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  1. #1
    Community Member XaatXuun's Avatar
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    Default got a Rog Alt thinking of splashing

    I started a Alt a while back that I had forgotten about and the other day decided to play him.
    It was something I wanted to try out and to have fun with, never really had a set plan. Now I have done other builds where I had splashed rogue, but this one was to be a 2hF Rogue. I have done fighter/rog, and ranger/rog, so I am not looking at any of those two, and I do kinda wanna splash in something for this fun build.

    What are the thoughts of splashing in Barb ?
    I have had some unpleasant starts with Barbarians so never was a fan, so maybe here I might like it, I forgot the Attributes, but it was a str build
    The other thought was splashing in Cleric , mainly for cure and bull wands . But my thinking keeps me wanting to toss in barb. I dunno why , maybe I am thinking for some resistance enhancements and some running speed ??

  2. #2
    Community Member Consumer's Avatar
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    If you've gone past 2 Rogue keep it pure, otherwise 18 Barb/ 2 Rogue is good.

  3. #3
    Community Member kamimitsu's Avatar
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    The new rogue capstone is so very nice, it's hard to recommend splashing out of pure rogue now. On a 2HF it is slightly less appealing, but still pretty darn nice.
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  4. #4
    Community Member XaatXuun's Avatar
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    I already have a pure Rogue started, well restarted many times but finally have one up to lvl 5 (actually L4 and banking). But this one is L2, and thought before I go further I see what kind of option I could go that have never tried (started) yet.
    I'm going to login real quick so I can note down what his stats are, I honestly don't remember, I believe I kept Int at 12 or maybe 13 for search and DD reasons, but I can't remember if I did 16 or 17 str with this Human Rog. Con was 14 (that's a standard I start all creations, never less, but sometimes more)
    I'm pretty sure I want to stick with the 2hand weapon

    Will the barbarian help a lot with the 2hand ?

    what about a splash of Cleric just for Cure, Fox and bull wands ? and continue the fun as barbarian ?

  5. #5
    Community Member XaatXuun's Avatar
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    okay these were the Attributes I have, I guess my Int was higher then I thought

    Str 16
    Dex 12
    Con 14
    Int 14
    Wis 10
    Cha 8

    Damn, forgot to look which feats I grabbed at creation but would guess Toughness and THF
    still have 5 AP to spend, I think I wait till I decide what to splash in, have spent 3 points I remember one was Skill boost, I don't recall what the other 2 were.

  6. #6
    Community Member XaatXuun's Avatar
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    I'm not sure if I need to be able to do L2 spells, just to use the wands like Bulls str, and Fox cunning, So just encase I did toyed with the Character Planner to get some ideas.

    Still have more playing with but what about splashing in Wiz ?

    I was using the same attributes that I already have, and already as lvl 2 Rog, then going from there. Some ideas were popping in my head as I was doing this, but maybe for another , for now just working from what I have.

    Uhmm, was still going to focus on Rogue and melee, not so much on the spells, but thought well a couple Offensive spells may not be too bad, but mainly would be getting the buffing.

    This is what I came up with, I stopped at LvL6 , because with what I had selected, I could take another road, like fighter, or Barbarian the rest of the way, to enhance the melee side of it, but too unsure. I need a better BAB, that's for sure

    Code:
    Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.5.1
    DDO Character Planner Home Page
    
    Rogw/splash for wand usage
    Level 6 Neutral Good Human Male
    (3 Rogue \ 3 Wizard) 
    Hit Points: 80
    Spell Points: 259 
    BAB: 3\3
    Fortitude: 4
    Reflex: 5
    Will: 4
    
                      Starting          Feat/Enhancement
    Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
    (28 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 6)
    Strength             16                    17
    Dexterity            12                    13
    Constitution         14                    15
    Intelligence         14                    15
    Wisdom               10                    10
    Charisma              8                     8
    
                      Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                     Base Skills         Modified Skills
    Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 6)
    Balance               5                     7
    Bluff                -1                    -1
    Concentration         3                     5
    Diplomacy            -1                    -1
    Disable Device        6                    12
    Haggle                1                     3
    Heal                  2                     2
    Hide                  1                     1
    Intimidate           -1                    -1
    Jump                  7                     8
    Listen                0                     0
    Move Silently         5                     6
    Open Lock             5                    11
    Perform              n/a                   n/a
    Repair                2                     2
    Search                6                    11
    Spot                  4                     9
    Swim                  3                     3
    Tumble                5                     6
    Use Magic Device      3                     6
    
