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View Full Version : Iconics - an idea to improve their versatility



Iriale
04-28-2015, 06:42 AM
Currently I feel the iconics like a job unfinished and a bad joke to the players. There are not iconics for all classes, some iconics don’t have the most iconic background for the race (sun elf as clerics? Seriosly? Arcane is the right iconic background for this race…), and we have to spend a +1 heart to play with the class we want, or do a multiclass that makes no sense. Understand, designers, this game draws heavily on the diversity of builds. Iconics don’t favor this, because their first level is set.

What I propose is to create new iconics, but using the old ones. Preserve race, appearance, and create new trees for each race with backgrounds that fit the race. For example, the bladeforged could have a tree for paladin, one for fighter, other for sorcerer, other for barbarian and other for artificer. Why not? No doubt the Lord of Blades created champions of many classes. And players could become very happy with this. Create more racial iconic trees to the sun elf: wizard (high elf / arcane knight), favored soul, druid, bard. And for the shadar-kai: ranger and fighter at least, although arcanes shadar-kai could be cool too, and other classes. Each variant (new tree) would have its own background, but you could re-use the basic model of the iconic, changing only some skills of the racial tree to fit the new background. Most of classes only could need minor changes to the trees, other would need more work. Indeed, some classes may even share the same tree. Fighter/ Paladin in the case of bladeforged, or cleric/fvs in the case of morninglord, for example.

Sell the new iconic trees separate to the basic iconic, reasonably priced (eg, harper tree), and certainly will have very good reception. I know many people who want something as this. It’s better than to buy a +1 hearth and to do the boring duty of level twice before to start to play. Also, new iconics who you create in the future will be better received if they have variations for different classes

And incidentally, please, please, please, re-make the look of PDKs. The appearance of this iconic is atrocious! And let a greater variety of hairstyles to shadar-kais, please.

Moreover, if you create a new iconic, might be cute a kalashtar iconic. Never mind that there is no psionics in the game; psionic abilities could be included in the racial tree itself.

General_Gronker
04-28-2015, 08:06 AM
Currently I feel the iconics like a job unfinished and a bad joke to the players. Unfinished? Maybe. Bad joke? That's dumb.

Iconics don’t favor this, because their first level is set. That claim demonstrates a lack of understanding of what "diversity" is on your part. I've used Iconics for a variety of builds and all without using any hearts to remove the fixed 1st level.


create new trees for each race with backgrounds that fit the race. For example, the bladeforged could have a tree for paladin, one for fighter, other for sorcerer, other for barbarian and other for artificer. Why not? Because it's a poor idea at best and a waste of resources.


No doubt the Lord of Blades created champions of many classes. And you know how you represent this? Oh, hey, right. By Multiclassing after the 1st level. Crazy that existing mechanics could handle this, I know.


And players could become very happy with this. Cite your sources please. I seem to recall here on the forums a fair number of players not liking the iconics at all, and not because of a lack of diversity, but on a purely conceptual level.


Create more racial iconic trees to the sun elf: wizard (high elf / arcane knight), favored soul, druid, bard. No, no, no and NO. If you want your sun elf to have access to those trees, MULTICLASS YOUR CHARACTER. Period.


I know many people who want something as this. And I know many who don't, and for better reasons.


psionic abilities could be included in the racial tree itself.No, that's a poor idea. If psionics are going to be added, they need to be done so properly. Period.

Literally the only good ideas you have are changing the iconic class for sun elves. Otherwise, your entire post represents a fundamental lack of understanding on the mothergame, this game, enhancement trees, and the purpose of Iconics. What you want is mostly covered already by multiclassing. Which is how it's supposed to work.


/NOT signed

Iriale
04-28-2015, 09:12 AM
Why multiclass is the only answer? It is absurd. If someone wants multiclass is free to do now. More choices are not bad, on the contrary. I think it is you who should prove that people do not want more options --- I have seen constantly in these forums (and in game) that what people want is choice, not vice versa. Moreover, what I propose is more consistent with the background of an iconic that necessarily to do multiclass. And nobody has said the multiclass is removed. If you want multiclass, keep doing it.

Why today's iconics must be the only ones there? There are not a huge selection now. Three melees and one divine. Meh. Could have a wider selection. There is at least an iconic (the morniglord) that is NOT the iconic to the race. But do new iconic from scratch would cost a lot more work. Use the current iconic is faster. And there is no reason for the bladeforged have to be born as a paladin (Lord of blade created a lot of classes), or the solar elf is a cleric (Divine it’s not the iconic for the race!!!!). Absurd. There is no reason not to have more variety of shadar-kai. A morniglord conceptually fits equally well with fvs or cleric. The only iconic that conceptually fits 100% with his class is the PDK, and yet the PDKs had members of many classes in their ranks.

There are builds that are better pure class. There are players who like to play pure class characters. Indeed, pure class fits even more with the concept of the an iconic (but I don’t want multiclass removed) And finally, no, the multiclass is not the solution to all problems. If you like multiclass, good, but others want more options.

It is not a waste of resources, not when many people would enjoy these iconic variants, not when these variants could be a source of income for turbine.

And yes, there are many people who feel cheated by the concept of spending hearts +1. No, not all builds are made to multiclass. And yes, many people would buy this.

You all you say is “I don’t need it, so is a bad idea”. But you do not represent all the players in this game. Just look at a few threads about iconics to see that many people would are very happy with more choices. There is now a thread of a guy who want to play a sun elf from level 1 as pure wizard. Well, he can not, because there is not some variation in the iconics and we're not even talking about the iconic concept suitable for the race (cleric for an sun elf, what designers thought?)

The kalashtar is only a proposal for a new iconic. There are many other concepts that I would like see, although I hope not limited as the current iconics. And frankly, I do not think I will ever see psionics in gameplay. Many possibilities of the psionic (eg, telepathy) are not are well transferred to the DDO and mechanics would be too much like magic. Psionics as specialized trees (race, universal like harper tree) could at least give some psionic flavor to the game. But in any case this was a separate proposal of the iconic variants of which I spoke earlier.



Literally the only good ideas you have are changing the iconic class for sun elves. Otherwise, your entire post represents a fundamental lack of understanding on the mothergame, this game, enhancement trees, and the purpose of Iconics. What you want is mostly covered already by multiclassing. Which is how it's supposed to work.
you can save the insult. I understand perfectly the mothergame, this game, enhancement trees, and the purpose of Iconics. Indeed, my proposals are more consistent with the background of an iconic that many multiclasses that are often made- and that you propose.
If the iconics were really consistent with his background, multiclass would not be possible. But nobody wants that. Everyone wants options ... even you, you said you play multiclassed iconics.
If you understood the concept of the iconics ... you would not build them as multiclass. Originally the iconics were necessarily pure class. And the players hated it instantly. So designers changed them to give us more options. Does that mean that all players are happy with the choices we have now? If you read a few threads you would see clearly that is not the case.