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View Full Version : Temporary Quest Closure: The Crucible



Cordovan
04-08-2015, 12:18 PM
The quest The Crucible has been temporarily closed while we address a bug. We'll be reopening the quest as soon as we are able.

depositbox
04-08-2015, 12:30 PM
#rekt

AlcoArgo
04-08-2015, 12:42 PM
The quest The Crucible has been temporarily closed while we address a bug. We'll be reopening the quest as soon as we are able.

I am assuming the fix is to increase the base XP? :D

Feralthyrtiaq
04-08-2015, 12:59 PM
just....omg

slarden
04-08-2015, 01:25 PM
I certainly don't have a problem with this.

The only point I'll make is that Turbine knew that people were using macros/bots to get full etr lifes with crucible optionals since April 2014 and you took nearly a year to fix the issue. Now that people can get a little extra experience legitimately by running the quest you shut down the quest completely the day you find out it about it.

It just seems the internal crisis alert system at Turbine is not working properly. I don't mean that as a criticism - that is just my honest feedback.

Rhysem
04-08-2015, 01:34 PM
I certainly don't have a problem with this.

The only point I'll make is that Turbine knew that people were using macros/bots to get full etr lifes with crucible optionals since April 2014 and you took nearly a year to fix the issue. Now that people can get a little extra experience legitimately by running the quest you shut down the quest completely the day you find out it about it.

It just seems the internal crisis alert system at Turbine is not working properly. I don't mean that as a criticism - that is just my honest feedback.

+1.

Even boosted from numbers I saw the xp isn't so crazy as to shut down a quest over. I've found quests that I duo with a friend without +50% pots where we turn out fairly similar xp/min numbers as what I was seeing for crucible -- and no I don't mean Impossible Demands, though that also qualifies.

Guess it just goes to show the good old "exploit early, exploit often" motto from Asheron's lives on.

mudfud
04-08-2015, 01:53 PM
So I guess Wheloon Mirror quest and Storm Horns What goes up is getting closed next? I'm just asking because 10 min EE mirror for 500k and 30 min What goes up 500k is too much xp to give us.

arkonas
04-08-2015, 01:59 PM
So I guess Wheloon Mirror quest and Storm Horns What goes up is getting closed next? I'm just asking because 10 min EE mirror for 500k and 30 min What goes up 500k is too much xp to give us.

i think you're missing the point. crucible was NOT suppose to have that huge of a boost to its xp.

Hendrik
04-08-2015, 02:21 PM
i certainly don't have a problem with this.

the only point i'll make is that turbine knew that people were using macros/bots to get full etr lifes with crucible optionals since april 2014 and you took nearly a year to fix the issue. Now that people can get a little extra experience legitimately by running the quest you shut down the quest completely the day you find out it about it.

it just seems the internal crisis alert system at turbine is not working properly. I don't mean that as a criticism - that is just my honest feedback.

qft!

Why wasn't this closed down a year ago and fixed?

Gleep_Wurp
04-08-2015, 02:22 PM
The quest The Crucible has been temporarily closed while we address a bug. We'll be reopening the quest as soon as we are able.

you going to update the launcher or did you forget?

Deadlock
04-08-2015, 03:56 PM
Jerry, this has to be a temporary closure in the nature of "less than 7 days" rather than the debacle we had previously with the "temporary closure" of the Tomb of the Tormented.

Some clowns (and I can give you names on Ghallanda if you need them :) ) have been bot-exploiting this for so long that reverting back to the previous "unfixed" version of this for a couple of weeks is not a game changer.

Right now, the non-bot-exploiting majority are being penalised for no damned good reason.

Hendrik
04-08-2015, 04:48 PM
Jerry, this has to be a temporary closure in the nature of "less than 7 days" rather than the debacle we had previously with the "temporary closure" of the Tomb of the Tormented.

Some clowns (and I can give you names on Ghallanda if you need them :) ) have been bot-exploiting this for so long that reverting back to the previous "unfixed" version of this for a couple of weeks is not a game changer.

Right now, the non-bot-exploiting majority are being penalised for no damned good reason.

Exploiting does not hurt anyone.

mudfud
04-08-2015, 05:18 PM
LOL Half the people complaining because it's closed are those same people who said it was too hard to find groups for because it was so hard and wanted it nerfed from being a Flagging required quest.
Make up your minds about how you feel about Crucible.

Erofen
04-08-2015, 05:45 PM
Exploiting does not hurt anyone.
No, just no. Macros are perfectly fine as long as you are at the keyboard. It is a different story when people leave it up while they sleep, but when you are at the keyboard it is perfectly legit. People calling anything that could save time/remove monotony exploits really annoys me. Just because someone found a more efficient way does not make it cheating.

