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Cocomajobo
03-27-2018, 03:13 PM
Welcome to the U38 Content Preview! We expect Lamannia to be open in the next hour or so. In the meantime we're putting out all the release notes while we work to open up the server. This preview is expected to run through Thursday March 29th. There will be a Dev event where Kookie Kobold and I will be available to run content with you and answer questions live on Wednesday evening from 8-10PM Eastern.

We would love your feedback to everything in this preview to be placed here in the Lamannia section of the forums and to submit any bug reports through the usual means at this link (https://help.standingstonegames.com/hc/en-us/requests/new).

NOTE:
This color means a that this thing was not in the first preview.
This color means that this thing was in the first preview.

Without further rambling here are the U38 Content Preview Release Notes:


Features Threads


The "Disciples of Rage" Adventure Pack (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/495170-U38-Preview-2-Disciples-of-Rage-Adventure-Pack)
The U38 Named Loot (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/495171-U38-Preview-2-Loot)
The Artificer Enhancement Tree: Renegade Mastermaker (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/495173-U38-Preview-2-Artificer)
The Full Druid Pass (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/495172-U38-Preview-2-Druid)


Combat


Character Dual-Wielding weapons will now do their full normal damage while moving.
Reaper Memento abilities are now less likely to go on cooldown without actually activating when used.


Enhancements


Monk: Henshin Mystic: Core Enhancement Melee Power has been adjusted from (10/10/10/10/10/25) to (3/3/3/3/3/15) to bring it closer to other Enhancement trees.
Monk: Shintao: "Touch of the Void Dragon" now gives +5 Melee Power.
Monk: Shintao: "To Seek Perfection" now gives +15 Melee Power.
Vistani Knife Fighter: Vistani Weapon Versatility now applies only to daggers and throwing daggers.


Epic Destinies
The Melee Power in the Cores of each Epic Destiny have been adjusted to give an overall boost to melee in Epics:


Fatesinger: +10 Melee Power per Core.
Grandmaster of Flowers: +10 Melee Power per Core
Shadowdancer: +10 Melee Power per Core
Fury of the Wild: +6 Melee Power per Core
Primal Avatar: +10 Melee Power per Core
Divine Crusader: +3 Melee Power per Core
Unyelding Sentinel: +5 Melee Power per Core
Legendary Dreadnaught: unchanged


Items


Scrolls of Curative Admixture: Cure Critical Wounds now occasionally drop in treasure wherever 5th level scrolls drop.
Fixed an issue where some Sentient Jewels now play personality-specific reactions when Filigree and Jewels are slotted or unslotted.
Character hand color is now correct when equipping the Robe of Celebration.
The base damage of the Duality handwraps has been changed to 1d6+3. The base damage of other Ravenloft-era handwraps and collars is now 1d6+2.
Projectiles from Cold Bolt Rune Arms are now twice as large.
Projectiles from Cold Bolt Rune Arms now have homing.


Quests and Adventure Areas


Recalling from the Ravenloft landscape after using one of the tavern transport NPCs now correctly sends you back to the Ravenloft tavern you came from instead of House Jorasco.
The Blue Water Inn exit sign now has the same options as the Blood on the Vine and Van Richten's tower do.
Fixed an issue where the wrong ambient sounds were playing in Eveningstar and Eveningstar Cavern.
Fixed an issue where a sound in the Spinner's Prison and the Demonweb wouldn't turn off even after you left the area.


Miscellaneous

Characters who currently have 1 or more Druid levels should receive a +3 Heart of Wood in their inventory when they log in.
Fixed a launcher issue that will correct some Direct X installation problems on Windows 10. The Direct X Web Installer is now installed along with the launcher.
Direct X Install has been added to the "Repair" tab. This can be found by opening Options from the menu then switching to the repair tab.
Corrected an issue so the Akamai SDK updates properly on a Mac installation.
A link to the Character Transfer Guide has been added to the transfer wizard in the launcher.
The DDO installation log path no longer includes a reference to Turbine.
An "Explore Log Folder" menu option has been added to the game launcher that will open the folder where the launcher and game client logs are placed.


PREVIEW ONLY
Significant work on the Test Dojo. This was to re-organize flow and (mostly) to improve performance with loading and using the dojo by removing more than half the things in it.


The former loot room (to the "west" of the entryway) is now empty, and has been walled off.
The former really-really-old loot room (to the "northeast" of the entryway, behind the trainers) has been removed entirely
There's a new NPC meant to give out the most recent update's loot standing near the Trainers. (It now has the u38 loot!)
There's a new Waypoint in the Dojo near the trainers, which leads to a new room called The Loot Pit. This room has all the stuff the West Loot Room used to have, plus a new NPC that will have all the Ravenloft loot.
There are Hearts of Blood in the Dojo now.

Arkat
03-27-2018, 03:45 PM
Wow. My pure 20 Shintao monk will lose 36 Melee Power because of this new update on top of the Duality nerf.

Not cool.

Cocomajobo
03-27-2018, 04:10 PM
Lamannia should now be open to players! Let us know what you think in the various threads!

unbongwah
03-27-2018, 04:11 PM
Miscellaneous

Characters who currently have 1 or more Druid levels should receive a +3 Heart of Wood in their inventory when they log in.



Oooh, better go splash druid on a whole bunch of toons now. Even when getting rid of that unnecessary druid level, I'll still have +2 class changes left!

;)

edrein
03-27-2018, 04:53 PM
Still no clarification on Vistani Single Dagger. It's not working with orbs or shields but is working with runearms. Can we get a confirmation this is WAI or not? This would certainly help a lot of struggling builds (Vol dagger user, vistani splashes, etc.).

