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Warlawk
04-20-2015, 09:33 PM
I've been away from the game for quite some time now. (Last played for a short while when Artificer was new) So I am familiar but far from a vet. I just have basic 38 point buy and no real twink items to speak of.

As such, what would be the ideal melee build to play? I have a wiz/rogue at like level 11, and a level 12 arty. Just looking for something fun and relatively east to play for melee. I would prefer that it can do traps as I solo.

I solo. Full stop, non negotiable.

Any suggestions would be great, thanks!

Vulkoorex
04-20-2015, 09:41 PM
Human Paladin with Heavy Armor.

unbongwah
04-20-2015, 09:51 PM
I think pure pally is still the most self-sufficient / newbie-friendly of the melee classes; they got a big boost to DPS in Update 23 to go along with their pretty good survivability. The first build in my Sacred Vanguard thread starts out as a 2H pally before switching to S&B Vanguard at higher lvls; but it can stay pure melee DPS too. Also see my drow paladin thread for TWF build examples. The biggest downside to pallies IMHO is they don't get a lot between, say, lvls 6-12; mostly just extra spells and more APs until you can take their tier-5 enhancements.

Barbs got some major survivability buffs in U24 as well; in particular, all of the barb PrEs have free self-healing in their tier-5 abilities, which become available at lvl 12. The downside is you have to make it to lvl 12 first without any self-heals (apart from pots & hires), which still makes them a little more challenging to be self-sufficient on a newbie build.

Bards also got big DPS buffs in the Swashbuckler PrE; you'll find plenty of S&B bards on the forums. Start with the Count of MC (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/443235-The-Count-of-Monte-Cristo-dps-CC-survivability-focused-pure-swashbuckler).

icekinslayer
04-20-2015, 09:55 PM
I've been away from the game for quite some time now. (Last played for a short while when Artificer was new) So I am familiar but far from a vet. I just have basic 38 point buy and no real twink items to speak of.

As such, what would be the ideal melee build to play? I have a wiz/rogue at like level 11, and a level 12 arty. Just looking for something fun and relatively east to play for melee. I would prefer that it can do traps as I solo.

I solo. Full stop, non negotiable.

Any suggestions would be great, thanks!


level 1 - rogue
level 2-8 - paladin
level 9 rogue
level 10-20 - paladin

sword and shield. put skill points into disable device, search, spot, and heal, and open lock where you can.

keep your search, disable and open lock gear up to date, use +5 tools only and you should be good for traps.

Warlawk
04-20-2015, 10:46 PM
Thanks everyone, I thought the pally stuff looked pretty good. Better to go Sword/board vanguard than knight of the chalice?

EllisDee37
04-20-2015, 11:36 PM
level 1 - rogue
level 2-8 - paladin
level 9 rogue
level 10-20 - paladin

sword and shield. put skill points into disable device, search, spot, and heal, and open lock where you can.What, an int-based Harper build? Paladins get 2 skill points per level. Assuming human for the extra skill point, your skill recommendations require 7 skill points per level (dumping open lock), which would mean a starting int of 18.

A paladin trapper is very difficult to pull off skill-wise.

Hobgoblin
04-20-2015, 11:39 PM
just to clarify,,,,,,,,


how do you get a 38 pt build?? :) :)

in seriousness,

in order of survivablity/dps,

Pure pally.

pure pally

pure paladin.

paladin that is pure

then paladin/rogue

then paladin monk.

then pure barb.

then something else.

EllisDee37
04-20-2015, 11:44 PM
You might like a bard trapper.

Swashbuckler is very strong melee dps -- it's one of the "big 3": paladin, barbarian, bard -- and very strong very early; you get the bulk of your melee power from bard level 3 compared to paladin level 14.

Bards get nice spells (fom, ddoor, more cures than paladins) plus a truly impressive fascinate ability for excellent crowd control when running solo.

Bards get more skill points than paladins (and UMD is native!) so it's easier to maintain trapping skills.

unbongwah
04-20-2015, 11:45 PM
Better to go Sword/board vanguard than knight of the chalice?
"Better" is a relative term, but I will say there's never been a better time to play a S&B char in DDO. :) That said, I suggest going with the combat style which most appeals to you and looking for builds to match.

Warlawk
04-21-2015, 12:16 AM
just to clarify,,,,,,,,


how do you get a 38 pt build?? :) :)

in seriousness,

in order of survivablity/dps,

Pure pally.

pure pally

pure paladin.

paladin that is pure

then paladin/rogue

then paladin monk.

then pure barb.

then something else.

So does a pure pally just pretty much facetank the traps then? Is that viable for running hard/elites?

Bard looks very interesting too... Choices choices.

Thanks everyone for the input!