Braegan
04-08-2015, 06:24 PM
This makes me sad. Crucible is one of my favorite quests and I run it often. Considering the game mechanics this quest should be worth a lot of xp. Perhaps not as much as what is was getting, but it certainly warrants more xp than many other quests that are more favorable to run speaking in a time sense. Please bring it back soon!

gabbatastic
04-08-2015, 06:49 PM
The quest The Crucible has been temporarily closed while we address a bug. We'll be reopening the quest as soon as we are able.

Yes, last night I had a glimmer of hope for a few short hours that there was another quest to bring down the tedious, mind numbing, grind down just a little bit.. 700k 1st time EE (with pot) was nice. Not insane, nice. What really needs to be considered here is when the game gets to be too much of a grind. People start doing other thing with their time and lose interest. With 80 degree days just around the corner, going hiking or paddling down the river sure sounds more attractive than doing the same slow xp grind for the 1000th time. Keep this in mind next time you rush to shut down something good like Crucible was last night...

blerkington
04-08-2015, 06:57 PM
Jerry, this has to be a temporary closure in the nature of "less than 7 days" rather than the debacle we had previously with the "temporary closure" of the Tomb of the Tormented.

Some clowns (and I can give you names on Ghallanda if you need them :) ) have been bot-exploiting this for so long that reverting back to the previous "unfixed" version of this for a couple of weeks is not a game changer.

Right now, the non-bot-exploiting majority are being penalised for no damned good reason.

Hi,

Well, this is a very nice offer.

I hope that you are able to provide some evidence if you start making these accusations, or are you hoping that your good name is enough to get these people into trouble, Salem-style?

This thread might be a good place for someone from Turbine to clarify under what circumstances, if any, the use of macros is allowed. Before the community goes all fire and pitchforks about this issue.

And for the record, no, I didn't farm xp from the optionals, with either a macro or by hand.

Thanks.

Chi_Ryu
04-08-2015, 08:01 PM
This thread might be a good place for someone from Turbine to clarify under what circumstances, if any, the use of macros is allowed. Before the community goes all fire and pitchforks about this issue.

It has previously been stated that macros are ok if and only if you are in front of the keyboard and in "control" at all times. One reference is here (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/252959-On-Dual-Boxing-for-purposes-on-lt-Favored-gt-Guild-Farming).

Macroing easy optionals and going to bed is a no-no. And, to be honest, any XP that can be farmed when a player has been replaced by a very small shell script is worthless XP.

blerkington
04-08-2015, 09:09 PM
It has previously been stated that macros are ok if and only if you are in front of the keyboard and in "control" at all times. One reference is here (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/252959-On-Dual-Boxing-for-purposes-on-lt-Favored-gt-Guild-Farming).

Macroing easy optionals and going to bed is a no-no. And, to be honest, any XP that can be farmed when a player has been replaced by a very small shell script is worthless XP.

Hi,

That's somewhat useful, thanks. Without going all bush lawyer, I wonder what specifically is meant by being 'in control'. The reply is somewhat vague, and does not seem to forbid macros entirely.

Perhaps they don't really want people using them at all, but are leery of running afoul of anti-discrimination laws which support the rights of disabled people. So some 'wiggle room' is being left in the wording.

The other problem is establishing whether someone has gone to bed, or they're watching a movie at their computer while keeping an eye on their macros running. I don't see a big difference between the two.

I still think it would be a good time to clarify what is and isn't allowed, this time in more detail. Though this is likely to be complicated, and require a good knowledge of what people can do with scripts and some legal input too.

Thanks.

Gizeh
04-08-2015, 09:10 PM
It would be nice if the Crucible could at least be skipped for free for the purpose of Gianthold saga completions until we can run the quest again.

pumagirl418
04-08-2015, 10:22 PM
It would be nice if the Crucible could at least be skipped for free for the purpose of Gianthold saga completions until we can run the quest again.

seconded!

myself, spouse, guildie, and guildie second account were going to do some xp/saga/renown run for 15/16... but not sure now... as 2 of the 4 don't have shards to skip.

ssHarlock
04-09-2015, 02:58 AM
Lets hope this wont become the next Bauntry quest that will be closed for over a year.
And thats another proof that Devs never test what they make and that Turbine doesn't have any play testers or they have to kick out those they have cause they are doing a rly bad job.

And also you should take counter measures for saga exp or a way for the game to remember that i did all quests x times on elite and i miss x crucibles for saga exp.
As it is you ask me to quit the game till cricible is fixed cause there's no other way to lvl up.

Oxarhamar
04-09-2015, 03:35 AM
Hi,

That's somewhat useful, thanks. Without going all bush lawyer, I wonder what specifically is meant by being 'in control'. The reply is somewhat vague, and does not seem to forbid macros entirely.

