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View Full Version : empower and maximize and regular versus SLA spells today... October 2018

silvarstar
10-15-2018, 06:37 PM
I've been googling for how maximize and empower work and made the mistake of reading really old threads on the subject.

looking at the definition to try and figure this out I see:

http://ddowiki.com/page/Maximize_Spell
Spell Power increased by +150. Spells will cost 25 additional spell points

http://ddowiki.com/page/Empower_Spell
increases the Spell Power of each spell by +75, but makes the affected spell cost 15 more spell points.

ok so more cost for more spell power I get that.

Questions

1) turning them both on increases spell power by 225, but costs an additional 35 spell points, right?
(Base SP Cost) + 35 = x
2) I hear SLAs are not affected by Spell cost? Free?
meaning they get the 225 Spell power increase but still cast at SLA SP cost? 6 sp, 4 sp etc...
(Base SLA Cost) = x
do I have that right?

glmfw1
10-15-2018, 06:46 PM
I've been googling for how maximize and empower work and made the mistake of reading really old threads on the subject.

looking at the definition to try and figure this out I see:

http://ddowiki.com/page/Maximize_Spell
Spell Power increased by +150. Spells will cost 25 additional spell points

http://ddowiki.com/page/Empower_Spell
increases the Spell Power of each spell by +75, but makes the affected spell cost 15 more spell points.

ok so more cost for more spell power I get that.

Questions

1) turning them both on increases spell power by 225, but costs an additional 35 spell points, right?
(Base SP Cost) + 35 = x
2) I hear SLAs are not affected by Spell cost? Free?
meaning they get the 225 Spell power increase but still cast at SLA SP cost? 6 sp, 4 sp etc...
(Base SLA Cost) = x
do I have that right?

Costs & Benefits for applying metamagics stack, so yes... you pay the sum of the extra spell point costs, but get all the benefits

For SLAs, there is no cost for applying metamagics, so they still cost the base SLA cost, but you still get all the benefits.

In general, if you don't have the efficient meta-magic enhancements (or items that grant efficient metamagic) it's not a great idea to use them on lower level spells (the cost often outweighs the benefit). BUT there can be circumstances where it's useful... e.g. you may be able to cast a damage spell without metamagics many times with the spell point cost of the metamagicked version, doing more total damage over time, but if the enemy is regenerating or healing, the metamagicked version may take them down in one go, where otherwise they would still be alive after the same SP cost.
I had hotbar slots for spells with and without metamagic, and used whichever was more appropriate at the time.

silvarstar
10-15-2018, 07:31 PM
Costs & Benefits for applying metamagics stack, so yes... you pay the sum of the extra spell point costs, but get all the benefits

For SLAs, there is no cost for applying metamagics, so they still cost the base SLA cost, but you still get all the benefits.

In general, if you don't have the efficient meta-magic enhancements (or items that grant efficient metamagic) it's not a great idea to use them on lower level spells (the cost often outweighs the benefit). BUT there can be circumstances where it's useful... e.g. you may be able to cast a damage spell without metamagics many times with the spell point cost of the metamagicked version, doing more total damage over time, but if the enemy is regenerating or healing, the metamagicked version may take them down in one go, where otherwise they would still be alive after the same SP cost.
I had hotbar slots for spells with and without metamagic, and used whichever was more appropriate at the time.

Thanks makes sense.

As a general share to any other newbies that might come across this. I just learned you can right click on spells in the hotbar to set the modes on a per spell basis. Very cool!

glmfw1
10-15-2018, 08:22 PM
Thanks makes sense.

As a general share to any other newbies that might come across this. I just learned you can right click on spells in the hotbar to set the modes on a per spell basis. Very cool!

Completely unrelated to your topic, but do you know that you can drag multi-selector spells onto the hotbar individually? e.g. Summon monster spells have 3 monsters - you can have a shortcut for each one, to save the extra click.
You can also put multiple versions of the same spell on the hotbars... e.g. have 3 hotbars next to each other with the same 10 spells - Hotbar 1 no metamagics, Hotbar 2 just 1 metamagic, Hotbar 3 all metamagics, then you can easily cast the version you need at the time, with no fuss.

MasterKernel
10-16-2018, 01:36 AM
a) You could/can simply test it in the game, it's free, you know. :-D
b) Yes and no. Because 25+15 was 40 last time I've checked. ^_^
c) Yes, the SLA's will maintain their cost. Just as the descriptions say they would.

silvarstar
10-17-2018, 06:50 AM
a) You could/can simply test it in the game, it's free, you know. :-D
b) Yes and no. Because 25+15 was 40 last time I've checked. ^_^
c) Yes, the SLA's will maintain their cost. Just as the descriptions say they would.

Ya I think I read some old posts and that number stuck. Ref: https://www.google.com/search?q=maximize%20empower%2035%20ddo

Yet the spirit of the question is there though the math is likely not 100% right ;). Agree 25+15=40.

glmfw1
10-17-2018, 10:00 AM
a) You could/can simply test it in the game, it's free, you know. :-D
The problem with testing some things in game is that you can't always easily see the answer. Some things are displayed clearly, while others are badly displayed or impacted by something else, so while you think you know the answer from what you see, you can't be 100% certain. Some things that experienced players take for granted are rather obscurely located/displayed, so even though it's there, newer players struggle to find the info.

It would probably be a hugely intensive job, but I would love to see all the spells, SLAs, Active Enhancements, Random Clickies, buff bar items updated to use standard terminology in descriptions, always include current duration/cooldown/spellpower/spell point cost/DC/range etc where relevant. Too often a bit of obvious info is left out from certain displays and different (sometimes ambiguous) wording is used to describe things that function the same way, leading new players (and sometimes experienced players who have only played one type of class) to ask questions that should be answered by the displays in game, the moment the query occurs to them.