    Level 1 (Rogue)
    Feat: (Selected) Toughness
    Feat: (Human Bonus) Two Handed Fighting
    Enhancement: Human Versatility I
    Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device I
    
    
    Level 2 (Rogue)
    Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I
    
    
    Level 3 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Mental Toughness
    Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons
    Enhancement: Rogue Balance I
    Enhancement: Wizard Energy of the Scholar I
    
    
    Level 4 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 5 (Wizard)
    Enhancement: Human Versatility II
    Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
    Enhancement: Wizard Concentration I
    Enhancement: Rogue Open Lock I
    Enhancement: Wizard Intelligence I
    
    
    Level 6 (Rogue)
    Feat: (Selected) Martial Weapon Proficiency: Greataxe
    Enhancement: Human Adaptability Constitution I
    Enhancement: Wizard Wand Mastery I
    this was just a dry run using the character planner, but if this dry run is good then I'll go with it, I am sure more adjustments will be needed

  7. #7
    Community Member Maxelcat's Avatar
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    rogue 18 fighter 2 gives you a lot of feats then you can get rid of them if necessary later.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tolero View Post
    Hireling: "Oh god, you're in trouble!" *heal fail* "Oh god, you're still in trouble!!" *heal fail* "Nooooo I will save you!!!" *heal fail* etc. but to the player, it just looked like the hireling was standing there staring off into space. He's not staring...he's thinking...REALLY hard.

  8. #8
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Standard caveat: multiclassing should be planned in advance.

    New rogue capstone is good enough that there's very little incentive to splashing on a rogue. You might want to consider a rogue 13 / 6 / 1 or 13 / 7 build. There are some fun-looking rogue / monk builds using staves out there; should be even better w/U7 now that Ninja Spy / Acrobat combo will be doable (in theory). You could also do rogue / barb, but bear in mind you can't disable traps while Raged.

  9. #9
    Community Member XaatXuun's Avatar
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    yeah I hate rage, I think that is why I am turned off on the idea of splashing in barb.
    I already have a Pure Rogue I am playing, also Fighter/Rog and Ranger/Rog, Pure Fighter, and a Pure Bard (but the bard is just for Sales)
    I have thought of going Rogue/Fig, but I'm afraid without thinking I may end up as a fig/rog, which I already have.

    I don't own Monk, and no longer a VIP. I was not happy playing the monk, too many buttons to press.

    I'm dealing with latency due to having a Satellite connection, so Sneaking does not always work for me, my Rogue I do have is Acrobat. Sometimes that latency works in my favor, but too few .
    So I kinda need to stay with Melee, maybe I have started all I can already that works for me.

    I'm not seeing any yay's or Nay's about that Rog/Wiz idea, but also not seeing any suggestions to improve on it. I have only 3 levels of experience with the Wizard, so I am unsure if that experience is enough to try out the build.
    I bought Vet status, I could go on another server and give it a try, and come up with my own conclusion

  10. #10
    Community Member Therigar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XaatXuun View Post
    Str 16
    Dex 12
    Con 14
    Int 14
    Wis 10
    Cha 8
    Your stat distribution is good. INT is not too high. You'll find that you want the INT if you intend to do rogue trap stuff.

    Going with barbarian in an 18/2 split (barb 18/rog 2) is a great class combination. Barbarians get a bit more skill points so it is easier to keep the Search & Disable skills maxed out and also grab things you may want. FWIW, Intimidate is a rogue skill and you'll be able to max it out if you wanted to be... intimidating.

    The reflex save with rogue giving you evasion is a top reason to go with 18/2.

    BTW, if you are L1 rogue then switch to barbarian for the next several levels. Take the 2d rogue level relatively late to top off any skills that really need attention.

    Of course, stat increases always in STR.

  11. #11
    Community Member Therigar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XaatXuun View Post
    yeah I hate rage, I think that is why I am turned off on the idea of splashing in barb.
    So don't use it. Get the extra HP, fast movement, huge HP, etc.

    What I do is carry lesser restore potions. That way I can rage, drink a pot and I'm all better -- no cool down.