Qhualor
03-27-2018, 05:05 PM
Combat


Character Dual-Wielding weapons will now do their full normal damage while moving.


Quests and Adventure Areas

Fixed an issue where the wrong ambient sounds were playing in Eveningstar and Eveningstar Cavern.

Fixed an issue where a sound in the Spinner's Prison and the Demonweb wouldn't turn off even after you left the area.


this is what I look forward to the most this update. the fix to the sounds makes me giddy like you wouldn't believe.

Avocado
03-27-2018, 05:06 PM
Any changes to avatar of nature and cleaves? Aka trees? I didn't see it anywhere.

LrdSlvrhnd
03-27-2018, 05:21 PM
Significant work on the Test Dojo. This was to re-organize flow and (mostly) to improve performance with loading and using the dojo by removing more than half the things in it.





Test Dojo stuff is great... but can you make Fred give free feat respecs also? Or at least include all the various types of Sib shards up through Flawless on the table next to him? Having to either crunch a bajillion sib shards down or go through an LR to change out one feat is very annoying.

Cocomajobo
03-27-2018, 05:34 PM
Test Dojo stuff is great... but can you make Fred give free feat respecs also? Or at least include all the various types of Sib shards up through Flawless on the table next to him? Having to either crunch a bajillion sib shards down or go through an LR to change out one feat is very annoying.

Done!

Gratch
03-27-2018, 06:27 PM
Test Dojo stuff is great... but can you make Fred give free feat respecs also? Or at least include all the various types of Sib shards up through Flawless on the table next to him? Having to either crunch a bajillion sib shards down or go through an LR to change out one feat is very annoying.

Why don't you just use 15 astral shards which if I remember right also doesn't put you on respec timer?

Free Poincalot Points DDO Stored into Astral Shards.

Donny_b
03-27-2018, 06:59 PM
Enhancements

[LIST]
Monk: Henshin Mystic: Core Enhancement Melee Power has been adjusted from (10/10/10/10/10/25) to (3/3/3/3/3/15) to bring it closer to other Enhancement trees.
Monk: Shintao: "Touch of the Void Dragon" now gives +5 Melee Power.
Monk: Shintao: "To Seek Perfection" now gives +15 Melee Power.


I understand the Nerf to Henshin - the low requirements made Melee power grab exceedingly easy. But why Shintao 18/20 levels? All you are doing is making underwhelming monks prior to level 29. The problem isn't melee power in this tree, we will still be able to easily attain 300-350 end game - the problem was the extremely overpowerful Duality wraps. Please reconsider this nerf to Shintao 18/20 cores.

steadlere
03-27-2018, 07:09 PM
I understand the Nerf to Henshin - the low requirements made Melee power grab exceedingly easy. But why Shintao 18/20 levels? All you are doing is making underwhelming monks prior to level 29. The problem isn't melee power in this tree, we will still be able to easily attain 300-350 end game - the problem was the extremely overpowerful Duality wraps. Please reconsider this nerf to Shintao 18/20 cores.

I agree with the shintao part, and a good alternative to the Henshin nerf would have been to lower melee power when using unarmed/hanwraps and leave it as is for two weapon fighting(so it wont affect as much pure henshin mystic player and stop if from being an easy grab for multiclassing a druid in animal form by exemple)

Donny_b
03-27-2018, 07:22 PM
I agree with the shintao part, and a good alternative to the Henshin nerf would have been to lower melee power when using unarmed/hanwraps and leave it as is for two weapon fighting(so it wont affect as much pure henshin mystic player and stop if from being an easy grab for multiclassing a druid in animal form by exemple)

Yes, I wholly agree as well. Adding a gradient would certainly allow more versatility. Besides, it's already been reckoned, a monk stick build is by far one of the weakest builds available, even post-passe. The solution certainly isn't to Nerf it even further.

3MP while centered, 10mp while wielding a staff and centered.

LrdSlvrhnd
03-27-2018, 07:50 PM
Done!

Sweet, thanks!


Why don't you just use 15 astral shards which if I remember right also doesn't put you on respec timer?

Free Poincalot Points DDO Stored into Astral Shards.

Because to be honest, I never thought about that. But just making it free (like they did) both makes it easier, and likewise doesn't have a respec timer.

Avocado
03-27-2018, 07:57 PM
I understand the Nerf to Henshin - the low requirements made Melee power grab exceedingly easy. But why Shintao 18/20 levels? All you are doing is making underwhelming monks prior to level 29. The problem isn't melee power in this tree, we will still be able to easily attain 300-350 end game - the problem was the extremely overpowerful Duality wraps. Please reconsider this nerf to Shintao 18/20 cores.

I disagree. Monks had far more melee power then any other tree (75). Kensei has 60 potential, rogues have 15, rangers have 20, druids have 25 now, paladins have 10, swashy has none, monks have 37 now. Not to mention monks still get thier die improvements which is worth more then melee power. Other classes can't get die improvements like monks. Monks are going to still be top dps and will somehow still hit harder then my mual fighter build, which makes no logical sense. Not to mention monks get the ability to do sneak attack damage all the time and have hide as a class skill. Other then rogues, no one else gets this. This is a good step in balance of monks. And monks not good until 29? They get a pair of wraps at level 11 that do 6(1d6) base damage. Thats just broken.

Donny_b
03-27-2018, 08:15 PM
I disagree. Monks had far more melee power then any other tree (75). Kensei has 60 potential, rogues have 15, rangers have 20, druids have 25 now, paladins have 10, swashy has none, monks have 37 now. Not to mention monks still get thier die improvements which is worth more then melee power. Other classes can't get die improvements like monks. Monks are going to still be top dps and will somehow still hit harder then my mual fighter build, which makes no logical sense. Not to mention monks get the ability to do sneak attack damage all the time and have hide as a class skill. Other then rogues, no one else gets this. This is a good step in balance of monks. And monks not good until 29? They get a pair of wraps at level 11 that do 6(1d6) base damage. Thats just broken.


