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Igognito
07-13-2018, 11:39 AM
Hi all,

as it is well known invisibility is badly broken in DDO.

This thread is (a) pointing out that we want invisibility to be corrected; (b) a suggestion for correcting invisibility.

Currently, invisibility is working more like a beacon to attract monsters rather than a buff to hide you from.

Invisibility should work like you are INVISIBLE not you are pin pointed regardless...
In p&p D&D someone can only pin point you if the roll a listen with a -20!
And to be precise when you are NOT using stealth (just casually walking) the opponent has a DC: 10-Armor Check Penalty for listen and an extra -20 penalty on the roll.
Thus a minimum of listen check 30.

Going stealthy that would bea DC: d20+move silently+20.

Furthermore, even if you are pin pointed in p&p D&D you can not be targeted! All target based spells should not work vs an invisible target unless the caster can actually see the invisible creature. And all creatures have a 50% miss chance with attacks.

We can agree on a middle ground here: 50% chance of target spells to work.

Caster mobs, can use see invisibility or something like that if they want to easily target you...

Anyhow, as invisibility is currently it is pretty much useless.
I personally use it at wilderness only, I shadow walk invisible to find fast the dungeon entrance. No need to say that I get red DA but shadow walk outruns most things and the 50% miss chance protects me pretty well. In other words shadow walk does 90% of the work. Invisibility is only for when I bump just on the monster. It seems that the monsters take a second or so to attack u when u are invisible.

I guess someone that knows a dungeon perfectly can use a similar tactic to avoid all fights and finish the dungeon faster. If that is their thing, I do not see why not. Especially on Normal-Hard.

I would suggest the following mechanics for invisibility:
a) Targeted actions/spells and attacks have 50% miss chance even when pin pointed.
b) Impose a -20 on listen checks to be detected.
c) Reduce aggro of monsters based on the difficulty: -50% for normal, -30% for hard, -10% for elite and at 0% for all r.

Detecting Invisible creatures:
Named monsters automatically see Invisible creatures.
Champions automatically pin point Invisible creatures. (Not see so still the have a 50% miss chance with any attack or target spell/power)
Reaper champions can have invisibility purge as a debuff!
All other creatures roll a listen check to pin point Invisible creatures:
Invisible character on stealth: DC: 1d20 + Move Silently +20
Invisible character not on stealth: DC: 30-Armor Check Penalty+min(Dex modifier, 0) <- this penalizes the player if dex less than 10.
Currently, from my understanding it is:
Invisible character on stealth: DC: 1d20 + Move Silently
Invisible character not on stealth: DC: 0
A middle ground is:
Invisible character on stealth: DC: 1d20 + Move Silently +20
Invisible character not on stealth: DC: 20

Interacting with non enemies:
Invisibility normally breaks when u interact with creatures. Not with the environment. But this is not essential as it is easy to recast in DDO.

to the Developers: PLEASE Fix invisibility and stealth playing. At least for Normal-Elite difficulties.

A final suggestion: The creature intelligence could alter the way to handle invisible creatures. At old school p&p D&D creatures with int 12+ (that would be 16+ for 3.5 edition) where allowed a save (under DM's discretion) to disbelieve and thus see an invisible creature.

Thank you

Saekee
07-13-2018, 03:06 PM
interesting thoughts. A lot of people do not know the difference between invisibility and stealth, but then they do not know the difference between a gorilla and a chimpanzee either. And hey, monkeys.