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Thread: Please Clarify

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    Community Member Khroc's Avatar
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    Default Please Clarify

    So if I am wearing 6 Dust guards on my barbarian.. there is not an increased chance for them to go off? If i am wearing one guard, it should be the same as if i was wearing 6 Dust guards? I know they cant go off on the same hit but isnt there a better chance of one of the guards going off if you have multiples of the same one? Not that they would proc at the same time but with each hit there is a better chance of one the guards going off? So if the proc rate is 2% per guard, one of the guards should proc 12% of the time? pls clarify...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Khroc View Post
    So if I am wearing 6 Dust guards on my barbarian.. there is not an increased chance for them to go off? If i am wearing one guard, it should be the same as if i was wearing 6 Dust guards? I know they cant go off on the same hit but isnt there a better chance of one of the guards going off if you have multiples of the same one? Not that they would proc at the same time but with each hit there is a better chance of one the guards going off? So if the proc rate is 2% per guard, one of the guards should proc 12% of the time? pls clarify...

    negative. each one has it's own chance.
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    I am not aware of any specific testing with dust guard, but with lightning storm guard, it doesn't make any difference if you're wearing 1 or 2. So I'd assume it's the same with Dust (which would be coherent with latest post by Eladrin about how guards don't stack), and it's pointless to wear more than 1.

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    It still seems it is unclear among the player base whether they stack or not. I'm not saying they do or don't, but if they don't, think of it this way.

    They may just apply a buff to your character. By putting on a Dust Guard item, you get the Dust Guard buff on you, and it does its thing. You can't have a buff applied more than once, so multiple Dust Guard items might still result in just one Dust Guard buff on you.

    It's like casting Fire Shield from a scroll, then a clicky, then from your spell points...you still end up with just one Fire Shield on you.

    Again, I have NO idea if that's the case, but it's one way to think of why they may not stack nor have separate chances to proc.

    Also, it seems horribly inefficient code to me to check through every item you're wearing every time you are hit (or hit something else) to check for applicable on-hit effects. It seems more likely to me that items put a buff on you, and then your buff list is checked.

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    Community Member Janth's Avatar
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    If they are independent then for one dust guard there should be a 98% that it does not go off, for 2 there should be a 96% that neither goes off, and for 6 there should be a 88.6% chance that none of them go off. There should be a 10.8% that more than one goes off. This is theoretical, but should be easy to test to determine if they do in fact stack.

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    Community Member Khroc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tihocan View Post
    I am not aware of any specific testing with dust guard, but with lightning storm guard, it doesn't make any difference if you're wearing 1 or 2. So I'd assume it's the same with Dust (which would be coherent with latest post by Eladrin about how guards don't stack), and it's pointless to wear more than 1.
    well .. based on this you are flat out wrong ,,,

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n33sAMpCZZs

    thats why I am asking this question.. It makes sense that each guard has a chance to proc for each hit and that no they cant go off at the same time but the more guards, the better the chance to proc.. that makes sense...

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    Community Member Khroc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janth View Post
    If they are independent then for one dust guard there should be a 98% that it does not go off, for 2 there should be a 96% that neither goes off, and for 6 there should be a 88.6% chance that none of them go off. There should be a 10.8% that more than one goes off. This is theoretical, but should be easy to test to determine if they do in fact stack.
    That makes sense... thank you..

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    Quote Originally Posted by Khroc View Post
    well .. based on this you are flat out wrong ,,,

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n33sAMpCZZs
    If you read the whole thread related to this video, you'll see it's really not clear what it actually shows.
    In this thread you'll also find data showing that Concordant Opposition stacks between item and weapon, but you can't put Dust guard on a weapon.
    You'll also find data showing that multiple Concordant Opposition items don't stack at all. I made my own tests with CO and Lightning Storm Guard items, none of them appeared to stack in any way (and by stack I mean "each has its own chance").

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    Community Member Khroc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tihocan View Post
    If you read the whole thread related to this video, you'll see it's really not clear what it actually shows.
    In this thread you'll also find data showing that Concordant Opposition stacks between item and weapon, but you can't put Dust guard on a weapon.
    You'll also find data showing that multiple Concordant Opposition items don't stack at all. I made my own tests with CO and Lightning Storm Guard items, none of them appeared to stack in any way (and by stack I mean "each has its own chance").

    so the video lies?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Khroc View Post
    so the video lies?
    In short, yes. It's all been beaten to death in that thread though, feel free to refer to it if you want details

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    Community Member Khroc's Avatar
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    how many l strike guards do u have that you tested this on? Did u test this in pvp?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Khroc View Post
    how many l strike guards do u have that you tested this on? Did u test this in pvp?
    I posted my results here.

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    Community Member Khroc's Avatar
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    k thx.. i just did a quick test myself on 2 l storm guards and i got the same results... thx

    dont like the result. It makes sense that the more of one you have one, the more chance to proc you should have ... oh well
    Last edited by Khroc; 03-26-2010 at 10:28 AM.

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    Unfortunately the thread showing "multiple concordant opposition (stacking) evidence" is just flat out wrong. The OP of that thread refuses to change his stance when it's been proven his data is altered. Just read the last few pages and you'll understand that like guards will not, and never stack. The devs have implied this, and even went as far to say that if they actually DID stack, it is not intended.

    It appears that a weapon and an accessory stack... for the time being.

    But to be honest, just this fact that multiple guards don't stack is more than enough reason to implement GS deconstruction.

    I was going to mention this to you when you sent me a tell asking about going pure 20 barb, but I didn't want to start an entire argument (over the fact that you have a ton of lightning and dust guards) heh.
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    Community Member Khroc's Avatar
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    Sigh.. I need a few Cleansing shards now.. lol

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