Once henshin is nerfed, nobody is going to want to waste 20 pts into a tree that is largely useless to wrap builds for 12 melee power. They will very, very likely start going Ninja Spy more for helpless dmg. And you cannot possibly make a base argument based on a broken handwrap dmg that will eventually be fixed, not to mention they are very likely not to be used from 10-29. Again, the Duality wraps are what is overpowered, bot Shintao core 18/20. And I never said they are unviable til 29 - not once did I say that, I said they will become underwhelmed until 29 because that overpower you are referring to comes from overpowered wraps, not melee power in Shintao. Again, even with this nerf, a monk can still achieve 300-350 melee power (end game level 30)(so can most other melee classes). Again, the melee power is NOT the problem in Shintao. The problem is Henshin low requirements for melee power and overpowered duality wraps.

Avocado
03-27-2018, 08:25 PM
Once henshin is nerfed, nobody is going to want to waste 20 pts into a tree that is largely useless to wrap builds for 12 melee power. They will very, very likely start going Ninja Spy more for helpless dmg. And you cannot possibly make a base argument based on a broken handwrap dmg that will eventually be fixed. Again, the Duality wraps are what is overpowered, bot Shintao core 18/20. And I never said they are unviable til 29 - not once did I say that, I said they will become underwhelmed until 29 because that overpower you are referring to comes from overpowered wraps, not melee power in Shintao. Again, even with this nerf, a monk can still achieve 300-350 melee power (end game level 30)(so can most other melee classes). Again, the melee power is NOT the problem in Shintao. The problem is Henshin low requirements for melee power and overpowered duality wraps.

Melee power was part of problem. In no world should handwraps be hitting for 2k damage a hit when a maul was only hitting for 700. Also what do you mean by underwhelming? What is a not underwhelming end game build that isnt underwhelming until 29?

Donny_b
03-27-2018, 08:27 PM
Melee power was part of problem. In no world should handwraps be hitting for 2k damage a hit when a maul was only hitting for 700.

Is everything I'm saying here going over your head? That dmg is almost solely due to Duality. Again, by level 30, I will STILL be able to get close to 300-350 melee power.

Donny_b
03-27-2018, 08:49 PM
Melee power was part of problem. In no world should handwraps be hitting for 2k damage a hit when a maul was only hitting for 700. Also what do you mean by underwhelming? What is a not underwhelming end game build that isnt underwhelming until 29?

Sorry. Let's do some math here.

I am not going to add +w from feats, enhancements and epic destinies as none of these are a proposed problem

Duality, now = 7(1d6+6)+15 = 80 avg per hit with absolutely no modifiers.

With exclusive Shintao MP of 35 = 80*.35=108

New Shintao MP = 96

Duality, proposed = 7(1d6+3)+15 = 60.5 avg per hit with absolutely no modifiers. (A 25% cut in dmg right there)

Exclusive Shintao MP =81.67

New Shintao MP=72.6

Cutting Shintao melee power only hurts mom's between 20-29, even after duality changes.

Really, I'd suggest a further reduction down to a (1d6+2) which would amount to approximately 35% dmg reduction from current wraps.

Any build running Blitz, on top of prowess' filigree can be hitting well over 1k. Shintao melee power= not a problem. Henshin melee power= a problem. Duality dmg die modifer+high W on monks is.

If I can buff up to 306 melee power, right now, before nerfs, without henshin, do you REALLY think that having 15 less melee power will affect my dps very much at 30, or more so between 20-29 before I can even come close to that number?

lLockehart
03-27-2018, 09:08 PM
I'm hyped to build a Meleeficer and the Druid changes seem to be in a workable format. My greatest critique is the change in the Epic destiny trees which... are very strange to me:

Melees are in no need of more damage, they damage just fine - the competitive builds. Rather the mobs should have less HP inflation. The main problem with Melees is that we don't have a good metric for survivability outside of stacking every dodge source imaginable. It's do or die situation in most high level content in contrast of -losing hp- where we don't really, we don't lose hp in DDO, if the mob does hit you, you're nuked which is very strange with things like a small spider that TWF hits you for a bazzilion damage.

This change not only doesn't cover the main problem, it possibly creates new ones. 10 power/core is insanely good and you're probably better off in Shadowdancer or Primal Avatar than you're on Dreadnaught which is a real shame because you're basically trading sweet and interactive clickies for bland passive power that doesn't fit the class in any way.

And in the future, when a solution is found for a good defensive metric to use, the Melees will be as strong as they were when Citw released because they're now jacked with 60 power. It doesn't sound much but it really is, you can barely keep Blitzing to match the same power. Maybe give some HP % per core or something like that? I have no clue for a good defensive metric at this point but I'm pretty sure this change isn't very good at all.

Avocado
03-27-2018, 09:38 PM
Is everything I'm saying here going over your head? That dmg is almost solely due to Duality. Again, by level 30, I will STILL be able to get close to 300-350 melee power.

No, its not. But you seem to thing duality is the only issue. Its not. Melee power was given to generously to monks when there are plenty of dps trees that get very little. I dont want handwraps hitting for more damage on a base number then a freaking maul. It doesnt make sense.

Show me the numbers for your melee power:

30 epic
8 ring if people still use this (not likely)
20 shintao
88 legendary w/full blitz
75 prowess (really 37.5)
20 sentient

maybe 9 henshin.

that's 250 or really 212.5. That isnt anywhere near 300 or 350.

