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  1. #1
    Community Member AkromaAoW's Avatar
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    Default PUGS and Elitists

    Well, I have seen my share of bad pugs both before and after the server merge. Groups with inexperienced players have their difficulties. Groups with experienced players do as well. In this latter case, it often comes down to play style. When doing things with a party, I tend to be very party oriented - complete the quest, but keep an eye on your other party members and let everyone fill their role.

    I have grouped with a few parties since the merge where we had elitists from who knows where. This is the person that wants to go ahead and start clearing before anyone gets to the quest (Our "elitist" died a few times during his efforts). Now, here's the rub. I joined the party because I wanted to experience all the quest with the party. Getting to a quest and finding it 50% done is not what I had in mind. What is the point? Getting loot? That's nice, but I also wanted to play through the quest with the group. I can loot much more effectively with my friends in a non-pug group.

    I am constantly confused by players that want to join a party and then work as if they are solo. Why not just go alone or with a short party? I have one main character that I play. He is a third generation multi-class (power gaming since DDO was released) that was designed with the goal of being useful. Some things he has been asked to do include:

    - Pick locks and find/disable traps, but if a capable rogue in the party, he or she gets the job.

    - Frontline a bit (for those that know ;-)), but I work crowd control and keep an eye on the casters if there are enough capable front liners in the party.

    - Use UMD for wands and casting scrolls, but I wont step on the caster with my casting or wand use.

    I try to work to complement or augment other party members, not overshadow them in their main role or underutilize their abilities.

    What does it all mean?

    It means that just because someone is capable of doing something doesn't mean he or she always should. This is particularly true when grouping. Each person in a party has a role to play. By doing all the things we can, we can often step on the role of another party member.

    Is this important?

    IMO it is, because if I am going to perform the same role as another party member to the point that the party member isn't needed, I'm going short party. Why would I invite a rogue to a party to have him or her watch me pick all the locks? The thing is: I won't. The rogue is a wasted resource.

    You're soooo uber!

    Some of the worst players to group with in the game have uber characters. It isnt because they aren't capable of wiping out mobs or defeating quests. It's because they dont know how to play with a group. I know some genuine killers, but they will take off at the beginning of a quest and run through it killing everything in sight while the rest of the party struggles to keep up. Where is the fun for the rest of the party?

    Why do they do it?

    My best guess is for recognition and to feed an ego. The players of these uber toons feel the need to show 5 other people that they are so great they can vaporize everything; Wow! Look at that kill count! Maybe they actually accomplish the goal, and some will add them to their friend list. I will add them to my "do not group" list with the comment "great skills, but can't play with group."

    You're not included if...

    All of the above comments are about PUGS; this completely DOES NOT APPLY to groups that form for the exact purpose of running through a quest as fast as possible. That, as the saying goes, is a dragon of a different color...

    Cya in game...
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  2. #2
    Community Member Scarsgaard's Avatar
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    bumped

  3. #3

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    Heh, bumping is against the board rules, but you could always add a comment if you want it bumped.

    I guess it all depends on the group. There are some guilds and folks that have a particular culture or become acustomed to doing things a certain way. When running gianthold quests, even my very casual guild will join other guild memebers in progress on a quest or if some are ready before others they will get started on the quest ahead of others. None of us feel like we are missing out on killing the first 10 creatures of a given quest, or that our glory is being hogged if someoen wants to show off.

    Now once we are all in the quest we generaly like to stick together and play as a team. Sometimes we will open up the group for others, but to be honest this sort of activity (having someone start the quest) is pretty common, especialy in giant hold.

    Generaly in a pug we usualy ask if someone minds or the LFM will say "in progress". If a pugger says, "hey can we take this slow?" we'll do that, but if they don't say anything.. well we play like we feel like playing I suppose.

    We had someone drop a group with us in a huff a while back because one of the group memebers had started in POP wtihout him. This person had asked if anyone minded to no objection untill after they started they got a tell from said PUGGER who then left. Our guldie offered an honest applogy and this guy just sent more complaints. I guess my point is it takes some understanding and communication. There is no "right way" to play the game, but we all owe it to eachother to be considerate and understanding if were grouping togetehr.
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  4. #4
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    i somewhat disagree with the OP here. although im sure that are more than a few cases where theres some player that feels the need to show off his e-peen of uberness, but for the most part, at least for me, its all about xp per minute and chests per minute........

