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Tagros
06-10-2017, 05:03 PM
As the idea of creating separate bug reports for the following items fills me with dread (and some of them are observations rather than bugs...)
(and with apologies if these have already been noted and fixed, 13 pages was too much to dredge through. Maybe there could be a list on the first post of what has already been covered??)

Shan to Kor part 2 -> it initially says kill 3 elementals but there are only 2. Once you have killed the first elemental, it correctly states that there is only 1 left.

The Black Loch -> the large blade/spike trap after the first door that needs a key (green?) has one spike that apparently doesn't get disabled because it keeps saying there is still a trap there after successfully disabling it

Mining for Ancient secrets - ladder bug
/loc r1 1x72 1y216 i2049, cInside ox26.77 oy = 150.01 oz=213.38 h271.4

The House of Rusted Blades -> it seems strange that there no xp for killing the Matron Mother (even though it is classed as an extreme challenge)

VON3 -> it seems strange that if the very first named is there, you get xp but no chest. If he is not there, you get no xp (obviously) but do get a chest.

Epic Rakham's Trial -> after the fire room and the mage cannons, but before the final fight, I keep getting notification of a secret door and have never been able to find it (with search skill of 74 on EN). Is there actually one there???

String Table Errors (in case they haven't already been caught and fixed):
Trial by Fury -> Text for Cixir and Cho'ahz (think it was when fighting him at his proper location rather than from the Challenge of Might lever)
Rest Stop -> when placing torch in holder to open secret door.

Ryiah
06-10-2017, 05:56 PM
Optional for Large Earth Elementals in The Cloven-Jaw Scourge: Caverns of Shaagh (aka STK Part 2) incorrectly lists there being three earth elementals when there are only two earth elementals.

http://i.imgur.com/rKLWKlG.png

AnubisPrime
06-10-2017, 06:03 PM
In the Monster Manual did you unlock the ability to see Kobolds' hit points? If not that *may* explain why...
<I may be wrong.>


Manager in Bargain of Blood doesn't show his HP

http://i.imgur.com/rTRO5kZ.png

Lynnabel
06-10-2017, 06:10 PM
Optional for Large Earth Elementals in The Cloven-Jaw Scourge: Caverns of Shaagh (aka STK Part 2) incorrectly lists there being three earth elementals when there are only two earth elementals.

http://i.imgur.com/rKLWKlG.png

Already fixed that one for U36, great catch though!

AnubisPrime
06-10-2017, 06:18 PM
What about town healing or silver flame healing? When you click on the buff, it says that it removes any "XP debt that you have." We had XP debt in ~2007. It's minor, but can this be fixed?

Phoenicis
06-10-2017, 06:39 PM
Optional for Large Earth Elementals in The Cloven-Jaw Scourge: Caverns of Shaagh (aka STK Part 2) incorrectly lists there being three earth elementals when there are only two earth elementals.

http://i.imgur.com/rKLWKlG.png

there are three.

Ryiah
06-10-2017, 06:42 PM
Already fixed that one for U36, great catch though!

What about the Whisperdoom's Daughters optional in Whisperdoom's Spawn (Part 4 of Tangleroot)?

http://i.imgur.com/sM1gB2V.png

By the way thanks for fixing these problems! I keep seeing them every life and my mind keeps trying to second guess what my memory tells me is actually correct. :D



there are three.

There are not three. First one is located near the River Gate Key chest and the second one is located at the end of the river. Feel free to run the quest yourself and count them like I do every single life.

TDarkchylde
06-10-2017, 06:53 PM
Orcish Privateer's Boots have a green (lootgen) border on its icon. It should be blue (named).

Phoenicis
06-10-2017, 07:11 PM
There are not three. First one is located near the River Gate Key chest and the second one is located at the end of the river. Feel free to run the quest yourself and count them like I do every single life.

Next time I run it I'll screenshot my end screen with all three and PM you.

Impaqt
06-10-2017, 07:40 PM
Next time I run it I'll screenshot my end screen with all three and PM you.

Please take a screen shot of all three Eles...... It should be easy to tell you are in different places, especially because one place will be somewhere no one has ever seen before.

HastyPudding
06-10-2017, 08:02 PM
Next time I run it I'll screenshot my end screen with all three and PM you.

There's only two. One is near where you find the river gate key and the other is right after the point where you unlock the river gate.

Gabrael
06-10-2017, 08:21 PM
I got one, in the fire cave in three barrel cove, one of the numberal objectives only show number, can't remember if it was the altars in 1st part, the mephits or the fire elementals in 2nd part

LeoLionxxx
06-10-2017, 08:54 PM
Ran Skyros' Jewel (http://ddowiki.com/page/Sykros%27_Jewel) today and noted 2 bits of mistimed narration that have been there for years:


When you enter the 2nd to last room, you get the narration about the spider Deluge jumping out at you,
Then you approach the door that leads to Deluge, you get a message about the lever being smashed, which I belive is supposed to be on the lever to its right


Is the triggering place of DM narration something that's relatively easy to change/fix?

zehnvhex
06-10-2017, 08:59 PM
In the Monster Manual did you unlock the ability to see Kobolds' hit points? If not that *may* explain why...
<I may be wrong.>

Yes. I think it's something to do with the way he spawns since he's 'spawned' from another mob. I've seen similar issues with that in the past. Not 100% on how or why but manager is the one I see it the most reliably with.

zehnvhex
06-10-2017, 09:01 PM
Is the triggering place of DM narration something that's relatively easy to change/fix?

I'd like to know this too since a lot of people are mentioning string table errors and mistimed DM voices. These are things that have been in the game forever and are ~really~ jarring for new players when you notice them.

Fnordian
06-11-2017, 12:47 AM
Hi Lynnabel! You're doing a terrific job!!

Three little requests:

1. The guild ship buff Old Sully's Grog Cellar doesn't have correct mouse-over text. It says "Your Guild connections grant you bonuses". (I believe it should say it grants +2 Charisma, +2 Constitution.) We don't have all the amenities on my guild ship so it's possible other ship buffs are still missing proper text but that's the only one I see missing for the buffs we do have.

2. Is it possible to fix the Grouping checkbox "Show groups I am not eligible for." so its status is saved between sessions?

3. Is it possible to fix the Friends checkbox "Hide Offline Friends" so its status is saved between sessions?

Thanks! :)

arkonas
06-11-2017, 05:12 AM
there are three.

i can tell you there is only 2. i run this quest every tr life.

arkonas
06-11-2017, 05:14 AM
Will the chest ever be able to be opened in Scoundrels run? the one that is suppose to have a key but never has. we thought they would of fixed it when 3 barrel went epic. its been like that since Creation of 3 barrel. the key is suppose to drop with the red name minotaur but of course it doesn't.

Faltout
06-11-2017, 06:49 AM
there are three.



There are not three. First one is located near the River Gate Key chest and the second one is located at the end of the river. Feel free to run the quest yourself and count them like I do every single life.
There are 2.
But for the purposes of the objective, there are 4. Each elemental counts as 2 elementals killed. Neat huh?

Madja
06-11-2017, 07:51 AM
This is but a simple typo, but it annoys me every time I see it. Hope you can fix it: The bonus slot on Against the Slave Lords craftables is written as "bonnus".



Also handwraps do not currently break any DR. Neither with metal handwraps or with enhancements (such as Shintao cores).

Faltout
06-11-2017, 07:57 AM
Will the chest ever be able to be opened in Scoundrels run? the one that is suppose to have a key but never has. we thought they would of fixed it when 3 barrel went epic. its been like that since Creation of 3 barrel. the key is suppose to drop with the red name minotaur but of course it doesn't.
I'm not sure which chest you're talking about. All 4 chests in scoundrel's run can be opened. No keys required.
1st chest: far west of the map. Can be opened freely, disturbs a nest of scorpions when opened.
2nd chest: located north center of the map. Can be opened freely, triggers a furnace in front of it to explode.
3rd chest: lockbox eastern side of the map. Can be opened once the red named minotaur is dead.
4th chest: Next to the lockbox. Appears when you kill the red named minotaur. Can be opened once the red named minotaur is dead.

Extra info:
- There is an iron key inside the lockbox. It can be used to open the way to an idol piece that is behind rune 2 rune controlled doors. If you don't get the key, you need 2 people to get that idol piece. To pull the lever and switch the runes.
- The lever at the start can be used to open the barrier of the earth elementals.

Lynnabel
06-11-2017, 09:15 AM
This is but a simple typo, but it annoys me every time I see it. Hope you can fix it: The bonus slot on Against the Slave Lords craftables is written as "bonnus".


Already in for U36! :D

Phoenicis
06-11-2017, 10:05 AM
Please take a screen shot of all three Eles...... It should be easy to tell you are in different places, especially because one place will be somewhere no one has ever seen before.

Ok. gotta bite the bullet on this one and admit I was wrong.

I would have sworn I found the third one tucked away in a corner in a room masked by the rest of the map but I just went thru it again and could not find a third ele.

I may be thinking of a different quest somewhere, dunno.

Niminae
06-11-2017, 10:19 AM
But until then I'm happy to be able to say:

"Hey Lynn...can Eldritch Wave, the T5 Warlock Soul Eater ability get the draconic breath treatment and no longer require a hard target? See the u34 patch notes."

Please also add Produce Flame (Druid level 1 spell and also a SLA in the Season's Herald tree) to the list of spells to un-hard target.

Gabrael
06-11-2017, 02:09 PM
Already in for U36! :D

BTW Lynnabel, thank you SO MUCH for addressing these little details, I know it may not seem like a lot in the grand scheme of things, than trying to focus on game breaking bugs and new content sound like it should be the - never ending - priority. But as a long time player, I can tell you every time i see typos, or wrong loading screens, It break my immersion, and can;t help wonder for a fraction of a sec how something seemingly so mundane never get fixed.

I know its gonna sound feels over facts, but my brain gets annoyed almost as much, if not more by these little things than broken loot, or unplayable quests. (except that one time I used cakes just to have quest bug out, but after fuming for a week until ticket get cleared I got reimbursed in cakes and was happy again.)

zehnvhex
06-11-2017, 02:21 PM
The wood woads in part 3 of the druids curse (right before the dude with the spider) are CR18 on Epic Elite and only have 1.3k hp.

http://i.imgur.com/TnGfp5V.png

AlcoArgo
06-11-2017, 04:14 PM
some stuff from a thread I started building last year... a few things are dated, but still lots of relevant issues..

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/479070-The-More-Than-Just-One-Thing-Thread

Hey Lynnabel, how about you reduce all damage and DCs of any "Jot" characters by 85%? Thanks!

JOTMON
06-11-2017, 07:54 PM
Hey Lynnabel, how about you reduce all damage and DCs of any "Jot" characters by 85%? Thanks!

but then who would come save you when you when jibo drags trash back to you.

situationalWizzy
06-11-2017, 08:52 PM
hi Lynn,

About the below, Power Surge from Kensei 4th core is an action boost but it didn't get recharge by Thunder Forge 3rd tier Draconic Reinvigoration.
Please help to look at this.

Thank You :)



Draconic Reinvigoration: Passive: +1 use/rest to Action Boost, Rallying Cry, Smite Evil, Turn Undead and Bard Songs. On Damage or Spell Damage: 2% chance to generate 1 Action Boost, Rallying Cry, Smite Evil, Turn Undead, and Bard Songs (triggers once per 100 seconds).

Power Surge: Action Boost: You gain +8 Psionic bonus to all attributes for 60 seconds. If you possess the ability to generate Ki, you gain On Hit: +2 Ki

Krelar
06-11-2017, 10:50 PM
Augments don't show their minimum level when they are in a bag or bank. You have to put them in your inventory to find out their minimum level. (It's sort of a tool tip error but a bit different from an description error.)

Aelonwy
06-11-2017, 11:59 PM
Don't know if anyone else has encountered this... and I can post a screen shot if necessary, but when a half-orc uses Lock Bash from their racial tree, the progress bar that says Bashing Lock... remains on the screen long after the lock is successfully bashed and you have moved away from the chest. In fact it may remain on the screen until you load into a new area, I'm not sure, I've been ignoring it remaining up in the center of my screen for so long now on my half-orc war chanter that I'm almost oblivious to it.

EmGreen
06-12-2017, 02:21 AM
Whew, done!

Are there any other similar effects that do not stick?

Criteria: Passive, always on, and affect a weapon and show up in the item description.

I can't think of any others at the moment, but it did bring to mind the related problems for two quests: 'Through a Mirror Darkly' (end of Wheloon chain) and 'The Portal Opens' (end of the Schind. chain). In both quests transitioning through portals, or from shadow to regular side of the map using the mirror (or back) causes things like masters blitz to end immediately. The issue definitely isn't feat related, it's just something about how players load between zones. There are plenty of other quests that do let players transition without stripping some effects so its not impossible.

Also, the none of the quests in the tangleroot chain can be done on reaper. There doesn't seem to be an obvious reason why not, so I'm assuming it's a mistake?

mrphlegm
06-12-2017, 08:52 AM
Hey Lynn,

I just got scammed by a NPC in the marketplace for my 3 medium ebberon dragonshards... Not only did he not deliver the agreed upon goods, when i politely inquire about the transaction he feigns ignorance of the whole situation and just gives me some snarky reply.

Evidence:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qj7y6Z783Cs


(A formal bug report has been submitted also)

Thumbed_Servant
06-12-2017, 09:22 AM
Hello Lynnabel,

Is it possible to fix the purple collectable bags dropped from killed mobs in raids? Tempest Spine and Legendary Tempest Spine and Shroud and Legendary Shroud, when the mobs are killed the purple bags they leave behind give nothing when clicked on.

Thank you

Greantun
06-12-2017, 10:29 AM
Hey Lynn,

I just got scammed by a NPC in the marketplace for my 3 medium ebberon dragonshards... Not only did he not deliver the agreed upon goods, when i politely inquire about the transaction he feigns ignorance of the whole situation and just gives me some snarky reply.

Evidence:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qj7y6Z783Cs


(A formal bug report has been submitted also)

It isn't that you didn't get it, you already have one (at least according to the error that pops up). That item is exclusive, and you can have only 1 in your inventory. http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Shard_Trinket_of_Mnemonic_Enhancement It looks like you have one on the 7th tab (:17 in), but because the screen is too small, and you didn't hover over the item (second row, second column) I can't tell if it really is or not.

Duana
06-12-2017, 10:43 AM
It isn't that you didn't get it, you already have one (at least according to the error that pops up). That item is exclusive, and you can have only 1 in your inventory. http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Shard_Trinket_of_Mnemonic_Enhancement It looks like you have one on the 7th tab (:17 in), but because the screen is too small, and you didn't hover over the item (second row, second column) I can't tell if it really is or not.

I believe the point of his post was ole boy took the shards and then said he already had one - and did not give the shards back.

Could be wrong. Its early.

mrphlegm
06-12-2017, 10:46 AM
It isn't that you didn't get it, you already have one (at least according to the error that pops up). That item is exclusive, and you can have only 1 in your inventory. http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Shard_Trinket_of_Mnemonic_Enhancement It looks like you have one on the 7th tab (:17 in), but because the screen is too small, and you didn't hover over the item (second row, second column) I can't tell if it really is or not.

Yes, that's right. The issue is that the NPC still takes your eberron dragonshards. You can see 3 eberron dragonshards laying in my inventory before the transaction, and that they disappear when i click the dialog. Hence the "scam" :P

Lynnabel
06-12-2017, 01:14 PM
Also, the none of the quests in the tangleroot chain can be done on reaper. There doesn't seem to be an obvious reason why not, so I'm assuming it's a mistake?

This was done intentionally.


I got one, in the fire cave in three barrel cove, one of the numberal objectives only show number, can't remember if it was the altars in 1st part, the mephits or the fire elementals in 2nd part

This was already done.


1. The guild ship buff Old Sully's Grog Cellar doesn't have correct mouse-over text. It says "Your Guild connections grant you bonuses". (I believe it should say it grants +2 Charisma, +2 Constitution.) We don't have all the amenities on my guild ship so it's possible other ship buffs are still missing proper text but that's the only one I see missing for the buffs we do have.

Done.


When you finish "Lost in the Swamp" Rina Belostos will direct you to Olyn Araphyr to advance the chain. She should actually send you to Kordo Sweetspire for this step.

This looks like it was either already fixed or I'm misunderstanding you. People tend to pick up each quest in the High Road chain and do them out of order in a sort of bottom to top C shape - starting with Detour ending with Rest Stop.


What about town healing or silver flame healing? When you click on the buff, it says that it removes any "XP debt that you have." We had XP debt in ~2007. It's minor, but can this be fixed?

Done.


What about the Whisperdoom's Daughters optional in Whisperdoom's Spawn (Part 4 of Tangleroot)?

This looks like it was already done.


Orcish Privateer's Boots have a green (lootgen) border on its icon. It should be blue (named).

Done.


3. Choose "Actually, I'd just like to be dropped off in Stormreach", you go back to the original dialog (sort of) but WITHOUT the Hall of Heroes option.

Done.


Stay frosty from shiardi has several issues. Hover over text from ed screen says one thing. Hover text when stance is active on buff bar says another. Stance actually does as described from buff hover.

Done.


Ps. Will you marry me? :)

No.



Orcish Privateer's Boots
Cannoneer's Goggles
Also, Drowned Priest's Torch has no border at all - looks like a non-magical torch.

Done, but the torch might be stuck with no border due to the icon itself. I've also gone ahead and stuck orange borders on all FotP and Deathwyrm loot, blue borders on a lot of weird oddity items that needed it (like those "random gen" end reward things from wheloon or somewhere). The Dragon Mask in particular was really bothering me in-game :P


Don't suppose you could have a look at the door in The Missing Party could you? The one to the entrance of the big hall where you have to wait for it to time out to progress.

This looks like it was changed already internally. From my snooping, it looks like that room's door bars open when the last skeleton is killed.

Faltout
06-12-2017, 01:30 PM
This looks like it was either already fixed or I'm misunderstanding you. People tend to pick up each quest in the High Road chain and do them out of order in a sort of bottom to top C shape - starting with Detour ending with Rest Stop.
No, there is a problem. Rina skips a quest (I don't remember which quest she skips) ending up directing you to the last NPC who's refusing to talk to you (until you've completed the missing quest). I came across that bug the first time I ran this chain, so I wasn't running the quests out of order and I was actually taking the time to read the dialogue.

There's also an issue with the pack purchase. One of the quest givers seems to think that his quest belongs to the Druid's Deep pack and so he shows a red chalice above his head if you haven't purchased Druid's Deep.

