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  1. #1

    Default Ram Bow (a build by request)

    This build is from Sigtrent's build request thread

    Ram Bow Neutral Good Elven Bard 8 / Ranger 6 / Fighter 2
    Requested By: Gabrion

    Introduction
    Gabrion had requested a bow using bard with stealth and some decent UMD among other details. So I whipped one up but I went too far in the casting direction and not far enough in the kicking but with bows direction for his tastes. So back to the drawing board I went and this time swung the pendulum far in the other direction. I missed one mark of his request, which was at least 9 levels of bard but I couldn’t resist this particular class set up so I hope I can be forgiven. Perhaps a more middle of the road build may be in order but this one is just too wacky not to post.

    So I was waffling about how much fighter, how much ranger, how much bard, spellsinger vs warchanter and so on. In the end I decided it would be fun to mix ram’s might with inspire courage and to get a ranger archery prestige enhancement along with a bard one. Besides, deepwood sniper kind of worked nice with the stealth concept. I cranked up the strength and cut down the charisma from the other build. When to take what class is the hard part here. There is just no smooth way to do it. Either you get spells first or you get archery first or you wait until late in the game for both. I went archery first as ranger had the most oomph for low level.

    I was close to done with Ranger 6 bard 10 and the final feat choices were kind of useless and spellsinger prerequisites were dead weight. But a couple fighter levels would open warchanter as well as some monster melee damage options so I went for it! It’s more fun this way. I did wait for Self cast haste before going for fighter though.

    So in the end we have a weird critter. Bow damage is pretty spectacular and melee damage is not too shabby at all. Casting is limited due to mana but you have some key buffs. For control you are pretty useless except for fascinate which should work just fine. Songs are somewhat limited but since you don’t have inspire greatness that cuts down on things. UMD is solid if not amazing, good enough to throw out a raise dead or heal when things hit the fan. Skills are a tad weak. No concentration means you won’t cast much in battle, but this build isn’t meant to be beat on anyhow and you can generally flee to heal quite easily.

    And you have lots of weird tricks. You have multishot and sniper shot and the warchanter DR song and fascinates and speed boosts etc. Lots of little buttons to play with. Again, divine power before multishot is optimal to get an extra arrow for some serious beat down. Between haste and sprint you can haul ass when needed and displacement and diplo offer plenty of “please don’t hurt me” options.

    ---------- Build Basics ----------

    Starting Statistics (32pts)
    STR DEX CON INT WIS CHA

    :16 :15 :12 :10 :11 :14


    Feats
    Point Blank Shot, Mental Toughness, Extend Spell, Weapon Focus Slashing, Multishot, Improved Critical Ranged, Impoved Critical Slashing, Power Attack, Weapon Focus Ranged, Two Weapon Fighting, Improved Two Weapon Fighting, Rapid Shot

    Enhancements
    Haste Boost 1, Skill Boost 1, Sprint Boost 1, Inspired Attack 2, Inspired Damage 2, Inspired Bravery 2, Lingering Song 2, Warchanter 1, Elven Dex 1, Melee attack 1, Melee Damage 1, Ranged attack 1, Ranged Damage 2, Item Defense 1, Favored Damage 2, Deepwood Sniper 1, Hide 2, Move silently 2, Song Magic 1, Energy of the Music 2, BardCharisma 2, Ranger Dex 1, Strength 1

    Skill Ranks
    Concentration 3, Diplomacy 16, Hide 17, Move 17, Perform 19, UMD 19, Tumble 1

    Spells
    Focusing Chant, Rams Might, Remove Fear, Cure Light Wounds, Resist Energy, Detect Secret Doors, Blur, Invisibility, Rage, Heroism, Cure Serious, Displacement, Haste

