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  1. #1
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    Default Build this Fighter (Challenge!)

    Looking for a 32 point character who is deadly with the longsword. Must be sturdy, and preferably quick (e.g. haste).

    Requirements:
    - Human or elf
    - Longsword
    - Either not squishy or bloody hard to hit
    - No tower shield
    - High damage output; not going to be competitive with a two hander or two weapon fighting, but should be a fair bit higher than your average sword and board.
    - NO KOPESH!

    Preferences:
    - Not TWF. I'll consider it, but prefer otherwise.
    - Kensai
    - No ranger or rogue levels. Once again, I'll consider it but prefer otherwise.

    Currently I'm working up the favour for 32 point builds (new to the game) and am looking to create a deadly yet hardy longsword based fighter. Until I unlock the 32 pointer I'm experimenting with various builds, with two viable ones appearing so far. The obvious human strength based sword/board pure fighter, and a dex based elven (dex without finesse, who would have thought?) fighter/wizard (4/1 currently, aiming at 11/5 for haste/displacement and both quicken/extend metas) who has been able to solo most elites so far. The former makes for a decent intimitank in groups whereas the latter has higher damage output and very high AC, though he's a two weapon fighter.

    Note that I do not care for end-game raid viability. Doing kobold assault solo (without a hireling) at level 3 was more fun than any raiding I've done in other MMOs. Also I don't require a full build with all feats/enhancements listed - bouncing ideas for feats, enhancements, race/class combos etc. to optimize the idea for this build will suffice and be appreciated.

    Oh and feel free to crush my hopes/dreams. Go!
    Last edited by Darlor; 05-18-2009 at 12:12 PM.

  2. #2
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    If you want to do real damage, you'll have to twf.

    I suggest 20 fighter, elf (not drow, regular elf), and throw in the elf dragonmarks, up to the second tier (if I remember correctly, the second tier of elf dragonmark is displacement).

    Extend spell, if I remember correctly, works on your elven dragonmarks and will make them last longer.

  3. #3
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    What do you mean by real damage? If you mean raid viable then I'm not concerned, but if you mean doing more than tickling my opponents, then that's something I need to consider.

    I'll definitely look into the dragonmark if I stay out of wizard (though in that case I won't have extend, mind you).

  4. #4
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    I do not know how you feel about monk splash builds but they are pretty hardy anyway the elf with displacement dragonmarks would be good for somebody who just likes playing the low to mid levels.. You should look into it.
    Norg Fighter12/Paladin6/Monk2, Jacquiej Cleric18/Monk1/Wiz1, Rabiez Bard16/Ranger3/Cleric1, Hangover Bard L20, Boomsticks Fighter12/Monk 6/Druid 2, Grumblegut Ranger8/Paladin6/Monk6, Rabidly Rogue L20, Furiously Rogue10/Monk6/Paladin4, Snowcones Cleric 12/Ranger 6/Monk 2, Norge Barbarian 12/FVS4/Rogue4. Guild:Prophets of The New Republic Khyber.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darlor View Post
    What do you mean by real damage? If you mean raid viable then I'm not concerned, but if you mean doing more than tickling my opponents, then that's something I need to consider.

    I'll definitely look into the dragonmark if I stay out of wizard (though in that case I won't have extend, mind you).
    Hitting things with one weapon is basically tickling them at end-game. It works to about level 10 but beyond that there's not much a point. Displacement brings a 50% miss chance before they swing on your AC, so it'll keep you pretty survivable.

    I may also be wrong about this one, but I think you can select extend spell as a feat (not a fighter bonus feat, just a regular feat you'd get at 1, 3, 6,.....) without taking a spellcaster level. Be a kensai and boost that DPS output, make sure to have haste boosts and extra dragonmark enhancements. Fighter 20 brings a 10% increase in attack speed, further boosting your damage output.

  6. #6
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    I looked into picking up a few levels of monk, but didn't see anything all that appealing. Also note that I do intend on taking this character into end-game, I just don't care for raids and don't mind being slightly "gimp" to create this build.


    If I go kensai, wouldn't I end up using power surges instead of the fighter haste? In light of that, I've taken human versatility (though won't be able to for elf, of course) since it helps intimidates, defense or offense as appropriate. I've taken the haste for my elf, however.

    How does a 1h build in elite STK or TR compare to level 10+ normal/hard? Does this mean that damage output without a 2h or TWF will be negligible?
    Last edited by Darlor; 05-18-2009 at 12:19 PM.