I've bug reported both of those, but sadly it was before I started keeping a record of my bug reports (before Bug #24027-101567 - Majesty core from Fatesinger is not applying +2 spell level (9/14/2015))

Dreppo
06-12-2017, 01:48 PM
The quest-giver Alyn Farrago in Eveningstar lets heroic characters take The Haunted Halls of Eveningstar even though it's an epic-only quest.

Grace_ana
06-12-2017, 02:10 PM
I have no idea if this is in your wheelhouse, but (and correct me if I'm wrong, guys) I believe the LGS sets are still bugged to where opposition acts funky. If you wear anything that isn't opposition, for example, you don't get the opposition HP bonus at all, or you only get partial, and sometimes you get partial for weird reasons that are still pretty unclear to me.

NameisToad
06-12-2017, 02:11 PM
//Yutang75 talked about The Missing Party//
This looks like it was changed already internally. From my snooping, it looks like that room's door bars open when the last skeleton is killed.

It does occasionally work as intended and open after the last skeleton is destroyed. More often however, the door refuses to open until it times out. I wonder if there's a problem with the skeletons spawning? Maybe one or more spawns inside a wall or underground sometimes?

Hipparan
06-12-2017, 02:40 PM
Done, but the torch might be stuck with no border due to the icon itself. I've also gone ahead and stuck orange borders on all FotP and Deathwyrm loot, blue borders on a lot of weird oddity items that needed it (like those "random gen" end reward things from wheloon or somewhere). The Dragon Mask in particular was really bothering me in-game :P


Speaking of weird items with no borders, Light Unending, Rod of Mythant, Shield of the Demonic Soldier, and their Epic versions are all missing borders. Not sure if these have been pointed out yet or not.

Greantun
06-12-2017, 03:03 PM
It does occasionally work as intended and open after the last skeleton is destroyed. More often however, the door refuses to open until it times out. I wonder if there's a problem with the skeletons spawning? Maybe one or more spawns inside a wall or underground sometimes?

I just ran this over the weekend, and it worked correctly. However, in this case I killed the archers first, and then the ghostly skeles, both of them, and it worked.

kkoliver
06-12-2017, 03:10 PM
The quest "Protect Baudry's Interests" displays an incorrect duration of 15 minutes. This should be reduced to 5 minutes to match the timer or maybe changed to match the format adopted by other quests. A minor issue but I bet at least one player has skipped this quest because they didn't want to do a 15 minute hold out on a low level character.

Jaenar
06-12-2017, 03:38 PM
YUTANG75 https://www.ddo.com/forums/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php?p=5982878#post5982878)

Don't suppose you could have a look at the door in The Missing Party could you? The one to the entrance of the big hall where you have to wait for it to time out to progress.



This looks like it was changed already internally. From my snooping, it looks like that room's door bars open when the last skeleton is killed.


I just ran this over the weekend, and it worked correctly. However, in this case I killed the archers first, and then the ghostly skeles, both of them, and it worked.

This has worked this way for as long as I can remember, kill the archers, then the ghostly skeletons, door will open immediately. If you happen to kill any ghostly skeletons before all the archers are killed or kill them first, it starts the timer.

Impaqt
06-12-2017, 03:49 PM
This has worked this way for as long as I can remember, kill the archers, then the ghostly skeletons, door will open immediately. If you happen to kill any ghostly skeletons before all the archers are killed or kill them first, it starts the timer.

Still seems like a bug to me.. Shouldnt matter what order you kill things. once they are all dead, door should open.

YUTANG75
06-12-2017, 04:05 PM
This has worked this way for as long as I can remember, kill the archers, then the ghostly skeletons, door will open immediately. If you happen to kill any ghostly skeletons before all the archers are killed or kill them first, it starts the timer.

Strange way for it to behave but thanks! I'll try and remember that. I actually started typing the question whilst waiting for the gate to open. There may have been another door with a similar problem but I was zerging and not really paying attention.

cdbd3rd
06-12-2017, 06:38 PM
...

No.....


Denied! LOL!

https://media.giphy.com/media/wkbMRgNqy5Pdm/source.gif

Seikojin
06-12-2017, 08:05 PM
Heya Lynnabel:
For the black loch quest, I know the central boat room has a lighting issue making machines lag out. Could an ambient source to make visibility decent allow removal of the directional volume lights? Or apply surface brightness/contrast for that room (given everything is custom made), so less lighting is required for visibility? I wonder if the underdark goggles would help...

Cleanincubus
06-12-2017, 09:55 PM
No, there is a problem. Rina skips a quest (I don't remember which quest she skips) ending up directing you to the last NPC who's refusing to talk to you (until you've completed the missing quest). I came across that bug the first time I ran this chain, so I wasn't running the quests out of order and I was actually taking the time to read the dialogue.

^ This. It is a problem, because you have to do them in order the first time through. After that, you can do them in any order.

I reported it in the "One Thing" thread, and it was unfortunately "fixed" incorrectly.

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/478966-The-One-Thing-Thread?p=5874724&viewfull=1#post5874724

The High Road chain quest order given to you by Rina Belostos is incorrect. After the 3rd quest in the chain (Lost in the Swamp), she tells you to talk to Olyn Araphyr for the next quest. This is incorrect. Olyn Araphyr is the quest giver for The End of the Road, which is the last quest in the chain. Rina should actually be telling players to talk to Freda Gambosi, to get the Rest Stop quest. This is an issue because you can't do The End of the Road until you've done the other 4 beforehand, the first time playing through the chain.

So originally the chain giver NPC told you to go to the incorrect NPC to continue the chain, which you could ignore and just go to the proper NPC to go to the right quest in the chain. So instead of fixing Rina's text that sends you to the wrong NPC, the incorrect text remained, and she now wrongly forces you to go to that wrong NPC via the chalice/or-what-not.

tl;dr - Rina needs to tell players to go to Freda (Rest Stop) instead of Olyn (The End of the Road). The chain mechanic needs to indicate this as well.

Mindos
06-12-2017, 10:13 PM
This is from before your time:
https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/466433-The-Balance-Change-post?p=5707964&viewfull=1#post5707964
or maybe the link is:
https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/466433-The-Balance-Change-post/page68?p=5707964#post5707964

Some named items never got upgraded crit ranges, particularry :) Epic soul eater. Heh, its something to look at.

unrelated p.s. I predicted Gnomes. Like a Half-Life bald scientist, all of it! -Kren

Razor_Wit
06-12-2017, 10:34 PM
Thanks for all your good work Lynnabel. /doublethumbsup
This was probably addressed before, but it would be great to be able to select the default-slot for Slavers crafted gear.
(Ex: My "Five Rings" ring defaults to trinket slot. I have it equipped on 2nd finger, I swap to use Ring of the Ancestors to help a party member, swap back to Five Rings once done and it equips to my trinket slot....so now I have to open my inventory window, drag my Five Rings from trinket to 2nd finger then equip what I originally had in my trinket slot.)
"Sigh" this wouldn't even be an issue for me but for having to open my pack in the middle of battle. I don't even swap that often, I imagine it's a true pain for anyone who is using an item they are constantly swapping. If there is a secret to this, please enlighten me, otherwise some ui similar to choosing metas for spells would be choice ^^

Natashaelle
06-13-2017, 02:18 AM
Thanks for all your good work Lynnabel. /doublethumbsup
This was probably addressed before, but it would be great to be able to select the default-slot for Slavers crafted gear.
(Ex: My "Five Rings" ring defaults to trinket slot. I have it equipped on 2nd finger, I swap to use Ring of the Ancestors to help a party member, swap back to Five Rings once done and it equips to my trinket slot....so now I have to open my inventory window, drag my Five Rings from trinket to 2nd finger then equip what I originally had in my trinket slot.)
"Sigh" this wouldn't even be an issue for me but for having to open my pack in the middle of battle. I don't even swap that often, I imagine it's a true pain for anyone who is using an item they are constantly swapping. If there is a secret to this, please enlighten me, otherwise some ui similar to choosing metas for spells would be choice ^^

IIRC the devs pointed out during Lammania preview (IIRC, though it could have been in the PC) that it's technically impossible to achieve what you're asking for.

Faltout
06-13-2017, 04:08 AM
Thanks for all your good work Lynnabel. /doublethumbsup
This was probably addressed before, but it would be great to be able to select the default-slot for Slavers crafted gear.
(Ex: My "Five Rings" ring defaults to trinket slot. I have it equipped on 2nd finger, I swap to use Ring of the Ancestors to help a party member, swap back to Five Rings once done and it equips to my trinket slot....so now I have to open my inventory window, drag my Five Rings from trinket to 2nd finger then equip what I originally had in my trinket slot.)
"Sigh" this wouldn't even be an issue for me but for having to open my pack in the middle of battle. I don't even swap that often, I imagine it's a true pain for anyone who is using an item they are constantly swapping. If there is a secret to this, please enlighten me, otherwise some ui similar to choosing metas for spells would be choice ^^
Not both ring slots are available for swapping. People only use the right ring slot to swap rings in and out because that's the default slot for a ring to go (unless the other slot is empty).
If a ring is not behaving nice when swapping, then you should keep it in your left ring slot (always equipped) and swap your other ring.

One way towards a fix for this kind of stuff would be an unequip function. If we could unequip items from hotbars, life would become so much easier. You could then select the ring you want to unequip and then equip the other ring (which will land in the empty slot). To do that, you could add a function to unequip from the shortcut bar and then allow players to add a key mapping for that function (for example holding ALT + click). In that regard, you could also allow a mapping for "use item" and "equip item" from shortcut bars. That would solve the quiver problem. And if you wanna have the perfect interface, you could allow via the right click (that currently brings the metamagic list), the user to modify the priority of each function. For example, a quiver could have priority 1: use, priority 2: equip, priority 3: unequip. Then the user could have each priority level mapped. shortcut selection = priority 1, ALT+selection = priority 2, CTRL+ALT+selection = priority 3 (selection being either explicit click or number key). So, the user can have each item in the shortcut bars configured to his liking.

tapster
06-13-2017, 06:58 AM
Hi. Not sure if this has been fixed or not but the origin point for missiles and thrown is above head height for Deep Gnomes. I've bug reported this before. It's either bug report Bug #24027-127403 or #24027-128413 from turbine days.

Cheers.

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/485603-Deep-Gnome-Bugs?p=5963695&viewfull=1#post5963695

Dreppo
06-13-2017, 08:07 AM
The text box for crafting storage capacity isn't large enough to display my capacity. It just says "Capacity: 1,823 of". I've been trying to upload a screenshot but it's not working.

Kylstrem
06-13-2017, 08:17 AM
I searched this thread and didn't see it. Playing a halfling warlock and when you run, the green balls that are supposed to be on your hands, end up at the same height as your ankles detached from the body.

First time playing a halfling warlock due to racial past lives, so first time I'm seeing this.

Kylstrem
06-13-2017, 08:36 AM
Also, during my racial 3x completionist project I'm up to 1600 elite streak but the box where it shows elite and hard streak aren't designed to show 4 digits. And you know someone will eventually get to 10,000, so might as make it fit 5 digits while you are in there. :)

Zzevel
06-13-2017, 10:11 AM
The one that gets me is talking to Evi Joss in House D that sends you to 3 Barrel Cove .. He tells you its for CR 5-7 ... Evidently He hasn't been informed of the EPIC greatness of the area..

LightBear
06-13-2017, 10:17 AM
Done, but the torch might be stuck with no border due to the icon itself. I've also gone ahead and stuck orange borders on all FotP and Deathwyrm loot, blue borders on a lot of weird oddity items that needed it (like those "random gen" end reward things from wheloon or somewhere). The Dragon Mask in particular was really bothering me in-game :P


The raid loot not having it's orange border and some out of raid named items having an orange border... thx a gazillion for that one!
(I never could get why this was done in the first place. :) )

LordSkyKnight
06-13-2017, 11:10 AM
Just ran The Bloody Crypt for the first time in a long time. The "Slay 3 Priests of the [Immortal/Sanguine/Burning/Crimson] Heart" optionals show up in the objectives as just "Slay 3".

DANTEIL
06-13-2017, 11:56 AM
Very small map issues:

In the Marketplace is the NPC Black-Nose Quint (http://ddowiki.com/page/Black-Nose_Quint), who gives you a vector quest (http://ddowiki.com/page/Pirates_of_the_Thunder_Sea) that sends you to Three-Barrel Cove to talk to Commodore Bloodeye (http://ddowiki.com/page/Bloodeye) in Barrel's Bottom.

After you talk to Bloodeye, though, his quest chalice still shows as 'active' on the map, although it goes away in-game.


Also there is a map issue with the location of Kupper Nickel, the Zawabi's Refuge wayfinder/teleporter guy. He shows up differently on the Marketplace map than in-game.

DaveyCrockett
06-13-2017, 12:40 PM
Any chance we can get rid of any instances of "True Druidic Heart of Wood" references? And maybe even make Legendary=Epic or Legendary=Epic. Leaving old stuff in after changing to new stuff sure does cause confusion and leaves an "unpolished" feel to the whole thing imo.

Lynnabel
06-13-2017, 12:51 PM
Any chance we can get rid of any instances of "True Druidic Heart of Wood" references?

Already changed the recipe in Lahar's barter window, anywhere else it shows up off the top of your head?

DaveyCrockett
06-13-2017, 12:58 PM
Already changed the recipe in Lahar's barter window, anywhere else it shows up off the top of your head?

That's where I noticed it (Lahar), but I'll ask the guildies if they've noticed it anywhere as well. Thanks!

DukePe
06-13-2017, 01:49 PM
Any chance you could have a look at Tenser's Transformation?

After the spell ends, it cancels all feat-giving enhancements, requiring a somewhat obscure "undress and relog" to get one's abilities back again.

~~Ghe~~

Graskitch
06-13-2017, 03:26 PM
1. The Temple of Elemental Evil platemail and scalemail armors incorrectly use LEATHER type icons.

2. is there any way to fix the broken icons for the Vault of the Artificers Cannith Challenge loot displaying in the traders? A lot of these items show up broken in the barter box (with 0 durability); there was a similar bug in the Anniversary Party items.
(this affects mournlode weapons, calomel weapons, elemental weapons, ring of the master artifice, ring of the stalker, spare hand, blasting chime, bracers of wind, cloak of flames, rock boots, as well as their respective upgrades)

3. some of the Vault of the Artificers Cannith Challenge items (after update 32) no longer fall in the correct Challenge Trader level range. many of the item ML was lowered by 1. Some of the upgrade path options in the barter window now have the incorrect level upgrade. For example, with Naiis Elebor <Challenge Trader (levels 7-10)> the upgrade option for the Ring of the Stalker (Level 4 to Level 8) will upgrade the ring to ML7.

4. any chance that you could add back guild renown elixirs into the daily rolls? even if they only drop for gold rolls?

5. could you please have someone in the SSG office record a unique audio /laugh track for half-orcs? It is disconcerting to see a silent guffaw. we need to hear a really deep throaty laugh.

6. would you be able to finish implementation of the character DNT TBD Titles - it would be great to have options to display something other than your guild affiliation below your character name. I feel like this would not be that difficult to do, and we could have options to display achievements (like Monster Slayer/Champion), raid achievements, epic destinies, etc.

7. is there a way to 'fix' legendary greensteel so that the enchantments/properties for the tiers and augments display properly when you link them to other people?

8. in the Sharn Syndicate quest "The Stormreaver Fresco", there is a Wedding Band that occasionally drops from the deposit lockboxes. These wedding rings used to be unbound and tradeable, but were changed in an update a while ago to Drops on Leaving Adventure. Is there any way to make them unbound again? I am planning to propose to a player in game. If you could make the Wedding Band engraveable with initials at the Stone of Change, that would be even better.

9. please add potions, scroll and wand vendors in eveningstar. Or a shop.

10. the tavern fare at the eveningstar lonesome tankard needs to be renamed. Ghallanda Distillate and Rations should not be available in Faerun. This is where you can be really creative... we need a whole new menu. You could have a community contest for people to come up with a restaurant and cocktail menu.

11. Broccoli Juice needs to be racially excluded for warforged. They need to imbibe Broccoli Seed Oil.

12. could you please investigate random gen loot quarterstaves for the drop rate on metal properties (flametouched/adamantine/cold iron/byeshk/silver) with red augment slot? afaik, these do not drop, although other weapon types do have a random gen drop chance to have both the metal property and red augment slot. why should quarterstaves be excluded?

13. not sure if you already got around to it, but a few spelling errors in random gen:
- when insightful evocation appears as a suffix in random gen loot ("of evocation"), there is a spelling typo in the item description tooltip: "insightul evocation focus" missing the f.
- incorporeal slaying on random gen weapons is misspelled as "incoporeal"
(if you are bringing back ghostbane though, I am hoping that ghostbane replaces incorporeal slaying and ghostbane slaying to combine the two effects)

14. I forget the status of the Abishai festivult cookie destroyer buff - was that ever properly fixed? I know that in one update patch that Cordovan had announced that it was working again, but I think it was found that it still did not work.

15. can you test if the divine epic destiny feat Forced Escape is broken? it has been bug reported, and there is a thread about it (which Cocomajobo acknowledged), but when I took this feat, it just did not dispel any crowd control effects for me when I used it (like being held).

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/486339

16. can you figure out some use for mystical ingredients either for cannith crafting or for some type of ingredient trade-in? after the cannith crafting update, these were made obsolete; we were told that they would be used in the new cannith crafting recipes, but it was never implemented. not sure if there are any current plans to add any recipes for cannith crafting. otherwise, can we get a trade-in on these ingredients to trade them for rare collectables? you could set up a mystical grocery/pottery vendor in the marketplace.
(mystical plant, mystical dried fish, mystical goblet, mystical bottle, mystical urn, mystical vessel)

17. in the harbor, the wooden plank bridge that spans from the free agents patron location to the airship portal used to have some mesh (either chains or rope I think) that visually prevented bridge crossers from falling off the sides. after an update a while ago, that mesh disappeared, and now we only see the wooden posts.

18. if you are not an arcane caster, the tooltip description for using gust of wind scrolls with umd does not show up. I am not sure if there are missing tooltips for any other scrolls (I generally only use scrolls for invisibility and gust of wind).

LrdSlvrhnd
06-13-2017, 08:11 PM
I've used sacred ground to try and heal hirelings (Owlbears, lioness, and random plat hires) the healing affect doesn't proc on them. Low priority as I doubt many people care but would be a nice fix.

I believe they purposely excluded NPCs from this because it was causing issues in some quests where an enemy goes inactive - they'd then get healed above the threshold and remain inactive, or somesuch. The global 'fix' also made it not work for hirelings. Made me sad because I derived way too much amusement from healing the slaves I keep chained up in the cargo hold.


6. would you be able to finish implementation of the character DNT TBD Titles - it would be great to have options to display something other than your guild affiliation below your character name. I feel like this would not be that difficult to do, and we could have options to display achievements (like Monster Slayer/Champion), raid achievements, epic destinies, etc.