  12. #12
    Community Member eonfreon's Avatar
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    Rog/Wizards are great fun but usually it's 18 Wiz/ 2 Rog and planned as a Wizard with Trap skills and full UMD.
    So your starting stats on your current build is lacking the max Int most Wiz/Rog's do.
    Also Evasion isn't quite needed for awhile so most Wiz/rog's wait to get that 2nd level of Rogue for awhile, so that they are not as far behind in Spell Selection (most specifically at low levels most Wiz's want Haste and Firewall asap, plus Blur, heroism etc) and to help even out any skills that may have lacked behind (if you know the game well Spot can lag but Search and Disable are mandatory if you want trap skills, and UMD generally is best maxxed out- at least by Cap to make using those no-fail Heal scrolls a sure-thing).
    I would suggest scrapping this one and starting a new one, maybe planning it out a bit on the Planner.
    But it could work, I've seen many crazy builds that work nicely.

    One thing, there's really no point to splashing Cleric. Unless you plan on doing a lesser reincarnate later to get rid of it, sicne you'll have enough UMD to use most useful Cleric wands soon enough.

  13. #13
    Founder Sani_Medicor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XaatXuun View Post
    I have thought of going Rogue/Fig, but I'm afraid without thinking I may end up as a fig/rog, which I already have.

    I don't own Monk, and no longer a VIP. I was not happy playing the monk, too many buttons to press.
    I started leveling a rogue/fighter today, but I'm still not sure the fighter levels are worth it. I totally agree with your opinion on monk...too many buttons...of course I don't have enough on my build right now. I'm used to having a cure spell and wand on my bar. lol

  14. #14
    Community Member XaatXuun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Therigar View Post
    Your stat distribution is good. INT is not too high. You'll find that you want the INT if you intend to do rogue trap stuff.

    Going with barbarian in an 18/2 split (barb 18/rog 2) is a great class combination. Barbarians get a bit more skill points so it is easier to keep the Search & Disable skills maxed out and also grab things you may want. FWIW, Intimidate is a rogue skill and you'll be able to max it out if you wanted to be... intimidating.

    The reflex save with rogue giving you evasion is a top reason to go with 18/2.

    BTW, if you are L1 rogue then switch to barbarian for the next several levels. Take the 2d rogue level relatively late to top off any skills that really need attention.

    Of course, stat increases always in STR.
    the character is already L2 Rogue. This character was actually a test run, I forgot what it was about was something I could see after I created, because I couldn't see it on the Character planner. This was also before I bought Vet status, so it is tempting to just place what good gear they have in the shared bank and roll a new one.
    think I'll go read up on that Barb/Rog and see what they are doing with it, Oh and yeah the Int thing, I really wish I could get more Int, just can't do it with a 28pt build, I will need +tombs, That was the thing between the character planner I was having problems with, because I wasn't seeing the added stats from gear showing up, and now I see some things require a base Stat score, and not an over all stat score, Bummers.
    oh and funny thing you mentioned there about Intimidating Rogue, not that I did it intentional, but he kinda is one, kinda liked it, which probably was where I got the idea of maybe splashing in Barbarian from

    Quote Originally Posted by Therigar View Post
    So don't use it. Get the extra HP, fast movement, huge HP, etc.

    What I do is carry lesser restore potions. That way I can rage, drink a pot and I'm all better -- no cool down.
    Curious question now, I wonder if I splashed 2 levels of fighter in for the extra feats, If that would help, If I plan to not use rage ? so something like a 16Barb/2Rog/2Fig

    Quote Originally Posted by eonfreon View Post
    Rog/Wizards are great fun but usually it's 18 Wiz/ 2 Rog and planned as a Wizard with Trap skills and full UMD.
    So your starting stats on your current build is lacking the max Int most Wiz/Rog's do.
    Also Evasion isn't quite needed for awhile so most Wiz/rog's wait to get that 2nd level of Rogue for awhile, so that they are not as far behind in Spell Selection (most specifically at low levels most Wiz's want Haste and Firewall asap, plus Blur, heroism etc) and to help even out any skills that may have lacked behind (if you know the game well Spot can lag but Search and Disable are mandatory if you want trap skills, and UMD generally is best maxxed out- at least by Cap to make using those no-fail Heal scrolls a sure-thing).
    I would suggest scrapping this one and starting a new one, maybe planning it out a bit on the Planner.
    But it could work, I've seen many crazy builds that work nicely.
    yeah I have toyed with the planner with it, the ugly part is having the low BAB.
    the only reason for splashing Wizard was to get the L2 spells for buffing, and I could just use the Find Hidden doors spell.
    The low BAB is not going to help me stay as a Melee user and would be more dependent of spells.
    Only reason I could see splashing in Rogue on the wizard is for the Evasion and sneak attack
    Only reason I see why I wanna splash Wiz on the rog is for wand usage and L2 buffing spells