  7. #7
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darlor View Post
    Looking for a 32 point character who is deadly with the longsword. Must be sturdy, and preferably quick (e.g. haste).

    Requirements:
    - Human or elf
    - Longsword
    - Either not squishy or bloody hard to hit
    - No tower shield
    - High damage output; not going to be competitive with a two hander or two weapon fighting, but should be a fair bit higher than your average sword and board.

    Preferences:
    - Not TWF. I'll consider it, but prefer otherwise.
    - Kensai
    - No ranger or rogue levels. Once again, I'll consider it but prefer otherwise.

    Currently I'm working up the favour for 32 point builds (new to the game) and am looking to create a deadly yet hardy longsword based fighter. Until I unlock the 32 pointer I'm experimenting with various builds, with two viable ones appearing so far. The obvious human strength based sword/board pure fighter, and a dex based elven (dex without finesse, who would have thought?) fighter/wizard (4/1 currently, aiming at 11/5 for haste/displacement and both quicken/extend metas) who has been able to solo most elites so far. The former makes for a decent intimitank in groups whereas the latter has higher damage output and very high AC, though he's a two weapon fighter.

    Note that I do not care for end-game raid viability. Doing kobold assault solo (without a hireling) at level 3 was more fun than any raiding I've done in other MMOs. Also I don't require a full build with all feats/enhancements listed - bouncing ideas for feats, enhancements, race/class combos etc. to optimize the idea for this build will suffice and be appreciated.

    Oh and feel free to crush my hopes/dreams. Go!
    You'll want elf because they get bonuses with longswords..

    Since you're going fighter, you'll have lots of feats, so get at least the first two dragonmarks, since the 2nd one is displacement (50% chance the bad-guys will miss you - this is very very good)

    Max out STR, get a high CON... don't worry too much about Dex, since you don't care about TWF... Get a 12 INT, so Combat Expertise (and Improved Trip) is a possibility down the road.

    Pretty straight-forward... Get the Weapon Specialization Feats for more damage... Get Power Attack... Stunning Blow is a good feat... Haste Boosts are a must... Kensai will work well a straight fighter like this, and the 20th level fighter capstone is very good...

    Your DPS WILL be sub-standard though, if you don't go TWF or THF... However, switching to a two-handed weapon is always an option, so don't worry about it.

    Why no tower shield, by the way?
    Last edited by Thrudh; 05-18-2009 at 12:19 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago. Note - This was posted in 10/2013
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by TedSandyman View Post
    Some people brag about how fast they finished the game. I cant think of a stupider thing to brag about. Or in this game, going from level 1 to level 30 in two days, or however long it takes. I can't even begin to imagine what drives a person to think that is fun. You are ignoring all of the content and options and going for sheer speed. It is like going to a museum and bragging about how fast you made it through. Or bragging about how fast you finished a good steak.

  8. #8
    Community Member Kanamycin's Avatar
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    Wink

    you may not be looking for end game/ raid viability but some builds will not even perform decently when they reach gianthold.

  9. #9
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    Personally I think he should go for TWF since it's so easy with the elf bonus to dexterity and a cheap +1 tome. If he has access to a +2, even better, because it'll bring more hit points with a con boost.

    If I were making this type of build I wouldn't want a shield, and I definitely wouldn't spend build points on INT for Combat Expertise. I'd keep the power attack on and focus on killing things before they kill me.

  10. #10
    Community Member spifflove's Avatar
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    Default Retribution Rogue

    Elf

    Rogue 18/Paladin2

    16 + levels
    16
    12
    14
    08
    12

    Feats:
    SA line
    IC slash
    toughness
    Whirlwind attack
    optional

    Enhancements
    Elf longsword
    Paladin longsword
    racial toughness
    others optional

    Favored lowbie weapon: Retribution (for weapon plus str plus 13d6 damage)
    Last edited by spifflove; 05-18-2009 at 12:22 PM.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darlor View Post
    If I go kensai, wouldn't I end up using power surges instead of the fighter haste? In light of that, I've taken human versatility (though won't be able to for elf, of course) since it helps intimidates, defense or offense as appropriate. I've taken the haste for my elf, however.

    How does a 1h build in elite STK or TR compare to level 10+ normal/hard? Does this mean that damage output without a 2h or TWF will be negligible?
    You'd use both. More boosts = more damage. Also, I also wouldn't bother with intimidate for this type of build either.