This reminds me - can we please get a space between the guild name and the guild level when we look at other people? It just looks funny right now.


10. the tavern fare at the eveningstar lonesome tankard needs to be renamed. Ghallanda Distillate and Rations should not be available in Faerun. This is where you can be really creative... we need a whole new menu. You could have a community contest for people to come up with a restaurant and cocktail menu.

Oh, this is a cool idea!


15. can you test if the divine epic destiny feat Forced Escape is broken? it has been bug reported, and there is a thread about it (which Cocomajobo acknowledged), but when I took this feat, it just did not dispel any crowd control effects for me when I used it (like being held).

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/486339

IIRC the Harper Pins have the same issue.

cdbd3rd
06-14-2017, 08:19 AM
How about nudging up the process speed on the Stone of Change? The segmented wheel and chomping teeth animations were kinda neat at first, but now crunching down shards and having to sit thru that animation every click is... not fun any more.


--------

Kylstrem
06-14-2017, 08:24 AM
How about nudging up the process speed on the Stone of Change? The segmented wheel and chomping teeth animations were kinda neat at first, but now crunching down shards and having to sit thru that animation every click is... not fun any more.


--------
Or just change it to the same interface as every other "crafting" interface in the game.

Steelstar
06-14-2017, 08:32 AM
How about nudging up the process speed on the Stone of Change? The segmented wheel and chomping teeth animations were kinda neat at first, but now crunching down shards and having to sit thru that animation every click is... not fun any more.


--------


Or just change it to the same interface as every other "crafting" interface in the game.

This isn't a thing we can do for tech and server performance reasons, unfortunately.

Think the kind of problems old Cannith Crafting instances used to bring, except in the marketplace, and multiplied by more than ten.

Sam-u-r-eye
06-14-2017, 08:35 AM
This isn't a thing we can do for tech and server performance reasons, unfortunately.

Think the kind of problems old Cannith Crafting instances used to bring, except in the marketplace, and multiplied by more than ten.

rofl

Mornyngstar
06-14-2017, 08:55 AM
Just before the server restart I was running slayers in the Menechtarun desert and noticed that the rare The Thirsty One dropped a collectable bag that was not Antique Bronze Tokens. This also occurred with the Mephits that I was killing. I am not sure if this is WAI or not.

cdbd3rd
06-14-2017, 08:56 AM
This isn't a thing we can do for tech and server performance reasons, unfortunately.

Think the kind of problems old Cannith Crafting instances used to bring, except in the marketplace, and multiplied by more than ten.

I think I'm following ya there. You're keeping the animation that slow to limit the number of conversions going on behind the curtain to a limited number/timeframe?

...As opposed to my first thought that removing the animation entirely would help as it did the Cannith decon machine. That's a bummer, but I'll live. :o


-------------

Since you're looking - how about tinkering with Trap the Soul ? That little irritant where casting it while in mouse-look doesn't release the cursor to select a HD version on the pop-up window.


(Guess who went soul shard hunting last couple days?) :rolleyes:

Phoenicis
06-14-2017, 08:58 AM
Since you're looking - how about tinkering with Trap the Soul ? That little irritant where casting it while in mouse-look doesn't release the cursor to select a HD version on the pop-up window.


I just drag the HD version I'm using currently to my hotbar, but that's my workaround, YMMV

dragons1ayer74
06-14-2017, 09:45 AM
This isn't a thing we can do for tech and server performance reasons, unfortunately.

Think the kind of problems old Cannith Crafting instances used to bring, except in the marketplace, and multiplied by more than ten.

This may be but how about make it convert to the lowest common denominator so if you put in 1000 shards you click once instead of ten times.

dragons1ayer74
06-14-2017, 09:47 AM
Can you make it so when you cast a cause X damage spell or harm spell without a target it targets the caster if they are in undead form?

ice584
06-14-2017, 10:06 AM
This isn't a thing we can do for tech and server performance reasons, unfortunately.

That's fair, no one wants that. Can we just get a few more recipes added which allow for full stacks to be converted at once? Saves clicks and saves CPU time; that's a win-win for everybody. Regardless, thanks for the feedback.

Galeria
06-14-2017, 10:14 AM
Sort banks, bags and reincarnation caches BY MIN LEVEL.

Sort reincarnation cache by anything. I'd take alphabet.

SORT BY LEVEL

Sort by level

SORT BY LEVEL

For the love of the Sovereign host, please let us sort by min level.

Stoner81
06-14-2017, 10:15 AM
IIRC the Harper Pins have the same issue.

The Greater Harper Pin works fine as does the regular one as far as I know, I know for sure that the greater one certainly works.

Stoner81.

JOTMON
06-14-2017, 10:17 AM
How about nudging up the process speed on the Stone of Change? The segmented wheel and chomping teeth animations were kinda neat at first, but now crunching down shards and having to sit thru that animation every click is... not fun any more.



This isn't a thing we can do for tech and server performance reasons, unfortunately.

Think the kind of problems old Cannith Crafting instances used to bring, except in the marketplace, and multiplied by more than ten.

I get maybe that the interface is coded in a way that the Stone of Change Crafting cant be messed with without screwing it up..

but seriously..
you couldn't add an NPC that would trade Khyber and Siberys shards instead of having us suffer through the mindless clicks on a stupid crunching interface...
even upping the crunch interface to handle the inventory 10k stacks...
The stone of change interface locks up constantly forcing a close and re-open of the interface.

! I challenge you.. !
take 1,000,000 Siberys fragments and make a flawless shard from scratch at the stone of change..
..or better yet.. delegate it to Lynnabel and risk her coming around to smack you upside the head..
(.. Lynnabel.. I will mail you plat for the head smack.. name your price..)


was a PITA even back in 2011 (annoyance to player even longer than that)...

Let the stone of change crunch these in stacks of 1000, instead of the 100 at a time.

Just finished crunching 12,000 of these things.

Change the time animation to be instant. the slow crunch..wait....start again cycle is brain numbing.

Lynnabel
06-14-2017, 10:33 AM
..or better yet.. delegate it to Lynnabel and risk her coming around to smack you upside the head..
(.. Lynnabel.. I will mail you plat for the head smack.. name your price..)

Out of all the ways for me to be fired, this is the new winner for "fastest way to get me physically removed from the building."

Gratch
06-14-2017, 10:38 AM
This isn't a thing we can do for tech and server performance reasons, unfortunately.

Think the kind of problems old Cannith Crafting instances used to bring, except in the marketplace, and multiplied by more than ten.

I realize the Stone of Change has a ton of old named item to new named item lookups, and the few other ingredient bump recipes and other "weird" stuff. But those types are probably the larger database hit. For things where people are doing a bunch of crunching (khyber/sib) a trader in the ???? or some isolated instance with a number of crunching recipes for the very simple (database wise) trade would be nice.


Out of all the ways for me to be fired, this is the new winner for "fastest way to get me physically removed from the building."

Nerf sword whackings are allowed in the SSG by-laws though right? Or does it require the challenge issued via nerf dart and then duel at the crack o' noon in ye olde standing stone ring?

JOTMON
06-14-2017, 10:43 AM
Out of all the ways for me to be fired, this is the new winner for "fastest way to get me physically removed from the building."

Decoy maneuver..

there was a mosquito on your head..

https://m.popkey.co/67e39f/w6Dxz_s-200x150.gif

cdbd3rd
06-14-2017, 10:47 AM
...

Nerf sword whackings are allowed in the SSG by-laws though right? Or does it require the challenge issued via nerf dart and then duel at the crack o' noon in ye olde standing stone ring?


...while wearing the required costume uniform. Broccoli.


You know, I bet there are a few people who haven't seen this yet. For their pleasure...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PtLd0Nks5Kc

zehnvhex
06-14-2017, 11:02 AM
but seriously..
you couldn't add an NPC that would trade Khyber and Siberys shards instead of having us suffer through the mindless clicks on a stupid crunching interface...

Yeah, I was gonna say. Obviously you can't do every recipe that the vendor has, but I think the big two that everyone complains about are Sib and Khyber shards. Would it really obliterate the game if you put in a vendor that could do 10k and 100k tradeins?

Everything else I can suffer through. Shards though...

zehnvhex
06-14-2017, 11:05 AM
While I'm thinking about it, the dude at the beginning of Von4 (R1 I think is it's name?) has like...50 hp on Epic difficulty.

Also you might want to nerf the optional xp for the first part of To Curse The Sky (the totem that frees the guards). I mean as much as I enjoy sitting here watching Chinese bot programs farm that optional for ez levels...

Zzevel
06-14-2017, 11:10 AM
How about nudging up the process speed on the Stone of Change? The segmented wheel and chomping teeth animations were kinda neat at first, but now crunching down shards and having to sit thru that animation every click is... not fun any more.


--------


FULL STACKS, talk about adding quality of life time!

Am I the only one who has actually fallen asleep doing this? It is SO freekin boring...

Aelonwy
06-14-2017, 11:28 AM
FULL STACKS, talk about adding quality of life time!

Am I the only one who has actually fallen asleep doing this? It is SO freekin boring...

No I nodded off once crunching for the top HD soul gems. The steady cha-chung sound effect may have had something to do with the somnolence.

Tagros
06-14-2017, 11:54 AM
When you complete Maraud the Mines in the menechtarum desert you are left with several gems that you have to trade to Behn the prospector in Zawabi's Refuge to be able to sell. The problem is you can only trade one at a time and have restart the conversation for each gem (not each gem type, but each individual gem). Could this be changed to a more normal type of trade-in interface please?

It would also be nice if the Tear of Dhakaan vendor accepted all your shards rather than one at a time.

Kylstrem
06-14-2017, 12:32 PM
When you complete Maraud the Mines in the menechtarum desert you are left with several gems that you have to trade to Behn the prospector in Zawabi's Refuge to be able to sell. The problem is you can only trade one at a time and have restart the conversation for each gem (not each gem type, but each individual gem). Could this be changed to a more normal type of trade-in interface please?

It would also be nice if the Tear of Dhakaan vendor accepted all your shards rather than one at a time.

Doesn't the Tear vendor only offer about 100gp or pp for each one?? Once I found out how much these were worth, I just destroy them. Waste of time to turn them in.

Kaisheng21
06-14-2017, 12:41 PM
Doesn't the Tear vendor only offer about 100gp or pp for each one?? Once I found out how much these were worth, I just destroy them. Waste of time to turn them in.

10pp. This needs an update.

JonD
06-14-2017, 12:48 PM
Enter any of the following quests in the Harbor, then look at the door or rope by which you entered. All of them claim that they link to the Marketplace, although they do actually return you to the Harbor correctly. Nothing vital, it just bugs me.

Retrieve The Stolen Goods (Baudry 3)
The Smuggler's Warehouse
The Kobold's New Ringleader
Stealthy Repossession
Garrison's Missing Pack
Recovering The Lost Tome
Walk The Butcher's Path
Durk's Got A Secret
The Miller's Debt
Haverdasher
Information Is Key

Sqrlmonger
06-14-2017, 12:49 PM
10pp. This needs an update.

I don't think the amount he gives matters as much as just having him grab them all at once.


On a different topic, another FIX I would like to see is when you get an e-mail from a timed out shard auction and you detach the AS from the message the box grays out but the message still shows 1 AS to be detached. This is just a display bug as you do get the shard, but on the flip side if you remove the item first it drops into your inventory and the mail shows that it has been removed.

Edwinge
06-14-2017, 02:30 PM
When you complete Maraud the Mines in the menechtarum desert you are left with several gems that you have to trade to Behn the prospector in Zawabi's Refuge to be able to sell. The problem is you can only trade one at a time and have restart the conversation for each gem (not each gem type, but each individual gem). Could this be changed to a more normal type of trade-in interface please?

It would also be nice if the Tear of Dhakaan vendor accepted all your shards rather than one at a time.

Good ideas. I'd also like to see Phinnian Barkbow (outsider token guy in harbor) and Vagan Taneer (planar shard guy in market) switched over to the barter interface. It's just a better system for handling collected item turn-ins for reward.

krolikru3
06-14-2017, 03:17 PM
Just allow us to buy the beverage, coffee, at one of the taverns. Maybe then I'll use the spirit binder there, instead of on my ship.

dunklezhan
06-14-2017, 04:35 PM
Dear Auntie Lynnabel,

When I was playing in House Phiarlan tonight and attempting to find some caged trolls for a nice lady in a pub, I asked my little magic book where to go and then looked for the little gold arrow that it normally sticks on my portable map. But it didn't point at the trolls. It pointed right through the eastern wall of the district, with no entrance in sight.

I decided I would ignore the gold arrow and go to where I knew the entrance was, because it seems that no matter how many times I live my life, the dang trolls just keep coming back, so they can't hide from me anyway.

But if I didn't know House Phiarlan so well, I might have got terribly lost. Please can you make any potential boo-boo cry-pants owie all better and fix the little gold arrow so it points at the entrance to the caged trolls?

Lots of love


Troll-E.

cdbd3rd
06-14-2017, 04:45 PM
Dear Auntie Lynnabel, ...

"Auntie" ?!?!?

Oh, that's just mean. She's not old enough for that yet. She's just our special little cousin - you know the one... :p

Kylstrem
06-14-2017, 04:53 PM
Add right-click option on heal spells (much like the meta-magic options) that have a "No matter what type of monster is selected, heal me instead". Nothing more annoying than trying to heal myself in the heat of combat and realize I'm damaging an undead mob.

Aelonwy
06-14-2017, 05:59 PM
Done, but the torch might be stuck with no border due to the icon itself. I've also gone ahead and stuck orange borders on all FotP and Deathwyrm loot, blue borders on a lot of weird oddity items that needed it (like those "random gen" end reward things from wheloon or somewhere). The Dragon Mask in particular was really bothering me in-game :P


That's interesting. I just noticed today that the Adventurer's Torch from Rest Stop does not use the torch icon (as the Drowned Priest's Torch does) but instead uses a regular club icon with a blue border and red background because it has the Blazing effect ...and Greater Incorporeal Bane. I suppose if it must be a choice between a unique icon for the Drowned Priest's Torch or the proper border ...I would want the unique icon but hopefully it can have a proper blue border.

Its too bad the Adventuring Torch (with a proper minimum level like ML15 or so) couldn't be kept as a basic ghost/shadow fighting weapon until something better comes along. Oh well.

JOTMON
06-14-2017, 11:12 PM
And the dead shall rise..

The "Slay 25 skeletons" optional objective is frequently uncompletable due to not enough skeletons spawning
its even recognizezd in the DDOWIKI...
been broken oh for so long....


http://i1361.photobucket.com/albums/r671/JOTMON/ScreenShot01183_zpsiartnrrw.jpg~original

JOTMON
06-14-2017, 11:12 PM
Eebilsteenk in Gianthold doesn't display a quest icon over his head when players complete Maze of Madness,
He does have the reward interface when you talk to him.. just no green icon.


http://i1361.photobucket.com/albums/r671/JOTMON/ScreenShot01185_zps63crkkdr.jpg~original

NameisToad
06-15-2017, 04:00 AM
How come when I deconstruct random loot in the crafting hall, if my dissolver is in the bank i get zero platinum, but if my dissolver is in my ingredient bag or in my pack I do get a small amount of platinum?

Niminae
06-15-2017, 09:26 AM
When you complete Maraud the Mines in the menechtarum desert you are left with several gems that you have to trade to Behn the prospector in Zawabi's Refuge to be able to sell. The problem is you can only trade one at a time and have restart the conversation for each gem (not each gem type, but each individual gem). Could this be changed to a more normal type of trade-in interface please?

It would also be nice if the Tear of Dhakaan vendor accepted all your shards rather than one at a time.

Similarly, in Redwillow's Ruins you need to collect (amongst other things) three personal effects for one of the research assistants. All of the personal effects are together in one place, so you get them all at the same time. But you have to go through the dialogue three times just to get that optional to complete. It is utterly pointless. It should be 'fixed' so that you need to give them all three items at once to complete.



"Auntie" ?!?!?

Oh, that's just mean. She's not old enough for that yet. She's just our special little cousin - you know the one... :p

Too old? She can't have an older brother or sister who has kids? I'm from a large family. I have aunts and uncles who were born with nieces and nephews.

JOTMON
06-15-2017, 09:35 AM
How come when I deconstruct random loot in the crafting hall, if my dissolver is in the bank i get zero platinum, but if my dissolver is in my ingredient bag or in my pack I do get a small amount of platinum?

I have not noticed that to be the case..
I have seen that only certain items give plat and augment slot items give plat regardless of what the item is.



Normally I don't pay attention to the decon process... its become the mindless drag click drag click single items at a time until all the stuff is crunched down...

Today I was looking at the value of the items and how many essences i was getting back and noticed during the process...
had 40 assorted items with average base value item 8800 collected from a stormhorns full series Heroic Reaper 2 run.

1.armor, shields, weapons gave plat and essences..
~got 360 plat and 24-28 essences per decon

2.gloves, necklaces, belts, rings, bracers boots only gave essences... not a single plat at all on any of these....
~and only got 20-24 essences per decon


Is it intended that the decon value is not equal between items with the same base value and plat is not given for all items deconned?
.. may make a difference when selecting items from end reward lists for decon purposes ..

zehnvhex
06-15-2017, 09:37 AM
Here's another one to add to the pile. The keybindings for 'choose dialog option' sometimes don't register unless your mouse cursor is over the dialog window (thus defeating the purpose of keybinding them in the first place).


Too old? She can't have an older brother or sister who has kids? I'm from a large family. I have aunts and uncles who were born with nieces and nephews.

That always freaked me out too. I grew up thinking my aunt was my cousin because I was older then her. Nope!

zehnvhex
06-15-2017, 11:51 AM
Some barbarians in our guild just had this to say as well:

- Tireless rage doesn't work. Once you unrage and re-rage and then unrage again your stats just keep going down as fatigue keeps stacking endlessly in the background. By the end of a long dungeon he's hitting for about half of what he should be. They also seem to be 'glitching' and if they stand still once fatigue has started to stack in the background, they stop being able to crit or get weapon proc's unless they're strafing.

- The blood frenzy and focus'd wrath crit multiplier bonuses do not work.

dunklezhan
06-15-2017, 12:36 PM
"Auntie" ?!?!?

Oh, that's just mean. She's not old enough for that yet. She's just our special little cousin - you know the one... :p


Too old? She can't have an older brother or sister who has kids? I'm from a large family. I have aunts and uncles who were born with nieces and nephews.

Just to be clear, the Auntie reference was entirely meant in the 'agony aunt' fashion. I mean, we're here, pouring out the deep seated long standing woes from our hearts in the hopes some distant lady will pick out our letter from all the others in the ever growing pile of sadness and make it all better with a short reply... it just seemed apt.