    ---------- Number Crunching ----------

    Final Statistics (Tomes: +1 Str, Wis and Dex)
    STR DEX CON INT WIS CHA

    :28 :24 :18 :10 :12 :22


    Hit Points ~230 / Spell Points ~580
    Fort ~22 / Reflex ~26 / Will ~17

    Ranged Attack Profile (+5 Longbow)
    BAB 14, Dex 7, Weapon 5, Elf Attack 1, Haste 1, Inspire Courage 5, Focusing Chant 1, Weapon Focus 1
    Str 9, Rams 3, Courage 6, Wep 5, Elf 2, Favored Enemy (6), Rage 1
    35/35/40/45 1d8 + 26(32fe) (19-20 X3) (Rapid Shot & Many Shot)

    Melee Attack Profile 1 (+5 Great Sword)
    BAB 14, Str 9, Weapon 5, Haste 1, Inspire Courage 5, Weapon Focus 1, Focusing Chant 1, Power Attack -5, Rams 3, Rage 1
    Str 16, Rams 2, Courage 6, Wep 5, PA 10, FE (6)
    35/35/40/45 2d6 + 39(45) (17-20 X2)

    Full Armor Class (+5 Darkweave Studed Leather, +5 mithral light shield)
    Armor 7, Dex 7, Barkskin Potion 3, Deflection 4, Shield 6, Haste 1 = 38

    Key skills
    UMD: Ranks 19, Cha 6, Boost 2, Item 3, Greater Heroism 4, Focusing Chant 1: 35 (can be made better with gear and such)

    ---------- Leveling Guide ----------

    1st Level: Bard
    Mental Tougness : Concentration 3, Diplomacy 4, Hide 4, Move 4, Perform 4, UMD 4, Tumble 1

    2nd Level: Ranger
    Hide 1, Move 1, Perform 1, UMD 1

    3rd Level: Ranger
    Weapon Focus Ranged : Hide 1, Move 1, Perform 1, UMD 1

    4th Level: Bard
    Str +1 : Diplomacy 2, Hide 1, Move 1, Perform 1, UMD 1

    5th Level: Ranger
    Hide 1, Move 1, Perform 1, UMD 1

    6th Level: Ranger
    Point Blank Shot : Hide 1, Move 1, Perform 1, UMD 1

    7th Level: Ranger
    Hide 1, Move 1, Perform 1, UMD 1

    8th Level: Ranger
    Str +1 : Hide 1, Move 1, Perform 1, UMD 1

    9th Level: Bard
    Improved Critical Ranged : Diplomacy 2, Hide 1, Move 1, Perform 1, UMD 1

    10th Level: Bard
    Diplomacy 2, Hide 1, Move 1, Perform 1, UMD 1

    11th Level: Bard
    Diplomacy 2, Hide 1, Move 1, Perform 1, UMD 1

    12th Level: Bard
    Str +1 : Extend Spell : Diplomacy 2, Hide 1, Move 1, Perform 1, UMD 1

    13th Level: Bard
    Diplomacy 2, Hide 1, Move 1, Perform 1, UMD 1

    14th Level: Fighter
    Improved Critical Slashing : UMD 1

    15th Level: Fighter
    Weapon Focus Slashing, Power Attack : UMD 1

    16th Level: Bard
    Str +1 : Hide 1, Move 1, Perform 3, UMD 1
    Happy Host of DDOcast The Dungeons and Dragons Online Podcast
    Member of the Umber Hulks and The Madborn of Thelanis
    You can see my many builds listed in this thread.

  2. #2
    Community Member Gabrion's Avatar
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    Wow another one, you're a machine man!

    When I was crunching some numbers myself I obviously started with Ranger 2/Bard 14, but like you I started thinking "what if..." in regards to more ranger, and maybe even some fighter. The Ram's Might spell was a draw for me as well. I'll keep pondering the idea, but I think I'll end up somewhere in between the two concepts - either Ranger 4/Bard 12 or Ranger 2/Bard 14.

    Thanks for the hard work!