    Comparing a 1hander in STK or TR to a 1hander in end-game is like comparing Paris Hilton to the Pope.

  12. #12
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aspenor View Post
    If I were making this type of build I wouldn't want a shield, and I definitely wouldn't spend build points on INT for Combat Expertise. I'd keep the power attack on and focus on killing things before they kill me.

    You would never make this kind of build....

    I suggest an INT of 12, because that leaves the option open.. Combat Expertise (+5 to your AC) has it's uses especially for a Shield-using character, and Improved Trip can be quite useful too. A monster on it's back can't fight back...

    This guy is not looking for a max DPS, raid-ready character... Improved Trip and Stunning Blow are fun tactical feats that make playing a fighter fun throughout the game (especially the low-mid levels)
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago. Note - This was posted in 10/2013
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by TedSandyman View Post
    Some people brag about how fast they finished the game. I cant think of a stupider thing to brag about. Or in this game, going from level 1 to level 30 in two days, or however long it takes. I can't even begin to imagine what drives a person to think that is fun. You are ignoring all of the content and options and going for sheer speed. It is like going to a museum and bragging about how fast you made it through. Or bragging about how fast you finished a good steak.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thrudh View Post
    You'll want elf because they get bonuses with longswords..

    Since you're going fighter, you'll have lots of feats, so get at least the first two dragonmarks, since the 2nd one is displacement (50% chance the bad-guys will miss you - this is very very good)

    Max out STR, get a high CON... don't worry too much about Dex, since you don't care about TWF... Get a 12 INT, so Combat Expertise (and Improved Trip) is a possibility down the road.

    Pretty straight-forward... Get the Weapon Specialization Feats for more damage... Get Power Attack... Stunning Blow is a good feat... Haste Boosts are a must... Kensai will work well a straight fighter like this, and the 20th level fighter capstone is very good...

    Your DPS WILL be sub-standard though, if you don't go TWF or THF... However, switching to a two-handed weapon is always an option, so don't worry about it.

    Why no tower shield, by the way?
    Substandard I can live with, and the build you've listed is the rough framework I've in mind. Now I'm looking for ways to optimize it. I was uncertain between elf/human since human can get +2 to strength from enhancements, and elves suffer the con penalty, though if I stay out of wizard the displacement will easily make up for that. However by hitting 5 levels of wizard I'll have that displacement without the feats, along with haste, +4 AC from shield if I TWF, along with other tricks (quickened invisibility for example, though I've no idea how that will actually work out).

    As for tower shield, it's largely a conceptual thing (far too encumbering) though I don't much care for the attack penalty either. Having said that, I'll carry one around if I need to intimitank for a group.

  14. #14
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aspenor View Post
    Also, I also wouldn't bother with intimidate for this type of build either.
    Why not? Intimidate is pretty useful even outside a raid setting... And since he plans on using a shield, and has plenty of fighter feats, he could even invest a bit in Shield Mastery (for occasional blocking)

    Comparing a 1hander in STK or TR to a 1hander in end-game is like comparing Paris Hilton to the Pope.
    You can do okay in end-game with just a single vorpal and a shield... Or a stunning blow, along with a burst weapon for the auto-crits. That self-cast displacement and a decent AC helps a lot.

    He can always pull out a two-hander for DPS on the end-boss...

    He gave us his parameters, he can do okay even inside those limits...
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago. Note - This was posted in 10/2013
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by TedSandyman View Post
    Some people brag about how fast they finished the game. I cant think of a stupider thing to brag about. Or in this game, going from level 1 to level 30 in two days, or however long it takes. I can't even begin to imagine what drives a person to think that is fun. You are ignoring all of the content and options and going for sheer speed. It is like going to a museum and bragging about how fast you made it through. Or bragging about how fast you finished a good steak.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thrudh View Post
    You would never make this kind of build....

    I suggest an INT of 12, because that leaves the option open.. Combat Expertise (+5 to your AC) has it's uses especially for a Shield-using character, and Improved Trip can be quite useful too. A monster on it's back can't fight back...

    This guy is not looking for a max DPS, raid-ready character... Improved Trip and Stunning Blow are fun tactical feats that make playing a fighter fun throughout the game (especially the low-mid levels)
    That's about right, and I do plan on having an int score sufficient for CE (especially if I go into wizard, for obvious reasons).