And even if you can hit 350. Why the heck are you complaining about a drop of 15? That is 5% drop in melee power amount. Seems reasonable to me.

I have no personal vendetta against monks, i just want to see sane damage numbers from monks that dont eclipse the next best melees by over 30%.

steadlere
03-27-2018, 10:06 PM
I disagree. Monks had far more melee power then any other tree (75). Kensei has 60 potential, rogues have 15, rangers have 20, druids have 25 now, paladins have 10, swashy has none, monks have 37 now. Not to mention monks still get thier die improvements which is worth more then melee power. Other classes can't get die improvements like monks. Monks are going to still be top dps and will somehow still hit harder then my mual fighter build, which makes no logical sense. Not to mention monks get the ability to do sneak attack damage all the time and have hide as a class skill. Other then rogues, no one else gets this. This is a good step in balance of monks. And monks not good until 29? They get a pair of wraps at level 11 that do 6(1d6) base damage. Thats just broken.

I think you are putting a lot of things together there to make an unfair comparison. yes the henshin has a potential of 75MP if you are ready to invest a lot in it but since a a tree mostly for staff, either a lot of point are wasted or you are using a staff which does not benefit from die improvements. the same for sneak attack you need to invest a lot in ninja spy to make it viable.

If I take one of my monks as an exemple(pure), 41points in shintao and 31 in henshin, I got 145MP at lvl30 + grandmaster. Those changes with the core of both tree will make me lose 50MP effectively dropping my dps by a third which is insane. monk are taking a hit every update or 2, they really aren't overpowered right now...

And yes monks get good MP but they don't have much awesome stuff anymore

cru121
03-27-2018, 11:15 PM
I got 145MP at lvl30 + grandmaster. Those changes with the core of both tree will make me lose 50MP effectively dropping my dps by a third which is insane.
Your math is off.

mraz
03-28-2018, 01:41 AM
so if every ED getting melee power per core why not some ranged power as well? at least for shiradi and fury (choose between melee or ranged power)?

Avocado
03-28-2018, 01:48 AM
I think you are putting a lot of things together there to make an unfair comparison. yes the henshin has a potential of 75MP if you are ready to invest a lot in it but since a a tree mostly for staff, either a lot of point are wasted or you are using a staff which does not benefit from die improvements. the same for sneak attack you need to invest a lot in ninja spy to make it viable.

If I take one of my monks as an exemple(pure), 41points in shintao and 31 in henshin, I got 145MP at lvl30 + grandmaster. Those changes with the core of both tree will make me lose 50MP effectively dropping my dps by a third which is insane. monk are taking a hit every update or 2, they really aren't overpowered right now...

And yes monks get good MP but they don't have much awesome stuff anymore

I think we are seeing different monk builds. The ones i see and play with are doing 2k + 800 SA damage a hit with 300+ melee power hitting almost over 200 hits a minute. To the average player this isnt achievable. To the power gamers i play with, this is what they do.

I would say that the average player might not notice much of a difference after this change. And now they will less inclined to try this. Play what you want to play, but dont make monks the only option for really high dps, it makes other dps builds feel sub-optimal and worthless. He is doing 4x damage that i am so why should i bother to play my toon. Its a rather large blow to self-esteem.

I prefer to see people play ddo in the style that they want to play the build they are playing and arent being forced into to option because it does 30% more dps then the next best build because they want to max dps.
With this change to monks, they will still do lots of dps, but now fighters and tempest rangers and vanguards will be able to compete and be comparable.

Dalsheel
03-28-2018, 02:45 AM
So monks were at the top of the food chain for 1 update for the very 1st time in DDO history and in the very next update you're nerfing them to oblivion. Well done SSG.

At least we'll be able to play Druid for ~3months before you start nerfing them as well.

steadlere
03-28-2018, 07:25 AM
Your math is off.

shintao tier 5 + capstone = currently 35MP will be reduce to 5/15 total 20(15Drop)
henshin 5 first core(10/10/10/10/10) = 50MP will be reduce to 3/3/3/3/3 total 15 (35drop)

Total of 50MP drop for my monk

Donny_b
03-28-2018, 09:00 AM
No, its not. But you seem to thing duality is the only issue. Its not. Melee power was given to generously to monks when there are plenty of dps trees that get very little. I dont want handwraps hitting for more damage on a base number then a freaking maul. It doesnt make sense.

Show me the numbers for your melee power:

30 epic
8 ring if people still use this (not likely)
20 shintao
88 legendary w/full blitz
75 prowess (really 37.5)
20 sentient

maybe 9 henshin.

that's 250 or really 212.5. That isnt anywhere near 300 or 350.

And even if you can hit 350. Why the heck are you complaining about a drop of 15? That is 5% drop in melee power amount. Seems reasonable to me.

I have no personal vendetta against monks, i just want to see sane damage numbers from monks that dont eclipse the next best melees by over 30%.

Refer my second reply. Duality + modifier to d6 on the large +w modifier of monks, is in fact, the overpowered element here. I can currently buff to 306 melee power, without Henshin cores. That is at cap. Between 20-29, that will now come down to 86 at 20 to 113 at 29. Plus sentiet boost for 186-213 (the boost is 100, not 75 - textual error or bug). Until I have duality, my dps takes a nerf of 14% and 9% after nerf. Besides, people are STILL getting 1.1k + a hit even AFTER nerfs. The problem STILL remains the d6+x modifier. We can now get as much melee power as other classes, so clearly melee power in Shintao was NOT the problem.

Seikojin
03-28-2018, 10:01 AM
I did not see a topic for quality of Life discussion. So I am posting it here (where the info is).

I love the dojo changes and some of the other QoL stuff going on.

