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  1. #21
    Community Member Trillea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeLoric View Post
    Some decent point here trillea.

    My concerns with the hellstroke greataxe are even with it's DR bypassing abilities, you are better off using ESOS on all but Elite devils bosses. ESOS just typically ruins the value of most of the could be good epic two handed weapons. The ability to obtain the axe is possibly even harder than the ability to obtain a ESOS due to the rarity of scrolls in Chronoscope. The Augments from DA would improve this some but I feel they are just not enough of them to have the effect on reliably. Id rather slot it as a +7 and be better against auto crit or go with good and break queen or epic rever/render/flenser dr. This weapon could be really good if we ever get a high end mobs that require dr evil and cold iron.

    For the staff unless the dex is really that much higher than strength which many acrobats are actually pretty close to even on this you are better served with a Min II with insight 4 on it. You get the same AC boost (more with icy's on) and more dmg and bypass demon dr as well as devils. A previous poster made a really good point in that this is probably much better on a mechanic than an acrobat which is pretty ironic to me.
    Thanks for the props, and I would raise the score on the epic Hellstroke axe even more personally because it is, by far, the coolest looking axe in the game..
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  2. #22
    Community Member Kourier's Avatar
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    I heard from the Lamm forums that the Illusionist robe is getting buffed to +7 int and greater illusion focus. Does PK work at all in endgame?

  3. #23

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    Epic Unkor’s Cleaver: +6 Battle Axe (2d8 Dmg) Limbchopper, Bleed, Keen, Vorpal, Eat Jerky 1/rest, Red Slot It’s a really good vorpal, but those aren’t really used much anymore, limbchopper was cool but that’s now gonna be on a khopesh that’s much lower level and much easier to get. A good weapon and I think most anyone would make one if they get the items for it but also nothing that makes me wanna specifically farm for it. Rating: 3
    I'd reduce the rating. You are right that Limbchopper is now available on lower-level khopesh now. Limpchopper does not work on any orange or red named. Not even the Epic Cleaver. And since Vorpal doesn't work on Epic mobs anyway this Epic weapon has far lesser utility for its ML.

    A suggested improvement is to make this have an Improved Limbchopper or something like that which either has a higher proc rate (not just natural 20) or can affect more kinds of mobs or has at least a slight chance of affecting a orange/red named. That may be too powerful though as this weapon is fairly easy to acquire the ingredients and craft.


    Epic Wolf Whistle: Necklace, Disease Immunity, Listne 15, Summon Epic Thaarak Hound 1/rest Yellow Slot, Colorless Slot The hound is awesome for the whole 1 minute you get him. The rest of the time this thing is clogging up my inventory. Rating: 1
    I know the existing screenshots say 1 minute, but I know I've seen one summoned that lasted for 5-10 like any normal summon. Screenshot may be stale, or description may be wrong. Of course I assume the CR:20+ Hound was summoned through an Epic Wolf Whistle - are there other ways one could be summoned?
    Last edited by EyeRekon; 12-03-2010 at 04:40 PM.

  4. #24
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    With the buff the epic Utility Vest deserves at least a 2. That +2 exceptional int is very useful to repeater mechanics.

  5. #25
    Community Member Aaxeyu's Avatar
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    You are abit too generous with the 6 IMO.

  6. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dilbon View Post
    With the buff the epic Utility Vest deserves at least a 2. That +2 exceptional int is very useful to repeater mechanics.
    I'm making it a policy to not update items until they have went live. Things on Lammania are always subject to change. Plus I know a lot of people used my old thread to view the items and I don't want to create any confusion of someone making one then having to spend 3 tokens later to upgrade. This may see a slight increase if only for repeater mechanics.
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  7. #27
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    FYI the Epic wolf whistle has been changed. Epic Hound summon now lasts 5 minutes. Was a stealth change in update 7. You might want to re rate this item as 1min vs 5min makes this item much more useful.
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  8. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aaxeyu View Post
    You are abit too generous with the 6 IMO.
    Possibly although I didn't give out many 6's

    Regarding the marilith chain and spell storing ring.

    Both of these are extremely powerful items. The rarity of being able to obtain them generally keeps them from being too overpowered as you dont see entire groups with these. Quite honestly Id wear the marilith chain on my rog and forego evasion it is that good. The ring is almost a 50% increse in the spell point pool of any caster. These things are pretty game breaking.

    ESOS is probably the most deserving of the 6 rating. It is better than any two handed weapon for all content except elite devil boss raids. Trying to make any further two handed weapons with this item in game and have them balanced yet still useable is a design and balance nightmare.

    The claw set is my other 6. Many people may disagree with me here but I find that these just obsolete too many items that would be good otherwise. Epic Spectrals saw a huge hit here, as did bracers of the hunter. Both of which are very good and strongly designed items. Charged gauntlets were rendered fairly obsolete before they even came out.