    How does improved trip/stunning blow work in the level 10-16 adventures?

    And to Spifflove - hadn't even considered anything of that sort, but I'll have to look into what one would end up with such a build.

  16. #16
    Community Member rezo's Avatar
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    Remember there is a lot of stuff to get through before you get to end game there tiger.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
    No one that throws together a bunch of numbers and calls it fact is going to give you and real accurate answer, there's too many variables and it's all biased towards there own personal outlooks on how it should be, not how it is. Numbers are too easy to manipulate.
    So sad but true.

  17. #17
    Community Member rezo's Avatar
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    Oh yeah, this is a Challenge build, not cookie cutter build for end game.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
    No one that throws together a bunch of numbers and calls it fact is going to give you and real accurate answer, there's too many variables and it's all biased towards there own personal outlooks on how it should be, not how it is. Numbers are too easy to manipulate.
    So sad but true.

  18. #18
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    Default Never mind this line of thinking.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aspenor View Post
    Hitting things with one weapon is basically tickling them at end-game. It works to about level 10 but beyond that there's not much a point.
    This just isn't true. Fighting with two weapons has nothing to do with your ability to hit, or damage output per hit. It does affect the number of attacks possible, and therefore the SPEED with which you can take down a foe. What REALLY matters at end game is doing enough damage per attack and using the right weapon to get past the damage resistance that most end game mobs have.

    Keeping all this in mind, if you are going to pass on TWF, you need to consider that it will take you longer to defeat any given monster, and you would be advised to compensate for that with tactics, good twitch skills, REAL high AC, displacement, fortification, massive numbers of hit points and self-healing, ect....

    Another truth is that most TWF are also using most, if not all of the damage avoidance techniques listed above.

    There are 3 main variables for success in this game (IMHO). They are 1) build 2) gear and 3) the player (ie: tactics and twitch skills). When push comes to shove, spending time developing #3 can make up for any deficiencies with 1 and 2.

    Perhapsnost importantly, is doing what you have done prior to posting and deciding what playstyle suits you and what you want out of the game. That being done, the rest of this is academic. You'll be fine with whatever you end up as long as you stay true to the original vision.
    Valiant Accord

  19. #19
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darlor View Post
    Substandard I can live with, and the build you've listed is the rough framework I've in mind. Now I'm looking for ways to optimize it. I was uncertain between elf/human since human can get +2 to strength from enhancements, and elves suffer the con penalty, though if I stay out of wizard the displacement will easily make up for that. However by hitting 5 levels of wizard I'll have that displacement without the feats, along with haste, +4 AC from shield if I TWF, along with other tricks (quickened invisibility for example, though I've no idea how that will actually work out).

    As for tower shield, it's largely a conceptual thing (far too encumbering) though I don't much care for the attack penalty either. Having said that, I'll carry one around if I need to intimitank for a group.
    FYI, the human stat bonuses don't stack... So you can only get +1 to two different stats, not +2 to one stat.

    A 15/5 fighter/wizard could be quite fun... I have a 11/5 ranger/wizard myself, and self-cast haste and displacement is very useful (Actually you should go 14/6, so you can get three 3rd level spells - haste, displacement, and rage)
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago. Note - This was posted in 10/2013
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by TedSandyman View Post
    Some people brag about how fast they finished the game. I cant think of a stupider thing to brag about. Or in this game, going from level 1 to level 30 in two days, or however long it takes. I can't even begin to imagine what drives a person to think that is fun. You are ignoring all of the content and options and going for sheer speed. It is like going to a museum and bragging about how fast you made it through. Or bragging about how fast you finished a good steak.

  20. #20
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darlor View Post
    How does improved trip/stunning blow work in the level 10-16 adventures?
    They still work, just not all the time... but they're free to use... My barbarian has Stunning Blow, and I still hit that key everytime I fight something... The bad guys may only be affected 20% of the time at end-game, but that's still means 20% easier fights(stunned mobs don't attack you, and you get auto-crits on them)
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago. Note - This was posted in 10/2013
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by TedSandyman View Post
    Some people brag about how fast they finished the game. I cant think of a stupider thing to brag about. Or in this game, going from level 1 to level 30 in two days, or however long it takes. I can't even begin to imagine what drives a person to think that is fun. You are ignoring all of the content and options and going for sheer speed. It is like going to a museum and bragging about how fast you made it through. Or bragging about how fast you finished a good steak.

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