EDIT: And yes, it's simple to get a 39 point build. You just cast Power Word: Typo ;)

Vulkoorex
04-21-2015, 12:41 AM
I have a PDK 2 fighter / 15 Paladin split S&B. Traps are nothing in Heroic. Run though them and a quick lay on hands to keep on running (on elite). If you want better DPS then go for KtC.

My toon is on its 2nd life with no Epic Destinies.

CThruTheEgo
04-21-2015, 12:43 AM
So does a pure pally just pretty much facetank the traps then? Is that viable for running hard/elites?

Yes. MRR from heavy armor has made the need to avoid traps pretty much unnecessary.

As others have mentioned, the three most newb friendly melees are bard, paladin, and barb. Bard has a great deal of versatility, as well as solid defenses and dps. Pick this if you want to be able to do many different things.

Paladin is practically indestructible and has solid dps, but that's it. They don't do anything else except kill and not die. Too boring for my playstyle, but it suits some people. Pick this if you just want to slaughter stuff mindlessly.

Barb has better survivability than they used to but is behind both bard and paladin, and they get solid dps. Honestly, I don't see barbs as being ahead of either bards or paladins in any way.

Hobgoblin
04-21-2015, 12:50 AM
So does a pure pally just pretty much facetank the traps then? Is that viable for running hard/elites?

Bard looks very interesting too... Choices choices.

Thanks everyone for the input!

EDIT: And yes, it's simple to get a 39 point build. You just cast Power Word: Typo ;)

ya.


if you go paladin or barb,make sure you take a shield with and have it on your hotbar for traps.

you use prr? mrr? one of the two for damage mitagation

pure bard is an option i forgot to say.

you get evasion at the capstone, you get ok prr/mrr, but nothing like you get with heavy armor

icekinslayer
04-21-2015, 07:13 PM
What, an int-based Harper build? Paladins get 2 skill points per level. Assuming human for the extra skill point, your skill recommendations require 7 skill points per level (dumping open lock), which would mean a starting int of 18.

A paladin trapper is very difficult to pull off skill-wise.

You never guessed to put pts into a couple skills every other level? you don't need to max every important skill every level. It's ok to skip a level and still do every pertinent trap on heroic, and epic. I know this because I've done this, which is why I suggested this. Human pally/rogues that can do all the traps are not that hard to pull off, without resorting to harper trees, and on a first life. Gear is the more important thing to worry about, and finding a cannith crafter on any server can't be that difficult.

Takes a little effort is all.

EllisDee37
04-22-2015, 03:14 AM
You never guessed to put pts into a couple skills every other level? you don't need to max every important skill every level. It's ok to skip a level and still do every pertinent trap on heroic, and epic.How many ranks are you thinking for each trapping skill by level 20? 15?

cru121
04-22-2015, 04:40 AM
You never guessed to put pts into a couple skills every other level? you don't need to max every important skill every level. It's ok to skip a level and still do every pertinent trap on heroic, and epic. I know this because I've done this, which is why I suggested this. Human pally/rogues that can do all the traps are not that hard to pull off, without resorting to harper trees, and on a first life. Gear is the more important thing to worry about, and finding a cannith crafter on any server can't be that difficult.

Takes a little effort is all.

With maxed skill tomes, GH pots, master crafted cannith gear, gs exceptional skills, 3 martial past lives, 3 arti past lives, ML7 good luck +2 items, legacy twinked +15 items, and full ship buffs --- anything is possible.

For a new player - unlikely.

Bart_D
04-22-2015, 07:52 AM
Definitely go with the style that seems the most fun to you.

I have not played barbarian in a long time so cannot really comment on that but both paladin and bard are great.

Paladin is tough with heavy armor and whatever weapon setup. It can be splashed or pure, but with updated enhancements there is less need for extra feats from fighter which used to be very popular.

Bard has spells and songs to play with in addition to swashbuckler dps. It can work very well pure but it is fairly easy to fit in trap skills if you splash rogue (get 2 for evasion). 3-6 fighter levels are popular for feats and defensive stance. FWIW, I'm currently playing a rogue2/bard15/fighter3 because i wanted trap skills and defensive stance while still being mostly bard. It is stronger than I thought it would be.

voodoogroves
04-22-2015, 11:16 AM
Just want to chime in and say that as someone who was away for quite a while and is recently spinning back up, the concept that Bards and Paladins are easy and effective melee builds is still kinda unbelievable to read. Much has changed, clearly.

EllisDee37
04-22-2015, 12:41 PM
Just want to chime in and say that as someone who was away for quite a while and is recently spinning back up, the concept that Bards and Paladins are easy and effective melee builds is still kinda unbelievable to read. Much has changed, clearly.Ha, right!

What happened was the devs put out a public survey anyone could fill out (and they strongly encouraged us all to do so) asking essentially "which classes stink?" This was broken down into a dozen or two questions, but that was the gist.

