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  1. #1
    Community Member FrostBeard's Avatar
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    Default Save Vs Trip? does it actually exist?

    Heres a level 4 character with 20 str or +5 to saves vs trip/improved trip
    in combat i was fighting a worg thats cr 5
    this is what happened:

    (Combat): You are hit by worg's improved trip.
    (Combat): You have been tripped and have a -4 penalty to your AC while on the ground.
    (Combat): You attempt to save versus improved trip. You roll a 10 (+5): strength failure!

    -------several lines of beat down killing me.

    (Combat): Worg's improved trip has been removed.
    (Combat): You attempt to save versus improved trip. You roll a 6 (+9): balance success!

    Few Things here

    why do we take the damage or failure and then then get the save roll text.
    is that lag?

    How come trip is so powerful even at such low level monsters.
    i mean rolling a 10 +5 thats 15 geez!

    I guess my question is, was trip supposed to work like this, even at high levels its very powerful, dont let me get into 'broken' pvp.
    Last edited by FrostBeard; 06-30-2007 at 06:35 AM.

  2. #2
    Community Member AEschyl's Avatar
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    yes there is a save, it simply lists the order of things wrong in the combat text, much like when you die - it lists the removal of all of your buffs before it displays the text indicating the killing blow.

    the save is based on either your strength mod or your dexterity mod, whichever is greater

    and trip isn't really that powerful, certain mobs simply get a bonus to their trip attempts (especially those that have improved trip as an ability) and turbine is smart enough that the creatures with low tripping ability don't make trip attempts. therefore, when you do have to save vs trip, you're going up against a creature designed for that ability (worgs, jariliths, bezekiras, wolfs, etc)
    Last edited by AEschyl; 06-30-2007 at 09:08 AM.
    Aesch - Ranger 13|Paladin 3 ~ Aeschill - Sorceror 16
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  3. #3
    Community Member The_Cataclysm's Avatar
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    For the difficulty, you might want to notice that it was an improved trip, not a regular.

    As for things being in the wrong order. The game does this quite a bit. If you will notice when you die your buffs are listed as being stripped before it lists you taking the final damage that kills you.

  4. #4
    Community Member AEschyl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Cataclysm View Post
    For the difficulty, you might want to notice that it was an improved trip, not a regular.

    As for things being in the wrong order. The game does this quite a bit. If you will notice when you die your buffs are listed as being stripped before it lists you taking the final damage that kills you.
    lol, beat ya to it
    Aesch - Ranger 13|Paladin 3 ~ Aeschill - Sorceror 16
    You Cant Shake The Devil's Hand and Say You're Only Kidding.

  5. #5
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    Running through tangleroot on a level 14 barbarian I noticed the same coincidence. CR 5 mobs tripping me on fairly high rolls. With a 15 strength modifier I should rarely be tripped, even against higher level mobs, however it seems like anything can trip me no matter what cr it is.

  6. #6
    Founder Ghoste's Avatar
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    10 Base DC
    +4 improved trip
    =14
    All that worg needs is a str bonus of +2 to beat your roll of 15.

    The roll to get back up is a balance check.

    My fighter's trip DC is currently 36, and im expecting it to be up to 40 soon. At 36 it takes a str score (or dex) of 44 just to save on a roll of 19 against that.

  7. #7
    Community Member AEschyl's Avatar
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    yup, good trippers sacrifice good-damage during those trip attempts to be able to do so, and if you have a high balance... you're gonna be up on your feet again before he has a chance to swap to a good weapon to finish you off with.

    just make sure you kill him before his trip timer resets
    Aesch - Ranger 13|Paladin 3 ~ Aeschill - Sorceror 16
    You Cant Shake The Devil's Hand and Say You're Only Kidding.

  8. #8
    Community Member LIMBUS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AEschyl View Post
    yup, good trippers sacrifice good-damage during those trip attempts to be able to do so, and if you have a high balance... you're gonna be up on your feet again before he has a chance to swap to a good weapon to finish you off with.

    just make sure you kill him before his trip timer resets

    Unless its a jarilith!

  9. #9
    Community Member AEschyl's Avatar
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    well, if it's a jarilith - pull out your double-banishers... put on your balance +13 item... and swing away praying!
    Aesch - Ranger 13|Paladin 3 ~ Aeschill - Sorceror 16
    You Cant Shake The Devil's Hand and Say You're Only Kidding.