    The other issue is with all melees wanting to get these and eventually having them it really hurts the threat tanking abilities of classes. The 20% threat will benefit a high dps toon as far as aggro generation much more than a threat based moderate dps character as its a % increase. I like the fact that tubine seems to be going away from the boring initmitanking role and moving to a threat based tank. However it just takes one person in a raid with this set to possibly render a threat tank unable to keep aggro.

    The red dragon scale armors were probably a typo I had no intention of rating them a 6 and am fixing now.

    As far as 6 rated items I am not screaming nerf them now devs or anything. I just feel that these overextend the power creep a bit much or cause issues with balance. I would understand their nerf but not necessarily calling for it.
    Last edited by LeLoric; 12-03-2010 at 07:18 PM.
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  9. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by KingofDiamondz View Post
    FYI the Epic wolf whistle has been changed. Epic Hound summon now lasts 5 minutes. Was a stealth change in update 7. You might want to re rate this item as 1min vs 5min makes this item much more useful.
    Thanks for the update I have changed this and rerated.
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  10. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by EyeRekon View Post
    I'd reduce the rating. You are right that Limbchopper is now available on lower-level khopesh now. Limpchopper does not work on any orange or red named. Not even the Epic Cleaver. And since Vorpal doesn't work on Epic mobs anyway this Epic weapon has far lesser utility for its ML.

    A suggested improvement is to make this have an Improved Limbchopper or something like that which either has a higher proc rate (not just natural 20) or can affect more kinds of mobs or has at least a slight chance of affecting a orange/red named. That may be too powerful though as this weapon is fairly easy to acquire the ingredients and craft.




    I know the existing screenshots say 1 minute, but I know I've seen one summoned that lasted for 5-10 like any normal summon. Screenshot may be stale, or description may be wrong. Of course I assume the CR:20+ Hound was summoned through an Epic Wolf Whistle - are there other ways one could be summoned?
    Yes the cleaver is not something overly exceptional but it still is an upgrade for any character that already carries a set of vorpals. As such it becomes a situationally used item that is usable by most melees. Vopals are still generally the best weapons in elite amrath and elite IQ for melees do to the amount of HP. Until there is no pointin using a vorpal ever I think these deserve a 3.

    Thanks for the info on the whistle I have updated the info and changed the rating
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  11. #31
    Community Member Aaxeyu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeLoric View Post
    Possibly although I didn't give out many 6's

    Regarding the marilith chain and spell storing ring.

    Both of these are extremely powerful items. The rarity of being able to obtain them generally keeps them from being too overpowered as you dont see entire groups with these. Quite honestly Id wear the marilith chain on my rog and forego evasion it is that good. The ring is almost a 50% increse in the spell point pool of any caster. These things are pretty game breaking.

    ESOS is probably the most deserving of the 6 rating. It is better than any two handed weapon for all content except elite devil boss raids. Trying to make any further two handed weapons with this item in game and have them balanced yet still useable is a design and balance nightmare.

    The claw set is my other 6. Many people may disagree with me here but I find that these just obsolete too many items that would be good otherwise. Epic Spectrals saw a huge hit here, as did bracers of the hunter. Both of which are very good and strongly designed items. Charged gauntlets were rendered fairly obsolete before they even came out.

    The other issue is with all melees wanting to get these and eventually having them it really hurts the threat tanking abilities of classes. The 20% threat will benefit a high dps toon as far as aggro generation much more than a threat based moderate dps character as its a % increase. I like the fact that tubine seems to be going away from the boring initmitanking role and moving to a threat based tank. However it just takes one person in a raid with this set to possibly render a threat tank unable to keep aggro.

    The red dragon scale armors were probably a typo I had no intention of rating them a 6 and am fixing now.

    As far as 6 rated items I am not screaming nerf them now devs or anything. I just feel that these overextend the power creep a bit much or cause issues with balance. I would understand their nerf but not necessarily calling for it.
    You got a good point about spellstoring ring, but the others I would not really call "overpowered"
    or "greatly overshadow other items".
    SoS, ofcourse, greatly overshadow all other weapons, but it allows THF to compete with TWF, and that's a good thing IMO.

  12. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aaxeyu View Post
    You got a good point about spellstoring ring, but the others I would not really call "overpowered"
    or "greatly overshadow other items".
    SoS, ofcourse, greatly overshadow all other weapons, but it allows THF to compete with TWF, and that's a good thing IMO.
    Balancing fighting styles is a good thing but doing it through gear is a bad thing. If the only way for thf to keep up with twf is through gear then those without the said gear are still at an extreme disadvantage.