I was not intending to spark speculations about her age, appearance or anything as irrelevant as that. I don't know anything about her except that I'm glad she's on the team - it was just supposed to make her laugh.

And fix the map reference for Caged Trolls. Obviously.

Lynnabel
06-15-2017, 01:21 PM
I don't know anything about her

I play DDO with a DDR Dance Pad and a pair of DK Jungle BeatTM Bongos. What else is there to know?

dunklezhan
06-15-2017, 01:23 PM
I play DDO with a DDR Dance Pad and a pair of DK Jungle BeatTM Bongos. What else is there to know?

lol, my point exactly. :)

Scrapco
06-15-2017, 01:27 PM
I play DDO with a DDR Dance Pad and a pair of DK Jungle BeatTM Bongos. What else is there to know?

NOW the marriage offers are going to come rolling in...

Phoenicis
06-15-2017, 02:05 PM
I play DDO with a DDR Dance Pad and a pair of DK Jungle BeatTM Bongos. What else is there to know?

Video or it didn't happen...

cdbd3rd
06-15-2017, 02:08 PM
Just to be clear, the Auntie reference was entirely meant in the 'agony aunt' fashion. I mean, we're here, pouring out the deep seated long standing woes from our hearts in the hopes some distant lady will pick out our letter from all the others in the ever growing pile of sadness and make it all better with a short reply... it just seemed apt.

I was not intending to spark speculations about her age, appearance or anything as irrelevant as that. I don't know anything about her except that I'm glad she's on the team - it was just supposed to make her laugh.....

Likewise my "cousin" reply. She's shown that she has both a sense of humor AND the willingness to walk off into the middle of this shark tank wearing a bacon bikini.

Lol. All is well, folks. Carry on!

cdbd3rd
06-15-2017, 02:10 PM
I play DDO with a DDR Dance Pad and a pair of DK Jungle BeatTM Bongos. What else is there to know?

https://media.giphy.com/media/13YroVUrUrLCec/giphy.gif




:p

UurlockYgmeov
06-15-2017, 02:44 PM
https://media.giphy.com/media/13YroVUrUrLCec/giphy.gif




:p

am confident that only proposals that include a documented and viable real-world way to hold such ceremony on Korthos Beach would be considered! :P

zehnvhex
06-15-2017, 04:34 PM
The thirst is real.

More cosmetic/text bugs:

Feed on Magic temp spell points uses a debuff icon instead of a buff icon.

Hungry for Destruction and Hungry For Destruction enhancements (soul eater): Surely we can think of a better name then just capitalizing the f?

(Legendary) Hardened Hide Armor is still granting an exceptional bonus to HAMP instead of Quality despite the item description

Nonesuch2008
06-15-2017, 06:02 PM
Hey,

Is it in your wheelhouse to do some volume leveling or boosting on the DM voice in the Dreaming Dark chain? Especially in the finale, the DM voice is both muted and muffled. There are other quests that could use this sort of help, but DD is probably the most noticeable one.

Nonesuch2008
06-15-2017, 06:04 PM
This isn't a thing we can do for tech and server performance reasons, unfortunately.

Think the kind of problems old Cannith Crafting instances used to bring, except in the marketplace, and multiplied by more than ten.

Uproot the Stone of Change and place it somewhere less impactful, maybe? Blame the kobolds, they steal everything.

LrdSlvrhnd
06-15-2017, 06:12 PM
Some barbarians in our guild just had this to say as well:

- Tireless rage doesn't work. Once you unrage and re-rage and then unrage again your stats just keep going down as fatigue keeps stacking endlessly in the background. By the end of a long dungeon he's hitting for about half of what he should be.

Tireless Rage works for my barb... I just raged and dismissed several times and my stats went back to exactly what they should be. I even raged and hung around waiting for it to time out, and no penalties. And the combat log immediately says "(Combat): Your fatigued effect has been removed from you."

Lynnabel
06-15-2017, 06:47 PM
Uproot the Stone of Change and place it somewhere less impactful, maybe? Blame the kobolds, they steal everything.

The lag would be so severe that even opening the barter window would probably file your taxes incorrectly.

Stoner81
06-15-2017, 06:49 PM
Could the recipes for the Stone of Change be moved to the Cannith Crafting machines instead or would that create more lag due to lots of recipes again?

Stoner81.

LrdSlvrhnd
06-15-2017, 07:44 PM
I'm just curious... would the lag be due to all of the "fix/upgrade this item" recipes, rather than the "crunch these shards" and "add this alchemical bonus" recipes that people actually use? If so, would it be possible to move all of *those* to a different interface ("The Stone of Repairing", perhaps, placed near the entrance to the Crafting Hall in House C) and have a barter window for the stuff that people actually use on a regular basis, without the crippling lag? Basically, move everything that's not on http://ddowiki.com/page/Stone_of_Change_-_Recipes elsewhere - that's 21 recipes, and even if you added several recipes for crunching multiple dragonshards, you could easily stay under 3 dozen.

fangblackhawk
06-15-2017, 08:02 PM
The lag would be so severe that even opening the barter window would probably file your taxes incorrectly.

but i can has a stone of change uprooted to my cargo hold already..... and id swear there was 2 stones of change some at one point.....

Steelstar
06-15-2017, 08:08 PM
There are potential ways we could make certain aspects of the Stone of Change more conveniently accessible/usable, some of which are mentioned in this thread. We don't have current plans to implement those at this time (and definitely can't before Ravenloft), but they're something we may consider in the future.

For the record, there are just shy of 1,100 recipes in the Stone of Change. :)

JOTMON
06-15-2017, 08:14 PM
There are potential ways we could make certain aspects of the Stone of Change more conveniently accessible/usable, some of which are mentioned in this thread. We don't have current plans to implement those at this time (and definitely can't before Ravenloft), but they're something we may consider in the future.

For the record, there are just shy of 1,100 recipes in the Stone of Change. :)

how many of those recipes are long dead..

there was a bunch of stone of change upgrades for the old augment system (the one that used catalysts) to change items to a newer old augment system

and fix upgrades to old gear/weapons..

but I guess if someone came back from a 6 year afk and wanted to upgrade their eSOS to the new augment version and could figure out how to do it from an old wiki link after talking to an ingame GM to find out that there was a stone of change fix that may or may not work to change their old item....

LT218
06-15-2017, 08:32 PM
For the record, there are just shy of 1,100 recipes in the Stone of Change. :)
At the risk of obviously armchair quarterbacking this, any properly maintained database should be able to run a query to select/pull/parse 1100 records very quickly. Select Top 1000 Rows is even one of the default right-click options on a table in SQL.

Shouldn't be a problem unless you've done some very, very bad things with the database. Databases were designed to parse large amounts of static information very quickly.

Lynnabel
06-15-2017, 08:34 PM
And any properly maintained database could run a query to select/pull/parse 1100 records very quickly. Select first 1000 rows is one of the default settings in SQL. Shouldn't be a problem unless you've done some very, very bad things with the database.

Our recipes aren't kept in a traditional database. Splitting up the stone of change would be cool, but as we've said, it's way outside our scope for right now. We've gotta focus on making U36 and Ravenloft as great as they can be :)

Gratch
06-15-2017, 08:42 PM
Our recipes aren't kept in a traditional database. Splitting up the stone of change would be cool, but as we've said, it's way outside our scope for right now. We've gotta focus on making U36 and Ravenloft as great as they can be :)

Based on your and Steel's response I don't think anyone is asking for you to touch the stone of change anymore. Instead give us a new vendor that can intelligently convert stacks of khyber and sib shards, 1000 will get you 100 of the next level OR 10 of the level two up OR 1 of the level 3 up. 100 will get you ... etc. Those should be much more straight-forward recipes and would even heavily reduce people using the stone of change for grinding those two family types of shards.

But yes... back to U36/Ravenloft. And Flavored Souls. And Clerks. And Arti-chokes (new animation!).

Seikojin
06-15-2017, 08:51 PM
Based on your and Steel's response I don't think anyone is asking for you to touch the stone of change anymore. Instead give us a new vendor that can intelligently convert stacks of khyber and sib shards, 1000 will get you 100 of the next level OR 10 of the level two up OR 1 of the level 3 up. 100 will get you ... etc. Those should be much more straight-forward recipes and would even heavily reduce people using the stone of change for grinding those two family types of shards.

But yes... back to U36/Ravenloft. And Flavored Souls. And Clerks. And Arti-chokes (new animation!).

I approve of what you did there! Just can't gie the rep to you for now. Womp, womp.

LrdSlvrhnd
06-15-2017, 09:06 PM
Our recipes aren't kept in a traditional database. Splitting up the stone of change would be cool, but as we've said, it's way outside our scope for right now. We've gotta focus on making U36 and Ravenloft as great as they can be :)

Just knowing you guys are amenable to doing something is good *g*

karatemack
06-15-2017, 09:10 PM
Based on your and Steel's response I don't think anyone is asking for you to touch the stone of change anymore. Instead give us a new vendor that can intelligently convert stacks of khyber and sib shards, 1000 will get you 100 of the next level OR 10 of the level two up OR 1 of the level 3 up. 100 will get you ... etc. Those should be much more straight-forward recipes and would even heavily reduce people using the stone of change for grinding those two family types of shards.

But yes... back to U36/Ravenloft. And Flavored Souls. And Clerks. And Arti-chokes (new animation!).

+1

Though I doubt your humor is appreciated. :)

SgtSarros
06-15-2017, 09:33 PM
Hey,

Is it in your wheelhouse to do some volume leveling or boosting on the DM voice in the Dreaming Dark chain? Especially in the finale, the DM voice is both muted and muffled. There are other quests that could use this sort of help, but DD is probably the most noticeable one.


There is one DM voice in the quest "Irestone Inlet" where after you kill Yaryar you get the 'yaryar screams 'i'll kill you, kill you allll"... and then he dies.' speech The volume on that DM voice is -far- quieter then any of the other voices in that quest. Like half of the volume.

Niminae
06-15-2017, 09:48 PM
am confident that only proposals that include a documented and viable real-world way to hold such ceremony on Korthos Beach would be considered! :P
See the post earlier in this thread about the Wedding Band that drops in The Stormreaver Fresco having been changed to drops on exit...
.
.
.
.
Here's one that has given me (and my inventory space) fits across the years, and I think I've finally figured it out:

Occasionally the exact same potion type will not stack with each other. Specifically, and I have just duplicated this in game right now and logged in to the forums to make this post so it should be easy to reproduce, spell power potions purchased in the two different House J shops House of Wizardry and Feather's Fall Apothecary will not stack with the exact same potion of the same name if it is purchased at the other shop. I guess they both decided to go the Dell power supply route and have made incompatible bottles, or something.

LT218
06-16-2017, 12:59 AM
Our recipes aren't kept in a traditional database. Splitting up the stone of change would be cool, but as we've said, it's way outside our scope for right now. We've gotta focus on making U36 and Ravenloft as great as they can be :)
Given the current lag from loading recipes, bank inventories, or any other mildly intensive datasets, maybe they should have been and this is part of where DDO went wrong?

Dragavon
06-16-2017, 04:15 AM
How about the very annoying bug that makes the bank often close a few seconds after you open it.

Not a big thing, but happens every day and is very annoying :mad:

JonD
06-16-2017, 04:50 AM
And Flavored Souls.
<off-topic>
Well, that's the new snack I'm taking along to my table-top games - "Mmmmm, tasty, tasty flavored souls".
</off-topic>

LrdSlvrhnd
06-16-2017, 07:03 AM
How about the very annoying bug that makes the bank often close a few seconds after you open it.

Not a big thing, but happens every day and is very annoying :mad:

Yeah, this bugs the heck out of me, too... especially when it's one of those "slow TR cache loading" days. It *just* opens after several seconds, and then *poof*. (Also, it has nothing to do with the TR cache, 'cause it happens on first-lifers, too. It's just slightly less annoying on them because they don't have the delay lol)

florestan
06-16-2017, 09:49 AM
Any possibility of a change to fix the disappearing spell wards in Detour when you fight Song? Or just lowering the bonus targets so the minimum that actually spawn is always achieveable for trap bonus?

zehnvhex
06-16-2017, 10:08 AM
Tireless Rage works for my barb... I just raged and dismissed several times and my stats went back to exactly what they should be. I even raged and hung around waiting for it to time out, and no penalties. And the combat log immediately says "(Combat): Your fatigued effect has been removed from you."

Ignore the combat log.

Do the following:

Go into a quest and kill a mob, note how hard you hit, let rage wear off, recast it. Keep doing this.

By the end of the dungeon you'll be hitting half as hard as you started.

I'll ask for more specific details but I've witnessed this myself. It started around the time reaper was introduced as well. Guy in my guild used to regularly hit for 40k+ with adrenaline, etc...going.

Since then he rarely gets passed 30k and by the end of the dungeon is hitting for like 15k crits. Normal white hits were going from 1000~ish to down around 600.

Saekee
06-16-2017, 10:11 AM
Think the kind of problems old Cannith Crafting instances used to bring, except in the marketplace, and multiplied by more than ten.

knees went weak...had to sit down, wipe forehead

zehnvhex
06-16-2017, 10:14 AM
Our recipes aren't kept in a traditional database. Splitting up the stone of change would be cool, but as we've said, it's way outside our scope for right now. We've gotta focus on making U36 and Ravenloft as great as they can be :)

Hi Lynn,

Speaking of Ravenloft this is something that has bugged me for quite some time now and this is me being a total weeb roleplayer...

Can you start changing

"Close Window" to "Goodbye! (close window)" Or "Thank you! (close window)" or other roleplayish nonsense in NPC dialog?

For example:

http://i.imgur.com/aVwxhuB.png

I don't expect you guys to go back and change all old instances of this in the game. But going forward can you guys make it your mantra for that last line to read something like, "It was my pleasure to take care of those scum, sorry for the mess Captain! (close window)"

Greantun
06-16-2017, 10:29 AM
How about the very annoying bug that makes the bank often close a few seconds after you open it.

Not a big thing, but happens every day and is very annoying :mad:

Not sure this is a bug. It started happening around the time they were trying to prevent duping issue with a specific cause. Now, I think they either detect a network anomaly, or they do this randomly so to help prevent dupers. It does happen to me, but not all the time.

assimilateur
06-16-2017, 12:33 PM
Can anything be done about optional objective ransack (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/487288-Optional-objective-ransack) in the foreseeable future?

zehnvhex
06-16-2017, 03:57 PM
Here's some more:

Cocoon removes invis

Flyby Attack does not remove invis (even if you hit a mob with it)

Saekee
06-16-2017, 04:13 PM
Here's some more:

Cocoon removes invis

Flyby Attack does not remove invis (even if you hit a mob with it)
Flyby and Dire charge do not even break stealth. But let's leave that, ok? There are a number of things redeeming stealth right now after the new aggro mess, so until aggro is managed, I'd rather keep silent on some rather non-WAI thingies that are hardly game breaking and to help gimp playstyles...

Lynnabel
06-16-2017, 04:30 PM
Flyby and Dire charge do not even break stealth. But let's leave that, ok? There are a number of things redeeming stealth right now after the new aggro mess, so until aggro is managed, I'd rather keep silent on some rather non-WAI thingies that are hardly game breaking and to help gimp playstyles...

What specifically is wrong with aggro as it stands?

Stoner81
06-16-2017, 04:30 PM
Going from Light side to Shadowfell side in Through a Mirror Darkly removes Death Aura and possibly Displacement when it's cast by a pale master.

Stoner81.

Tlorrd
06-16-2017, 05:22 PM
i believe castigation from Divine Crusader is still not working as per the description. It does not give damage to bosses and orange names take the 1% per stack and 1d6 per stack damage. Maybe update the description or hopefully fix to have it WAI. Thanks!

Ebondevil
06-16-2017, 05:26 PM
What specifically is wrong with aggro as it stands?

Seem to recall it was mentioned by another Dev, so known issue, but I believe Mobs currently aggro the furthers target in range when they are aggroed, instead of the mob that aggroes them, this can result in mobs running past the person attacking them for someone doing absolutely nothing.

cdbd3rd
06-16-2017, 05:43 PM
Hi Lynn,

Speaking of Ravenloft this is something that has bugged me for quite some time now and this is me being a total weeb roleplayer...

Can you start changing

"Close Window" to "Goodbye! (close window)" Or "Thank you! (close window)" or other roleplayish nonsense in NPC dialog?

For example:

http://i.imgur.com/aVwxhuB.png

I don't expect you guys to go back and change all old instances of this in the game. But going forward can you guys make it your mantra for that last line to read something like, "It was my pleasure to take care of those scum, sorry for the mess Captain! (close window)"

Lol. I hadn't paid that much attention to that, but now that you've mentioned it... :rolleyes:

RydeaNikkna
06-16-2017, 05:55 PM
Seem to recall it was mentioned by another Dev, so known issue, but I believe Mobs currently aggro the furthers target in range when they are aggroed, instead of the mob that aggroes them, this can result in mobs running past the person attacking them for someone doing absolutely nothing.

Also you can no longer break aggro with stealth. It used to be that if you broke line of sight and went into sneak mode, the mobs would go into search mode (they used to come around the corner with red ? over their head) and actually have to find you again (presumably via a search/listen vs your hide/move silent skills.) It seems mobs have forgotten search mode; they and any other mob they see know precisely where you are. Same goes for a ranged attack that you move out of sight, mobs no longer search, they just come directly to you (or past you to other party members)

It is not that these make the game unplayable, they just nerf a couple playstyles out of existence. But this isn't the first nor last nail in the stealth coffin, the kill-all-mobs-to-open-the-way quest mechanic was a large nail too. Maybe these are anti-zerg measures that just waffle-stomp stealth too. I don't know, but right now DPS is king, skills are less in demand.

ComicRelief
06-16-2017, 06:28 PM
What specifically is wrong with aggro as it stands?

Well, for one thing, when they 'fixed' the mechanic where if you range-plink one mob, all in a given radius come running after you, not just the one mob, that I've seen a cascading effect with that. Meaning, if I range-plink the closest mob to me, and everyone in a 30-ft radius of he/she/it instantly know where I am and the mob which is farthest from me manages to trigger additional mobs that are within a 30-ft radius of *he/she/it* and not the original hit mob (which is out-of-range of the additional mobs), which may trigger yet a 3rd event, etc.

Trouble is, this seems to be an intermittent issue, as it doesn't happen all of the time. How do I know it happened? Usually by a short delay from when the last 'original group mob' shows up and the first of another wave (seeing as how they have to run farther). One place I've seen it happen is "A Cry for Help" which has a couple of really long (longer than 30-ft), twisty corridors. I'm at the door, I shoot and kill what appears to be the only couple of mobs in the corridor, and then after a short delay, here comes a couple more running around the corner; I kill them, short delay, more mobs coming around the corner.