    the faster you complete a quest, the faster you can move on to the next quest, and the faster you will gain xp

    the faster you can get to a good chest, the faster you can go and hit another good chest and thus more loot opportunites you'll have.

    also some of us don't have all that much time to play, so personally, i don't mind at all joining a pug thats already started in its quest, unless i get hit with an xp cut, but getting the xp and looting all the chests in minimal time is definately the way to go.
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  5. #5
    DDOCast & Hero Theris's Avatar
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    There are some things any player joining a PUG can do to ensure their enjoyment of the game, but in general, it requires players to be active in their own well fair:

    1) Be informed before joining the PUG! Read the LFM and send a tell to the party leader before sending your Join Request. Being active in finding information in what the group's play style is about will ensure a better match. Sometimes checking the guilds of the players in the group in the Who List can get an idea of what a group's play style will be like.

    3) Be vocal and upfront, yet polite, about want you want in-group play. If you want to go slow and start a quest as a group, let the party members know! If you want to start the quest with only 3 or less members of your full party because the other players are busy or slow, ask (many times, both in chat and voice) to get a consensus for your PUG. Communicate! Do not be silent, because silence will be assumed for agreement.

    4) Pay attention to the group's chats and voice to the best of your abilities. This will help give you an idea of what the group's play style is. If you don't pay attention, often times you will be left out and what you assumed about the group's play style could be the opposite. For example, they left you behind be cause they assumed you were listening to voice and reading chat, not because of you personally.

    5) Do not take it personally. It’s a game, if you are not having fun in any way stop playing and do something else. If you don't like your group, be polite and leave. A simple "Sorry, I'm not into your group's play style. I'm going to drop. Good luck on the quest!" (You can even set an alias for that line!) Just let the party leader know so that they can replace your spot.

    There are many different ways to play a game as there are people in the world. Knowing this and knowing how you yourself play the game will give you a better player-group match -- and more enjoyment out of the game for everyone!
    Last edited by Theris; 08-06-2007 at 12:49 PM.
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  6. #6
    Community Member Solstice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Weedo View Post
    the faster you complete a quest, the faster you can move on to the next quest, and the faster you will gain xp...
    the faster you can get to a good chest, the faster you can go and hit another good chest and thus more loot opportunites you'll have.
    Think you're wrong (MY OPINION, not a rule write in a stone) on this sentence.

    A fast run - as the Vons when I manage - have the golden rule: "just kill what is needed for finish the quest". Faster run isn't fast xp, is "some" xp. faster runs are for loot, for be ready for some raid.

    good xp runs means do all or close to all bonuses and optionals for more 5% to 35% xp bonus (considering ransack 10% and 25% bonus for kills)

    have a considerable difference. do some runs with speed need a group that wanna do that. is just COMMUNICATION, you all know, talk about in party chat or voice channel.

    Is the failure communication that makes 90% of pugs get bad experience and fun... you enter in a pug and if nobody say "wait for buffs" or "i need some specific buff for this" or "don't cast resist xxxxxx, i'm have this here", you think that everybody is auto sufficient and it's not true.

    you don't know the build, the items, the skill of some players before play with. and before ask/talk about.

    one stuff here is: pug for xp = break all, kill all, take all bonuses
    other is: pug for loot = speed, best time, best combination

    for BOTH everybody need COMMUNICATION. the cleric on pug isn't your cleric with your items. is other. the fighter isn't your. the wizard sometimes don't know/forget what spell is better (sorcerer is nuker IMO).

    I play since release game, agree about time is short for play (Work, GF, RL issues, family), but sometimes (not always) a faster speed run can take more time that a normal speed run.

    PS: sorry if have some bad spelling, I'm Brazilian, don't talk or write English so good as most of you (just for survive in travels), but I believe that post be understood.
    Last edited by Solstice; 08-06-2007 at 01:08 PM.
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  7. #7
    Community Member elkin's Avatar
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    A comment

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  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Solstice View Post
    Think you're wrong (MY OPINION, not a rule write in a stone) on this sentence.
    well, i think i agree with Weedo.

    With the example of Delera's... A good speed run can get all parts done in 25-30 min. At lvl 5-8 that is some nice xp. I have been in runs where a frind of mine, having started part 2 in a PUG while I was filling a group for a speed run was just finishing that same part while my group was heading in to town for repairs and selling after finishing
    Code:
     Speed Run                              Conquest, Ransack and optionals
    Mystery of Delara's Tomb:  1,642       Mystery of Delara's Tomb:  4,558    
    Mystery of Delara's Tomb:  4,558       Ransack 10%
    Mystery of Delara's Tomb:  2,148       Conquest 25%
    Thrall of the Necromancer: 4,622       Optionals ?
                            12,970XP         6153XP
    For the same time, I prefer the 100% xp "bonus" and having the endreward.
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clay View Post
    well, i think i agree with Weedo.

