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  1. #1

    Default Healing Amplification

    There are a few threads out there dealing with healing amplification and the formulas behind them, but nothing I found went into enough details to explain some odd behavior I had noticed recently, so here's what I have collected. Feel free to add to this if you have a Human, Warforged or Monk with all of the necessary items available to do testing with.

    Important notes:
    1. Healing Amplification items of the same bonus DO NOT stack. For example, Levik's Bracers and a Tempest 20% Healing Amplification on Dragontouched Armor does not stack with each other.
    2. When using a Finger Necklace, the order that you equip the items in DOES matter. Any amplification items put on AFTER the Finger Necklace also boost the 10% from the Finger Necklace.
    3. Healing Amplification % items multiply together to determine how much you are healed, and thus order DOES NOT matter amonst these items.


    The first (and most complete) round of testing was done via the Meridia healer on a Dwarf. The results in ascending order of amount healed are:
    Code:
    Naked = 110 
    10% = 121
    20% = 132
    30% = 143
    10% + 20% = 145
    10% + 30% = 157
    20% + 30% = 171
    10% + 20% + 30% = 188
    10% + 20% + 30% + Finger Necklace = 199
    20% + 30% + Finger Necklace + 10% = 200
    10% + 30% + Finger Necklace + 20% = 201
    10% + 20% + Finger Necklace + 30% = 203
    30% + Finger Necklace + 10% + 20% = 203
    20% + Finger Necklace + 10% + 30% = 204
    10% + Finger Necklace + 20% + 30% = 205
    Finger Necklace + 10% + 20% + 30% = 207
    Explanation:
    The Finger Necklace is adding on 10% of the initial spell when it is the last item equipped, or in this case 11. When it is equipped BEFORE putting on Healing Amplification items, the amount healed increases because the Healing Amplification boosts the bonus from the Finger Necklace. For example, wearing the Finger Necklace first and then putting on all 3 items generated a Heal of 110*1.1*1.2*1.3 + 11*1.1*1.2*1.3.

    Partial testing was done with a Human (using Human Improved Recovery 2):
    Code:
    Human = 132
    Human + Finger Necklace = 143
    Human + 20% = 158
    Human + 20% + Finger Necklace = 169
    Human + Finger Necklace + 20% = 171
    I also did some brief testing by resetting my enhancements, and testing the values as I added Human Improved Recovery back in. This DID add to the amount healed by the Finger Necklace, but it would be an incredible pain to try and reset your enhancements like this just to get a small benefit.

    I discussed some of this while performing these tests with another player on Sarlona who uses these a lot, and it appears that during initial testing (months ago when the Shroud was new) the order did not matter. However, it's fairly clear that it does now, and he had noticed some inconsistencies too. This all got started because I noticed that on occasion my tavern food was healing me for different amounts even though I was wearing the exact same equipment.
    Recently completed a very slow Completionist adventure, playing each class until I was bored. My son (Henry) randomly picked the next class from the ones I hadn't done yet.

  2. #2
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    Just thought I would necro this to mention that Human healing amplification and Monk healing amplification stack in a multiplicative way. Using the Heal spell cast by the clerics in the taverns my human monk with rank 2 and 3 gained 171 hps. This means it its 1.2 x 1.3 x 110 for amount healed. With rank 3 in both enhancements a scroll cast of Heal should net you 185hps.

  3. #3
    Community Member al73r's Avatar
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    great post!

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    Update: Moved around my enhancements and managed to get rank 3 in both monk and Human lines. A Heal from a brother/sister in a tavern got me 186hps. Was careful to time it so that the normal tick did not get added in as well.

    1.3 x 1.3 x 110 would be 185.9 so it looks like they do round up in some cases.

  5. #5
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    On the Finger Necklace. When you put it on seems to be affecting where the bonus is added into the formula.

    If its added first the formula becomes:
    110 x (1.1 [FN] x 1.1 x 1.2 x 1.3) = 207

    If the finger necklace is added last it becomes:
    110 x (1.1 x 1.2 x 1.3) + 110 x 0.1 = 199

    Its a bit more complex if the FN is put on somewhere in the middle, annoyingly so. I seem to be too tired to work it out just now though.

  6. #6
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    Have you tested Dragon Touched Armor 10% healing amplification and Leviks bracer 20%? A guildy of mine did and stated they didn't stack/multiply together. He had a paladin hit him with lay on hands and drank csw pots what have you..

    On the basis of my guildies testing my guess is that actually none of the healing amplifications items stack other then the finger necklace with one of the others..

    I see you have test results included.. Either my guildie is incorrect which is quite possible or something is bugged what have you..
    Last edited by maddmatt70; 03-27-2009 at 02:10 PM.
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    Community Member gfunk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by maddmatt70 View Post
    Have you tested Dragon Touched Armor 10% healing amplification and Leviks bracer 20%? A guildy of mine did and stated they didn't stack. He had a paladin hit him with lay on hands and drank csw pots what have you..