{I also maintain that a regular bluff-failure should not instantly trigger (group) aggro. Critical fail? Fine. Regular fail? No. It has ruined the bluff-pull.}
;)

Lynnabel
06-16-2017, 07:31 PM
Well, for one thing, when they 'fixed' the mechanic where if you range-plink one mob, all in a given radius come running after you, not just the one mob, that I've seen a cascading effect with that.

I've seen quite a few people here and elsewhere talking about this. That specific change was actually a reversion to our previous shared aggro system. It is working as intended that you can no longer pull mobs by simply standing outside of their aggro range and hitting them one at a time. Monsters thematically will absolutely notice that you are shooting their friend with arrows :P



It is not that these make the game unplayable, they just nerf a couple playstyles out of existence.

My last life was a pure assassin rogue and I had no trouble at all working either solo or in a group. I had some rough spots before 12 and Assassinate (Execute is so great O_O) but after 12 and up through 30 it was quite fun and rewarding. I did put points into both hide and move silently, though, so your mileage may vary if you neglect one or the other.

nokowi
06-16-2017, 07:53 PM
My last life was a pure assassin rogue and I had no trouble at all working either solo or in a group. I had some rough spots before 12 and Assassinate (Execute is so great O_O) but after 12 and up through 30 it was quite fun and rewarding. I did put points into both hide and move silently, though, so your mileage may vary if you neglect one or the other.

hahahahaha!

20 players can fill thread after thread with what is specifically wrong, but evidently that makes no difference.

Assassin is now purely for those that don't understand agro - a really sad state of affairs.

FYI - I did about 80 assassin lives.

guzzlr
06-16-2017, 07:56 PM
In our duo we repeatedly (always) see the mobs blow by the first person to aggro them and charge whoever is farthest away. This may be a cat, a hireling, the other half of the duo, or some mosquito on the wall. We have even watched mobs run all the way back to the beginning of quests to hit a hireling waiting on standby. Then ensues a silly case of mob beat healer hireling while said healer hireling stands there until dead.

It is really frustrating to be the intimitank watching the icon flash over the heads of mobs only to have them rush over to people a hundred miles away.

Lynnabel
06-16-2017, 07:57 PM
but evidently that makes no difference.

Why do you say that? Feedback of all kinds is important to us, we're working hard to make DDO the best it can be.

mpetrarca
06-16-2017, 08:14 PM
I would really like to see a search feature in Augment Bags just like Collectables Bags, Ingredients Bags, Gem Bags and even Tapestry Pouches! I myself have a Colossal Augment Bag and it is quite a chore to find anything in it. In fact, at times I wish I could get a refund.

PermaBanned
06-16-2017, 08:24 PM
What specifically is wrong with aggro as it stands?
Why do you say that? Feedback of all kinds is important to us, we're working hard to make DDO the best it can be.Not sure if all y'all have better forum search tools than we do, but if do and/or check Nok's posting history you'll find many threads & discussions about agro, stealth and how the two {don't?} work together.

Stealth play isn't generally my thing, so I follow these far more than I participate in them. Even though I don't have personal experience with the current (alleged?) issues, as just a forum "lurker" on the subject I'm well aware that folks like Nokowi who do play Stealth/Assassin have cited & exampled (via screen shots, vids etc) numorous problems. Not sure what if any of them would be under your umbrella, but the info is out there and easily accessible.

FYI;

I've seen quite a few people here and elsewhere talking about this. That specific change was actually a reversion to our previous shared aggro system. It is working as intended that you can no longer pull mobs by simply standing outside of their aggro range and hitting them one at a time. Monsters thematically will absolutely notice that you are shooting their friend with arrows :PI'm totally with ya there, but you'll find in those threads that "realism" is a R10 Legendary Elite can o' worms ;)

On a related note, the lack of consensus on just what exactly constitutes "stealth play" (i.e. "Invis + Sprint Boost" vs "Hide & Move Slient" vs ...?) has also been... problematic. I don't want to digress or derail further on that, but if/when you get into agro/stealth threads you'll see what I mean.

nokowi
06-16-2017, 08:40 PM
Why do you say that? Feedback of all kinds is important to us, we're working hard to make DDO the best it can be.

Well, its been 7+ months since U33.2 and here you telling us everything is fine, despite very detailed posts to the contrary, and prior dev responses that they would like to look into it if they have time (many months ago).

The assassins that post on the forums are largely letting their toons gather dust - spend a few minutes in the rogue threads if you have doubts.

Some of the confusion is that ranged assassin is still mostly functional (less affected by broken agro mechanics), but melee is completely broken (it's functionally better to not use stealth than to use it).

Actions speak louder than words, and the actions say SSG doesn't care enough to do something about it. The words say "we might get around to it", with no update for months, and the actions say "we simply don't care".

I'd like to have my toon back, even if someone is picking their way through content at 1/10th the pace of everyone else by ranging toons one at a time - it's a totally inefficient play style, and one mostly used by casual players. It's hardly an issue worth breaking entirely unrelated play style over, especially one that is as unique as stealth play.

Mindos
06-16-2017, 09:55 PM
Why do you say that? Feedback of all kinds is important to us, we're working hard to make DDO the best it can be.

Years ago, there was a Dev that fixed Agro. He/she did a good job, no one complained. That Dev is gone now. Should be able to find in the older Dev Tracker.

2nd Point: The Agro system went to sheet right after the datacenter move, during the great lag battle. My conspririciry is that CPU cycles for AI/Agroo were turned WAY down. :)


Lets just say what I want: And I want it consistently, not turned off a patch later, regressed, adjusted, etc.

1. Don't tell us its the way it always was. It isn't. One of us, either the Devs or the customers are wrong. And you know what they say about customers never being wrong?
2. I wanna shoot a projectile NEAR a mob, and have it wake up, and come look for me. I don't want it to ignore it. I don't want EVERY mob on the continent of Khorvaire to come to me either.
2. I want line of sight to work correctly, I should be able to sneak behind without touching a mob. I shouldn't glitch and come out of stealth in the wrong order when assinating, thereby preventing the assinate, etc. (if you dont know what I'm talking about her, then you really should. -reread that line as needed. Envenomend blades doing damage first preventing the kill ring a bell?
3. Spiders/animals telling the entire world where we are. Sure, they have life sense, tremor sense, but they talk to every mob everywhere? They direct like a hound dog? I can see mobs following a spider/dog, not getting mental telepathy from it like an Ohio class submarine radar array.

4. Finally, just give us what we want. Know what we want. Fix it, THEN NEVER CHANGE IT. Seriously, why, just why, has there been ANY changes to the agro system ever? And how many times has it been changed and adjusted? It's rediculous. I don't want a khobold statue to wack on, I don't want a robot that runs into walls, off ledges!

-rant off. Sorry in advance

zehnvhex
06-16-2017, 10:17 PM
I imagine she never played a stealth build prior to the agro rework so probably has nothing to compare her experiences to. As assassin works fine now simply because everything works fine now. It doesn't mean it's stealth play like it used to be.

I believe Torc said he wanted to look into fixing stealth/agro when he had the chance but between u36 and Ravenloft it sounds like they don't have much time to work on it. It's a shame because for a brief glorious period in DDO history stealth was really fun and sort of working outside of a few small issues.

nokowi
06-16-2017, 10:39 PM
I imagine she never played a stealth build prior to the agro rework so probably has nothing to compare her experiences to. As assassin works fine now simply because everything works fine now. It doesn't mean it's stealth play like it used to be.

It doesn't need to be like it used to be. Everything does not work fine now.

What I can tell you, is that if you play a ranged build, most of the issues can easily be avoided. True seeing mobs share your location with all other mobs, and if you move far enough from that location the mobs simply remain in search mode. On ranged, you are likely moving away from mobs anyway, and may not notice this as a major or even minor problem. If you are melee, you need to approach mobs (not run away), and it prevents you from using your primary ability to assassinate mobs that should not yet have a way of detecting you. It's certainly fine that a true seeing mob moves toward you, attacking and taking you out of stealth, and THEN getting all agro, but this is NOT what currently happens.

The other issue is that the sharing of agro can cause mobs to maintain agro in very strange ways, such as a mob simply getting within X radius of you, and without any reason for that mob to know your location. Again, a minor issue for ranged but a deal breaker for melee. When you combine the first with the second, even ranged builds can suddenly agro mobs for no reason (mob approaches within X distance of player), although this is an infrequent but very annoying occurrence for ranged (unlike melee, where it is much worse).



I believe Torc said he wanted to look into fixing stealth/agro when he had the chance but between u36 and Ravenloft it sounds like they don't have much time to work on it. It's a shame because for a brief glorious period in DDO history stealth was really fun and sort of working outside of a few small issues.

Yet they do have time to prevent casual players from picking off mobs one at a time. A cardinal rule of design is to not break more than you fix.

Players were already gathering all agro with the old mechanic, as it was the optimal/efficient way to play, and it was actually more challenging to tank when individual mobs had a better chance of going to separate players. People say they are using stealth to get agro now - ridiculous.

Aelonwy
06-16-2017, 10:39 PM
I encountered a new bug... and I can post some screenshots to prove it if you want to see them. I'm not certain though if the bug is only visual or what, let me explain:

While doing Epic 3BC I took a fresh Major Slayer Boost, a few minutes later my hubby decided he wanted to do a quest so we popped into Epic Prove Your Worth. About a third of the way in the quest (right before pit of spikes) the game froze and I DCed, so I restarted my computer, restarted the game and as soon as I could kept going in the quest. I hit the shrine after the spike pit and noticed that my Major Slayer Boost was counting down in the quest. So I took a few screenshots to capture the icon counting down in the quest and went to make a bug report but the external window for bug reporting either wasn't coming up or it was very delayed. Either way we kept going, I took another screenshot at the end and finished out into the wilderness zone of Epic 3BC where the timer continued to time down from the time it had counted down in the quest (~34 mins) and then recalled to 3BC town area. Turned in the quests and jumped on my guildship.

Now this is where it really gets weird. Once I'm on my ship in the cargo bay selling and repairing I notice that the timer on my Major Slayer Boost is back to where it should have been (56+ mins). So now I'm thinking there was some weird visual bug going on when it looked as if it was timing down in the quest. But its not over yet folks. No we went back out to the wilderness zone and the first time we entered the timer on the slayer boost gave me an additional 20 seconds or so. That is it went from 56 mins and I think 16 seconds to 56 mins and 30+ seconds but then continued to time down as is proper.

I don't get it. That is beyond bizarre and I still am not sure if I can trust that icon. I half want to enter a quest and see if the timer goes down to what it showed in the Epic Prove Your Worth quest (~34 mins) but its late and my kids are going to wake me expecting breakfast. I'll post again tomorrow if it continues to behave strangely but for now this is what I know.

nokowi
06-16-2017, 10:59 PM
I encountered a new bug... and I can post some screenshots to prove it if you want to see them. I'm not certain though if the bug is only visual or what, let me explain:

While doing Epic 3BC I took a fresh Major Slayer Boost, a few minutes later my hubby decided he wanted to do a quest so we popped into Epic Prove Your Worth. About a third of the way in the quest (right before pit of spikes) the game froze and I DCed, so I restarted my computer, restarted the game and as soon as I could kept going in the quest. I hit the shrine after the spike pit and noticed that my Major Slayer Boost was counting down in the quest. So I took a few screenshots to capture the icon counting down in the quest and went to make a bug report but the external window for bug reporting either wasn't coming up or it was very delayed. Either way we kept going, I took another screenshot at the end and finished out into the wilderness zone of Epic 3BC where the timer continued to time down from the time it had counted down in the quest (~34 mins) and then recalled to 3BC town area. Turned in the quests and jumped on my guildship.

Now this is where it really gets weird. Once I'm on my ship in the cargo bay selling and repairing I notice that the timer on my Major Slayer Boost is back to where it should have been (56+ mins). So now I'm thinking there was some weird visual bug going on when it looked as if it was timing down in the quest. But its not over yet folks. No we went back out to the wilderness zone and the first time we entered the timer on the slayer boost gave me an additional 20 seconds or so. That is it went from 56 mins and I think 16 seconds to 56 mins and 30+ seconds but then continued to time down as is proper.

I don't get it. That is beyond bizarre and I still am not sure if I can trust that icon. I half want to enter a quest and see if the timer goes down to what it showed in the Epic Prove Your Worth quest (~34 mins) but its late and my kids are going to wake me expecting breakfast. I'll post again tomorrow if it continues to behave strangely but for now this is what I know.

You might notice that if you are DCing due to lag your timers continue to count down. When you have major lag, you can't trust the current timer status, because there is no "update" from the server, and you are simply seeing a counter on your end. I wouldn't call this a bug myself.

red_kain
06-17-2017, 12:31 AM
As I've currently got a pure rogue assassin at 30, which I play actively. I'd like to say that my experience with stealth is that it seems to be working relatively fine, although I'm often being detected just before I get close enough to assassinate in quests such as the slavers chain. What I assume is happening is since I am in a hall and have to approach from the front (where the enemies are looking) they get a large spot bonus, see through my 80ish? hide/move silently, thus ruining my assassinate (which goes off) as they aggro and I lose sneak attack. I'm only using +15 augments and I'm a INT build so I might just be under what I'm expected to be at (90-100 hide/move silently) but my bluff(82/85ish) is kind of in the same area, it seems to have about 50% success rate on legendary elite content, which again, I feel is because I'm just under that 90-100 range. I personally would prefer the monsters having a bit lower spot/bluff requirements but not focusing on them is my own fault (no insightful skill gain). I'd also like to say that this is only an issue when solo, as in a group letting someone else aggro first lets me get sneak attack even if they detect me, and assassinate works (for me).

In terms of running around a corner and losing line of sight then ditching aggro with sneak, forcing enemy "search mode", realistically, if you can "hide in plain sight" and monsters can't see you, then going around a corner should work, but game wise, it may end up breaking mechanics in unforeseen ways so leaving it as not working seems fine. I can see devs not interested in making that work for a balance//not breaking things/intended play point of view In general stealth doesn't feel too powerful right now but it does seem functional and useful for what it is. I don't have too many problems with widespread aggro either. Though clerics always getting targetted first, (related to "furthest party member?) more than EVERYONE else, is still a thing. Has always been a thing as far as I can remember.


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I wanted to ask about Legendary Greensteel set bonuses too. I'm hoping Lynnabel can find me a clear answer as I haven't seen a direct dev response related to this subject. I planning some sets right now, and am not currently prepared to do major testing (or have spare testing materials) and would like to know.

In regards to this thread --- https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/481349-LGS-Opposition-HP-bonus-not-applying?p=5903969#post5903969

Is Opposition's HP% bonus not applying when paired with partial other (escalation/dominion) augments WAI or broken and in need of fixing?

For clarity as I understand it, if you wear 2 pieces of LGS gear,
1st: Tier1: Opposition+Material / Tier2: Opposition+Material / Tier3: Escalation+Material / CLEANSED
2nd: Tier1-Opposition Material T2&3 Blank.

You SHOULD get 3 augments worth of HP% (12% bonus HP), however you don't.

I'm just looking for a "WAI" or "broken-will fix" answer here.

ComicRelief
06-17-2017, 12:52 AM
I've seen quite a few people here and elsewhere talking about this. That specific change was actually a reversion to our previous shared aggro system. It is working as intended that you can no longer pull mobs by simply standing outside of their aggro range and hitting them one at a time. Monsters thematically will absolutely notice that you are shooting their friend with arrows :P
*snip*

I think you misunderstand. It's not the 'shared' aggro that's the problem, per se. I get that hitting a single mob in a group will aggro the group. BUT it should NOT aggro a completely *separate* group that is farther away. In other words, if I hit mob A located at position zero, his buddy (B) at position 30-ft is aggro'd (along with "B1", "B2", "B3"...) - I get that - but there are occasions when hitting A triggers B (as it should), but then mob C, which is located at 30-ft from B or 60-ft from A is also aggro'd (presumably because B triggers C, which IMO should not be the case, as C is in a different group from A). And D at 30-ft from C, which is 60-ft from B, which is 90-ft from A is also aggro'd. Etc. That's the 'cascading effect' that sometimes happens. At least, it's the best explanation I can come up with for what I have observed.
;)

Also - just because a mob is hit doesn't mean it should know instantly and exactly where that hit came from. I mean, I get ranged by mobs all the time - do I know exactly where they are? No. At least, not every single time - rarely, in fact. I have to look around and find them. Which takes some finite amount of time. (Sometimes, it takes quite a *long* time.) Unfortunately, it doesn't work the same way in reverse - mobs *instantly* and *accurately* know exactly where I am. And it doesn't matter if I turn a corner (or even several corners), where the no longer have line-of-sight, and "thematically" they should no longer know exactly where I am, yet they still do.

And don't get me started on Drow which I can see being able to literally up-and-disappear before my very eyes. If they can do it, why can't I?
;)

Dragavon
06-17-2017, 03:07 AM
Seem to recall it was mentioned by another Dev, so known issue, but I believe Mobs currently aggro the furthers target in range when they are aggroed, instead of the mob that aggroes them, this can result in mobs running past the person attacking them for someone doing absolutely nothing.

Yes, this happens all the time.

dunklezhan
06-17-2017, 03:48 AM
Hey Lynn,

The aggro/stealth thread you are looking for is here, this post just summarises all the posts up to page 11 that have documented evidence:

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/484173-Here-is-What-is-Wrong-With-Stealth?p=5943827&viewfull=1#post5943827

Torc is aware, although whether or not having reviewed it he thinks there really is a problem is a whole other thing, of course! Assuming he thinks it is a problem, I get the impression its quite deep systems work he's looking at.

.... get stuck in? :)

Flywheel
06-17-2017, 04:08 AM
It is the only scroll that I know that completely lacks description. So it is hard to say which class can learn it for example.
Please fix it.

TDarkchylde
06-17-2017, 08:00 AM
(re: orc boots) Done.

Thank you, you are awesome and that was seriously annoying the hell out of me.

Dayko_DAllen
06-17-2017, 08:57 AM
I find myself in this situation constantly. Either enemies will notice me through walls, and then the spells they shoot off go through the wall, or all of the enemies rush me at once. It of course isnt as much of a problem in the q's where certain milestones spawn enemy mobs, but for example, I was running the bloody crypt and as soon as i got in one of the subdivisions for the torches, all of the enemies on that section of the dungeon swarmed me, Lucky I was a warlock with web :o , but this has happened to me in numerous quests, and I just find it hard to see how one would play an assassin in a situation where enemies are noticing you from across the map.