  3. #3
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    The thing about Ram's might that I can speak with from experience on my 12 fighter 4 ranger is it scales with ranger levels. For my 12 fighter 4 ranger I only get +2 to strength and +1 to damage vs. my 11 ranger multiclass build I get +2 to strength and +3 to damage. Nice build - the question for the OP is how much bard do you want. Improve precise shot is a really good feat as I mentioned in the other post it really is great with manyshot. If you line up your foes in a straight line and target the back foe it rocks.. Primary change to your build I would make is removal of mental toughness and improved crit slash for precise and improved precise shot and upgrade the dex to qualify for improved precise shot it is totally worth it. Finally, another trick for you and this is when my fighter ranger archer rocks. Click on fighter haste boost right before you hit many shot = +30 attack speed on my fighter/ranger with 4 arrows a shot - I do more damage then any other character in the game other then a spellcaster for 19 seconds..

    There is alot of testimony about how deepwood sniper is a diappointment as it last only 15 seconds and is a clickie effect. A friend of mine who has 3 rangers and is a super archer dislikes it and I take his word on anything related to archery.
    Last edited by maddmatt70; 04-25-2008 at 09:28 PM.
    Norg Fighter12/Paladin6/Monk2, Jacquiej Cleric18/Monk1/Wiz1, Rabiez Bard16/Ranger3/Cleric1, Hangover Bard L20, Boomsticks Fighter12/Monk 6/Druid 2, Grumblegut Ranger8/Paladin6/Monk6, Rabidly Rogue L20, Furiously Rogue10/Monk6/Paladin4, Snowcones Cleric 12/Ranger 6/Monk 2, Norge Barbarian 12/FVS4/Rogue4. Guild:Prophets of The New Republic Khyber.

  4. #4

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    Thanks maddmatt

    I didn't realize rams scales, that explains why I've seen differing reports of how much damage it adds. I don't have any highish level rangers myself.

    I agree that IPS is a pretty amazing feat. I'd have worked it in both builds if it wern't for the 19 dex requirement. Hopefully one of these days I'll level up my ranger paladin and I'll get to check it out first hand.
    Happy Host of DDOcast The Dungeons and Dragons Online Podcast
    Member of the Umber Hulks and The Madborn of Thelanis
    You can see my many builds listed in this thread.

  5. #5
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    By the way I would start the charisma at 10 and the int at 8 and raise the dex up to 17 and the str up to 17 as well.. eat a +2 dex tome and you can pick up improved precise shot.. If you really want to pick up improved crit slash you can swap out weapon focus ranged..
    Last edited by maddmatt70; 04-25-2008 at 10:05 PM.
    Norg Fighter12/Paladin6/Monk2, Jacquiej Cleric18/Monk1/Wiz1, Rabiez Bard16/Ranger3/Cleric1, Hangover Bard L20, Boomsticks Fighter12/Monk 6/Druid 2, Grumblegut Ranger8/Paladin6/Monk6, Rabidly Rogue L20, Furiously Rogue10/Monk6/Paladin4, Snowcones Cleric 12/Ranger 6/Monk 2, Norge Barbarian 12/FVS4/Rogue4. Guild:Prophets of The New Republic Khyber.

  6. #6

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    1. Mountain Dew coming out your nose is kinda painful.

    2. Sigtrent now owes me a new keyboard. (I'd prefer on with illuminated keys!)

    3. Best... Build... Name... Ever... :lol:
    Things that if Turbine went all EXTREME PREJUDICE™ on, would actually make the game fun again.:
    • Giving us the racial PrE’s we were promised, before rolling out DDOStore™ Enhancement Trees.
    • Fixing physical defense for Rangers and Rogues. It’s ridiculous that you’re better off wearing Heavy Armor and ignoring your innate feats on these classes.
    • Cannith Crafting.
    • Update the named loot to put them on the same system.
    • Fixing the Cannith Challenges so that they can be 6 starred without incredible luck or store bought items.
    • Fixing all challenges to give us decent XP and ingredient returns for the unreasonable time we have to spend in most of them.

  7. #7
    Community Member Gabrion's Avatar
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    Thanks for the input again maddmatt. I'm really thinking about improved precise shot now, but I'm not sure if I should go that route or not. I see it as a huge DPS increase against trash mobs in quests, but not as an improvement to single target fights (think Pit Fiend, DQ, etc). I'm probably looking more for the single target DPS than registering super high in the kill count, and honestly most of the number breakdowns I've done just don't have the free DEX to go that route.

