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Thread: New Neverwinter

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    Community Member eldervamp's Avatar
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    Default New Neverwinter

    Greetings...

    Have you been wanting to see what the big lawsuit between Atari and Turbine is all about, then check this out.

    http://www.playneverwinter.com/

    They are calling it a D&D game, not an MMO - but you will have to log online to play it. So in other words it is a new D&D MMO (see why Turbine is upset now). It will be based on 4th Edition rules (so it mean generic characters like all other MMO's).

    Turbine should not worry we are a bunch of loyal fans to our DDO! With 4th edition rules, generic characters, you do not have to worry about me playing.
    **When I die, I want to go peacefully like my Grandfather did, in his sleep -- not screaming, like the passengers in his car. **
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    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    It wont be an MMO. It will likely have PW settings like the old NWN did, where you have ~50 or so people logged into a server playing at once, and those servers are hosted by the players, not the company.
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

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    Community Member grodon9999's Avatar
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    It's not 3.5/3.0, but 3.x D&D was the most ridiculously over-powered munchkin game ever made. is 4.0 a better balanced game?

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    Neverwinter may not even release. It was being developed by Cryptic Studios, and since Atari is in the process of selling off Cryptic to Perfect World Inc., the future of the game is uncertain. At the time of Atari's announcement of the plans to sell Cryptic, they said that development of the game would continue "for the time being", so it's a bit iffy. It should be noted that Neverwinter Nights 1 and 2 were pretty solid games with a good following. If the new Neverwinter does release, I imagine that a fair amount of D&D fans and NWN fans will be trying it out.

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    Founder PurdueDave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grodon9999 View Post
    It's not 3.5/3.0, but 3.x D&D was the most ridiculously over-powered munchkin game ever made. is 4.0 a better balanced game?
    Yes but there's a few holes at times.

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    Community Member flynnjsw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grodon9999 View Post
    It's not 3.5/3.0, but 3.x D&D was the most ridiculously over-powered munchkin game ever made. is 4.0 a better balanced game?
    In Before the Version Flame Wars

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    Default look awsome

    waiting for some time for a new dnd game to come out
    im more of a purist anyways wont mind the linear class lines

    the graphics look alot better then ddo by a longshot lets see if the combat is worthwhile too

    the game looks like its seriously gonna come out it was at e3 so why not?

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    Community Member grodon9999's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flynnjsw View Post
    In Before the Version Flame Wars
    2nd Edition was the best anyway

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    Community Member dkyle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grodon9999 View Post
    It's not 3.5/3.0, but 3.x D&D was the most ridiculously over-powered munchkin game ever made. is 4.0 a better balanced game?
    Far better balanced. It's certainly not perfect, but it holds together from level 1 to at least mid 20s. High levels start to get a little crazy, but nowhere near as crazy as high level 3.5. And WotC puts forth a lot of effort to put out errata to help reign in the degenerate stuff that slips through.

    I think it's a great system, overall. The best tactics-heavy RPG system, in my opinion. But not everyone likes tactics-heavy RPGs.


    That said, I have some concerns about how well it will translate to a real-time video game. So much of 4E is based on subtleties of positioning, status conditions, and other mechanics (like Marking, Oaths, etc.) that work well in a turn based, grid based, combat system, but could be difficult to represent in a video game.
    Last edited by dkyle; 06-07-2011 at 03:51 PM.

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    Community Member Silverwren's Avatar
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    Not to worry. I spend far too much time playing DDO to go elsewhere and start a new game. Heck, I still have an unopened box full of Call of Duty 4 sitting on my desk.
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    Community Member Rakian_Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grodon9999 View Post
    It's not 3.5/3.0, but 3.x D&D was the most ridiculously over-powered munchkin game ever made. is 4.0 a better balanced game?
    It really just depends on who you ask, however I will say it isn't really. Dungeons and Dragons 3.x was balanced until they started adding expansions and the same thing is happening to 4th edition basically. As they publish more books the material they need to check to make sure things are balanced will become more until they slip and the whole system falls.

    Now if you want to start a flame war just start calling 4th ed. the bastard child of pnp Dungeons and Dragons and an MMO.
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    Quote Originally Posted by dkyle View Post
    Far better balanced. It's certainly not perfect, but it holds together from level 1 to at least mid 20s. High levels start to get a little crazy, but nowhere near as crazy as high level 3.5. And WotC puts forth a lot of effort to put out errata to help reign in the degenerate stuff that slips through.

    I think it's a great system, overall. The best tactics-heavy RPG system, in my opinion. But not everyone likes tactics-heavy RPGs.


    That said, I have some concerns about how well it will translate to a real-time video game. So much of 4E is based on subtleties of positioning, status conditions, and other mechanics (like Marking, Oaths, etc.) that work well in a turn based, grid based, combat system, but could be difficult to represent in a video game.
    Couldn't have said it better myself.