QuantumFX
06-17-2017, 11:14 AM
Could you fix the lava in the fire and ice portion of Tempest Spine? If your soul stone drops in, you can't jump out to get a raise.

Aelonwy
06-17-2017, 12:51 PM
You might notice that if you are DCing due to lag your timers continue to count down. When you have major lag, you can't trust the current timer status, because there is no "update" from the server, and you are simply seeing a counter on your end. I wouldn't call this a bug myself.

The thing is the icon continued to count down in quest when I reconnected. At the very least it should be considered a visual bug. I did log in that character after lunch today and the icon displayed 56+ mins then I entered a quest just to check and it remained the same. So behind the screen everything is fine but when I DCed and then relogged into the game I was very upset to see a MAJOR SLAYER BOOST icon counting down in quest.

Point being I didn't notice anything fishy while I was DCing, it was afterward when I re-entered the game that the slayer boost icon was displaying incorrectly that it was and had been counting down in quest. People are not going to react pleasantly to such store bought boosts behaving counter to their description (counting down in quests) even if its just a display issue, especially if they are not even aware that there could be such a weird display issue. I had never seen such an issue before myself and I can only express my relief that it was a display issue and that I did not feel compelled to deal with CS which is apparently very busy with much larger issues.

nokowi
06-17-2017, 02:21 PM
I find myself in this situation constantly. Either enemies will notice me through walls, and then the spells they shoot off go through the wall, or all of the enemies rush me at once. It of course isnt as much of a problem in the q's where certain milestones spawn enemy mobs, but for example, I was running the bloody crypt and as soon as i got in one of the subdivisions for the torches, all of the enemies on that section of the dungeon swarmed me, Lucky I was a warlock with web :o , but this has happened to me in numerous quests, and I just find it hard to see how one would play an assassin in a situation where enemies are noticing you from across the map.

I myself will put up with a few instances of mass swarming, or the lessen version of everyone in a room, if it occurs when I actually fail a stealth roll, or get taken out of stealth by something attacking me, or me bumping a mob, or a random arrow hitting me, or leaving stealth to interact with an object, or many of the other ways players get removed from stealth. I won't play if it happens through no failure of the player, or makes it impossible to play a stealth melee toon (making running into the room out of stealth superior to using stealth). A working stealth mechanic already has the costs of provoking that huge swarm you mentioned, while only having single target damage. All we ask for is a working stealth mechanic.

If a player in a group runs into the room second, no stealth mechanics are actually ever used. If mob has agro on something, no stealth check is ever made. The confusion comes from both ranged assassins (experiencing less of the issues), and melee assassins that play clean up duty, not realizing that a stealth check was never made when they are not the first to enter a room. Stealth is certainly fine if you never use it -> these players should really learn to run into the room second out of stealth, as the results are the same. Stealth happens when you enter rooms before anyone else, and try to take actions ahead of the party.

zehnvhex
06-17-2017, 03:11 PM
It doesn't need to be like it used to be. Everything does not work fine now.

I'm not saying stealth in and of itself is working fine Nok. Stealth play is obviously in a really bad spot. What I mean is you can get by as assassin rogue because it's not like you're up a creek without a paddle once the entire dungeon is aggro on you. I was still able to complete quests on R1 on mine.

It's just not as fun/sneaky as it used to be and I'm guessing Lynn just didn't play a rogue ever prior to the recent changes. She has nothing to compare it to so her only perception is, "I don't see what the problem is, it looks fine to me."

Lynnabel
06-17-2017, 04:57 PM
I'm not saying stealth in and of itself is working fine Nok. Stealth play is obviously in a really bad spot. What I mean is you can get by as assassin rogue because it's not like you're up a creek without a paddle once the entire dungeon is aggro on you. I was still able to complete quests on R1 on mine.

It's just not as fun/sneaky as it used to be and I'm guessing Lynn just didn't play a rogue ever prior to the recent changes. She has nothing to compare it to so her only perception is, "I don't see what the problem is, it looks fine to me."

That was my fourth life as a rogue. Please try not to make assumptions about me and my playstyle, I hate having to "prove myself" and it adds an unnecessary wedge between my interactions with the community as a developer. I want the best for DDO, nothing else.

Gratch
06-17-2017, 05:00 PM
Has QA/Devs played "In the Belly of the Beast" on elite recently? Despite killing everything before the Arena fight and during the arena fight, most of the waves of mobs (drow, then drider, then drow battlemasters) spiked DA to red alert within 5s of releasing each waves. There were also some of the crowd up above active casting things - as well is blur/invis'ed/unfightable mobs on the arena floor. Something isn't quite right with that scripting or mob wave sizing with that quest.

Lynnabel
06-17-2017, 05:03 PM
Has QA/Devs played "In the Belly of the Beast" on elite recently? Despite killing everything before the Arena fight and during the arena fight, most of the waves of mobs (drow, then drider, then drow battlemasters) spiked DA to red alert within 5s of releasing each waves. There were also some of the crowd up above active casting things - as well is blur/invis'ed/unfightable mobs on the arena floor. Something isn't quite right with that scripting or mob wave sizing with that quest.

It's entirely possible some extra mobs are aggroing when that quest stage is set. I'll take a look. Does it happen every time?

Ebondevil
06-17-2017, 05:12 PM
Has QA/Devs played "In the Belly of the Beast" on elite recently? Despite killing everything before the Arena fight and during the arena fight, most of the waves of mobs (drow, then drider, then drow battlemasters) spiked DA to red alert within 5s of releasing each waves. There were also some of the crowd up above active casting things - as well is blur/invis'ed/unfightable mobs on the arena floor. Something isn't quite right with that scripting or mob wave sizing with that quest.

If you have someone sitting up top side (even if they are in a safe place), and not down in the arena when the fight starts, then all the mobs in the viewing gallery aggro and it goes Red DA Instantly.

Grace_ana
06-17-2017, 05:15 PM
Well, its been 7+ months since U33.2 and here you telling us everything is fine, despite very detailed posts to the contrary, and prior dev responses that they would like to look into it if they have time (many months ago).

The assassins that post on the forums are largely letting their toons gather dust - spend a few minutes in the rogue threads if you have doubts.

Some of the confusion is that ranged assassin is still mostly functional (less affected by broken agro mechanics), but melee is completely broken (it's functionally better to not use stealth than to use it).

Actions speak louder than words, and the actions say SSG doesn't care enough to do something about it. The words say "we might get around to it", with no update for months, and the actions say "we simply don't care".

I'd like to have my toon back, even if someone is picking their way through content at 1/10th the pace of everyone else by ranging toons one at a time - it's a totally inefficient play style, and one mostly used by casual players. It's hardly an issue worth breaking entirely unrelated play style over, especially one that is as unique as stealth play.

My main is a pure assassin, and I almost never play her anymore. Like, once in the past six months or so. Stealth and aggro are so broken it's no longer fun, and I LOVED my assassin. The details have already been described in numerous threads, so I see no need to rehash here. And yes, hide and move silently scores are very high for her.

nokowi
06-17-2017, 06:20 PM
My main is a pure assassin, and I almost never play her anymore. Like, once in the past six months or so. Stealth and aggro are so broken it's no longer fun, and I LOVED my assassin. The details have already been described in numerous threads, so I see no need to rehash here. And yes, hide and move silently scores are very high for her.

It's disappointing to see an SSG employee make such comments, and defend them because they have 4 rogue lives. With bravery bonus, players frequently level to 30 without learning builds. I am a 3x completionist, and I knew enough on the PC to let others that truly understand builds lead the discussions about builds I had only played 3 times. I usually spent my time listening and asking questions for clarity rather than telling those that played a build many more times.

Given the complaints from people who actually play the build throughout many agro changes, we can judge an SSG employee by the accuracy of their comments. Being completely unaware of any issues, telling us everything is fine, and making gross misstatements, such as it being about not being able to grab mobs one at a time shows a huge misunderstanding. I heard nothing about understanding melee assassin or playing at the front of the party in those 4 lives, which I will infer means an inability to decipher the comments made by those that use stealth.

If devs truly want feedback, here is some:

1) If you don't want to be judged, LISTEN to your players instead of telling us about your self described causal experience.

2) Melee assassin is BROKEN as defined by those that understand stealth and agro. Players are not going to pay for a 12 month VIP when you leave their characters broken for 7+ months. They are not going to resubscribe once they let their subscription lapse, because you have shown them directly that you are perfectly willing to not even look at or fix what you broke in that same amount of time.

3) Have the decency to quickly fix what you broke instead of turning players away from the game. DDO needs more unique play styles, not less. If one employee can enjoy assassin as a self-defined casual player, that doesn't mean it is fine for those that enjoy skill and challenge. Melee Assassin was supposed to be an end-game build, where it is worth your time to find gear and gain past lives. As it is now, it is nothing like this.

4) Lynnabel was doing a fantastic job this thread, right up to the point where they told much more experienced players they were wrong, without the depth of understanding to do so. I suggest not describing your casual experiences and instead listening to your players, particularly those with the biggest depth of knowledge to give you useful feedback.

HastyPudding
06-17-2017, 06:23 PM
I got a rather strange bug, so not sure if you can help with it.

I've been grinding out some racial past lives with guildies. We did Tomb of the Tormented last night (as we have done every life so far). The problem is if the wight spirit twisters (wight casters) are a champion and they cast the spell crushing despair, the spell goes off multiple times, causes a big lag spike, and deals a tremendous amount of damage (due to added champion damage + magic damage for each cast). This is the only quest I've had this kind of trouble in, so far that I can remember.

LrdSlvrhnd
06-17-2017, 07:24 PM
I've seen quite a few people here and elsewhere talking about this. That specific change was actually a reversion to our previous shared aggro system. It is working as intended that you can no longer pull mobs by simply standing outside of their aggro range and hitting them one at a time. Monsters thematically will absolutely notice that you are shooting their friend with arrows :P


I think you misunderstand. It's not the 'shared' aggro that's the problem, per se. I get that hitting a single mob in a group will aggro the group. BUT it should NOT aggro a completely *separate* group that is farther away. In other words, if I hit mob A located at position zero, his buddy (B) at position 30-ft is aggro'd (along with "B1", "B2", "B3"...) - I get that - but there are occasions when hitting A triggers B (as it should), but then mob C, which is located at 30-ft from B or 60-ft from A is also aggro'd (presumably because B triggers C, which IMO should not be the case, as C is in a different group from A). And D at 30-ft from C, which is 60-ft from B, which is 90-ft from A is also aggro'd. Etc. That's the 'cascading effect' that sometimes happens. At least, it's the best explanation I can come up with for what I have observed.
;)

Yes, this is the problem I have with the new aggro. I don't mind that everybody around the guy you plink gets mad at you. It's when they call everyone in the NEXT room... who calls everyone in the NEXT room, and so on and so forth. I was running Cabal once and plunked a guy, and it very quickly scaled the DA up to red... and just as quickly scaled down as stuff went too far away and got the white circle of I-don't-care-anymore and went back to start. Cleared out everything that didn't, had a bit of a breather, then started again when I got to the first mobs that had gotten bored and wandered off.


2. I wanna shoot a projectile NEAR a mob, and have it wake up, and come look for me. I don't want it to ignore it. I don't want EVERY mob on the continent of Khorvaire to come to me either.

Yes please, I miss being able to draw stuff away like that.


3. Spiders/animals telling the entire world where we are. Sure, they have life sense, tremor sense, but they talk to every mob everywhere? They direct like a hound dog? I can see mobs following a spider/dog, not getting mental telepathy from it like an Ohio class submarine radar array.

Similarly, anything with true seeing. You're invised, even if somebody is shouting "There's somebody over there!" and pointing vigorously, the other mobs shouldn't know EXACTLY where you are. Cranked-up awareness, sure, but charging directly to you, even if you move, even if you move out of LOS from the guy with TS? No.[/QUOTE]

Stoner81
06-17-2017, 07:28 PM
https://s26.postimg.org/z0rws2rt5/Trinket.jpg

I pulled the above in WGU tonight in a regular chest but yet the crafting machine says it's not craftable (i.e I can't disjunct it to make it ready for crafting on). It's not a named item since it's lootgen so it should be craftable.

Thank you.

Stoner81.

JonD
06-17-2017, 07:43 PM
The Quest Journal entry for "Harbinger of Madness: Making the Monsters" has "</rgb>" visible in the description, as well as a backslash at the start of the last sentence.

LrdSlvrhnd
06-17-2017, 08:50 PM
https://s26.postimg.org/z0rws2rt5/Trinket.jpg

I pulled the above in WGU tonight in a regular chest but yet the crafting machine says it's not craftable (i.e I can't disjunct it to make it ready for crafting on). It's not a named item since it's lootgen so it should be craftable.

Thank you.

Stoner81.

WAI now, none of the "wondrous items" (which the compasses count as) are craftable anymore, because people found ways to make high-level stuff at ML1 on them. Which really sucks for the compasses because they were the best source for craftable trinkets. They kept referring to them as "special items" from Stormhorns and Wheloon end reward lists, but I believe they can technically drop from anywhere.

Also, wow, I didn't even know they could come with slots. Now that would've made a heck of a craftable trinket!

zehnvhex
06-17-2017, 09:13 PM
It's entirely possible some extra mobs are aggroing when that quest stage is set. I'll take a look. Does it happen every time?

The DA spiking happens in a lot of quests with large pulls. Happens almost all the time with the battlemaster stage of Belly especially since you have like, 30 of them spawn at once. Honestly with how this zone is set up it would make more sense just to turn red alert off entirely (if that's even possible?)

Personally I only have stands mobs agro if someone isn't in the arena because they arrived ~slightly~ late (are in the first area when I trigger the fight). Don't seem to have any issue if they zone in once it starts though.

zehnvhex
06-17-2017, 09:44 PM
That was my fourth life as a rogue. Please try not to make assumptions about me and my playstyle, I hate having to "prove myself" and it adds an unnecessary wedge between my interactions with the community as a developer. I want the best for DDO, nothing else.

It's an educated guess based on your comments. You say that stealth play is working fine despite numerous people saying otherwise. Search AI has been broken for months now and it seems that archers especially now have homing arrows and will 100% break stealth unless you juke them. You can no longer evade mobs and essentially 'reset' aggro. I mean the other assumptions I could make are far less kind but you strike me as not the oblivious type so I'm more inclined to believe you just haven't experienced the stealth play we're talking about.

I mean, I don't doubt that you've played rogues before. I've also been playing them for 11 years now and stealth has gone through many changes over the years. It's just not fun anymore. Partially because of far too many forced encounters, partially because of aggro linking, partially because stealth isn't working like it used to and so on.

Telling us otherwise and then saying if we don't just accept your answer you're going to stop posting is not the kind of community interaction we want.

We love what you're doing with the fixes, everybody agrees. You won't find anyone that appreciates what you're doing more then people like me who have been harping for -ages- to get all these small things fixed. u36 is shaping up to be one of the best updates in DDO history thanks to you. I mean you could release it with -just- the stuff you've posted in this thread and I would be happy as a clam.

But blocking people or telling people that they're not allowed to try to figure out where you're coming from or you'll stop posting sours it incredibly and makes me not want to be involved either. I'd prefer to keep playing DDO. I'm absolutely in love with almost every quest Torc/Steel have had their hands on. But I'm also not above telling Torc that RSO is an absolute pile because I expect better from him.

The same goes with you. We love what you're doing but that doesn't mean we're not going to tell you that you're wrong about stealth.

Qezuzu
06-17-2017, 11:34 PM
I've seen quite a few people here and elsewhere talking about this. That specific change was actually a reversion to our previous shared aggro system. It is working as intended that you can no longer pull mobs by simply standing outside of their aggro range and hitting them one at a time. Monsters thematically will absolutely notice that you are shooting their friend with arrows :P



My last life was a pure assassin rogue and I had no trouble at all working either solo or in a group. I had some rough spots before 12 and Assassinate (Execute is so great O_O) but after 12 and up through 30 it was quite fun and rewarding. I did put points into both hide and move silently, though, so your mileage may vary if you neglect one or the other.


What specifically is wrong with aggro as it stands?

I'll tell you of the three bugs I know of regarding stealth.

Personal made-up terms used in this write-up:
aggro: mob knows where a player is, and is also targeting them specifically over other players (red-eye appears if the player is invis or sneaking)
soft-aggro: swinging-at-the-air 'searching behavior,' mob knew the location of a player, but then lost them. Their search is centered around the last location they knew the player was at, NOT the player (no red-eye)

I use these terms particularly so be sure you know I'm using a strict definition when I say aggro and soft-aggro.

My understanding of the aggro mechanics as it concerns sneaking players is that a mob that successfully aggro's a sneaking player alerts everything around it, however those alerted mobs CANNOT aggro on a player ("red-eye") unless they can successfully find the player themselves. Mobs alerted through shared aggro do not know the location of the player, they are simply made aware of a location where a player was seen, and thus soft-aggro. Furthermore, they cannot be alerted to new locations sneaking player has moved to by a mob that has aggro, unless they have given up searching, which takes 30 seconds.


The first and most minor bug: archer mobs that have only soft-aggroed can make 100% accurate shots at a player whose location they do not know. 0:06 in this video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_5cPlrvNfw8), where a mob gets soft-aggro on me through shared aggro and accurately fires a shot, which missed, even thought I rapidly sneaked away from the location they "saw" me at. If it hit, everything would have been able to aggro on me, and in a less controlled situation this would spell disaster for the sneaking player.



Second bug: mobs alerted of a sneaking player through shared aggro ignore party members they can see. Video example (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTJ5ukSKDA0). As I explained before, mobs do NOT know where a sneaking player is, they are simply told where a player was; they should immediately aggro on any player they successfully found themselves, it doesn't make sense that they would search for a single player when there could be as many as five other perfectly good targets in front of them. Not only that, they will spend the entire thirty seconds looking for that single sneaking player as though they were the only player in that dungeon. This is not only frustrating, it has exploit applications where large numbers of mobs can be made to waste their time looking for a sneaking player as they get picked off one by one by the rest of the group.



The third bug is completely WAI but it severely detracts from my enjoyment of the game, so I think it's a bug anyway. This is reapers having tremorsense. In reaper, if you sneak ahead you risk being the first player a reaper sees, and thus the first player that everything around the reaper will soft-aggro on. This seems reasonable, "just don't sneak ahead" you can say, but consider the practical applications of sneaking:
-building Measure the Foe stacks, satisfy stance requirement for Assassinate
-scouting ahead, which would actually be valuable in reaper if you wished to note champions and reapers
-moving to a more aggressive, flanking position prior to the start of combat
-move to attack dangerous mobs that keep their distance (casters) before combat starts
-being ahead of the rest of party but avoiding aggro, which again lets you be more aggressive by being able to attack earlier
-laying spell traps prior to combat to web/blind mobs
-save the party resources, effort by pulling a lever or completing whatever objective is guarded by mobs that do not need to be killed (very D&D scenario, snatch a key under the enemy's noses while the rest of the party waits)

Of these, only the first "tactic" really functions in reaper. In fact, if you do not have Assassinate, there is not really a reason to use sneak at all unless you're just confident there isn't a Reaper around the corner. In reaper, the only surefire way to avoid aggro while sneaking is to hang back, but doesn't hanging back on its own also allow you to avoid aggro? I guess it can help with the bug where mobs will aggro on the player furthest away from them..