    All that said, the fighter haste + manyshot is a very cool idea, I may even take a few levels just for that!

  8. #8
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabrion View Post
    Thanks for the input again maddmatt. I'm really thinking about improved precise shot now, but I'm not sure if I should go that route or not. I see it as a huge DPS increase against trash mobs in quests, but not as an improvement to single target fights (think Pit Fiend, DQ, etc). I'm probably looking more for the single target DPS than registering super high in the kill count, and honestly most of the number breakdowns I've done just don't have the free DEX to go that route.

    All that said, the fighter haste + manyshot is a very cool idea, I may even take a few levels just for that!
    Improved precise shot is a good idea believe me. Archers are not major dps players and any way you can increase your dps the party will appreciate. The changes that I advocate in the previous section will not hurt your character very much if at all because spell points for this particular build is not a big deal because quite frankly you don't have many spells to cast. lol.. Ony real spells are haste, displacement, blur, rage, and ram's might and your party will not be interested in a 50% duration haste unless the arcane is out of sp and other then displacement here or there the other spells dont cost many spell points.

    You don't have the inspire greatness song (+2 to hit) which bards get at 9th level and your inspire courage song is -2 to hit and damage (level 14 is +1 to hit and damage and you dont get the option of selection inspire attack 3 and inspire damage 3). Level 10 is the next big bard cutoff level after 8 with the inspire damage 3 enhancement for your information. Level 14 is the next big bard song level after that with a +1 to hit and damage. That is the negative of this build not tremendous songs although you have very nice personal dps overall in my opinion deepwood sniper and a watered down ram's might is probably not worth it, but that is my opinion. One thing with this build to make sure to get is the best lingering song enhancement you can get for the length of your songs...
    Norg Fighter12/Paladin6/Monk2, Jacquiej Cleric18/Monk1/Wiz1, Rabiez Bard16/Ranger3/Cleric1, Hangover Bard L20, Boomsticks Fighter12/Monk 6/Druid 2, Grumblegut Ranger8/Paladin6/Monk6, Rabidly Rogue L20, Furiously Rogue10/Monk6/Paladin4, Snowcones Cleric 12/Ranger 6/Monk 2, Norge Barbarian 12/FVS4/Rogue4. Guild:Prophets of The New Republic Khyber.

  9. #9
    Community Member Mike_Ivory's Avatar
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    Looks very close to a tempest bard i wipped up for a buddy, slight diffrences are there is no fighter levels(10bard/6 ranger, 14 bard/6 ranger at 20) and i combined tempest with warchanter rather than deepwoods. With taking no fighter, feats were very tough but he wanted to be alot more on the bard side of things so he did not really care. The fun factor of these builds seem very high though. GJ

  10. #10
    Community Member Naso24's Avatar
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    Deepwood sniper is a real disappointment. It isn't a 15 second duration. It is a single shot, with a 10 second reset timer. Other rangers that take arcane archer seem to be much happier with the selection.

    A feat you may wish to consider is heavy repeater. I have this on my ranger and he rocks with a banishing and smiting repeater. The crit range is 2x that of a bow, and the rate of fire is 2x compared to BAB 16 bow. I use a bow for manyshot, but then switch back to repeater (for instant kill effects).
    Margolie L16 Wizard Beaar L16 Fighter14-Rogue2 Beaaar L16 Cleric Gwynneth L14 Paladin10-Cleric3-Sorc1 Relle L16 Ranger15-Rogue1 Aluzia L7 Bard Bareskin Rugg L16 Ranger2-Monk2-Fighter2 Manbearpigg L12 Cleric10-Monk2

  11. #11
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    Default any updates?

    This build sounds interesting, but the level cap is no longer 16...

  12. #12
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Default Awise fwom youw gwave!

    Quote Originally Posted by kyril96 View Post
    This build sounds interesting, but the level cap is no longer 16...
    There are plenty of bard-based melee+ranged builds out there, inc. my Bardcher thread.

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