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  1. #1
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    Exclamation WF wiz archmage build advice

    any problems with this build? Was wanting a basic WF wiz focusing on evocation, force and elemental spells.
    Havent played a Wiz before so it may be missing something, your suggestions appreciated:
    Code:
    Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.8.0
    DDO Character Planner Home Page
    
    hitdie wf wiz
    Level 20 Lawful Good Warforged Male
    (20 Wizard) 
    Hit Points: 200
    Spell Points: 1615 
    BAB: 10\10\15\20
    Fortitude: 11
    Reflex: 16
    Will: 14
    
                      Starting          Feat/Enhancement
    Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
    (28 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
    Strength             12                    14
    Dexterity             8                    10
    Constitution         17                    21
    Intelligence         18                    30
    Wisdom                6                     8
    Charisma              6                     8
    
    Tomes Used
    +1 Tome of Constitution used at level 1
    +2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7
    
                      Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                     Base Skills         Modified Skills
    Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
    Balance               1                    12.5
    Bluff                -2                    -1
    Concentration         4                    34
    Diplomacy            -2                    -1
    Disable Device        n/a                  n/a
    Haggle                0                    10.5
    Heal                 -2                    -1
    Hide                 -1                     0
    Intimidate           -2                    -1
    Jump                  3                    10
    Listen               -2                    -1
    Move Silently        -1                     0
    Open Lock            n/a                    n/a
    Perform              n/a                   n/a
    Repair                8                    34
    Search                6                    16.5
    Spot                  0                    10.5
    Swim                  1                    13.5
    Tumble               n/a                    1
    Use Magic Device     n/a                   n/a
    
    Level 1 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Extend Spell
    Feat: (Selected) Insightful Reflexes
    
    
    Level 2 (Wizard)
    Enhancement: Improved Concentration I
    Enhancement: Improved Repair I
    Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation I
    Enhancement: Wizard Force Manipulation I
    Enhancement: Wizard Energy of the Scholar I
    Enhancement: Wizard Intelligence I
    Enhancement: Warforged Combat Training I
    
    
    Level 3 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness
    
    
    Level 4 (Wizard)
    Enhancement: Improved Concentration II
    Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation II
    Enhancement: Warforged Constitution I
    Enhancement: Warforged Inscribed Armor I
    
    
    Level 5 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Spell Focus: Evocation
    
    
    Level 6 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Combat Casting
    Enhancement: Wizard Energy of the Scholar II
    Enhancement: Wizard Archmage I
    
    
    Level 7 (Wizard)
    Enhancement: Wizard Intelligence II
    Enhancement: Warforged Healer's Friend I
    Enhancement: Evocation I - Magic Missle
    
    
    Level 8 (Wizard)
    Enhancement: Wizard Force Manipulation II
    Enhancement: Wizard Force Manipulation III
    
    
    Level 9 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Greater Spell Focus: Evocation
    Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation III
    
    
    Level 10 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Maximize Spell
    Enhancement: Wizard Force Manipulation IV
    
    
    Level 11 (Wizard)
    Enhancement: Wizard Energy of the Scholar III
    Enhancement: Arcane Bolt
    Enhancement: Wizard Archmage II
    
    
    Level 12 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Improved Mental Toughness
    
    
    Level 13 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 14 (Wizard)
    Enhancement: Wizard Energy of the Scholar IV
    Enhancement: Wizard Intelligence III
    
    
    Level 15 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Heighten Spell
    Feat: (Selected) Iron Will
    Enhancement: Archmage Spell Mastery I: Evocation
    Enhancement: Archmage Spell Mastery II: Evocation
    Enhancement: Evocation II - Gust of Wind
    
    
    Level 16 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 17 (Wizard)
    Enhancement: Improved Concentration III
    Enhancement: Improved Concentration IV
    Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation IV
    Enhancement: Warforged Constitution II
    
    
    Level 18 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Discipline
    
    
    Level 19 (Wizard)
    Enhancement: Wizard Archmage III
    Enhancement: Wizard Archmage IV
    Enhancement: Wizard Archmage V
    Enhancement: Evocation III - Chain Missles
    Enhancement: Evocation IV - Fire Shield
    Enhancement: Evocation V - Cyclonic Blast
    
    
    Level 20 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Quicken Spell
    Enhancement: Wizard Master of Magic
    Enhancement: Wizard Improved Heightening I
    Enhancement: Arcane Blast

  2. #2
    The Hatchery GeneralDiomedes's Avatar
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    One glaring issue: drop Discipline and Iron Will, get Toughness and Empower spell instead.