    With the example of Delera's... A good speed run can get all parts done in 25-30 min. At lvl 5-8 that is some nice xp. I have been in runs where a frind of mine, having started part 2 in a PUG while I was filling a group for a speed run was just finishing that same part while my group was heading in to town for repairs and selling after finishing
    Code:
     Speed Run                              Conquest, Ransack and optionals
    Mystery of Delara's Tomb:  1,642       Mystery of Delara's Tomb:  4,558    
    Mystery of Delara's Tomb:  4,558       Ransack 10%
    Mystery of Delara's Tomb:  2,148       Conquest 25%
    Thrall of the Necromancer: 4,622       Optionals ?
                            12,970XP         6153XP
    For the same time, I prefer the 100% xp "bonus" and having the endreward.
    While I tend to want to quest slow, that is my style and how I enjoy the game. Weedo and Clay are correct from the standpoint of efficiency.

    You only have so much time to play... even if that is 16 hours a day your limiting factor is time. Its not always the best thing to spend your precious time doing optionals etc. in order to max out xp. If your interested in XP you can often make more xp per minute but quickly meeting the minimum goals and then moving on to another quest. Same thing with loot, and often you can do speedy XP and Loot runs and make more xp and get more loot per minute than those doing everything.

    With that said, I usually prefer to do most everything, just because I am playing at least 50% because I want to hang out with my buddies.

  10. #10
    DDOCast & Hero Theris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shamguard View Post
    Above all remember this is a game. Have fun however you play. Just remember not everyone will play the game the same way you do, live with it.
    AMEN!
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  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by Clay View Post
    well, i think i agree with Weedo.

    With the example of Delera's... A good speed run can get all parts done in 25-30 min. At lvl 5-8 that is some nice xp. I have been in runs where a frind of mine, having started part 2 in a PUG while I was filling a group for a speed run was just finishing that same part while my group was heading in to town for repairs and selling after finishing
    Code:
    Speed Run                              Conquest, Ransack and optionals
    Mystery of Delara's Tomb:  1,642       Mystery of Delara's Tomb:  4,558    
    Mystery of Delara's Tomb:  4,558       Ransack 10%
    Mystery of Delara's Tomb:  2,148       Conquest 25%
    Thrall of the Necromancer: 4,622       Optionals ?
                            12,970XP         6153XP
    For the same time, I prefer the 100% xp "bonus" and having the endreward.

    I guess what it really comes down to what do you want from a quest. If it's just xp, loot, and/or favor then by all means speed run. Just don't be crying when you run out of quests to run and are bored, because all of your 32pt build characters are level capped and there's nothing new to do.

    I like to take a dungeon a little slower, at least the first time, just so I can get the "flavor" of the quest. Alot of work goes in to creating these dungeons and they deserve to be appreciated, not just devored like they were some Mickey Ds burger.

    Every quest in this game has a story line associated with it. I some times wonder how many players have actually read them. More than once I've been in a dungeon and have had the question asked, "What's this all about anyway?" Or something to that effect.

    I admit that there are some quests (WW for one) that I have run so many times that I just want to get then over and will speed run them. I try not to do this with new players or people who have never run the quest before. As they need a slower pace just so they can learn the dungeon too.

    I guess what it comes down to is know your group, if they are just doing favor runs don't expect them to go after every thing. If they are trying to milk every last bit of xp from a dungeon and take it slow cooperate or find another group that is doing the type of run you want.

    The real issue what the party leader is after. This is the person who should set the tone of the dungeon dive. He is also the person who should make sure everyone in the party knows what the objective is and if someone objects to the the current party objective asked them to conform or please leave. Sometimes it is hard to do this but that is part of being a leader and in the long run it can lead to a lot less hurt feelings.

    Above all remember this is a game. Have fun however you play. Just remember not everyone will play the game the same way you do, live with it.
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  12. #12
    Community Member Solstice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clay View Post
    well, i think i agree with Weedo.