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    Community Member Dysmetria's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    It wont be an MMO. It will likely have PW settings like the old NWN did, where you have ~50 or so people logged into a server playing at once, and those servers are hosted by the players, not the company.
    I hope it has those Permanant World settings. The player made PW servers with 50 people or less online at once and small playerbases were by far the most fun I ever had in any online RPG.

    On top of the imaginitive player-created worlds, the DMs there could appear as NPCs to send you on or further the storyline of your quests, spawn as many of any type of monster they wanted along the way, and reward you with whatever item they wanted at the end. There were at times multiple new and unique DM events for my characters and their groups daily, and when I was DM I was sure to return the favor.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eldervamp View Post
    Turbine should not worry we are a bunch of loyal fans to our DDO! With 4th edition rules, generic characters, you do not have to worry about me playing.
    This ^^^

    (though in my case the fact that I'm too cheap/lazy to buy and learn yet another set of rules might also factor in)

    Of course, that assumes I can find a server that will let me in before dinner
    I'm only an occasional player since ShadowFell, please forgive me if I'm not up to speed on anything that's changed since then.

  15. #15
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grodon9999 View Post
    It's not 3.5/3.0, but 3.x D&D was the most ridiculously over-powered munchkin game ever made. is 4.0 a better balanced game?
    Some of its supporters claim it is, however, 4.0 tried to rebalance D&D by throwing most of the complicated situational game mechanics out and letting DMs house rule in for those specific situations not covered. Once 4e reaches the age and complexity of 3.x, we will likely see that it is equally as broke - maybe not in the same aspects, but equally as broke nonetheless. When the edition matures and the designers have tried to account for as many situations as they did in 3.x, we will see the same level of complexity, the same level of rebalancing, and the same level of broken game mechanics etc. We have witnessed this occur in many different games, both D&D and non, where a revamp happens, matures, and needs to be revamped again...I remember the 3.0 lovers who used to rave that the new game was "moar balanced" than that crappy old broken 2.0 version, heh.

    Overpowered? Depends...

    Our NWN PW was not crazy monte haul where people could become overpowered because I restricted alot of gear acquisition and made the PW to adhere to the 4 or 5 large encounter rule before groups had to rest up, etc. Most zones had 10+ different maps that could load, with random traps, and random encounters to boot. Metagaming was at a minimum. Loot value was restricted as far as where the components to build certain items could drop. Level 7 toons were running around with +2 weapons that had 1-2 points of fire damage on it, and respectable but not over the top AC. People MADE cure pots, as well as other potions. The items to make them dropped off mobs. There were no clicky items that were not consumable, and no limitless vendor consumables. None.

    On the converse, there were some NWN PW that were over the top. One PVP server I tried for a few days had a scimitar that dropped which had 6d6 of every elemental burst type on it. ROFL. One guy had a bow that procced epic hellball spells on crits. /yawn.
    Last edited by Chai; 06-07-2011 at 04:31 PM.
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

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    Community Member Lissyl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grodon9999 View Post
    It's not 3.5/3.0, but 3.x D&D was the most ridiculously over-powered munchkin game ever made. is 4.0 a better balanced game?
    Balanced to the point of uselessness. I only marginally like 3.x, but 4.0 is an abomination to all that D&D has ever been.

    Used to be, when you started out your character, you were the beginning hero, out to make a name for yourself. Now, level 1 is at the END of a fantasy novel, not the beginning. The Krynn trilogy would start at book 3 with the characters at 1st and maybe, MAYBE 2nd level. They wouldn't have to worry about strange undead types, they have skills to know what all a monster does. And they have SuperSpecialAttacks that do things like...telepathically move your army from one side of the field to the other...then claim they were there all along as the 'in-game' reason.

    Also, it gives a cute form of Intimidation. Rawr, look at me! But you don't actually have to fight me, we'll just do more damage if you don't.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eldervamp View Post
    Have you been wanting to see what the big lawsuit between Atari and Turbine is all about, then check this out.
    From what I understand that had nothing at all to do with NWN, and everything to do with Atari's 'alleged' failure to carry thru with their contractual obligations in regards to marketing ddo. In any case, it was all settled out-of-court when WB bought Turbine (apparently for more than 30 pieces of silver).


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    Community Member Cold_Stele's Avatar
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    As for Neverwinter -

    From what I'm hearing it's not a true MMO, more like pnp experience, ie - no grind, run an adventure in a night with friends.

    Where's the fun in that?

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    Community Member sacredguyver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rakian_Knight View Post
    Now if you want to start a flame war just start calling 4th ed. the bastard child of pnp Dungeons and Dragons and an MMO.
    TY for the sig.
    Last edited by sacredguyver; 06-07-2011 at 04:26 PM.
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    Community Member Symar-FangofLloth's Avatar
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    Old news (though I cannot find the thread).

    I imagine it'll be more akin to the online portion of Diablo2, or how I understand Guild Wars to work.
    A public town/hub (although D2 was only a chat channel), and personal world instances.
    Don't get your hopes up for privately hosted servers.


    Also, they're launching with *less* classes than DDO had. Only 5 or so of the few dozen official classes they could choose from.
    Former Xoriat-er. Embrace the Madness.

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