Sneak does absolutely have cheese potential which is why I think there should be some difficulty in using it reaper, but as it stands it's just been completely gutted and players attempting to use the play style in reaper are simply punished for trying. I think it's better to have reapers have very high spot and listen scores, so that using it demands good gear, much like a DC caster who can make a reaper quest more trivial to complete than any sneaker could ever hope to.


There are many more refinements you can give the system but these are the three biggest things, and fixing them would really revive stealth as a playstyle in DDO, whose following has pretty much died off since the aggro mechanic changes and reaper. I personally played as a Rogue for most of my time in DDO, after abandoning my first character a couple months in I made an Assassin who, through many lives in for the last seven years, has been my main character and has been an Assassin or an Acrobat for 95% of her existence.

But now I've more or less abandoned the class simply because it's just plainly not fun to use anymore, it feels like a generic melee class now. My former main character has been pretty much been mothballed as I focus on my DC caster.

Also please, please, PLEASE tell your co-workers to stop making quests with every door and lever being locked-unless-you-kill-literally-everything.

Retired_Old_Gamer
06-18-2017, 12:10 AM
My last life was a pure assassin rogue and I had no trouble at all

Not everybody plays a rogue.

BRING BACK the single pull tactic in one form or another. These boards represent less than 5% of the player base. If you talked to the player base IN-GAME you'll find A LOT OF PEOPLE want this tactic back.

nokowi
06-18-2017, 12:12 AM
I'm not saying stealth in and of itself is working fine Nok. Stealth play is obviously in a really bad spot. What I mean is you can get by as assassin rogue because it's not like you're up a creek without a paddle once the entire dungeon is aggro on you. I was still able to complete quests on R1 on mine.

Ya, sorry if my tone seemed to be against you. I largely agree with what you have said in this thread.

I'm pretty sure I could complete most any quest, solo, on R1 without using stealth on my rogue (left before reaper, but elite was largely too easy, even solo). I solo'd Devil Assault on a melee assassin when it was in the top 4 toughest quests to solo. Using zero assassinations and successfully completing, it was probably the most painful and worst experience I had in 6 years of DDO. I would never want to repeat the experience. Nor do I want to move to clean up duty in groups without needing any stealth, which is what newer and more casual players tend to do. I have to chuckle at anyone sneaking into a room where someone already has agro - it's a total waste.



It's just not as fun/sneaky as it used to be and I'm guessing Lynn just didn't play a rogue ever prior to the recent changes. She has nothing to compare it to so her only perception is, "I don't see what the problem is, it looks fine to me."

I can accept her experience, but it is not representative of what those truly using stealth will find. I suspect she played ranged (telling us how great execute is, but not assassinate) and doesn't understand that melee plays much differently, particularly in conjunction with using assassinate.

Niminae
06-18-2017, 01:03 AM
Our recipes aren't kept in a traditional database. Splitting up the stone of change would be cool, but as we've said, it's way outside our scope for right now. We've gotta focus on making U36 and Ravenloft as great as they can be :)

I get priorities. Fine, push back fixing the Stone of Change. But please, when you do have time to fix things, don't do it in a short sighted manner. Don't "split up" the Stone of Change recipes. The real fix would be to actually use a traditional database that won't cause lag just because it has ~1000 entries in it. Databases are good at what they do, ~1000 entries is a tiny database.


WAI now, none of the "wondrous items" (which the compasses count as) are craftable anymore, because people found ways to make high-level stuff at ML1 on them.

This is a perfect example. Instead of breaking the compasses because there was an exploit and calling two wrongs a right, eliminate the exploit!

Another example would be how you are "fixing" the guard properties of Bracers of the Sun and Moon, but not fixing guard properties in general. Why spend time fixing 2 items (counting the heroic and epic versions as separate) but leaving broken every other item with the same effect that makes those 2 items desirable? Wouldn't fixing guard properties in general also fix the Bracers of Sun and Moon? If not, then that's another bug that needs to be corrected.

Nonesuch2008
06-18-2017, 07:13 AM
The stealth topic is way beyond the scope of this thread, but if you need background on where a lot of people are coming from, there are some great summations here:

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/484173-Here-is-What-is-Wrong-With-Stealth

Now then, back to the on-topic stuff.

"You receive AN universal challenge token."

I cringe every time that I see that one.

Lynnabel
06-18-2017, 11:19 AM
The real fix would be to actually use a traditional database

It's not possible to just "turn things into a database" or fix it "the right way," no matter how much I or anyone else wants it to happen. The Barter UI is a great "right way" to do things, but the act of porting things from the stone of change over is a huge waste of developer hours that could be better spent on making new content, or fixing old content to make it more fun. I would much rather see those several years that would be spent redoing inventory be put toward concrete fixes that actually change gameplay for the better, adding new and exciting features, and engaging with the community to determine the best direction the game can grow in.

SgtSarros
06-18-2017, 11:45 AM
It's not possible to just "turn things into a database" or fix it "the right way," no matter how much I or anyone else wants it to happen. The Barter UI is a great "right way" to do things, but the act of porting things from the stone of change over is a huge waste of developer hours that could be better spent on making new content, or fixing old content to make it more fun. I would much rather see those several years that would be spent redoing inventory be put toward concrete fixes that actually change gameplay for the better, adding new and exciting features, and engaging with the community to determine the best direction the game can grow in.



I notice the new intern you have in that cage you put them in is frequently on the forums even on the weekends. You may wish to check to make sure their exercise wheel is working. Want her to stay in shape and healthy after all!

In all seriousness, thanks for all the work you've done fixing so many of the things talked about in here. We get many of these are outside of your scope but it's good to see some of the long-standing minor annoyances finally dealt with :)

The only negative is with the sheer number of them i'm sure it won't even be mentioned in the patch notes besides 'numerous name and typo errors fixed'. All that hard work wrapped into six words at the bottom of a release note.

Aelonwy
06-18-2017, 11:49 AM
It's not possible to just "turn things into a database" or fix it "the right way," no matter how much I or anyone else wants it to happen. The Barter UI is a great "right way" to do things, but the act of porting things from the stone of change over is a huge waste of developer hours that could be better spent on making new content, or fixing old content to make it more fun. I would much rather see those several years that would be spent redoing inventory be put toward concrete fixes that actually change gameplay for the better, adding new and exciting features, and engaging with the community to determine the best direction the game can grow in.

Thanks for all you do Lynnabel.

I don't think anyone wants you to waste time. The thing is most of us wouldn't feel that making siberys/khyber shard crunching less tedious so we can get back into the action of the game is a waste of time.

Wizza
06-18-2017, 11:52 AM
Thanks for all you do Lynnabel.

I don't think anyone wants you to waste time. The thing is most of us wouldn't feel that making siberys/khyber shard crunching less tedious so we can get back into the action of the game is a waste of time.

I don't think anyone consider fixing stuff like that or "redoing inventory" a "waste of time" as she said.

In fact, personally, considering the latest trend of the game, I consider the 2 raids coming up in the expansion a waste of time, because I know they are not going to be run, just like the one in U35.

Tlorrd
06-18-2017, 12:07 PM
can you fix please ... bard tool tip for sustaining song and song of vigor. When placed on the hot bar, both say a duration of 30 seconds; however, when you use the activity both are actually (i think) 24 seconds plus 6 secconds per bard level.

thanks.

ps ... i like how you have you're own personal thread ... might be a great idea if each dev had their own personal thread for folks to respond to and in if a dev can from time to time list what they are working on ... thus they don't have to scour the boards for things addressed to them.

Lynnabel
06-18-2017, 12:49 PM
can you fix please ... bard tool tip for sustaining song and song of vigor. When placed on the hot bar, both say a duration of 30 seconds; however, when you use the activity both are actually (i think) 24 seconds plus 6 secconds per bard level.

thanks.

ps ... i like how you have you're own personal thread ... might be a great idea if each dev had their own personal thread for folks to respond to and in if a dev can from time to time list what they are working on ... thus they don't have to scour the boards for things addressed to them.

Part 1 of your post: Great catch! I'll tackle that first thing Monday morning :)

Part 2 of your post: The other developers are busy doing super cool secret things that I can't talk about (most of it rhymes with "Schmavenloft") and therefore don't have the time during the day for random bug fixing. Luckily, since most of my job involves helping the other developers with other, larger tasks, I sometimes get an hour or two just to knock out some good old fashioned bug fixing :)



The only negative is with the sheer number of them i'm sure it won't even be mentioned in the patch notes besides 'numerous name and typo errors fixed'. All that hard work wrapped into six words at the bottom of a release note.

I'm not here for personal glory, I'm here because I love DDO. Whatever the release notes say, it doesn't matter - it's all about how much it helps the game :)

Nonesuch2008
06-18-2017, 12:54 PM
Part 1 of your post: Great catch! I'll tackle that first thing Monday morning :)

Part 2 of your post: The other developers are busy doing super cool secret things that I can't talk about (most of it rhymes with "Schmavenloft") and therefore don't have the time during the day for random bug fixing. Luckily, since most of my job involves helping the other developers with other, larger tasks, I sometimes get an hour or two just to knock out some good old fashioned bug fixing :)


I'm not here for personal glory, I'm here because I love DDO. Whatever the release notes say, it doesn't matter - it's all about how much it helps the game :)

Thank you, it's all appreciated. Maybe we can organize a Stormreach parade or something later on for everyone's hard work. ;) I'm really looking forward to all the things that are coming up!

Metathron
06-18-2017, 12:57 PM
I was going to make a separate topic, but I'll post here in the hope that somebody at SSG reads it. Population seems dangerously low, and as a player looking to return I've noticed several simple issues that somehow have been left unaddressed by SSG. I'm beginning to suspect you should re-evaluate your priorities. Many of us are looking forward to the expansion, but there are other low hanging fruit that are at least as important. The immense response to this bug fix thread shows as much. QA is immensely important.

I'll start with two really crucial monetization issues:
1) When trying to re-subscribe, the launcher actually sends me to Turbine's store, with no way to subscribe and no hint that I'm even in the wrong place. I wonder how many subscribers you have lost due to this? Fixing this would have been the first thing I did if I were SSG, it amazes me that a key revenue stream is being neglected like this. You could maybe ask Turbine to use a HTTP redirect, or put up some message, if by some arcane twist of fate you can't change the launcher.

2) As a returning player, I want to play newer content such as the first expansion and not run the same 0-20 quests I've run a billion times. All my builds are of course outdated, and I want to play Dragonborn. Surprisingly, it doesn't seem like there is a way to change race without starting at L1, and apparently the only way to level up to first expansion (L20) requires an Otto's box, which for some silly reason isn't in the store atm?? How do we solve this problem? DDO business model is to provide fun for its players, to most of us it's a D&D *sandbox*, not a Skinner box. I'm prepared to pay to have fun content, but I will take my ~$200 elsewhere if I have to slog through the boring content first.

Finally,
3) The lag. I might be misremembering, but DDO felt more responsive back in the day. The biggest problem is however the occasional hiccups with warping mobs and missed attacks. I can't imagine playing a melee on high difficulties with such unreliable performance. Honestly, I don't know the specifics, but considering the low population I'm surprised lag is a problem. I've read up a bit on the forum and it seems like you have implemented a number of fixes over time. This might not be simple, but I'm surprised at how difficult a conclusive fix seems to be. Having extensive experience in writing performance critical code, in my experience this as most things follow a power law distribution, with only a few dominating causes. Once again, this might be an exception, but latency is usually straight forward to track down by careful profiling of the code.

Honestly, the basic combat physics in DDO was a key advantage over other MMOs back 10 years ago, it's a bit sad that this feature has been seemingly ignored by the powers that be. If you don't have the in-house expertize to fix the lag yourselves, perhaps you could draw in some old DDO dev on consulting basis.

TLDR; Follow up on your revenue streams and offers, you are turning away players and leaving money on the table. I want DDO to be around 6 months from now.

Don1966
06-18-2017, 01:10 PM
All righty, here's one to take a look at. Crafting Storage. In general if it goes in a collectable bag it will stack to 500 in the Crafting Storage bank. If it goes in an ingredient bag in general it will stack to 1000 in Crafting Storage. There are exceptions to this, for instance, Lily Petals will only stack to 99, Cannith Marks will only stack to 10. It would be nice if things would stack to the same numbers.

Lynnabel
06-18-2017, 01:32 PM
All righty, here's one to take a look at. Crafting Storage. In general if it goes in a collectable bag it will stack to 500 in the Crafting Storage bank. If it goes in an ingredient bag in general it will stack to 1000 in Crafting Storage. There are exceptions to this, for instance, Lily Petals will only stack to 99, Cannith Marks will only stack to 10. It would be nice if things would stack to the same numbers.

Entirely possible to fix! I'll need to confirm if the stack sizes set were intentional. Do you have a list on-hand of the irregular ones?

Don1966
06-18-2017, 01:46 PM
Entirely possible to fix! I'll need to confirm if the stack sizes set were intentional. Do you have a list on-hand of the irregular ones?

Sadly I do not have a full list as there are many collectables that I barely have double digits of.

On an unrelated note, the Ruby Eye of Rightousness augment does not break good DR when you would think it should.

Aletys
06-18-2017, 01:57 PM
Entirely possible to fix! I'll need to confirm if the stack sizes set were intentional. Do you have a list on-hand of the irregular ones?

Most collectibles & many ingredients are like this. Collectibles stack up to 1000 in a bag, but only to 99 in the shared storage.

Marks of House Cannith, Yuguloth & Silver Flame are horrible for this. Stack size is 10 max, & if your crafter doesn't have the favor to buy them directly, it's very painful buying them on another toon & then transferring them to the crafter ... 10 at a time.

Another one is the House C Challenge mats. They stack up to 10,000 in a huge ingredient bag, but only to 1000 in the shared storage.

FYI, it's my understanding that the shared storage stacks are the same as what you get if you put them in your inventory. So the limitation may actually be coming from inventory stack size limitations, which also need to be fixed.

Krelar
06-18-2017, 01:59 PM
On an unrelated note, the Ruby Eye of Rightousness augment does not break good DR when you would think it should.

That one is intentional, but disappointing. (Although if they want to rethink that position I wouldn't complain.)

peng
06-18-2017, 02:03 PM
Entirely possible to fix! I'll need to confirm if the stack sizes set were intentional. Do you have a list on-hand of the irregular ones?

As long as we're talking about stack sizes, any chance of increasing stack size of silver flame potions?

Lynnabel
06-18-2017, 02:05 PM
As long as we're talking about stack sizes, any chance of increasing stack size of silver flame potions?

4000% intentionally low.

LrdSlvrhnd
06-18-2017, 02:57 PM
All righty, here's one to take a look at. Crafting Storage. In general if it goes in a collectable bag it will stack to 500 in the Crafting Storage bank. If it goes in an ingredient bag in general it will stack to 1000 in Crafting Storage. There are exceptions to this, for instance, Lily Petals will only stack to 99, Cannith Marks will only stack to 10. It would be nice if things would stack to the same numbers.


Entirely possible to fix! I'll need to confirm if the stack sizes set were intentional. Do you have a list on-hand of the irregular ones?

The problem here is that items stack in the crafting bank only to a max of how they stack in inventory. Cannith Marks *only* stack to 10; Dissolvers *only* stack to 100, etc. Collectibles used to stack to 99, but this was increased when the crafting storage was introduced because of the outcry; however, Lily Petals (and the others that Demodris collects, and the Necro ones) aren't used in Cannith Crafting, so were missed.

Personally, I see nothing gamebreaking about just setting the crafting storage to a stack size of 10K, regardless of what it's like in inventory.

Here are the ones I specifically know about:



Collectables: (stack to 99)

Demodris Meele

Crimson Nightshade
Lily Petal
Woodblossom Nectar


Orchard of the Macabre

Abbot's Ring
Mark of Favor
Vol Prayer Charm



Ingredients

Stacks to 100

Dust of Disjunction
Dissolver
+10% Crafting success Booster (presumably others, but these are the ones available for large purchase with plat)


Stacks to 10

Mark of House Cannith
Mark of the Silver Flame
Mark of the Yugoloth





Sadly I do not have a full list as there are many collectables that I barely have double digits of.

On an unrelated note, the Ruby Eye of Rightousness augment does not break good DR when you would think it should.

It actually shouldn't; it only adds a damage proc, it doesn't actually change the weapon.

Mindos
06-18-2017, 04:10 PM
I would much rather see those several years that would be spent redoing inventory be put toward

You should do it for free on your own time! Think of the challenge! I'll bet you could get it done in under two years!
Or don't you love DDO as much as you say, hmmmm? :)

Mindos
06-18-2017, 04:15 PM
The confusion comes from both ranged assassins (experiencing less of the issues), and melee assassins that play clean up duty, not realizing that a stealth check was never made when they are not the first to enter a room. Stealth is certainly fine if you never use it -> these players should really learn to run into the room second out of stealth, as the results are the same. Stealth happens when you enter rooms before anyone else, and try to take actions ahead of the party.

I think you hit the nail on the head here. Stealth, your place on the agro list, stealth as a condition for an ability, etc are all different things.

Mindos
06-18-2017, 04:17 PM
That one is intentional, but disappointing. (Although if they want to rethink that position I wouldn't complain.)

Why is that?

EmGreen
06-18-2017, 05:23 PM
The problem here is that items stack in the crafting bank only to a max of how they stack in inventory. Cannith Marks *only* stack to 10; Dissolvers *only* stack to 100, etc. Collectibles used to stack to 99, but this was increased when the crafting storage was introduced because of the outcry; however, Lily Petals (and the others that Demodris collects, and the Necro ones) aren't used in Cannith Crafting, so were missed.

Personally, I see nothing gamebreaking about just setting the crafting storage to a stack size of 10K, regardless of what it's like in inventory.

Here are the ones I specifically know about:



Collectables: (stack to 99)

Demodris Meele

Crimson Nightshade
Lily Petal
Woodblossom Nectar


Orchard of the Macabre

Abbot's Ring
Mark of Favor
Vol Prayer Charm



Ingredients

Stacks to 100

Dust of Disjunction
Dissolver
+10% Crafting success Booster (presumably others, but these are the ones available for large purchase with plat)


Stacks to 10

Mark of House Cannith
Mark of the Silver Flame
Mark of the Yugoloth






It actually shouldn't; it only adds a damage proc, it doesn't actually change the weapon.