Next steps for the Dojo: Could a greensteel ingredient vendor get added? For heroic and legendary? The old lever based room offered heroic ingredients. And for a while, you could get them from somewhere else. But now you cannot, and LGS is more commonplace than before. They also make a good comparison to other weapons being introduced.

cru121
03-28-2018, 10:02 AM
shintao tier 5 + capstone = currently 35MP will be reduce to 5/15 total 20(15Drop)
henshin 5 first core(10/10/10/10/10) = 50MP will be reduce to 3/3/3/3/3 total 15 (35drop)

Total of 50MP drop for my monk

it will not decrease your DPS by a third.

Donny_b
03-28-2018, 10:08 AM
it will not decrease your DPS by a third.


If he is currently at 100 melee power, it will decrease 25% base. Not everyone plays competitively and goes for absolute maximum melee power.

cru121
03-28-2018, 10:17 AM
If he is currently at 100 melee power, it will decrease 25% base. Not everyone plays competitively and goes for absolute maximum melee power.

Still wrong. steadlere mentioned being in GMoF. GMoF gains +36 MP. If losing 14 MP decreases his/her damage by a third, something is seriously wrong.

Donny_b
03-28-2018, 10:42 AM
Still wrong. steadlere mentioned being in GMoF. GMoF gains +36 MP. If losing 14 MP decreases his/her damage by a third, something is seriously wrong.

He is talking about a loss of 50 melee power from the nerfs (though I believe it's actually 42). If his current layouts allows him 100 melee power, a decrease of 50 melee power would result in the net loss of 25% base damage.

Donny_b
03-28-2018, 10:55 AM
Still wrong. steadlere mentioned being in GMoF. GMoF gains +36 MP. If losing 14 MP decreases his/her damage by a third, something is seriously wrong.

Sorry, just looked over his comment, again. You're right.

Donny_b
03-28-2018, 11:18 AM
shintao tier 5 + capstone = currently 35MP will be reduce to 5/15 total 20(15Drop)
henshin 5 first core(10/10/10/10/10) = 50MP will be reduce to 3/3/3/3/3 total 15 (35drop)

Total of 50MP drop for my monk

You are disregarding the melee power increase to GMOF. You will afectively be at 131 melee power come the update.

I agree with the Nerf to Henshin, they made splash builds far too viable with cheap requirements for melee power. Though I do believe the Shintao nerf is incessant and unnecessary. But they're committed. They never listened to us the first time we told them monks would become ridiculously overpowered due to the new wraps.

Nickodeamous
03-28-2018, 01:17 PM
Monks are being forced into running GMOF. I run in GMOF for EIN only. I'll still get my trash kills so I feel I am helping the party out.

here is the new math for my monk MP. (I run in GMOF usually) Hint...I'll break even...BUT, I'll have to run in GMOF for constistent MP (no clickies). I do put quite a bit of points into Ninja Spy, so I have 30% helpless.

Current: 152 MP

Shintao - 35
Henshin - 20
GMOF - 24
Other - 73
Total - 152


Post U38

Shintao - 20
Henshin - 6
GMOF - 60
Other - 73
Total - 159

I think 6 MP for 2 cores in Henshin is garbage, so I'll drop Henshin and do Harper for KTA. hence, more stunning.

What I'll end up with will be this: (1 more MP than I have right now)

Post U38

Shintao - 20
Henshin - 0
GMOF - 60
Other - 73
Total - 153

Avocado
03-28-2018, 02:17 PM
Sorry. Let's do some math here.

I am not going to add +w from feats, enhancements and epic destinies as none of these are a proposed problem

Duality, now = 7(1d6+6)+15 = 80 avg per hit with absolutely no modifiers.

With exclusive Shintao MP of 35 = 80*.35=108

New Shintao MP = 96

Duality, proposed = 7(1d6+3)+15 = 60.5 avg per hit with absolutely no modifiers. (A 25% cut in dmg right there)

Exclusive Shintao MP =81.67

New Shintao MP=72.6

Cutting Shintao melee power only hurts mom's between 20-29, even after duality changes.

Really, I'd suggest a further reduction down to a (1d6+2) which would amount to approximately 35% dmg reduction from current wraps.

Any build running Blitz, on top of prowess' filigree can be hitting well over 1k. Shintao melee power= not a problem. Henshin melee power= a problem. Duality dmg die modifer+high W on monks is.

If I can buff up to 306 melee power, right now, before nerfs, without henshin, do you REALLY think that having 15 less melee power will affect my dps very much at 30, or more so between 20-29 before I can even come close to that number?

Okay why should a punchy monk get to hit that hard? No other twf build hits that hard. My maul hits 100 times a minute for the same damage where monk does 200 hits a minute. Maybe people should suggested and cried for a w die decrease from core 5 and 6. Maybe players should be thankful that didn't happen because that it's a larger nerf then the melee power. Be careful what you wish for.


Clearly 15 melee power nerf isnt a big deal to either of us. I think its warranted and you think it won't matter. So this discussion seems over?

Avocado
03-28-2018, 02:20 PM
Monks are being forced into running GMOF. I run in GMOF for EIN only. I'll still get my trash kills so I feel I am helping the party out.

here is the new math for my monk MP. (I run in GMOF usually) Hint...I'll break even...BUT, I'll have to run in GMOF for constistent MP (no clickies). I do put quite a bit of points into Ninja Spy, so I have 30% helpless.

Current: 152 MP

Shintao - 35
Henshin - 20
GMOF - 24
Other - 73
Total - 152


Post U38

Shintao - 20
Henshin - 6
GMOF - 60
Other - 73
Total - 159

I think 6 MP for 2 cores in Henshin is garbage, so I'll drop Henshin and do Harper for KTA. hence, more stunning.