    But what I was thinking was 14Fighter or 14Barbarian /3rogue/3wizard. I'm not sure if at the later levels if I screwed myself 3 levels spent as a Wizard

    My thoughts of going Fighter was for the extra feats
    My thoughts of Barbarian was for the speed
    My thoughts for Rogue was for the Rogue skills, but like Therigar mentioned, my Int is kinda low for trap monkey business which is where I got the idea of splashing in Wizard

    -------------
    after a lil toying with the idea of and barb/fig/rog this is what I came up with, this would be a new roll, because I decided to get spring attack, and needed 13 dex base to get it, other then that everything was the same.

    Code:
    Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.5.1
    DDO Character Planner Home Page
    
    RogL2 Ver1.1 splash test
    Level 10 Neutral Good Human Male
    (2 Fighter \ 6 Barbarian \ 2 Rogue) 
    Hit Points: 216
    Spell Points: 0 
    BAB: 9\9\14
    Fortitude: 11
    Reflex: 7
    Will: 1
    
                      Starting          Feat/Enhancement
    Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
    (28 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 10)
    Strength             16                    19
    Dexterity            13                    14
    Constitution         14                    17
    Intelligence         14                    14
    Wisdom                9                     9
    Charisma              8                     8
    
                      Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                     Base Skills         Modified Skills
    Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 10)
    Balance               5                     8
    Bluff                -1                    -1
    Concentration         2                     3
    Diplomacy            -1                    -1
    Disable Device        6                    14
    Haggle                3                     4
    Heal                  1                     1.5
    Hide                  1                     2
    Intimidate           -1                     3
    Jump                  7                     9
    Listen               -1                    -1
    Move Silently         5                     7
    Open Lock             5                    12
    Perform              n/a                   n/a
    Repair                2                     2
    Search                6                    14
    Spot                  3                     6
    Swim                  3                     4
    Tumble                5                     6
    Use Magic Device      3                    12
    
    Level 1 (Rogue)
    Feat: (Selected) Toughness
    Feat: (Human Bonus) Two Handed Fighting
    Enhancement: Human Versatility I
    Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device I
    
    
    Level 2 (Rogue)
    Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery I
    Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I
    
    
    Level 3 (Barbarian)
    Feat: (Selected) Dodge
    Enhancement: Barbarian Toughness I
    
    
    Level 4 (Fighter)
    Ability Raise: STR
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons
    Enhancement: Fighter Critical Accuracy I
    Enhancement: Human Versatility II
    Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
    Enhancement: Barbarian Intimidate I
    Enhancement: Rogue Open Lock I
    Enhancement: Rogue Search I
    Enhancement: Rogue Spot I
    
    
    Level 5 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Mobility
    Enhancement: Human Adaptability Constitution I
    Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
    
    
    Level 6 (Barbarian)
    Feat: (Selected) Spring Attack
    Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
    Enhancement: Barbarian Constitution I
    
    
    Level 7 (Barbarian)
    Enhancement: Barbarian Improved Damage Reduction I
    
    
    Level 8 (Barbarian)
    Ability Raise: STR
    Enhancement: Barbarian Toughness II
    
    
    Level 9 (Barbarian)
    Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Handed Fighting
    Enhancement: Rogue Balance I
    
    
    Level 10 (Barbarian)
    Enhancement: Racial Toughness III
    Enhancement: Barbarian Constitution II
    After doing this or actually by the time I got to L6 ( W/Character Planner), this looks great for the low levels, but I am concern of the later levels, I only took it to lvl 10 because I do not have any experience beyond ML9 (well a couple ML10's[resulting in Epic fails because I was trying to solo a new map as an 8]) Since I would be going with out using Rage ( that's not set in stone that I wouldn't) The type of build I was creating here, I would get no Prestige from any of the Classes.
    Kinda maybe a fail build after reaching mid levels, I dunno it could be an awesome build, but looks good for the low levels . I have 4 other characters I play so still have time to think of something to splash into the Rogue and still be fun and not something I have already tried or done
    Last edited by XaatXuun; 10-05-2010 at 01:25 PM. Reason: new info added