In addition, the crystal disc of /dreams, nightmares, phantasms, torments, horrors/ from the Dreaming Dark and Mindsunder chains only "stack" to a maximum of 1 in the crafting bank. They stack to different sizes in green bag vs in inventory so I'm not sure what the intended stack size is but it's gotta be more than 1.

I bug reported this and some other collectibles with wrong stack sizes around the time the crafting storage bank was introduced, but I think everything I had other than the discs is covered by LordSilverHand's list above.

Thank you ever so much for fixing this! :D

LrdSlvrhnd
06-18-2017, 05:44 PM
In addition, the crystal disc of /dreams, nightmares, phantasms, torments, horrors/ from the Dreaming Dark and Mindsunder chains only "stack" to a maximum of 1 in the crafting bank. They stack to different sizes in green bag vs in inventory so I'm not sure what the intended stack size is but it's gotta be more than 1.

I bug reported this and some other collectibles with wrong stack sizes around the time the crafting storage bank was introduced, but I think everything I had other than the discs is covered by LordSilverHand's list above.

Thank you ever so much for fixing this! :D

Forgot about those because I run those so little *g*

Intended stack size would be 1. The bags don't care about external stack limits, just their own... and IMHO, I think the crafting storage should be the same way.

Stoner81
06-18-2017, 07:27 PM
WAI now, none of the "wondrous items" (which the compasses count as) are craftable anymore, because people found ways to make high-level stuff at ML1 on them. Which really sucks for the compasses because they were the best source for craftable trinkets. They kept referring to them as "special items" from Stormhorns and Wheloon end reward lists, but I believe they can technically drop from anywhere.

Well that sucks worse than <insert something very very graphic here>.


Also, wow, I didn't even know they could come with slots. Now that would've made a heck of a craftable trinket!

I KNOW RIGHT! I saw it and was practically dribbling everywhere over it, I'd go as far to say I ended up with a nerd on over it!

Stoner81.

Gargoyle69
06-18-2017, 07:55 PM
Entirely possible to fix! I'll need to confirm if the stack sizes set were intentional. Do you have a list on-hand of the irregular ones?

Lynnabel, I've already said it but I feel drawn to saying it again. Please don't underestimate (or under-value) what you are doing here. You are doing wonders for the game, the community, and the relationship b/w customers & the company. Keep up the good work, keep fighting the good fight like this, we are loving what you are doing !

zehnvhex
06-18-2017, 07:59 PM
I'm not here for personal glory, I'm here because I love DDO. Whatever the release notes say, it doesn't matter - it's all about how much it helps the game :)

Given how popular this thread is I'd say you're helping the game a significant amount.

Here's one:

Can you change the timer on the public LFM popup when you zone into an area? It stays up for a really long time and takes up a ton of real estate in the middle of the screen. I think by now most everyone knows what it says. Or maybe move it off to the side or something?

Public LFM needs a lot of work but reducing the nuisance of that popup would be a great start.

Kantia
06-19-2017, 12:06 AM
Here's an easy typo for you:

Jungle of Khybher, the achievement says "Slay Chactar Luridae" but the NPC is spelled Chacter Luridae.

Stoner81
06-19-2017, 06:54 AM
Lynnabel, I've already said it but I feel drawn to saying it again. Please don't underestimate (or under-value) what you are doing here. You are doing wonders for the game, the community, and the relationship b/w customers & the company. Keep up the good work, keep fighting the good fight like this, we are loving what you are doing !

The most heartfelt +1 I have ever given <3

With that said I don't want to take from any of the devs and their time, energy and effort in creating, building and maintaining this wonderful sand box we all play in.

Stoner81.

Niminae
06-19-2017, 08:21 AM
It's not possible to just "turn things into a database" or fix it "the right way," no matter how much I or anyone else wants it to happen.

Well actually, it is possible. All it takes is the will and the skill. If SSG does not employ a DBA, then that is a roadblock for doing things right. But when the alternative is lag and band-aids and kludges on top of kludges, things aren't going to actually get better in the long run. In the short run, maybe. But not in the long run. Every band-aid and kludge added is just one more that would need to be removed to do things right, and then "it would take too much time to fix it right" becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy.

Kylstrem
06-19-2017, 08:26 AM
Well actually, it is possible. All it takes is the will and the skill. If SSG does not employ a DBA, then that is a roadblock for doing things right. But when the alternative is lag and band-aids and kludges on top of kludges, things aren't going to actually get better in the long run. In the short run, maybe. But not in the long run. Every band-aid and kludge added is just one more that would need to be removed to do things right, and then "it would take too much time to fix it right" becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy.

SSG: I hope you are taking note of this. As people who program and do technical things for your jobs, I'm sure none of this EVER occurred to you. This person has solved all your problems if only you do what he says. It's as easy as that. Forget about 12+ years of coding in DDO that you inherited. just hire a DBA and BAM! DDO is all good. I don't know why you guys didn't think of this. Genius!

Steelstar
06-19-2017, 08:29 AM
SSG: I hope you are taking note of this. As people who program and do technical things for your jobs, I'm sure none of this EVER occurred to you. This person has solved all your problems if only you do what he says. It's as easy as that. Forget about 12+ years of coding in DDO that you inherited. just hire a DBA and BAM! DDO is all good. I don't know why you guys didn't think of this. Genius!

"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Kylstrem again."

Cantor
06-19-2017, 08:56 AM
Oh. Could you make it stop telling me four times every time I zone that I can't use epic twists in heroic levels?
I know this only happens if you happen to look at EDs, but it's still annoying.

psykopeta
06-19-2017, 09:06 AM
It's entirely possible some extra mobs are aggroing when that quest stage is set. I'll take a look. Does it happen every time?

it happens to me, always, and it's a bit annoying cause my pc is quite awful lol

Cantor
06-19-2017, 09:13 AM
Another annoying stack size thing, (might have been mentioned already) The discs for mindsunder end chest do not stack in the crafting bank.

Natashaelle
06-19-2017, 09:16 AM
"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Kylstrem again."

"Thanks for adding Reputation to this user."

zehnvhex
06-19-2017, 09:23 AM
The pacify debuff that harpies can apply lasts 2 seconds less then the debuff icon for it.

Lerl
06-19-2017, 10:00 AM
For Bringing the Light, the quest giver is Brother Malden but the script upon completion of the quest talks about Brother Agustus. I have submitted bug reports for it, years ago and it still hasn't been fixed. It is annoying.

Hipparan
06-19-2017, 10:30 AM
For Bringing the Light, the quest giver is Brother Malden but the script upon completion of the quest talks about Brother Agustus. I have submitted bug reports for it, years ago and it still hasn't been fixed. It is annoying.

This is something that has always bothered me. Who is/was Brother Augustus?

LeoLionxxx
06-19-2017, 10:36 AM
Oh. Could you make it stop telling me four times every time I zone that I can't use epic twists in heroic levels?
I know this only happens if you happen to look at EDs, but it's still annoying.

I second this notion. I'll accidentally hit ctrl+e, planning to open my enhancements, but then I have to re-log to get rid of the message. Also spams the general chat tab.

Mindos
06-19-2017, 10:39 AM
Imagine you are Siri Keaton, wait, scratcth that. Imagine you are a new player, and you go to House J and run some Delera's! Yay. But since you are new, you follow the yellow chalice around. Now as a dev trying to fix things, notice how at points in the quest chain that a newbie will NOT know what to do since chalices either arent there OR the door doesnt flash, etc.

Gratch
06-19-2017, 10:44 AM
RE: In the Belly of the Beast instant red alerts


It's entirely possible some extra mobs are aggroing when that quest stage is set. I'll take a look. Does it happen every time?


If you have someone sitting up top side (even if they are in a safe place), and not down in the arena when the fight starts, then all the mobs in the viewing gallery aggro and it goes Red DA Instantly.

I believe I used a hireling for Deathward at the shrine and don't think I remembered to tell him to stop following and stay put until he was partway up the ramp to the top of the arena. Guess the hireling could have triggered the stands. Blargh.

scipiojedi
06-19-2017, 10:56 AM
Imagine you are Siri Keaton, wait, scratcth that. Imagine you are a new player, and you go to House J and run some Delera's! Yay. But since you are new, you follow the yellow chalice around. Now as a dev trying to fix things, notice how at points in the quest chain that a newbie will NOT know what to do since chalices either arent there OR the door doesnt flash, etc.

If you read the text you can figure out what to do, I'd like there to be more incentive to reading NPC text such as give clues to how to prep for the quest, what kind of items to bring, what path to take in a quest, etc.

Tlorrd
06-19-2017, 10:57 AM
Implosion does not have it's save listed in the tool tip when placed on the hotbar. Anyway to fix this please? Thanks.

Tlorrd
06-19-2017, 11:02 AM
Divine Cleansing lingering immunity to disease and poison in tool tip is listed as 12 seconds per cleric level; however, the duration listed in the tool tip states a hard 1 minute. My cleric was level 18 when I checked this and the duration was actually 3:48 and not 1 minute. Thanks.

Tlorrd
06-19-2017, 11:11 AM
So the PDK Past Life Feat when placed on hotbar works pretty much as it should.

However, it states in tooltip that the duration is 1 minute ... when in actuality the duration is 20 seconds and the cooldown is 1 minute. I might have this clarified to have both a duration and cooldown in the tooltip.

Thanks.

UurlockYgmeov
06-19-2017, 11:37 AM
Oh. Could you make it stop telling me four times every time I zone that I can't use epic twists in heroic levels?
I know this only happens if you happen to look at EDs, but it's still annoying.

hear-hear. the finger-pressing acrobatics sometimes leads to miss-pressed keys, along with ummm... what's that combo again....

Yell once if you must - but for all the Gods in two realms!!!

dunklezhan
06-19-2017, 12:13 PM
If you read the text you can figure out what to do, I'd like there to be more incentive to reading NPC text such as give clues to how to prep for the quest, what kind of items to bring, what path to take in a quest, etc.

Agreed, but not basic stuff like where the next quest actually is.

Jango-EX
06-19-2017, 01:50 PM
hey hey I got one to (kinda?) fix! at last, maybe i'll be able to help ddo in a tiny amount, or at least for hoarders like me!

I got a magical d20. It was inside my pretty dice bag for months but one day I was bored and, after organizing my augments bag decided to organize my dice bag.

I took the d20 out to sort my remaining cards in numeric order because it was in the middle of them. Unacceptable. I sorted them all, all the way from I to VIII or something. I was happy.

Then I could never put my magical d20 back in. Some very bad people did bad things back then and it is no longer bankable because of that. Cursed for all eternity. IIRC it won't even go to the TR Cache when you TR. It stays in my inventory, as a reminder of the evil that men do.

These days are gone, though. Maybe it's time for the curse to be lifted?

----

TLDR: hey pls allow us to place the magical d20 inside the dice bag again now that it's harmless, would be nice to have that inventory space back and i'm one of those guys that keep twigs and coal in alts just in case

nokowi
06-19-2017, 02:57 PM
SSG: I hope you are taking note of this. As people who program and do technical things for your jobs, I'm sure none of this EVER occurred to you. This person has solved all your problems if only you do what he says. It's as easy as that. Forget about 12+ years of coding in DDO that you inherited. just hire a DBA and BAM! DDO is all good. I don't know why you guys didn't think of this. Genius!

I feel that DDO is full of broken and outdated systems, and that they break more stuff than they fix. So while you can make a nice post refuting the over-simplification, ignoring or diminishing the actual issue does not help DDO, quite the opposite.

A rule of thumb would be to fix more than is broken, and if that leaves some outdated systems, that would be acceptable.

I also don't feel that Steelstar should have publicly commented with a +1, because players should feel free to express their opinions. I would much prefer actual substance, such as a post showing how devs are actually addressing the issue expressed by the players. The +1 without addressing the player is actually quite rude, even if it was not intended that way. You can take the time to provide players actual feedback if you can take the time to throw out the +1 --> and don't tell us you are too busy making content, because you took the time to read and post. I expect player sarcasm, so I have no issue with the over-simplification ignoring the actual issue by Klystrem.

It's quite sad when players receive more positive rep for "zingers" than for actual discussions.

Scrapco
06-19-2017, 03:01 PM
SSG: I hope you are taking note of this. As people who program and do technical things for your jobs, I'm sure none of this EVER occurred to you. This person has solved all your problems if only you do what he says. It's as easy as that. Forget about 12+ years of coding in DDO that you inherited. just hire a DBA and BAM! DDO is all good. I don't know why you guys didn't think of this. Genius!

Lemme know when they can put up an HTML store page once a week.

nokowi
06-19-2017, 03:05 PM
Lemme know when they can put up an HTML store page once a week.

An actual constructive post, providing specific actionable feedback, not likely to receive positive rep.

Hakushi
06-19-2017, 04:45 PM
Personally, I see nothing gamebreaking about just setting the crafting storage to a stack size of 10K, regardless of what it's like in inventory.

I definitely agree with you here.

Kylstrem
06-19-2017, 04:46 PM
I feel that DDO is full of broken and outdated systems, and that they break more stuff than they fix. So while you can make a nice post refuting the over-simplification, ignoring or diminishing the actual issue does not help DDO, quite the opposite.

A rule of thumb would be to fix more than is broken, and if that leaves some outdated systems, that would be acceptable.

I also don't feel that Steelstar should have publicly commented with a +1, because players should feel free to express their opinions. I would much prefer actual substance, such as a post showing how devs are actually addressing the issue expressed by the players. The +1 without addressing the player is actually quite rude, even if it was not intended that way. You can take the time to provide players actual feedback if you can take the time to throw out the +1 --> and don't tell us you are too busy making content, because you took the time to read and post. I expect player sarcasm, so I have no issue with the over-simplification ignoring the actual issue by Klystrem.

It's quite sad when players receive more positive rep for "zingers" than for actual discussions.

The devs were honest with why the stone of change thing is not going to be fixed in the near term. I love that honesty. I'm pretty sure almost any dev understands how databases work. I'm pretty they understand the enormity of the mess that the original stone of change "coding" is. They said it wasn't a normal database. And that the conversion would be nasty and complex.

At the end of the day, SSG has to decide where to put their resources. Having a DBA, and one who is good, i.e. expensive spend 6 months fixing some spaghetti code from 8+ years ago for a feature that really has no useful function anymore and no one really uses (and there are not a lot of people who are working on crunching dragonshards). Or use that same money/resource to get out new content that the majority of the players are going to benefit from.

Have you not been reading all the dev posts on this thread where Lynnabel is explaining how she is addressing the issues? She posted dozens of times on here explaining everything in clear language. Yet you grasp on to ONE response of dozens and whine about how Devs aren't addressing things.

When you have the "Actually" guy point out super-obvious things about databases to Devs, I don't think the Devs are really going to give that guy too much credence. Essentially the "Actually" guy is insulting the devs by saying "I don't think you guys have any idea what you are doing so let me explain something super-obvious to you about databases and what a DBA is... why didn't you think of this already?"

Kylstrem
06-19-2017, 04:48 PM
Lemme know when they can put up an HTML store page once a week.

That's marketing. Devs need to be fixing things and making new content. They need to get Cordovan some training on this.

Stoner81
06-19-2017, 04:54 PM
Or how about NOT bashing SSG employees and stay on topic? Lynn has done so much because of this thread please don't get it locked for something stupid and petty. Love or hate them it makes no difference they are the ones who build, run and maintain the game we all love! Without them there would be no game so lets to remember that shall we :)

Stoner81.

Kylstrem
06-19-2017, 04:58 PM
It's an educated guess based on your comments. You say that stealth play is working fine despite numerous people saying otherwise. Search AI has been broken for months now and it seems that archers especially now have homing arrows and will 100% break stealth unless you juke them. You can no longer evade mobs and essentially 'reset' aggro. I mean the other assumptions I could make are far less kind but you strike me as not the oblivious type so I'm more inclined to believe you just haven't experienced the stealth play we're talking about.

I mean, I don't doubt that you've played rogues before. I've also been playing them for 11 years now and stealth has gone through many changes over the years. It's just not fun anymore. Partially because of far too many forced encounters, partially because of aggro linking, partially because stealth isn't working like it used to and so on.

Telling us otherwise and then saying if we don't just accept your answer you're going to stop posting is not the kind of community interaction we want.

We love what you're doing with the fixes, everybody agrees. You won't find anyone that appreciates what you're doing more then people like me who have been harping for -ages- to get all these small things fixed. u36 is shaping up to be one of the best updates in DDO history thanks to you. I mean you could release it with -just- the stuff you've posted in this thread and I would be happy as a clam.

But blocking people or telling people that they're not allowed to try to figure out where you're coming from or you'll stop posting sours it incredibly and makes me not want to be involved either. I'd prefer to keep playing DDO. I'm absolutely in love with almost every quest Torc/Steel have had their hands on. But I'm also not above telling Torc that RSO is an absolute pile because I expect better from him.

The same goes with you. We love what you're doing but that doesn't mean we're not going to tell you that you're wrong about stealth.

The one big thing that has broken stealth is that Champions seem to "auto-see" you no matter what. And when they Auto-See you, they "tell" every other mob that is a non-champion where you are. This makes stealthing just about impossible in any quest that is hard or higher (anything that can have champs) because all it takes is some random champion in a room you can normally stealth to ruin it all.

Maybe I've just not been stealthy in my attempts and maybe Champs don't get "auto-detection" of a stealth character. It would be nice to have confirmation if Champs get to "auto-see" a stealthy, inviso'ed character or if there is actually a DC check involved.

Ebondevil
06-19-2017, 04:59 PM
This is something that has always bothered me. Who is/was Brother Augustus?

Brother Augustus, a priest of the Church of the Silver Flame, who can be found in the Wayward Lobster.

Lynnabel
06-19-2017, 05:18 PM
Or how about NOT bashing SSG employees and stay on topic?

I think it just means I'm part of the team :)

All of the bard songs now list appropriate durations, PDK feat now lists appropriate duration, Chactar Luridae will hopefully keep their name this go around, cleric thing - divine cleansing? - now lists appropriate duration, I've deleted warlocks, and some other stuff that's totally insanely cool but can't show you guys until u36!

btw no progress on stack sizes, totally slipped my mind. Tomorrow! Or, uh, eventually! Maybe!

oh and the whole "Hey you stop touching your twists!" dealio is rough but necessary, it's part of the "hey stop touching EDs in heroics, I mean it!!!" system. Sorry! I'll see if I can get it to, uh, stop yelling.