Perhaps they don't really want people using them at all, but are leery of running afoul of anti-discrimination laws which support the rights of disabled people. So some 'wiggle room' is being left in the wording.

The other problem is establishing whether someone has gone to bed, or they're watching a movie at their computer while keeping an eye on their macros running. I don't see a big difference between the two.

I still think it would be a good time to clarify what is and isn't allowed, this time in more detail. Though this is likely to be complicated, and require a good knowledge of what people can do with scripts and some legal input too.

Thanks.

basically it mean you must remain at the keyboard.

there's a lot involved but, your right basics are: Macros are aloud because, it would alienate players with disabilities who would use macros to play.

Basically if a player was identified as macroing & contacted by a GM in game they would need to respond or be considered AFK Macroing.

Oxarhamar
04-09-2015, 03:37 AM
snip~
As it is you ask me to quit the game till cricible is fixed cause there's no other way to lvl up.

there is no other way to level up? please expand

caberonia
04-09-2015, 04:20 AM
Hi,

That's somewhat useful, thanks. Without going all bush lawyer, I wonder what specifically is meant by being 'in control'. The reply is somewhat vague, and does not seem to forbid macros entirely.

Perhaps they don't really want people using them at all, but are leery of running afoul of anti-discrimination laws which support the rights of disabled people. So some 'wiggle room' is being left in the wording.

The other problem is establishing whether someone has gone to bed, or they're watching a movie at their computer while keeping an eye on their macros running. I don't see a big difference between the two.

I still think it would be a good time to clarify what is and isn't allowed, this time in more detail. Though this is likely to be complicated, and require a good knowledge of what people can do with scripts and some legal input too.

Thanks.
I know you're looking for a specific detailed response from someone in turbine and this response will cover neither. However.. generally in the History of MMOs the "test" of being in control has been if a GM sends you a /tell and you respond or not.. now given gms in ddo don't seem to actively do much outside of responding to the assault of help requests due to so many things breaking easily...Turbine i'm sure is going to be different.

ssHarlock
04-09-2015, 04:29 AM
there is no other way to level up? please expand

Yes for me that i don't like wilderness and necro 4 is the next pack that i run quests only once there's no other way to lvl from 14 to 16

Lanadazia
04-09-2015, 07:22 AM
i don't see the problem.
well its not WAI ofc, but if people prefer to exploit the game in this way, instead of actually playing
they don't really give a **** anyways. and it doesn't hurt any other player.
the only thing they damage is their own fun to play the game, what is a good punishment, in my opinion.

also i've reported this a year ago and now they put it down like it was a hotfix. meanwhile its more like a coldfix ;)

Hendrik
04-09-2015, 07:57 AM
i don't see the problem.
well its not WAI ofc, but if people prefer to exploit the game in this way, instead of actually playing
they don't really give a **** anyways. and it doesn't hurt any other player.
the only thing they damage is their own fun to play the game, what is a good punishment, in my opinion.

also i've reported this a year ago and now they put it down like it was a hotfix. meanwhile its more like a coldfix ;)

Your right!

Exploiting does not hurt anyone but the exploiter, if they are caught, and thankfully only exploiters have to deal with bank delays, bag delays, one container open UI, quest xp changes, and all other bandaid fixes.

ssHarlock
04-09-2015, 08:45 AM
The problem is not that they closed crucible, the problem is that they never test what they make or thet test it purly. They are doing a bad job and they are getting payed for that. In my company if my performance is bad i'm offhired and propably will never find a job again.

Chai
04-09-2015, 08:55 AM
i don't see the problem.
well its not WAI ofc, but if people prefer to exploit the game in this way, instead of actually playing
they don't really give a **** anyways. and it doesn't hurt any other player.
the only thing they damage is their own fun to play the game, what is a good punishment, in my opinion.

also i've reported this a year ago and now they put it down like it was a hotfix. meanwhile its more like a coldfix ;)

Im not sure how folks can keep claiming it doesn't hurt anyone else with a straight face when we now have several examples of storage access being cut off for everyone before patching, and quests being closed off for everyone before patching. This is before we take into account that people are handing out stacks of items which are sold in the store, for free to people who should be paying for those items. This undermines the company's revenue stream, and peoples livelihood gets put in jeopardy when the next round of layoffs happens. Not only does it negatively impact others game experience, it also impacts employees.

sk3l3t0r
04-09-2015, 10:39 AM
Yes for me that i don't like wilderness and necro 4 is the next pack that i run quests only once there's no other way to lvl from 14 to 16

By end of 14, I am done with GH Epic Saga farming, I am already running E Star Heroic content in Wheloon prison, Harbinger chain, LoD chain and Flagging for shroud because I already have 15-16 banked at 14, 16-17 banked at 15, and 17-18 banked at 16. When I have 18 banked I grab and sit on 18 (skip over 17 altogether) and I am getting ready to bank 20 in IQ, LoD daily runs, Druid's deep, High Road and Stormhorns Heroic. When I hit 20 this life I chose to go to 28 instead of HTR right away, and now sitting on 28 and holding collecting seeds, farming gear and doing Epic PLs for a change of pace.