The final tabulation (which they shared with us) put paladin and bards firmly in last place, well behind everything else. Eventually they started doing passes on each class, one per update, starting with paladin (the worst) then bard (second to worst) then a little ahead of them but still lagging behind was barbarian.

The first revamp was paladin, who got a better KotC tree and Holy Sword was changed to add +1 to crit range and multiplier, so pally shot to the front of the class.

Bard was next, who got a whole new fighting style (single weapon fighting) to specialize in and a new tree to take that style to the next level. In a swashbuckler's hands, any valid weapon becomes 15-20x3. (!) So boom, bards were up there with paladins at the top of the heap.

Then barbarians, who were voted weak due to lack of self-healing, got their turn and received rock solid self-healing.

Then rogues got their turn this most recent update, but they didn't get a huge boost because they weren't that far back in the original survey. (Though they might be now if they did a new survey in relation to the new and improved pally/bard/barb.)

Next update looks to be no revamp, instead introducing the new Warlock class.

unbongwah
04-22-2015, 01:28 PM
The first revamp was paladin . .

Bard was next . . .
Other way around: bards were revamped in U22, pallies in U23.

icekinslayer
04-22-2015, 07:46 PM
With maxed skill tomes, GH pots, master crafted cannith gear, gs exceptional skills, 3 martial past lives, 3 arti past lives, ML7 good luck +2 items, legacy twinked +15 items, and full ship buffs --- anything is possible.

For a new player - unlikely.

You missed the Part where I said I did it on a first life. It's just the trapping gear you need. No need for skill tomes. GH can be scrolled easily. No gs on a first life toon. None of the 6 past lives on a first life toon. Good luck from the Voice of the Master is easy. Legacy twinked +15 items is just silly. Ship buffs are easy if you're in a guild.

Anymore nonsense you'd like to add? It CAN be done with a little effort, no need to try to disprove me, because as I've said many many times, I've done it. Smrtass.

Jsbeer
04-23-2015, 07:08 AM
You missed the Part where I said I did it on a first life. It's just the trapping gear you need. No need for skill tomes. GH can be scrolled easily. No gs on a first life toon. None of the 6 past lives on a first life toon. Good luck from the Voice of the Master is easy. Legacy twinked +15 items is just silly. Ship buffs are easy if you're in a guild.

Anymore nonsense you'd like to add? It CAN be done with a little effort, no need to try to disprove me, because as I've said many many times, I've done it. Smrtass.

I think it is MUCH more than a little effort for a new player to get the ML trapping gear as they level - have you seen how much they cost in the AH or even ASAH. Not to mention that those guilds that a new player might be able to get into often don't have all those wonderful +30 resist buffs that make low level quests trivial for vets. I've tried this un-twinked on a new server and it isn't easy even with quest knowledge, which of course a newer player won't have. So while not entirely impossible, certainly what you described is extremely implausible for a new player. And given the tendency for so the vast majority of LFMs to be on Elite at level Q+2, life is not easy for new players who choose to be trappers. (Paladins and I assume Barbs and Bards are good to try to Elite streak complete un-twinked although I strongly suspect the even vets might get better XP/min by sometimes swapping to a Hard streak after the Marketplace quests....)

Paleus
04-23-2015, 09:27 AM
You missed the Part where I said I did it on a first life.

There is a significant difference between a "first life character" when rolled by a vet and when rolled by a new player. Even though the OP is technically not a new player, their posts suggests it should be a reasonable approximation. Personally, I would opt for suggesting the simpler pure pally build over a pally/rogue build in such a situation. Relying on a few mechanics of the game is simpler than dealing with multiple overlapping mechanics of the game. The benefit of being able to disable trapping vs just run through the traps is probably negligible enough that I don't see the benefit in suggesting a cadillac option when the standard option will work just as well. Sure, second life, go full cadillac and get the added benefits, but first time around just re-orienting to the game is enough.

Bluegirl_Two
04-23-2015, 03:04 PM
You might like a bard trapper.

Definitely this ^^^^.

Exceptional synergy with enough skill points in bard to keep rogue skills up. Swashbuckler enhancement line with SWF and buckler is my preference. Better DPS all along the way plus the ability to charm mobs, compel them to dance, instant kill them -- it really is a Swiss Army Knife with something for every situation.

I also like the synergy with the Harper enhancements.

To me this is better for a soloist than paladin because it has greater synergies and more flexibility with more skill points to work with and no real gear requirements.

Edit: One more thing, if you are thinking of rogue on either bard or paladin and also thinking of running elite content then you really do want maximum skills points in search and disable device at every level. High INT also helps but is less important as you increase in levels than the number of skill points you have invested.

Godfeast
05-02-2015, 09:16 AM
If looking to come in gangbusters and grind to setup gear for a tr or other characters, heavy barb anything is op right now. There is nothing they can't do and do quickly.

You don't even need to worry much about the build, that's how strong they are.