What I'll end up with will be this: (1 more MP than I have right now)

Post U38

Shintao - 20
Henshin - 0
GMOF - 60
Other - 73
Total - 153

You are not being forced into gmof. You now get decide what you want to run in without having to sack 60 melee power to run in a destiny with some sub par enhacments. If anything it's a nice change because you die you lost bltiz and most of your dps. Now if you die you get to keep your melee power.

Edit: I also wouldn't care as much if my fighter could actually use the prowess to it's full effectiveness. Power surge currently procs grand prowess meaning I can only get grand prowess every 60 seconds which is not worth it over many other sentient sets. So the grand powess doesn't even work on the characters it was designed for. I get 11 melee power where as no power surge players get 37.5.

Nickodeamous
03-28-2018, 02:43 PM
You are not being forced into gmof. You now get decide what you want to run in without having to sack 60 melee power to run in a destiny with some sub par enhacments. If anything it's a nice change because you die you lost bltiz and most of your dps. Now if you die you get to keep your melee power.

I am not sure I understand your last sentence here

"If anything it's a nice change because you die you lost bltiz and most of your dps. Now if you die you get to keep your melee power."

I never used Blitz before and I don't think most of my DPS is going away. The only difference for me the way that I run is that my post nerf Duality Wraps will perform exactly like my Pre-nerf Morninglords (but now I get the 2d4 vampirism). I am happy with that. Sometimes I lead kill counts, sometimes I don't, but its a group game so I just try and do my part to help the team out. I've never really run in dreadnought, and I only socked enough points into Henshin for the 20MP. since I like to run in GMOF, I won't see a difference in MP, just the nerf for Duality.

That being said, my monk will be so-so until I hit level 29, but I like to run at cap for a while. it is what it is I guess!

Nico

Just saw your edit. I hear ya. I don't run the prowess set either, but I do run Action Boost +30 MP from Ninja tree, so I can land around 180 or so MP.

Avocado
03-28-2018, 03:41 PM
I am not sure I understand your last sentence here

"If anything it's a nice change because you die you lost bltiz and most of your dps. Now if you die you get to keep your melee power."

I never used Blitz before and I don't think most of my DPS is going away. The only difference for me the way that I run is that my post nerf Duality Wraps will perform exactly like my Pre-nerf Morninglords (but now I get the 2d4 vampirism). I am happy with that. Sometimes I lead kill counts, sometimes I don't, but its a group game so I just try and do my part to help the team out. I've never really run in dreadnought, and I only socked enough points into Henshin for the 20MP. since I like to run in GMOF, I won't see a difference in MP, just the nerf for Duality.

That being said, my monk will be so-so until I hit level 29, but I like to run at cap for a while. it is what it is I guess!

Nico

Just saw your edit. I hear ya. I don't run the prowess set either, but I do run Action Boost +30 MP from Ninja tree, so I can land around 180 or so MP.

Ah that is my mistake on assumptions. Are you saying your basically right back where you started with melee power? Decrease in heshine and shintao melee power and an increase in gmof melee power. A valid argument and it seems sucky for you. But yeah handwraps got a nerf but I think it closer to dps of other classes and splits.

Donny_b
03-28-2018, 04:47 PM
Okay why should a punchy monk get to hit that hard? No other twf build hits that hard. My maul hits 100 times a minute for the same damage where monk does 200 hits a minute. Maybe people should suggested and cried for a w die decrease from core 5 and 6. Maybe players should be thankful that didn't happen because that it's a larger nerf then the melee power. Be careful what you wish for.


Clearly 15 melee power nerf isnt a big deal to either of us. I think its warranted and you think it won't matter. So this discussion seems over?

Okay, I see literally everything I am saying to you is in fact going over your head. Where did I agree that monks should be hitting over 1k? No where. I stated that even after the Nerf, they are STILL hitting over 1k, the melee power had minimal reduction in that, rather it only hurts monks between 20-29. Never did I say it won't matter, either. Read the sentence two before this one.

AGAIN THE OVERPOWER DETAILS HERE ARE IN THE WRAPS. Get it? Got it? Good.

And of course a monk will hit harder than any other TWF. They are intended to be that way. They are supposed to be the optimal choice for single target dps, not to mention all the +w they receive.

Nickodeamous
03-28-2018, 04:53 PM
Ah that is my mistake on assumptions. Are you saying your basically right back where you started with melee power? Decrease in heshine and shintao melee power and an increase in gmof melee power. A valid argument and it seems sucky for you. But yeah handwraps got a nerf but I think it closer to dps of other classes and splits.

Yup, exactly...I get to benefit from the wraps I just got for a few weeks, then back to reality...but I am ok with reality :)

Mandelia
03-28-2018, 05:00 PM
Characters who currently have 1 or more Druid levels should receive a +3 Heart of Wood in their inventory when they log in.


This should be given to everyone. Druids will want to clean up and Monks may want to change things since you are changing things to slightly nerf them (they will still dominate ruthlessly), but the rest of us may want to change into a druid or monk to get on the same page. Just giving it to ones who happen to have one druid level at that moment is incredibly one sided.

Ballrus
03-29-2018, 10:53 AM
Welcome to the U38 Content Preview...

Monk: Henshin Mystic: Core Enhancement Melee Power has been adjusted from (10/10/10/10/10/25) to (3/3/3/3/3/15) to bring it closer to other Enhancement trees.
Monk: Shintao: "Touch of the Void Dragon" now gives +5 Melee Power.
Monk: Shintao: "To Seek Perfection" now gives +15 Melee Power.



The problem isn't melee power, is melee power AND all that bonuses to unarmed combat (all that bonuses to w AND Unnarmed strikes feats, because.... Handwraps, now are weapons.