    With the example of Delera's... A good speed run can get all parts done in 25-30 min. At lvl 5-8 that is some nice xp. I have been in runs where a frind of mine, having started part 2 in a PUG while I was filling a group for a speed run was just finishing that same part while my group was heading in to town for repairs and selling after finishing
    Code:
     Speed Run                              Conquest, Ransack and optionals
    Mystery of Delara's Tomb:  1,642       Mystery of Delara's Tomb:  4,558    
    Mystery of Delara's Tomb:  4,558       Ransack 10%
    Mystery of Delara's Tomb:  2,148       Conquest 25%
    Thrall of the Necromancer: 4,622       Optionals ?
                            12,970XP         6153XP
    For the same time, I prefer the 100% xp "bonus" and having the endreward.
    remember the penalty with a level 8 in a level 5 quest

    my experience running agree with run deleras for xp in 20 minutes duo level 5 but only AFTER get normal/hard/elite and all bonus with a full group that did the same stuff in 45 minutes (normal and hard) getting all possible XP.

    your group = ppl that you know and know you.
    pug group = ppl that you never saw on your life...

    and yes, course is a game. and yes, of course you wanna play with better players against play with newbies/jerks. and of course that you wanna do fast. and for this you'll search good players.

    Xoriat was cover about your local newbies, as Thelanis and Tharashk... we're sharing only the bad stuffs... you can find good stuffs too


    edited in time: I'm bad with words...but a little better playing =P
    [Tharashk/Thelanis]
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  13. #13

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    Just to make sure here:
    This post is in no way meant to make light of anyone's play style, or to insult anyone.

    People who play slowly through dungeons, getting all the bonuses and optionals, I see as your average person eating a nice meal. They want to savor the meal, and the meal itself is the reward. At the end, they may or may not have a bit of iced cream or maybe some pie. (Loot)

    Speed runs I look at as a child eating at McDonalds. They HAVE to eat all the stuff their parents got them so they can get the ice cream and go play on the playground. For that reason they get through the unpleasant part as fast as possible to get to that reward they actually want

    Gold farmers here I guess would be dogs woofing down the same meals as fast as possible for a strictly utilitarian purpose.


    Personally, I like a good meal, but I also like iced cream. Everyone has their own way of having fun with this game, and one's no more or less than the next. (unless theirs some guy out there grinding up DDO disks to snort, that's just wrong).

    Make sure before you sit down to eat that everyone at your table has the same plan in mind and no one will be annoyed.

    (and yes, I've done both styles. I've run the Pit Elite at 6th level. I've run Stormcleave Elite at 5th, and I've had a blast running Korromar on Normal at 11th level)
    ------------------------------------------------------

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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by AkromaAoW View Post
    IMO it is, because if I am going to perform the same role as another party member to the point that the party member isn't needed, I'm going short party. Why would I invite a rogue to a party to have him or her watch me pick all the locks? The thing is: I won't. The rogue is a wasted resource.

    You're soooo uber!
    I think excluding people simply because they don't add as much to the capability of the party as the current members is elitist and shallow. I cannot count the times I've heard "what do we need for the last spot?" and the answer is "anything is fine, we are set".


    Quote Originally Posted by AkromaAoW View Post
    I have grouped with a few parties since the merge where we had elitists from who knows where. This is the person that wants to go ahead and start clearing before anyone gets to the quest (Our "elitist" died a few times during his efforts). Now, here's the rub. I joined the party because I wanted to experience all the quest with the party. Getting to a quest and finding it 50% done is not what I had in mind. What is the point? Getting loot? That's nice, but I also wanted to play through the quest with the group.
    If it is 50% done by the time you got there, then by your definition, they did not need you and should not have invited you. I'd suggest you thank them for the offer and then leave the group. It is not the groups responsibility to change their playstyle and decrease what they consider to be fun, simply to cater to your idea of what is fun.

    AkromaAoW I think it is in poor taste to try to equate someone going fast in a quest to being an elitist. There are multiple playstyles and multiple situational paradigms within said playstyles.

    For example at times I go fast because I am trying to:

    a) squeeze in some XP/Loot before a raid
    b) squeeze in some XP/Loot before going to dinner
    c) squeeze in some XP/Loot before before my girl wakes up from her nap.
    d) test the capabilities of my toon/gear
    e) test the capability of other group members
    f) get through a quest I do not care for as fast as possible
    g) have fun, and enjoy an occasional blood frenzy.

    On the other hand I may be the slow guy because I am:

    a) playing the game with a 2 y/o on my lap watching the Mickey Mouse Club House DVD.
    b) dog tired and nearing the end of my play session
    c) dealing with guild issues
    d) dealing with a gm
    e) being interupted by my wife who deserves my attention upon request for whatever reasons she has at the time.