    On the basis of my guildies testing my guess is that actually none of the healing amplifications stack other then the finger necklace with one of the others..
    csw pots are two variable to be accurate when you are trying to judge a 10% increase. Try various gear combinations and eat food in a tavern, as food regenerates you at a known and constant amount.
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  8. #8
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gfunk View Post
    csw pots are two variable to be accurate when you are trying to judge a 10% increase. Try various gear combinations and eat food in a tavern, as food regenerates you at a known and constant amount.
    Well lay on hands is a set value which was his primary testing..
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  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by maddmatt70 View Post
    Have you tested Dragon Touched Armor 10% healing amplification and Leviks bracer 20%? A guildy of mine did and stated they didn't stack/multiply together. He had a paladin hit him with lay on hands and drank csw pots what have you..

    On the basis of my guildies testing my guess is that actually none of the healing amplifications items stack other then the finger necklace with one of the others..

    I see you have test results included.. Either my guildie is incorrect which is quite possible or something is bugged what have you..
    Yes, I was using Dragontouched Fullplate with 10%, 20% from Levik's (as well as 20% on Dragontouched Fullplate at the time IIRC), and 30% from a Greensteel triple-pos Dwarven Axe. I didn't bother making a 10% or 20% Greensteel weapon, but based upon Levik's and Dragontouched 20%s not stacking, I didn't think it was worth the effort - especially since a +5 Holy Pure Good Burst weapon is still pretty good damage-wise.
    Recently completed a very slow Completionist adventure, playing each class until I was bored. My son (Henry) randomly picked the next class from the ones I hadn't done yet.

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ikuryo View Post
    On the Finger Necklace. When you put it on seems to be affecting where the bonus is added into the formula....Its a bit more complex if the FN is put on somewhere in the middle, annoyingly so. I seem to be too tired to work it out just now though.
    You pretty much have it. If put on after other sources of amplification, it gives a 10% bonus of the non-amplified amount. Any sources of amplification put on afterwards grant their bonus to the Finger Necklace's 10%.
    Recently completed a very slow Completionist adventure, playing each class until I was bored. My son (Henry) randomly picked the next class from the ones I hadn't done yet.

  11. #11
    Community Member krud's Avatar
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    If you logout and log back in, does it remember the order of equip? If not, what is the default when wearing the finger necklace?
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  12. #12

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    I don't recall offhand, but it might be one of those situations where it varies each time. I know some days when I have a lot of lag while loading in, my hotbars & equipment show up a few at a time. I'll do a little testing in a minute here and post back.

    Edit: relogging almost certainly makes it take effect after your enhancements though.

    Edit2: It would appear that the Finger Necklace is effectively last upon relogging. I put it on first and was getting 207s, and 3 different relogs resulted in 199.
    Last edited by vyvy3369; 03-27-2009 at 04:56 PM.
    Recently completed a very slow Completionist adventure, playing each class until I was bored. My son (Henry) randomly picked the next class from the ones I hadn't done yet.

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    Lay on hands could be using different rules for what affects it. The best think to do is to just spend the 50pp on a heal from Sister in a tavern after using /death to reduce your hps to 1. I have noticed that healing amounts can be off if you are at, or near full health.

  14. #14
    Community Member Dark-Star's Avatar
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    There was a theory going around that the Finger Necklace had a hidden effect like much of the named loot from that mod. The effect was reported to be increased chance of getting crit healed.

    In all of your testing, have you noticed anything along these lines? Or are we talking urban legend?
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  15. #15

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    I haven't noticed anything like that, and even with extensive testing it would be hard to prove, especially if it was only another 3%.
    Recently completed a very slow Completionist adventure, playing each class until I was bored. My son (Henry) randomly picked the next class from the ones I hadn't done yet.

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    I have a warforged monk (no finger necklace) and can say that what you have in here appears to be spot on. As far as warforged, they are a special case. I recently ran with a pure monk WF who said he had +80% healing, and though I tried to explain to him that he was not getting that full amount I don't think he was all that interested in the math.

    In any event, here's the gist of how WF works:

    All +% items, effects, and abilities (except the Healer's Friend Enhancement) work off of your base percentage. WF Healer's Friend is the only thing that adds directly to your base percentage, which everything thereafter is based upon. This means that, for instance, the 20% bracers worn on a non-HF warforged will add 20% of 50%, or 0.50 * 1.2 for a net healing percentage of 60%. The same bracers worn on a HF I warforged will add 20% of 65%, or 0.65 * 1.2 for a net healing percentage of 78%, showing just how big a difference Healer's friend makes.

    Now for some corollary numbers, using the healer in GH:

    Base 50%: 55
    Base + 10% Monk: 60
    Base + 20% Monk: 66
    Base + 10% Monk + 20% Hound bracers: 72
    Base + 20% Monk + 20% Hound bracers: 79
    HF I (65%): 71
    HF I + 10% Monk: 78
    HF I + 20% Monk: 85
    HF I + 10% Monk + 20% Hound bracers: 94
    HF I + 20% Monk + 20% Hound bracers: 102

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  17. #17
    Community Member daniel7's Avatar
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    Well now you guys have to punch in the +5% healing amplification from the Paladin past life feats...I suck at math.
    Ghallanda
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    if 10% is 1.1 5% should be 1.05

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    /turn undead

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