View Full Version : Returning Player: Old character is nearly useless in Epics, help needed.

04-18-2016, 03:22 AM
I took a fairly long break at the end of 2014, only coming back now. And to my great surprise, many mechanics have completely changed! And so by that fact several of my characters have been rendered extremely weak or even useless!

My main character, who is on his third life, is a strength based TWF 18 FVS 2 Paladin, which I remember being a very, very good build back several years ago. I remember being able to crush basically anything at most levels and level 20 epic content. However, in this new world of beyond level 20, I am nearly useless. I only do about 120 damage per hit, and instantly die in any melee combat for Epic elite above level 23. I also seem to have basically no health! This feels very strange for me. I am level 24, and have 593, which when i left, was totally fine, or in fact pretty good!. Now I see people running around with 800 at my level and 1200 at 30, AS A CASTER CLASS, and it makes me really sad.

I guess the game has just heavily evolved, and I fell behind in my downtime. While buffed I have 52 str, 30 con, 36 Charisma, so I don't think I am that lacking in stats, but maybe I am? I don't know. As i am trying to quest forward, instant, unavoidable deaths are becoming less of a once per dungeon, and more of a every 30 seconds kind of thing, and its making me hate the game. Is there anything that can be done, or am I TRing?

04-18-2016, 05:30 AM
Hi and welcome back!

The game has evolved, yes, largely due to the opinion that it was too easy and not much of a challenge at end game.

But before you TR or re-roll any of your toons, consider taking them to lvl 30 and then Epic TR'ing back to 20. This will give you your 1st epic past life and accompanying feats. This will only make you ever-so-slightly stronger, however the ETR process will give you a chance to re-spec your stats, skills and feats. You cannot change your classes or the levels at which you took them, or your alignment - but you get 2 Epic Past-life feats (a passive and a toggled stance) and a re-spec.

Once you are back at 20 after the ETR you have the choice to run up to 30 again (and ETR again, adding to your EPL feats) or True TR back to 1 (or 15 if you choose Iconic).

The run from 20 to 30 can be done fairly quickly if you like running the same 'dailies' every day, but I don't know your playstyle so this may not be for you. If you wish to maintain your elite streak it's gonna take longer than dropping to a hard streak as the step from Epic Hard to Epic Elite is a big one!

If your frustration wins out and you can't bear it any longer, have a look here (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/470423-Build-Repository) for some build ideas - heck have a look anyway, you might find some ideas to help with your current toons.

Good luck.


Edit: ETR followed immediately by a True TR is only possible if your current life is not an Iconic (as Iconics have to be lvl 30 to True TR)

04-18-2016, 05:36 AM
Hey there, welcome back.
Your stats don't look too bad for someone who just came back from such a long break, though ability scores don't say everything. More important to know are things like your individual layers of defense, self healing and the damage you're doing. The HP you have could be a bit higher if you get into melee a lot. I don't know what your PRR and MRR are at, or your dodge, fortification and if you have concealment and incorp covered. Knowing that would help. I'm assuming you have no problems self healing as an fvs.

there are plenty of things that can be done to salvage your build. Personally I would have at least 3 paladin levels on a melee build like that, because it will give you access to sacred defender stance which can give you +25 PRR, MRR, +3 saves and +30% hp defense wise and it allows for a bigger save bonus from your charisma. Another good splash option for TWF builds in particular is 5 or 6 ranger.

You shouldn't have to change classes to perform at the very least decently in epics though. A lot has changed gear wise, with the recent random loot pass for instance. It would help to know what your gear layout is at the moment to see if any defenses are missing, like PRR (sheltering), concealment (blurry, can cover with blur wands and displacement clickies) and incorp(ghostly). 100% fortification is also not always enough anymore, I'd shoot for between 150 and 200 because of champions and other mobs with armor piercing.

Besides increasing your offense and defense you could look into ways to passively cc mobs, like a paralyzing weapon, freezing ice and tier 3 balanced attacks from primal avatar, which knocks mobs down and helpless on a vorpal. A deception item also helps by turning mobs around so they swing at the air instead of you.

If you show what enhancements you're using we can check if there's anything that may not be all that useful in the current meta.
What's also very important is the epic destiny you're using since a great deal of power after 20 comes from that. Without knowing that I can't say for sure whether your damage is where it should be. For example it's fine if you're in unyielding, but running in LD I'd expect bigger hits than 120.