    In conclusion, not everyone is going to fit into your perfect little fantasy. Opening your mind and closing your mouth is at times better than opening your mouth and closing your mind.
    Last edited by Kattoo; 08-06-2007 at 06:57 PM.
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  15. #15

    Default bad luck

    the only reason I put 5-8 cuz the last two times I leveled a character it took that long to get the items I wanted!

    I think I was 6 when I hit Delera' and by the time I got the cartouch I was almost 9... (sigh). And don't get me started on the visor... (though i have got that one down to 30 minutes for the whole thing as well its just so-o-o tedious!)

    On the whole I like to run quests at least a level below the elite level to get that small bonus, and some quests are easier to do that in than others.

    As others have said, it is up to the leader to set the tone, and if i have joined a pug and they want to hit all the optionals and get all the barrels in D's, TR, or CO6 then I gracefully bow out. Some of these chain quests just take so much time otherwise.

    And I hate standing around at the quest entrance waiting for someone who is either checking an auction. going shopping for the thing they just remembered they need for the quest... IMO anytime I am making others wait I'd rather they just get started... I'll catch up.

    a) playing the game with a 2 y/o on my lap watching the Mickey Mouse Club House DVD.
    e) being interupted by my wife who deserves my attention upon request for whatever reasons she has at the time.
    Very good points and while I don't have a 2/yr old... my clever little cat will sit in front of my screen, lie on my keyboard or play with my mouse when she wants my attention. And my wife... well let me say that if I haven't answered after the 2nd time, the 3rd time activates a Madstone-Tensers transformation cuz it gets ugly in a real hurry. Then I have to try and recall what it was she said the first two times... Of course I have no idea, I wasn't paying attention!

    Going fast in a quest is NOT like a child eating in McDonalds. It is like finishing a project at work: the faster you finish the work the greater your "salary" for the time input, and the sooner you get your bonus. I am sure that most people would rather a higher per hour wage than lower.
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  16. #16
    Community Member Scarsgaard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sigtrent View Post
    Heh, bumping is against the board rules, but you could always add a comment if you want it bumped.
    LOL... I bumped because I was 3 sheets to the wind and that this post was not only excellent but worth more than me trying in vain to post something rationale...

    Hands down.. best conversation without going into misunderstandings.

    I walk away b4 someone thinks that I'm creating arguements and thereby ruining a good thread.
    Last edited by Scarsgaard; 08-06-2007 at 08:02 PM.

  17. #17
    Community Member AkromaAoW's Avatar
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    Default Ah Kattoo...

    Quote Originally Posted by Kattoo View Post
    I think excluding people simply because they don't add as much to the capability of the party as the current members is elitist and shallow. I cannot count the times I've heard "what do we need for the last spot?" and the answer is "anything is fine, we are set".
    You misunderstand. I am not going to invite a character and then NOT let him or her play. In a PUG group, I will absolutly fill that last spot with whatever is appropriate or maybe just fun. The key point here is I'm going to hope that this person actually gets to PLAY as part of the group. I'm not personally going to fill his role, if perhaps I could, and I hope others will do the same. That is, unless the player proves to be incapable of performing the tasks set before him or her. With PUGS, you never know...

    Quote Originally Posted by Kattoo View Post
    If it is 50% done by the time you got there, then by your definition, they did not need you and should not have invited you. I'd suggest you thank them for the offer and then leave the group. It is not the groups responsibility to change their playstyle and decrease what they consider to be fun, simply to cater to your idea of what is fun.
    This is true, and everyone is entitled to play in the manner they deem fun. However, in a PUG with five other alien toons, it is best to wait to see what the correct playstyle should be before running ahead and clearing half the quest. I don't usually see PUGS containing six players that all support running ahead UNLESS THAT IS WHAT WAS POSTED IN THE LFM..

    Quote Originally Posted by Kattoo View Post
    AkromaAoW I think it is in poor taste to try to equate someone going fast in a quest to being an elitist. There are multiple playstyles and multiple situational paradigms within said playstyles.
    This is partially correct. For an individual to run ahead in gianthold quests alone on elite, they have to have a little bit going for them. Nope, the same wouldn't be true for favor questing in STK. However, minus the newly met player I mentioned that died a few times during his effort, the elitists I was referring to are well known to me and true killers. My point is that those individuals that can do these types of things shouldn't always. For the fun of the group and the consideration of its other members, one person should not likely do it all, even if they can. Of course, you might find a PUG full of unknown players that want to be carried through a quest, but I haven't met one yet.