  15. #15
    Community Member Therigar's Avatar
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    Here are some things to consider:

    Splash 1 level of ranger for a) cure wand use and b) bow strength. Cure wands are cheaper per use than cure potions and it is handy to wand whip since you don't need to stop moving. When you drink a potion you have to stop moving and mobs catch up to you. When you wand whip you slow down but are still moving, so mobs tend to stay behind you. Next, you occassionally want to shoot stuff because it is perched up where you can't get to it or because you can perch where it can't get to you. Bow strength gives added damage.

    Splash 3 levels of wizard and take the extend metamagic feat. This gives short duration shield, nightshield, jump, merfolk's and blur (swap jump & merfolk's as needed). It also gives all arcane wands so you can fireball, magic missile, protect from elements, etc.

    Splash 2 levels of fighter for a) 2 feats and b) a +1 STR enhancement.

    Since you are already L2 with rogue I'd just go ahead with whatever melee class you really want. 18/2 splits work with paladin, barbarian, fighter, ranger, cleric, favored soul, wizard and sorcerer. It works with monk too but you've said you don't want to play monk.

    Obviously your alignment may dictate some of the choices unless you get a realignment from the Turbine store.

    FWIW, don't split stat increases between STR and CON. Just put them into STR. Your CON will be fine as it is and you'll pick up CON with barbarian enhancements.

    Lastly, IMO 18/2 barbarian/rogue is your best option since you have already done the ranger & fighter options.

  16. #16
    Founder Sani_Medicor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Therigar View Post
    Splash 1 level of ranger for a) cure wand use and b) bow strength. Cure wands are cheaper per use than cure potions and it is handy to wand whip since you don't need to stop moving. When you drink a potion you have to stop moving and mobs catch up to you. When you wand whip you slow down but are still moving, so mobs tend to stay behind you. Next, you occassionally want to shoot stuff because it is perched up where you can't get to it or because you can perch where it can't get to you. Bow strength gives added damage.
    I was considering doing that with mine...current plan is 13rog/7ftr...you get another toughness, haste boost, and stunning blow enhancement at fighter 7 though...not sure it's worth giving those up for wands.

  17. #17
    Community Member Therigar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sani_Medicor View Post
    I was considering doing that with mine...current plan is 13rog/7ftr...you get another toughness, haste boost, and stunning blow enhancement at fighter 7 though...not sure it's worth giving those up for wands.
    Depends on what you did with UMD. A 7 level splash makes me wonder why you bothered with rogue to start with. 13/7 seems excessively deep.

  18. #18
    Founder Sani_Medicor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Therigar View Post
    Depends on what you did with UMD. A 7 level splash makes me wonder why you bothered with rogue to start with. 13/7 seems excessively deep.
    I did it mainly for acrobat II, but I've got full rogue skills and umd.

  19. #19
    Community Member XaatXuun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sani_Medicor View Post
    I was considering doing that with mine...current plan is 13rog/7ftr...you get another toughness, haste boost, and stunning blow enhancement at fighter 7 though...not sure it's worth giving those up for wands.
    I just looked at your post Drow Acrobat Kensai and that kinda has me thinking agin about this character I have.
    I wasn't a Half-Orc fan on PnP, but DDO is not D&D that I played, so I may just play an Half-Orc.
    I think I'll keep an eye how you progress with your build, looks interesting. Maybe I'll try the same but with my Human version I have.
    I'm still kinda in conflict if I want to splash a Wiz for Buffing wands, or Ranger for Cure wands, I mean having 4 L1 wizard spells on top of that is tempting.

    For now I need to work on Fav 4 TP, so this lil project of mine is kinda on hold, my Fighter and Ranger/Rogue is getting close to wanting to get Giant Hold, I think that was the the adventure pack I was wanting, eh .. sleepy at the moment I am sure if it wasn't the moment I shut the comp off I'll remember and shout the name out loud

  20. #20
    Founder Sani_Medicor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XaatXuun View Post
    I just looked at your post Drow Acrobat Kensai and that kinda has me thinking agin about this character I have.
    I just posted an updated warforged version with a wizard splash.

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