  3. #3
    Community Member Acehole31's Avatar
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    1: Ditch Improved Mental Toughness. Take Toughness instead.

    2: Firewalls and Ice Storms have no DC check for them, so rather than Evocation focus try for Enchantment focus. Mass Hold Monster ROCKS.

    3: Discipline and Iron Will are wasted feats, those are much better spent on metamagics or additional toughness feats.

    4: Don't take so many Archmagi Enhancement spells, they'll kill your max SP. If you find something to be useful then go for it, but don't take it just to take it.

    5: Wizards are masters of the DC...Max out your damage lines, and try to max your DC as much as possible as well in whatever you do eventually end up specializing in. If you want a purely damage-specced nuker, roll up a Sorcerer in my opinion.

    6: As a caster you might benefit more from your alignment being True Neutral, thereby being able to utilize things that otherwise would have a Taint of Evil on them with no negative effects(I'm thinking Litany here).

    I hope these tips help you. ^-^
    Last edited by Acehole31; 01-23-2011 at 10:45 PM.
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  4. #4
    Community Member Samadhi's Avatar
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    99% of the above advice is worth following. I disagree on not going Evocation though. IMO Evocation is the only Archmage line that is worth it.
    sravana, kirtana, smarana, dasya, atma-nivedana
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  5. #5
    Community Member Parody's Avatar
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    Seconded but also add "for leveling."

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Samadhi View Post
    I disagree on not going Evocation though. IMO Evocation is the only Archmage line that is worth it.
    I disagree with your disagreeing I think 90% of the reason to go Archmage is more SP, so it doesn't matter a huge amount what focuses you go for, unless you take a lot of SLAs, and end up with less SP than you started with. That means that the low level SLAs are really the only ones worth it, which makes hypnotize and web sort of stand out glaringly if you're looking at cost:benefit. Which means not Evocation. But ymmv, unless you disagree with "90% of the reason to go Archmage is for more SP" and prefer "less SP, but cheap force spells."

    I agree with the other posts overall. A few other things:

    1) Repair (skill) is useless. Take some other skill. Like USE MAGIC DEVICE. EVERYONE NEEDS TO, oh sorry for shouting, take this skill. Swim is also useless, especially since you're a wizard and can cast a +swim skill on yourself! Ditto Jump, but not as useless as swim.

    2) Combat Casting. No no! This is a pretty useless feat since it doesn't add much, a high concentration will work as well, and there is a much better feat to prevent interruption in combat: Quicken, and it's guaranteed no interrupt not "oh it's a little bit better to my concentration." And! You're taking Quicken anyway, so...

    3) Improved Mental Toughness is not needed, and is not worth a feat slot, imo especially compared to the amounts of spell points you gain from Archmage (assuming you don't go SLA crazy). Very poor return for a feat.

    4) You probably should take Spell Penetration & Greater Spell Penetration, but it's not crucial if you disregard all your enchant and necro skills. I guess. This is probably not a good idea to do (disregard them)

    5) Seconding Toughness & Empower. Especially Toughness. As a warforged, and taking the toughness enhancements, that's 63 hit points.

    6) Go True Neutral. Less damage. This is perfectly fine since that Use Magic Device in #1 will make up for any reason to go Lawful Good.

    7) We're just trying to make playing and leveling this character a fun time where you feel powerful and able to take on anything, so the above is just stuff that helps this along.
    Last edited by locus; 01-25-2011 at 12:18 AM.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Acehole31 View Post
    1: 4: Don't take so many Archmagi Enhancement spells, they'll kill your max SP. If you find something to be useful then go for it, but don't take it just to take it.

    -^
    I only really wanted archmagi spells Magic missile and chain missile, mabey im missing something, but it seemed like i needed the others just to unlock chain missile. is this correct?

    The advice has been very useful,(keep it coming!!!) and i am taking it all onboard. this is my first wiz and first wf so the learning curve is high... thanks again.

  8. #8
    Community Member Jaid314's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by elgaeb View Post
    I only really wanted archmagi spells Magic missile and chain missile, mabey im missing something, but it seemed like i needed the others just to unlock chain missile. is this correct?

    The advice has been very useful,(keep it coming!!!) and i am taking it all onboard. this is my first wiz and first wf so the learning curve is high... thanks again.
    magic missile and gust of wind are required for chain missiles, yes, and an evocation/force archmage is very viable for most of the game. gets a lot less awesome in epics, but up until then, you should be just fine... your damage won't be incredible, but it will be respectable. the main problem is you have to put feats into evocation focus... which is something you may come to regret if your plan for this archmage includes a lot of epics.

