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  1. #41
    Community Member sephiroth1084's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Angelus_dead View Post
    "anti-backstabbing"
    Useful links: A Guide to Using a Gamepad w/ DDO / All Caster Shroud, Hard Shroud, VoD, ToD Einhander, Elochka, Ferrumrym, Ferrumdermis, Ferrumshot, Ferrumblood, Ferrumender, Ferrumshadow, Ferrumschtik All proud officers of The Loreseekers. Except Bruucelee, he's a Sentinel!

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gratch View Post
    Can we still tumble in defensive mode? Or do we tumble at a partial rate too?
    That's a good point that was already mentioned when Defender of Syberis was announced. As-written, it implies a character in Defensive Stance would want to roll around to move faster, just like happens now with Docent of Defiance.

    Hopefully the devs will avoid that result, one way or another.

  3. #43
    The Front Side Gratch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sephiroth1084 View Post
    Gamepad to the rescue!
    You have the manual dexterity even on a gamepad to distinguish between 25, 33, and 50% rates? Now if you had said Thrustmaster XGY7 with separate Throttle pad... I might believe you. Or if the gamepad's minimal pressure slow walk is always 25% you'd be fine... though you wouldn't take advantage of stance 2 or 3.

    Quote Originally Posted by Angelus_dead View Post
    That's a good point that was already mentioned when Defender of Syberis was announced. As-written, it implies a character in Defensive Stance would want to roll around to move faster, just like happens now with Docent of Defiance.

    Hopefully the devs will avoid that result, one way or another.
    Though allowing a full tumble to give a faster speed while in stance does take care of the movement/catchup issue... just like with the docent. It's just not a pretty solution.

    Ed: This could be a use for the mostly worthless except as a stepping stone mobility feat... allows tumbling while in a stance.
    Last edited by Gratch; 02-13-2009 at 07:38 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan View Post
    DO NOT DO THIS. We are investigating.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gratch View Post
    Though allowing a full tumble to give a faster speed while in stance does take care of the movement/catchup issue... just like with the docent. It's just not a pretty solution.
    Yeah, if they continue to allow slowed people to Tumble move, they should at least change the animation, so that instead of somersaulting he make long hops. It still looks rather silly, but not as bad as rolling like a pillbug.

  5. #45
    Community Member Cold_Stele's Avatar
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    Questions for Borro, A_D and Henry (vyvy) -

    So do you like this?

    Is it what you were looking for?

  6. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cold Stele View Post
    Questions for Borro, A_D and Henry (vyvy) -

    So do you like this?

    Is it what you were looking for?
    I wasn't really sure what to expect, and for not costing much, it's a nice boost (most likely +7 AC most of the time that matters).

    As others have stated, the DR seems a bit low (especially with Stoneskin clickies being incredibly common, and 5/- from Ironskin chant in most raids anyways). As it is, I very rarely run out of Stoneskin charges, and there aren't that many places where 6/- DR would be better.

    The max dex bonuses seem a bit off too - a dwarven fighter in DT Fullplate can expect to boost the max dex up to +9, but Tower Shields will be boosted up to +10 for Fighters of any race. Switch the values to give +3 to heavy armor, and I'd be a LOT happier, especially since I could then pick and choose between Fighter & Dwarf AM to save a few action points (Henry's dex isn't all that great).

    Edit: I was pretty pleased at the idea of having a raid-buffed & boosted AC that could finally get right up around 100 even with a low dex though, although really...it probably just means I'll run around with PA on more instead of CE against most things.
    Recently completed a very slow Completionist adventure, playing each class until I was bored. My son (Henry) randomly picked the next class from the ones I hadn't done yet.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by vyvy3369 View Post
    The max dex bonuses seem a bit off too - a dwarven fighter in DT Fullplate can expect to boost the max dex up to +9, but Tower Shields will be boosted up to +10 for Fighters of any race.
    You can instead look at this enhancement as if it frees you from needing to spend AP on Tower Mastery III.