This is the problem with monks, they got a lot of bonuses to unarmed combat, but they (shintaos) are no more unarmed.

From Wiki:

Monks are the most naturally fluent and fastest unarmed fighter in the game. Items that formerly increased your die step to damage will now augment Unarmed Strike by an additional 0.5[w].

Again:

They are no more unarmed.

Remove these bonuses OR redo the handwraps changes, if u want balance.

Des0xyn
03-29-2018, 10:41 PM
A thought, since we are adjusting the henshin cores anyway.

With the upcoming changes, come the changes to Fires of purity fire DR penalty changing from -10 penalty to fire resistance to 10% (fire?) vulnerability.

I'm guessing this form of change (from flat bypass 15 points of target's elemental resistance, to some % element vulnerability) will apply to sorcerers savants in the upcoming arcane tree changes.

So, since we are looking at henshin cores, could that be worked in to replace the "enemies have -2 fire resistances against your spells" to some % vulnerability to fire as well? Even 1% fire vulnerability per core would be better than flat -2 fire resistance when scaling into epics.

This change would allow cauldron of flame and incinerating wave to scale slightly better and also allow some better synergy from multi-classing

Ellihor
03-30-2018, 09:55 AM
The second round of nerf to monk was too much I think. I wonder if you are putting in your tests the fact that monks get 25% boost from jade, wich is kinda unfair to compare with other classes. Me and others have tested many builds on lama this opening and it doesn't seem like monks are doing better than other classes, they're equal at most, but if you discount jade they can even do a bit less. If you go on with these changes the result will just be a 2018 full of bears.

Cocomajobo
03-30-2018, 10:33 AM
Thank you all for coming out to the second preview for U38! We will be bringing the world down within the next hour. If you have any feedback on any of the new U38 features we would love it if you would direct it right here in this section of the forums!

LevelJ
03-30-2018, 12:26 PM
Well, I had a very limited time this go-round to test stuff on Lamannia due to RL stuff, but here's the general summary, complete with bugs, observations, and suggestions (the one major bug is one I submitted a report for, but I'll reiterate it here because of its severity)

I worked with two things...the Renegade Mastermaker and the Palemaster-themed set bonus.


I'll start with the Set Bonus for Palemaster: I love it. After testing it out I learned the fortitude debuff procs of Death Aura. The premise of being able to rack up fortitude penalties on enemies with Death Auras I'm assuming is WaI, and if not it should be. It is a bittersweet moment, because my Palemaster will have to give up his Epic Litany, which makes me sad. But honestly, the only reason I still have it though is because a decent Profanely Well-rounded item has eluded me thus far. But the bonuses on this are nice and should help me continue to instakill everything from Demons to Owlbears.


Renegade Mastermaker: Because of my limited time these last few days, I was not able to work on nearly as much as I wanted to, and this tree was the key point that suffered. As a result, I was not able to fully test the capability of this tree in very much questing or with decent gear, but I will still try to give my applause and concerns where I can.

First, my applause...it is a very meaty tree, one with all sorts of cool hooks to make me want to use it, something I always want in a new enhancement tree. Secondary to actual utility of course, but still important. I have recently been working on a melee SWF FvS build, and the weird thing is that its functionality can almost completely be replicated as an Artificer using Battle Engineer and Renegade. The build I came up with on the fly was a SWF Bastard Sword INT build that utilized the rune arm point-based Crowd Control abilities in RgM and Evocation DC's to run mass CC via Lightning Sphere and Tactical Detonation. It was a pure Artificer...Sun Elf. Actually worked quite well with Rejuvination of Dawn as a panic button...great for Plague Reapers especially, and I look forward to trying this build on live. The defensive abilities in RgM provided much-needed defense to the build, while Mighty Slam and Battlefist are great things to keep champions in place...sadly did not get a chance to try them on Reapers, so idk if it works on them. I do not see RgM being a very useful tree for Ranged outside of the defense options (unless you want to splash in the Rune Arm CC combo for defense), but this makes sense based on what's available. However, this is an excellent tree for both casting-based and melee-based Artificers, and I look forward to seeing more variety to come out of Artificers outside the clackity-clack-clack of a heavy repeater. :p

The only real concern I had with the tree is one I am terrified to say because I really hope it's not true, but...I was surprised at the lack of abilities that cost 2 AP. I figured the drone/constructs would cost that much, along with some other things. I really don't want them to at all, but if they do, I can't say I would be surprised if the points were adjusted, just really disappointed.


BUGS: Whelp, I play Palemasters as my primary characters, so when it came to looking for bugs, I knew exactly which buttons to push. Unbreaking Forcefield is an amazing premise for a party support option in a pinch (especially for raids), but please...for love of all things negative energy-based, don't let it kill Palemaster Negative Energy healing. My Negative Energy Burst on my main Wizard heals generally in the 500-700 or so range, though on my other Palemaster it tends to be higher. I got the assistance of one of the many wandering Artificers in the dojo to cast Unbreaking Forcefield on me for testing purposes, and sure enough...my negative energy healing absolutely plummeted down to a measly 51 points during those 6 seconds.

Yes, it only lasts 6 seconds. But given that the forcefield is only ideal to be used in situations bordering on a party wipe, there is no reason the Palemaster should be nigh guaranteed to die from the very ability intended to save him/her. And no, this is not the only "Barrier" ability that does this (yea, I had a reason for asking people to cast the ability on me...I had a sneaking suspicion this would happen). The devs are probably already aware of my long list of bug reports related to this issue (Arcane Barrier, Action Boost: Thick Skinned), but I really, reeeeaaaallly hope we don't have to wait until the caster pass for this to get fixed. Please?