  9. #9
    Community Member hermespan's Avatar
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    SLAs are bad news.

    you want all of the toughness, concentration, int, con, spell point, capstone, spell pen, archmage enchantment 1 & 2, archmage necro (or whatever your secondary) enhancements for DC.

    By the time you are done, you won't (or shouldn't) have anything left for SLAs.

    At the high end of things they aren't very good. Metas don't work on them etc. Every time I've used SLAs at level 15 + it's like using a .45 against a tiger tank.

    For epic you really want to specialize and max out your DC, spellpoints, and hit points. Then again that's my philosophy. Some people take the generalist route. I've found it to be less effective personally. I've tried both ways.

  10. #10
    Community Member teamghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hermespan View Post
    SLAs are bad news.



    At the high end of things they aren't very good. Metas don't work on them etc. Every time I've used SLAs at level 15 + it's like using a .45 against a tiger tank.
    Metas certainly do work on SLA's...

  11. #11
    Community Member ganondalf's Avatar
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    If you TR from a wizard into a wizard again you can drop greater spell penetration for the active past life feat. You'll still get the +2 spell pen you would have gotten, but you'll also get a stacking +1 to the DC of all your spells and 10 free uses of magic missile (max 10 missiles) which can be amplified just like the regular version.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by hermespan View Post
    By the time you are done, you won't (or shouldn't) have anything left for SLAs.
    Yep (also the full energy of scholar line's also required). Pretty steep AP requirements just for base Archmage. Arcane bolt IS pretty handy for 1AP, and the level 1 (maybe level 1-3 if you want chain missiles, which is worthful if you're Evocation) SLA of your choice. Past that you start losing SP and have few AP points, which will be cutting down your Force damage boost/crit boosts to nearly nothing. Archmage is pretty tight on AP unfortunately.

    Metas work on SLAs, which is one of the benefits of getting chain missiles, to be honest, as it's significantly cheaper than a full meta'd normal casting. Meta's DON'T work on Arcane Bolt/Blast (but other force enhancements do), but I guess that's why it's 1 AP and 1SP to cast, at least for Bolt (more for Blast, which makes it less worth it).

  13. #13
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    UMD instead of Repair skill?

    Whilst im on this forum..... spells you cant live without?

    All your Advice is always appreciated, ty.

  14. #14
    The Hatchery samthedagger's Avatar
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    I think your build is halfway there. A few notes.

    1) If you are going to be an evocation archmage you absolutely MUST have Empower Spell. Using it with your SLAs is free and direct damage is a key advantage of choosing evocation over another school so why wouldn't you? Get rid of Insightful Reflexes or Combat Casting.

    2) Iron Will and Discipline are a complete waste. If you swap them for Spell Focus and Greater Spell Focus you can get secondary focus. I would recommend enchantment or conjuration to give yourself some better crowd control. It's not just for the bonus to DCs, although those are a big part of it. Heightened hypnotism or web for only 1 or 3 SP respectively is an incredible asset to any wizard whether you are playing epic or not.

    3) You would probably get a lot more mileage out of Toughness than you would Improved Mental Toughness. I have a high level archmage without IMT and I never have to worry about SP. And I mean never. When SP gets low, I just rely on my cheap SLAs to hold me out until the next shrine and an archmage can do a lot with a little SP so you are still contributing.

    4) Search serves no useful purpose. From level 1 you can locate secret doors with a spell. And it doesn't do you any good to find a trap box if you can't disable it. I keep either DSD or true seeing prepped at all times in case I need to find a secret door.

    5) At least one rank of Tumble is worth investing in. And you don't need Repair.

    6) This build isn't going to be very impressive on epics. Once you are ready to do epics, I suggest respeccing for enchantment or conjuration (or both!).

  15. #15
    Community Member Fejj's Avatar
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    Repair skill - Gets you more Hitpoints when you shrine (30? more hitpoints) - Worthless for a feat

    UMD skill - Gets you access to Race Restricted and alignment restricted items. Cross Class scrolls too. Revered by some to be the best skill in the game. I have it maxed on every character, its that good.


    (I had this in guild forum, its for a sorc, but you will get the flavor.)