    Quote Originally Posted by vyvy3369 View Post
    Edit: I was pretty pleased at the idea of having a raid-buffed & boosted AC that could finally get right up around 100 even with a low dex though
    Someone should probably do the numbers on the AC of Stalwart Defender using Fighter20 vs Fighter18/Monk2. Maybe I'll add it up later, if nobody else has posted it.

  8. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angelus_dead View Post
    You can instead look at this enhancement as if it frees you from needing to spend AP on Tower Mastery III.
    Seeing as my Fighter is a very old 28-point build that started with 12 dex, I'd have to really work to need TM2 as things are now. As it stands for me at least, assuming I somehow get a +5 Dex Tome AND swap in for +1 Exceptional Dex somewhere I still wouldn't need TM1 after MOD 9.
    Last edited by vyvy3369; 02-13-2009 at 08:13 PM.
    Recently completed a very slow Completionist adventure, playing each class until I was bored. My son (Henry) randomly picked the next class from the ones I hadn't done yet.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by vyvy3369 View Post
    Seeing as my Fighter is a very old 28-point build that started with 12 dex, I'd have to really work to need TM2 as things are now. As it stands for me at least, assuming I somehow get a +5 Dex Tome AND swap in for +1 Exceptional Dex somewhere I still wouldn't need TM1 after MOD 9.
    Yes, but whatever, the general result is that Stalwart Defenders need to spend fewer APs on Tower Mastery than they otherwise might need to.

  10. #50

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    Quote Originally Posted by Angelus_dead View Post
    Yes, but whatever, the general result is that Stalwart Defenders need to spend fewer APs on Tower Mastery than they otherwise might need to.
    Exactly - making one of the few relatively useful enhancement lines for Fighters even less useful for Stalwart Defenders. The majority of Stalwart Defenders will still be taking AM enhancements, but you'd need a very high dex to need to take ANY TM. Making Heavy Armor benefit more would make it so both are still useful to the majority of Stalwart Defenders.

    Edit: to give you a better idea of what I mean, I have a hard time spending my APs as it is on a pure Fighter. With the addition of Stalwart Defender, I'm not even sure what I'll spend the last 4 levels of APs on, since I'll be saving about as many as I'm using on Armor Boost & Stalwart Defender (and Item Defense 2, woo!). Looking things over, I'll need to use 16 APs that I'm not currently spending, but even with JUST +5 dex it's saving me 10 APs. Bump that up to +6, and you're spending 16 to save 14.
    Last edited by vyvy3369; 02-13-2009 at 08:25 PM.
    Recently completed a very slow Completionist adventure, playing each class until I was bored. My son (Henry) randomly picked the next class from the ones I hadn't done yet.

  11. #51
    Community Member Dexxaan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Impaqt View Post
    Will the DR stack with other forms of Passive DR? Like Adamantine Full Plate or GOlden Greeves? If not, Its WAY too low.....

    TIer1: 25% of your Blocking DR is applied Passively
    Tier 2: 50%
    Tier 3 75%

    Edit:
    Its way too Low regardless... Why should someone carrying a Bucker have the Same passive DR as someone carrying a Tower Shield? I think the Percentage based on your Blocking DR is a WAY better alternative.... GIve my shield some real meaning. The small bumps to ac still dont get us anywhere near the monk splashes...
    Here's the REAL issue IMO.

    Eladrin pls reconsider DR....
    "Multi-Classing: If you don't know what you are doing...please don't do it."
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  12. #52

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    One other thought: make shield blocking more attractive. Yeah, the extra AC and DR are OK, but the real problem is elemental damage. Adding in an extra bonus to reflex saves in particular while blocking or even a % chance to ignore a reflex-based attack/spell would be much more useful.
    Recently completed a very slow Completionist adventure, playing each class until I was bored. My son (Henry) randomly picked the next class from the ones I hadn't done yet.

  13. #53

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    How will non-fighter dwarves be able to use the activated ability? Will this enhancement give them if the character is not a fighter?
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  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ustice View Post
    How will non-fighter dwarves be able to use the activated ability?
    They won't, because they don't qualify to take it.

