more time studying,etc. so would be more apt to have a high int.

    So far the racial stat bonus is by 1 with no penalty.
    Yeah but stats have a cap of 20 in 5e so +1 means alot more than in PnP 3.xe or in DDO
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan
    There is little value in getting into an edition debate; as with anything, we create what we believe works best for DDO.

  19. #179
    Founder & Hero cdbd3rd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Failedlegend View Post
    ... & Kobolds +2 Cha, -2 Str (or +2Dex&Cha, -2Int&Wis)
    Kobolds would also HAVE to have an inherent +2/character level to Jump.

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  20. #180
    The Mad Multiclasser Failedlegend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cdbd3rd View Post
    Kobolds would also HAVE to have an inherent +2/character level to Jump.

    Also unlimited Mana and an ability to jump backwards with a 1 second cool down, last but not least innate spider climb buff


    Spider Climb
    2nd-level Transmutation

    The creature gains the ability to move up, down, or across vertical surfaces or even upside down along ceilings while leaving its hands free. The creature can move in this way at its normal speed and without needing to make a check.
    Last edited by Failedlegend; 11-17-2012 at 01:43 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan
    There is little value in getting into an edition debate; as with anything, we create what we believe works best for DDO.

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