    This is the list I have, and what I use most

    * = I will never swap this spell <---- answers your question of which are must haves (for me)

    (Level 20 Set Up)

    Level 1
    Jump*
    Nightshield*
    Protection from evil*
    Charm Person

    Level 2
    Resist energy*
    Web*
    Blur*
    Knock

    Level 3
    Rage*
    Displacement*
    Haste*
    Chain Missile

    Level 4
    Dimention Door*
    Fire Shield
    Wall of Fire
    Stoneskin

    Level 5
    Teleport*
    Protection from elements
    Hold Monster
    Cone of Cold

    Level 6
    Greater Heroism*
    Disintegrate*
    Reconstruct

    Level 7
    Otto's Sphere of Dancing*
    Finger of Death*
    Waves of Exhaustion

    Level 8
    Polar Ray*
    Summon Monster VIII
    Otto's Irresistible Dance

    Level 9
    Wail of the Banshee*
    Hold Monster, Mass*
    Meteor Swarm

    Honerable mentions (Spell level first)
    9 - Energy Drain
    8 - Trap the Soul
    8 - Incendiary Cloud
    7 - Banishment
    7 - Delayed Blast Fireball
    6 - Flesh to Stone
    5 - Cloudkill
    5 - Dismissal
    4 - Enervation
    4 - Phantasmal Killer
    3 - Frost Lance
    3 - Heroism
    3 - Acid Blast
    3 - Fireball
    2 - Invisibility
    2 - Scorching Ray
    2 - Melf's Acid Arrow
    1 - Expeditious Retreat
    1 - Magic Missile
    1 - Burning Hands
    1 - Hypnotism
    1 - Master's Touch
    1 - Niac's Cold Ray

    Scrolls I have and use
    Invisiblity
    Mass Invisability
    Greater Teleport
    Grease (11 seconds of LOL)
    Tumble (For Reavers Raid)
    True Seeing

    Divine Scrolls
    Restoration
    Raise Dead
    Heal

    This list is for a level 20 sorcorer. Leveling up my list was very different. I know I can scroll cast several spells I took, but I drain so much plat in other ways I just can't afford to buy that many scrolls.



    My list if I were to level back up, (level 7,8,and 9 spell choices are based on playstyle)
    I'd say level 1-15 is pretty solid (for my style of play). 15-20 You can change a bit. Depends on you.

    Level 1 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (1): Master's Touch
    Spell (1): Hypno

    Level 2 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (1): Niac's Cold Ray

    Level 3 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (1): Burning Hands <--- used most at this level

    Level 4 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (2): Blur

    Level 5 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (2): Scorching Ray <---- best single target spell for a while

    Level 6 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (3): Haste

    Level 7 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (2): Resist Energy
    Spell (3): Fireball

    Level 8 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (4): Wall of Fire

    Level 9 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (2): Invisibility
    Spell (3): Frost Lance <----- I used this till about level 16 or so. Its great
    Spell (4): Dimension Door

    Level 10 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (5): Teleport

    Level 11 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (3): Displacement
    Spell (4): Phantasmal Killer
    Spell (5): Cone of Cold

    Level 12 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (6): Disintegrate <---- Booooya

    Level 13 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (4): Stoneskin
    Spell (5): Protection From Elements
    Spell (6): Greater Heroism

    Level 14 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (7): Finger of Death <----- Gianthold will make you smile

    Level 15 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (5): Hold Monster
    Spell (6): Reconstruct
    Spell (7): Banishment <--- must have for Vale, if getting into vale sooner, take at 14.

    Level 16 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (8): Polar Ray

    Level 17 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (7): Delayed Blast Fireball <---- BOOM!
    Spell (8): Summon Monster VIII

    Level 18 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (9): Wail of the Banshee <---- changes everything

    Level 19 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (8): Otto's Irresistable Dance
    Spell (9): Meteor Swarm <---- I don't recommend but I had a nice robe for it.

    Level 20 (Sorcerer)
    Spell (9): Mass Hold Monster

    (I'm not looking for feed back on my list, Just providing a reference for a new caster.)

    As a wizard you get some extra spell slots to play with too.

    I hope this helped, and wasn't too long.

  16. #16
    The Front Side Gratch's Avatar
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    I tried the transmutation SLA for a month. Very nice being able to stone everything in EPIC (DC 44 or so). Well except chrono devils which hold nicely. Which is why I took a minor AM focus in enchantment. But awesome or epic scroll farming.

    Though now TR'ing the wizard again for more free spell pen. Going the Necro line for higher necro spell dc's. But no SLA's... just the focus lines. Mostly for leveling speed. Should probably try PM again on an enhancement reset. Though a good setup to compare the two lines.

    Will probably end up going enchantment greater focus AM sans SLA's as the 4th and final wizard life. If I ever get an Epic Spell Storing Ring shard... boom straight back to transmutation WITH SLA's.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan View Post
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