    In the future that might change: for example, dwarves might be allowed to substitute Paladin AC boost, Barbarian DR boost, or Ranger Resist boost.

  15. #55
    Community Member Samadhi's Avatar
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    Is madstone rage zero'd out from this same as regular rage?
    sravana, kirtana, smarana, dasya, atma-nivedana
    ...NAMASTE...

  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eladrin View Post
    Rage effects do not permit "any abilities that require patience or concentration", which is pretty much a description of Defensive Stance.
    That's a specious motivation, as DDO's Rage spell does not interfere with activities like Combat Expertise, spellcasting, or even the literal Concentration skill.

    In fact, it seems inaccurate to say that DDO even has the concept of a "rage effect". There are four kinds of rage for a player character, all with different limitations:
    Barb Rage: CE no, Casting no
    Rage Spell: CE yes, Casting yes
    Madstone: CE yes, Casting no
    Bloodrage: CE yes, Casting yes

    The real reason for the Defensive Stance ability to negate a Rage spell is because Rage is the only spell a DDO player can cast on another to both buff and debuff him at the same time. Because there's no other call for it, the DDO GUI doesn't allow a way for players to decline or cancel buffs cast by other people. So, the actual rules justification is that someone using Defensive Stance probably wants high AC, so he probably would have been unwilling to accept Rage at all (and unwilling targets are immune to Rage... even in D&D, you can't cast it on an enemy to drop his AC).

    By that reasoning, Combat Expertise and Defensive Fighting should also counteract a Rage spell, because a player using either of those stances has indicated he's prioritizing AC. Thus, my suggestion that Def Fighting, CE, and Def Stance all suppress Rage spells for as long as you continue the stance. (Yes, that means if a person uses CE and falls incap, the stance will end and he'll gain 16 hitpoints to revive him. That's a cool side effect)

  17. #57
    Community Member sephiroth1084's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gratch View Post
    You have the manual dexterity even on a gamepad to distinguish between 25, 33, and 50% rates?.
    Yes.

    I get 6 disticnt speeds using the thumbstic, though 2 of those require more concentration than I'd normally apply while adventuring.
    Useful links: A Guide to Using a Gamepad w/ DDO / All Caster Shroud, Hard Shroud, VoD, ToD Einhander, Elochka, Ferrumrym, Ferrumdermis, Ferrumshot, Ferrumblood, Ferrumender, Ferrumshadow, Ferrumschtik All proud officers of The Loreseekers. Except Bruucelee, he's a Sentinel!

  18. #58
    Community Member eyepuppy's Avatar
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    You guys must have looked at my build and built this line for my fighter. It's just awesome. It'll work very well with my build. Thanks!
    Rule number one, never follow Wobert. Rule number two, never listen to Wobert.


  19. #59
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by moorewr View Post
    I get the impression (from many threads) that you have an issue with the idea of Intimidate altogether.. why don't you start a Development thread about that and lay out your case? I'm sincere here - I've seen you state this is various places but not your reasoning. And of course it's best not to hijack this thread for it.
    I will sure post a thread.. I have before, but it has been awhile.. Intimidate is bad for the game. I think even the devs realize that hence the hate generation for both the two defensive prestige classes..
    Norg Fighter12/Paladin6/Monk2, Jacquiej Cleric18/Monk1/Wiz1, Rabiez Bard16/Ranger3/Cleric1, Hangover Bard L20, Boomsticks Fighter12/Monk 6/Druid 2, Grumblegut Ranger8/Paladin6/Monk6, Rabidly Rogue L20, Furiously Rogue10/Monk6/Paladin4, Snowcones Cleric 12/Ranger 6/Monk 2, Norge Barbarian 12/FVS4/Rogue4. Guild:Prophets of The New Republic Khyber.

  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by maddmatt70 View Post
    Intimidate is bad for the game. I think even the devs realize that
    Um, how do you reconcile that with the huge Intimidate buff in mod 7, which was clearly aimed specifically at Suulomades?
    Last edited by Angelus_dead; 02-14-2009 at 03:03 AM.

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