You mention EE, have you considered running EN or EH for a while to familiarize yourself with everything that's changed and to get back into the game?

04-18-2016, 03:48 PM
Alright here is my full stat sheet, lets seem if there are large improvements that can be made. And on a side notee, I can solo most EN and even a lot of EH just fine, but even in full groups I can't even handle 1 mob in EE, so maybe I am just used to be able to deal with a few mobs on EE before the updates?

Str 52 (With Divine Might)
Dex 30
Con 30
Int 10
Cha 33

HP 578


Fort 47
Reflex 45
Will 37

Fortification 125

AC 61
PRR 67 (Using a Sheltering 23 item, which is the highest I have been able to get my hands on)
MRR 23
DR 5/- and 5/- (Favored soul and armor)

04-19-2016, 06:02 PM
Ok, let's see.

Heavy armor gives a PRR of 2*BaB. It's important that you use either t5 warpriest, the spell divine power or run in Divine Crusader to make sure you have full BaB. Tensers also gives full BaB progression but it's much less convenient to have to keep up considering your build. With that, heavy armor should give you a PRR of 44.
Your warpriest enhancement wall of steel adds 10 to that.

That puts us at 44 + 23 + 10 = 77 with your sheltering item.

New random loot and named items like Boots of the devil Commander (http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Boots_of_the_Devil_Commander) or Planar Compass (http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Planar_Compass) can add an insightful bonus to that, and more bonuses can be found in epic destinies, like Divine Crusader. Another +5 could come from two weapon defense, but I understand not being able to fit it in without bonus feats.

Ideally you'd have more in melee, but as a third lifer with your class split you're limited in that regard. The usual list to check would be false life item, vitality item, maybe gs hp item, insightful con item, level appropriate con item(10 at 24 is not uncommon with new lootgen), have you taken your draconic vitality feat and are you running in a destiny that helps with your hp.

To give you more time to heal you of course want to take as few hits as possible through AC, concealment, incorporeality and dodge. You wont get AC high enough to matter this life, so focus on the other 3. Dodge is quick to fix in heavy armor. Sacred defender's armor mastery and a sapphire of armored agility increase your max dex bonus and a decent dodge item should cap you.
I don't slot concealment unless it happens to come on something I'm wearing, but I do use wands of blur and displacement clickies. It's a good layer of defense against things without true seeing. Keep in mind a lot of champions bypass it though.
Incorporeality I really like as an extra 10% chance that no melee/ranged enemy seems to bypass. It comes on the compass I listed in the bit about PRR and a lot of the epic necro items.

Decent for fvs, but you're going to fail saves in EE. Make sure you're scrolling GH, wearing a good resistance item and a riposte/parrying item on top of it like Bracers of the Sun Soul. Good luck also stacks. Here twists can help you get a few extra points, like Magister's Unearthly Reactions for reflex or Unyielding Sentinel's Brace for Impact for a small bonus to all 3 and some added fortification.

Last things: you left around the time champions were introduced. They added a lot of difficulty to mainly EE for players who aren't used to them and could partially explain why you're struggling. Also full party means scaling, but that's never been any different. Old content hasn't been made any harder besides that, but your build has lost saves, PRR and MRR due to this patch (http://ddowiki.com/page/Update_28_Patch_1). You may also be lagging, we all are for now :p
Silly addition maybe, but check if you have all your stances toggled. I know I sometimes forget after a day, let alone years.

If the 10 PRR you are missing is because of BaB I'd highly recommend fixing that since it will also improve your rate of attack. Leading to more damage and more procs of the passive cc I mentioned, like paralyzing, freezing ice, deception, blinding and balanced attacks. Thunderforged weapons can get blinding at t1 and paralyzing at t2, still leaving the other hand free for a dps focused version. As a TWF investing in this kind of cc it can really help with quickly picking off mobs one at a time while minimizing the damage done to you.

I still have no idea if you even have EDs and which one you use, but in your current build I'd run Divine Crusader or Legendary Dreadnaught.

All in all, change out some gear and EDs and just get used to playing again. Good luck!

11-06-2016, 08:16 PM
First step is go to the AH and buy cheap new gear which will be WAY better than the epic stuff you will have farmed years ago.

Then check your enhancements and epic destiny.

And as said above, EH your way to 30 and then ETR and rebuild your character if you enjoy it and want to then spend time at 30. Or TR and build something new !