  10. #10
    Community Member Stormanne's Avatar
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    Jariliths are nothing as long as you are lucky and wield a vorpal...emphasis on lucky. Ran PoP last night, made the run for a couple of party members. When I went to jump onto the crystallized dragon bridge, I missed and ran into the jariliths at the bottom. Started swinging madly and got three consecutive 20's that were confirmed crit. So, all in all, a good vorpal and some good luck will get you out of a tight spot way more often than a good save table....lol

  11. #11
    Community Member Rog's Avatar
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    Default dog food

    my low level goes against improved trip by the doggies they eat me does not matter that my str was 24 at the time i am just dog food to them why do they get improved trip again. five minutes laying on the ground i die have a lot of hitpoints u know takes them a while
    lunarsong
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    Last edited by Rog; 07-01-2007 at 05:21 AM.

  12. #12
    Community Member JD2134's Avatar
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    1ST I think the save for trip should be based off ones balance, While the roll to stand back up should be based on your str. Come one we trip cause we lose our balance and we stand back up when we have enough str.. Case in point get drunk lose you balance fall down

  13. #13
    Founder Riggs's Avatar
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    Default Monster trip is way overpowered

    Most monsters still dont need to hit to trip. And get Improved Trip as well.

    Overrun is also way overpowered.

    Part of AC is dodging ability. If a monster doesnt hit you it shouldnt be able to trip you.

    Since monsters have much higher stat scores than players, it is a lot harder to trip a monster than for a monster to trip a player.

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghoste View Post
    10 Base DC
    +4 improved trip
    =14
    All that worg needs is a str bonus of +2 to beat your roll of 15.

    The roll to get back up is a balance check.

    My fighter's trip DC is currently 36, and im expecting it to be up to 40 soon. At 36 it takes a str score (or dex) of 44 just to save on a roll of 19 against that.
    Actually he siad his mod was 15, not his roll.
    Clerics of Fernia
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cowdenicus View Post
    Actually he siad his mod was 15, not his roll.
    To be fair, I think he was talking about the OP.

    Sometimes it's just bad luck that you get tripped...much like a paladin dying from a finger of death or whatnot. 1's happen .
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  16. #16

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    oh i know that feeling, look at my loot pulls.
    Clerics of Fernia
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  17. #17
    Community Member Racolus's Avatar
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    Well, the first roll against the trip is a STRENGTH check, which is much harder to improve, it is a roll that just add your str mod.

    The second is a balance skill check, which can be modified by skill rank, item mod and feat, along with ability. This check, needless to say, is much easier.

    Hence, everyone falls easily, prior to the AE trip correction, the red lions in Gianthold can trip few players at the same time. The difference is how quick they get up.

    IMO, balance check should replace the the first check as well, for consistency sake.

  18. #18
    Community Member Balthazar_No_Oni's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Racolus View Post
    Well, the first roll against the trip is a STRENGTH check, which is much harder to improve, it is a roll that just add your str mod.

    The second is a balance skill check, which can be modified by skill rank, item mod and feat, along with ability. This check, needless to say, is much easier.

    Hence, everyone falls easily, prior to the AE trip correction, the red lions in Gianthold can trip few players at the same time. The difference is how quick they get up.

    IMO, balance check should replace the the first check as well, for consistency sake.
    Its actually a str or DEX check, whichever is higher.
    Chairman of the Mabarian Citizens Against Trading in LFM Association.

  19. #19
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    And if we're playing this game now, if they fail their trip attempt and don't have some ability stating they get to trip for free, then we get to try to trip them back...unless they drop whatever weapon they were using .

    For example...the hobgoblins with their darned pikes.
    Arathel - Cleric 16
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  20. #20
    Community Member Netminder69's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JD2134 View Post
    1ST I think the save for trip should be based off ones balance, While the roll to stand back up should be based on your str. Come one we trip cause we lose our balance and we stand back up when we have enough str.. Case in point get drunk lose you balance fall down
    hat's not how tripping works in D&D though. It's a touch attack by the tripper (although I don't think DDO implemented it as a touch attack, probably because of nbo Attacks of Opportunity in DOO) followed by an opposed STR vs. STR or DEX roll.

    The worst thing about how it's implemente dis how the critters spam the tripping when you're on the ground. Once you're prone, you SHOULD NOT be able to be tripped again. They keep doign it though.

    Also, critters shouldnt' have the improved trip feat. They should have the imp. trip critter ability where they get a free chance to trip IF THEY HIT.

    Big surprise that isn't implemented correctly.

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