I started in GH by level 12 and forgot about it by 14. I skipped Necro 4 personally and saved it for Epic.

I guess the difference is that I run most quests under level (running level 14 Epic, so level 16 quest, at level 14 and banking xp) on full BB in Heroics.

TrinityTurtle
04-09-2015, 11:07 AM
Exploiting does not hurt anyone.

I can't disagree more. While not all of them will, a lot of those people who exploited that to gain lives would join/start pugs to gain the xp without the exploit. So that hurts all the people who are actually looking to form/join groups. That does hurt quite a bit of people.

Others will solo, but they'll have to actually play the game longer, rather than letting a bot do it while they sleep, and some of those people are vip's, and therefore it will take them longer to gain all those past lives, and they will play the game longer, supporting it longer so it here for others. Shortening this life span of game harms both the playerbase and the turbine employees.

Exploiting actually hurts a lot of people when you really look at it.

Chai
04-09-2015, 03:02 PM
It has previously been stated that macros are ok if and only if you are in front of the keyboard and in "control" at all times. One reference is here (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/252959-On-Dual-Boxing-for-purposes-on-lt-Favored-gt-Guild-Farming).

Macroing easy optionals and going to bed is a no-no. And, to be honest, any XP that can be farmed when a player has been replaced by a very small shell script is worthless XP.

That post addressed multi-boxing, not macros.

slarden
04-09-2015, 03:07 PM
basically it mean you must remain at the keyboard.

there's a lot involved but, your right basics are: Macros are aloud because, it would alienate players with disabilities who would use macros to play.

Basically if a player was identified as macroing & contacted by a GM in game they would need to respond or be considered AFK Macroing.

There is a wacko guild leader on Sarlona that decided I am an exploiter and he reported me for duping - of which my account was briefly locked presumably to be checked and of course I was cleared quickly - no infractions - nothing - because I raid daily and didn't dupe.

Then I didn't know his other characters name so I hit an lfm and was rejected - no big deal - his raids are as terrible as he is. Then I joined a crucible lfm and a few minutes later was contacted by a GM to see if I was macroing. It HAS to be the same wacko that reported me for that too even though it should have been obvious I was in a group.

Not only did I never macro - I never even ran the optionals for xp except once to get an idea how quickly xp could be farmed.

I don't think Turbine is ok with people getting experience with macros which is why they changed the design of the quest. They just don't want to deal with potential legal issues for the reason you mentioned. I really thought a better option would to have been to put 15 or so mobs in the area where the optionals are.

Lanadazia
04-10-2015, 03:45 AM
The problem is not that they closed crucible, the problem is that they never test what they make or thet test it purly. They are doing a bad job and they are getting payed for that. In my company if my performance is bad i'm offhired and propably will never find a job again.

remember that no intern playtest is as good as a week on life. hundreds of players will find a bug by just playing the game more unerringly than a whole team of intern playtesters.
its just the vast ammount of people playing something compared to a little staff doing some play tests. they just cannot be as efficient as the liveserver players




Im not sure how folks can keep claiming it doesn't hurt anyone else with a straight face when we now have several examples of storage access being cut off for everyone before patching, and quests being closed off for everyone before patching. This is before we take into account that people are handing out stacks of items which are sold in the store, for free to people who should be paying for those items. This undermines the company's revenue stream, and peoples livelihood gets put in jeopardy when the next round of layoffs happens. Not only does it negatively impact others game experience, it also impacts employees.



Exploiting does not hurt anyone but the exploiter, if they are caught, and thankfully only exploiters have to deal with bank delays, bag delays, one container open UI, quest xp changes, and all other bandaid fixes.

well you're both right there. with 'not getting hurt' i meant an actual impact to your gaming, not some uncomfortable changes to stop exploiting.
though some may consider this being an actual impact to their gaming experience, there is no actual harm. like you won't lose anything you have achieved.
sure its annoying that there are collective penalties when a minority is doing something wrong. still i think, exploiters are ruining their own fun making them less likely to play along for a long time
compared to the honest players

Cordovan
04-10-2015, 12:58 PM
Just to make sure the news is in the thread, in case folks stumble on this later: The Crucible has been reopened as of Update 25 Patch 1 on April 10th.