    Quote Originally Posted by Kattoo View Post
    For example at times I go fast because I am trying to:

    a) squeeze in some XP/Loot before a raid
    b) squeeze in some XP/Loot before going to dinner
    c) squeeze in some XP/Loot before before my girl wakes up from her nap.
    d) test the capabilities of my toon/gear
    e) test the capability of other group members
    f) get through a quest I do not care for as fast as possible
    g) have fun, and enjoy an occasional blood frenzy.

    On the other hand I may be the slow guy because I am:

    a) playing the game with a 2 y/o on my lap watching the Mickey Mouse Club House DVD.
    b) dog tired and nearing the end of my play session
    c) dealing with guild issues
    d) dealing with a gm
    e) being interupted by my wife who deserves my attention upon request for whatever reasons she has at the time.
    These are excellent points for when and why people play as they do. I do not dispute them. My only thought is that there are not usually 6 toons in a typical PUG that are happy with chasing one of their members through a quest while he or she kills everything as fast as possible. A PUG can do that, but I'm suggesting that it isn't the common desired behavior in a group that was not specifically put together for that purpose. For example, we have all seen LFMs:

    Vons 1-4, quick run
    POP in progress
    Tempest Spine,in progress, chests unopened

    We know what to expect for this, and I have absolutely no problem. I personally hate rerunning the Vons to vist Velah, and I have a regular group that sprints through these with me. However, I also know a few folks that get into any Tempest Spine group and run through it as fast as possible to come out with the highest kill count. I have come to expect it when I join a TS party and see these particular individuals in the group. I just trot along with the casters that usually get left behind when they stop to shrine to add some protection in case some straggler mobs are still wandering about. I always think though, how incredibily awful it must be for the folks left behind to just spend 40 minutes trotting through the quest without much to do. Oh yes, when I see these particuar folks join, I will sometimes drop party before starting into TS, if I'm not in the mood to spend 40 minutes admiring the caves.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kattoo View Post
    In conclusion, not everyone is going to fit into your perfect little fantasy. Opening your mind and closing your mouth is at times better than opening your mouth and closing your mind.
    Well, I don't know about my perfect fantasy. I do hope I know a thing or two about being considerate. I will stand by the point of what I was saying. I won't invite people to my party and then not let them play. If I intend to speed run because of time constraints or because I am in serious loot mode, I will put together a specific party for that purpose. I won't make x newly met PUG'gers chase another party member through the quest, watch them kill everything, do all the locks and traps, etc.

    IMO, grouping is all about TEAMWORK and being considerate of your party members, and realizing that in a PUG, players usually want to, well, play .
    Last edited by AkromaAoW; 08-07-2007 at 01:04 AM.
    Arteriik - Level 28 Artificer/Rogue, Arteriika - Constant TR Artificer/Rogue/?, Eriik - Level 21 Ranger/Artificer, Cleriik - Level 20 Favored Soul/Rogue/Fighter, Eriikajoplin - Level 20 Bard/Ranger/Rogue. Lowbies: Artxeriika, Aneriika, Drueriik

  18. #18
    Community Member XFracture's Avatar
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    When I form a PUG, this is how it goes:

    "Is there ANYONE in the group that has NEVER done this quest before OR has only done it a couple times?"

    If there is no answer, or everyone chimes in with a "yes I've done it" then it's full speed ahead and if you fall behind then you better be afk or don't start b****ing. If there are any cherries in the group then I take it a little slower, but not by much, and at least voice over what is going on and why it is being done this way.

    I consider this reasonable.

  19. #19
    Community Member XFracture's Avatar
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    Oh, and don't get me started with favor runs. I've already had a few pantywaist sissy girls out there complain when they join my party that I'm going too fast and leaving people behind.

    WHEN IT EXPLICITLY STATES IN THE LFM: That "I DO NOT REQUIRE any help, join at yer own discretion". Or when they see their being powerleveled and drop out with some form of attitude.

    God I just wanna crush some newbie heads so bad.

  20. #20
    Community Member Scarsgaard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XFracture View Post
    ...God I just wanna crush some newbie heads so bad.
    LOL... man, you might want to curb your enthusiasm or they might think you're from Xoriat

    P.S. I can smell the Hate developing already ***jumps up and does Happy Hat Dance***

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