Related Suggestions: I have used Artificer before on live and played through a life, but I'm seeing now more than ever the need for an Artificer-based Epic Destiny. It just feels like Artificers have to get all their crucial toys out of their enhancement trees rather than both enhancements and ED's. As I considered what ED the Arti build I made on Lamannia fits into, I realized that outside of LD there really are no good options. Sure, I could twist Energy Burst for some spiciness, and I'll need the Evocation DC's out of Arcane, but that's it. Artificers are like bards and druids in that they have so much unique stuff that warrants their own ED just as Bards got Spellsinger and Druids got Primal. I could spend some time throwing out ideas for that, but this is not the place for that, and I have been running my mouth in this post long enough. I know the developers mentioned plans for an Arti ED, but I just wanted to say that I'd still be up for one if it's in the cards still.


Sorry for the wordiness...hopefully something in here is helpful


-Jayron

M3RCUL35
03-30-2018, 12:42 PM
I disagree. Monks had far more melee power then any other tree (75). Kensei has 60 potential, rogues have 15, rangers have 20, druids have 25 now, paladins have 10, swashy has none, monks have 37 now. Not to mention monks still get thier die improvements which is worth more then melee power. Other classes can't get die improvements like monks. Monks are going to still be top dps and will somehow still hit harder then my mual fighter build, which makes no logical sense. Not to mention monks get the ability to do sneak attack damage all the time and have hide as a class skill. Other then rogues, no one else gets this. This is a good step in balance of monks. And monks not good until 29? They get a pair of wraps at level 11 that do 6(1d6) base damage. Thats just broken.


This is just one example of many I've seen of people complaining about how monks do more damage then their fighters/barbarians/paladins...how can someone punch for more then my maul when its bigger and I'm a fighter waaaaahhhhhaaaawaaaaahhhhhaaaaa. Its pretty obvious most of you playing DDO have never actually played tabletop D&D...in pen and paper (which is what this game is based off of genius') starting at pretty much level 12 monks will do more melee damage then any melee class just by punching things...without taking any specialized feats for doing more damage a monk does 1d20 starting at level 16...there is no weapon in pen and paper that does that much damage...and if you take the correct feats in pen and paper u can get a monks unarmed attack to 4d6...once again there is no weapon in pen and paper a character can wield who is a fighter/barbarian/paladin that does that much base damage...monk is the most damaging melee character in D&D always has been...casters have been getting love in this game for 12 years and 1 melee class finally gets some love and everyone just wants to cry and whine about how their toons doesn't have anything like that...you want to talk about overpowered stuff in this game??? completely delete the warlock class right now!!! a 3 year old could make a warlock in DDO and get to level 30 in a week.

noinfo
04-02-2018, 08:44 AM
This is just one example of many I've seen of people complaining about how monks do more damage then their fighters/barbarians/paladins...how can someone punch for more then my maul when its bigger and I'm a fighter waaaaahhhhhaaaawaaaaahhhhhaaaaa. Its pretty obvious most of you playing DDO have never actually played tabletop D&D...in pen and paper (which is what this game is based off of genius') starting at pretty much level 12 monks will do more melee damage then any melee class just by punching things...without taking any specialized feats for doing more damage a monk does 1d20 starting at level 16...there is no weapon in pen and paper that does that much damage...and if you take the correct feats in pen and paper u can get a monks unarmed attack to 4d6...once again there is no weapon in pen and paper a character can wield who is a fighter/barbarian/paladin that does that much base damage...monk is the most damaging melee character in D&D always has been...casters have been getting love in this game for 12 years and 1 melee class finally gets some love and everyone just wants to cry and whine about how their toons doesn't have anything like that...you want to talk about overpowered stuff in this game??? completely delete the warlock class right now!!! a 3 year old could make a warlock in DDO and get to level 30 in a week.

Can't remember monks actually having handwraps in DnD 3.5 and certainly not in earlier editions.

Cantor
04-03-2018, 01:44 PM
So monks were at the top of the food chain for 1 update for the very 1st time in DDO history and in the very next update you're nerfing them to oblivion. Well done SSG.

At least we'll be able to play Druid for ~3months before you start nerfing them as well.

First time? Ho that gave me a good laugh. Also this Nerf won't knock them out of #1.

bloodnose13
04-04-2018, 03:31 PM
Epic Destinies
The Melee Power in the Cores of each Epic Destiny have been adjusted to give an overall boost to melee in Epics:


Fatesinger: +10 Melee Power per Core.
Grandmaster of Flowers: +10 Melee Power per Core
Shadowdancer: +10 Melee Power per Core
Fury of the Wild: +6 Melee Power per Core
Primal Avatar: +10 Melee Power per Core
Divine Crusader: +3 Melee Power per Core
Unyelding Sentinel: +5 Melee Power per Core
Legendary Dreadnaught: unchanged


[/COLOR]


to tell the truth i dont get logic behind this, this means that a barbarian in fatesinger will do more base damage than in fury? is that some effect of dps calculations based on relative power of a destiny or just a here have some dps kind of thing? afaik destinies are not class locked or build locked so someone somehow will find a way to exploit this to build another dps monster.

also, why no melee power in magister, and draconic? what about casters that can melee?i think it would be much better if all melee power/ranged was removed from the destiny cores and were added to epic levels, so every class of every build recieves same benefits, and then destinies balanced towards it.

Traffik
04-05-2018, 03:31 AM
My question is, when are we getting the next monster manuals? It's been a while since we got the last tomes.

Alisonique
04-05-2018, 04:57 AM
Wow. My pure 20 Shintao monk will lose 36 Melee Power because of this new update on top of the Duality nerf.

Not cool.

Mine too, why? Not a happy bunny. SSG please do not do this . And if you must then please send all pure monks a free +20 LR.