    Also one of the benefits of thf is less weapons to get over twf but the ESOS takes this to extremes. Needing only one weapon for the vast majority of content versus a twf needing several sets of two weapons each while still doing the same amount of damage puts twf at a severe disadvantage. My biggest issue with the sos is it negates the need for pretty much all other two handed weapons. There is no such thing as a specialized thf weapon with ESOS in the game because those specialized weapons do less dmg than the ESOS.
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  13. #33
    Community Member Book_O_Dragons's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeLoric View Post
    Epic Sacred Band: Ring, Wis +6, Sacred Unless you are in desperate need of more turns and can’t really think of anyone who is this is a ml 20 +6 wis ring on its own. I think you can find better rings to go here. Rating: 1

    Epic Sacred Helm: Helm, Deathblock, Radiance Guard, Eternal Faith One of the best guards available in game and Deathblock make this a viable stand alone item. Even if only as a situational swap. Rating: 3.5

    Greater Divine Blessing: Epic Sacred Ring and Helm, Greater Devotion VIII Most healers by the time they get to 20 have several amrath clickie healing belts. Also many have crafted Greater Devo VIII onto a ring or on DT armor. This set bonus has really no value at all. Add to that the fact that one of the items is comepletely useless and prevents a tod set bonus and this is probably the worst of the fens epic sets. Rating: 1
    The epic doesn't give turns but IMO it should.
    wiki has no image so no confirm

  14. #34
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    Curious

    How come non of the epic Mabar items been included into this thread.

    Just wondering how you would rate it compared to other non event type
    items

  15. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by flipstre View Post
    Curious

    How come non of the epic Mabar items been included into this thread.

    Just wondering how you would rate it compared to other non event type
    items
    Because i just never did them lol they werent on my list of epics as i went through them ill add later thanks.
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  16. #36

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    Not sure if the mabar items should even count.

    1) Yes, you need to complete 1-2 epic quests in order to get the token to upgrade from L16 to L20, but since the tokens are BtA, you can have an epic mabar item on a character who isn't (and has never been) level 20 yet.

    2) No item-shard-scroll-seal nonsense. I think part of the purpose of this list is to identify those items where you would want to go through the hassle of scraping up all of those ingredients.

    3) Mabar items are not available for 95% of the year (and who knows, may never appear again), the other epics have open season going all the time.
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  17. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by Matuse View Post
    Not sure if the mabar items should even count.

    1) Yes, you need to complete 1-2 epic quests in order to get the token to upgrade from L16 to L20, but since the tokens are BtA, you can have an epic mabar item on a character who isn't (and has never been) level 20 yet.

    2) No item-shard-scroll-seal nonsense. I think part of the purpose of this list is to identify those items where you would want to go through the hassle of scraping up all of those ingredients.

    3) Mabar items are not available for 95% of the year (and who knows, may never appear again), the other epics have open season going all the time.
    Meh someone asked for it and it's not a bad thing to have them to compare to regular epic items if you are wanting to decide on the viability of an item it's best to have enough items out there to compare it to.
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  18. #38
    Community Member Aaxeyu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeLoric View Post
    Balancing fighting styles is a good thing but doing it through gear is a bad thing. If the only way for thf to keep up with twf is through gear then those without the said gear are still at an extreme disadvantage.

    Also one of the benefits of thf is less weapons to get over twf but the ESOS takes this to extremes. Needing only one weapon for the vast majority of content versus a twf needing several sets of two weapons each while still doing the same amount of damage puts twf at a severe disadvantage. My biggest issue with the sos is it negates the need for pretty much all other two handed weapons. There is no such thing as a specialized thf weapon with ESOS in the game because those specialized weapons do less dmg than the ESOS.
    I look at it this way: It's better to balance with gear than have no balance at all.

  19. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aaxeyu View Post
    I look at it this way: It's better to balance with gear than have no balance at all.
    True but think of it this way.

    Dev 1: Hey I'd like to give THF a little boost here. What do you think about this idea.

    Dev 2: Not a bad idea but wouldn't that be too strong with ESOS.

    Dev 1: yeah probably but we could always tone done the ESOS

    Dev 2: You wanna go tell the forum mobs we are nerfing ESOS.

    Dev 1: Hell no that's why you are the lead dev.


    Couple that with the fact that designing other two handed weapons further down the road is virtually impossible to make a balanced yet useable item and you've got a serious hinderance to game design in the form of ESOS. Any weapon or item that is a hindrance to good game design is probably in need of a little nerf.
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  20. #40
    Community Member Thriand's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeLoric View Post

    Epic Helm of Frost: Helm, Cha +7, Greater Cold Resist, Polar Ray (CL 20, 3 charges, 3/rest), Greater Might of the Abashai, Green or Yellow Slot? Got some conflicting info on whether this is a green or yellow slot and neither provides a screenshot image. With the green slot this is a really stellar stand alone item, without it’s still a +7 cha helm so nothing to laugh at. Rating: Green Slot 4, Yellow Slot 3

    The helm of frost has a yellow slot on it, I have an already slotted one if you absolutely need a screenshot
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