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View Full Version : I'm looking for a Druid wolf build, a really broken one!



Xathris
03-05-2015, 02:19 PM
I have trouble with the forum search. I can never find anything relevant!???! I read a lot of crying about how Druid wolf builds are broken, so of course I want to see what all the fuss is about. I just can't find any on the forum, just people complaining about them. Can anyone send me a link of a good one?

Thanks!

Lychias
03-05-2015, 02:44 PM
I have trouble with the forum search. I can never find anything relevant!???! I read a lot of crying about how Druid wolf builds are broken, so of course I want to see what all the fuss is about. I just can't find any on the forum, just people complaining about them. Can anyone send me a link of a good one?

Thanks!

Any build that incorporates ranger levels with druid is probably taking advantages of the broken mechanic which allows a user to get multiple weapon style feats. Just make sure to get SWF first then get ranger levels for TWF.

One example that looked interesting to me is (I don't think that this build does the SWF, you would have to swap some things around):
https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/454686-TWF-Ranger-6-Druid-14-(Melee-Caster)

It doesn't take as much advantage of the ranger levels as it could, but does incorporate the higher level druid spellcasting which is potent.

Xathris
03-05-2015, 03:36 PM
Any build that incorporates ranger levels with druid is probably taking advantages of the broken mechanic which allows a user to get multiple weapon style feats. Just make sure to get SWF first then get ranger levels for TWF.

One example that looked interesting to me is (I don't think that this build does the SWF, you would have to swap some things around):
https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/454686-TWF-Ranger-6-Druid-14-(Melee-Caster)

It doesn't take as much advantage of the ranger levels as it could, but does incorporate the higher level druid spellcasting which is potent.

That's funny! Of the four characters I'm playing right now, 2 of them are unbongwah builds! This doesn't look like a wolf build, however. (?)

I've been doing some more searching. Would it be dangerous to do a "broken" wolf, if it later gets "fixed," and I'll be howling in sorrow?

Bart_D
03-06-2015, 09:07 AM
I had a lot of fun playing a PDK fighter4/druid10/ranger6 with black dragon armor and a wall of wood, and misc weapons.
Very similar to Unbongwha's suggestions in the link but with defensive stance and a couple more feats instead of some spell casting.
I'd say 1-4 fighter levels and 10-13 druid levels can work well.

Xathris
03-06-2015, 09:38 AM
I had a lot of fun playing a PDK fighter4/druid10/ranger6 with black dragon armor and a wall of wood, and misc weapons.
Very similar to Unbongwha's suggestions in the link but with defensive stance and a couple more feats instead of some spell casting.
I'd say 1-4 fighter levels and 10-13 druid levels can work well.

In the thread I posted, I am using a combination of Unbongwa's and Tilomere's build (Tilomere's post is a few down from Unbongwa).


Does anyone know how TWF and SWF works for a druid, or how TWF and shield works?

unbongwah
03-06-2015, 09:48 AM
Does anyone know how TWF and SWF works for a druid, or how TWF and shield works?
See this thread (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/455517-Melee-druid-what-is-working-with-it); I believe it covers everything which works for wolf builds.

tl;dr summary: animal forms are a broken mess, but it is possible to do good DPS if you're willing to exploit the synergies / bugs. Although I've been playing a WIS-based pure druid wolf build lately, `cuz I'm obstinate and willing to sacrifice minmaxing for flavor. :p

Lonnbeimnech
03-06-2015, 09:53 AM
In the thread I posted, I am using a combination of Unbongwa's and Tilomere's build (Tilomere's post is a few down from Unbongwa).


Does anyone know how TWF and SWF works for a druid, or how TWF and shield works?

You take swf, then you take 2nd ranger level. Ranger 2 auto grants twf which bypasses the lock out.

Swf blocks twf, but swf does not block taking improved twf or greater twf, and twf blocks swf but not improved swf or greater twf.

To use both at once you must be in wolf form and using a single one handed weapon in main hand, and either nothing or an orb in offhand.

this also works with dance of death from tempest.

If you are looking for a melee build I would recommend 10 druid, 6 ranger, 4 fighter. gtwf and gswf, improved bludgeoning, quicken and empower heal. Heavy armor, stalwart defender for the bonus hp and movement rate and prr, tempest for dance of death, and enough in natures warrior to pick up fatal harrier.

Lonnbeimnech
03-06-2015, 09:59 AM
See this thread (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/455517-Melee-druid-what-is-working-with-it); I believe it covers everything which works for wolf builds.

tl;dr summary: animal forms are a broken mess, but it is possible to do good DPS if you're willing to exploit the synergies / bugs. Although I've been playing a WIS-based pure druid wolf build lately, `cuz I'm obstinate and willing to sacrifice minmaxing for flavor. :p

That's an understatement.

Xathris
03-06-2015, 11:13 AM
See this thread (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/455517-Melee-druid-what-is-working-with-it); I believe it covers everything which works for wolf builds.

tl;dr summary: animal forms are a broken mess, but it is possible to do good DPS if you're willing to exploit the synergies / bugs. Although I've been playing a WIS-based pure druid wolf build lately, `cuz I'm obstinate and willing to sacrifice minmaxing for flavor. :p

I do have 4 flavor dominated builds, but this time I just can't help myself. I know it's doubly bad that I am exploiting druid/nature, but I'm still new to the game, and can't help myself.

ValariusK
03-06-2015, 11:15 AM
That's an understatement.

10 druid/6 ranger/4 fighter with all the synergies produces damage comparable to a THF barbarian (I've played both recently).

Lonnbeimnech
03-06-2015, 12:23 PM
10 druid/6 ranger/4 fighter with all the synergies produces damage comparable to a THF barbarian (I've played both recently).

But the increased attack rate combined with a good weapon, stat drainers in heroic, level drainers in epic and mortal fear at cap is awesome for trash and orange names. Against red names, yes the dps is similar.

ValariusK
03-06-2015, 01:27 PM
But the increased attack rate combined with a good weapon, stat drainers in heroic, level drainers in epic and mortal fear at cap is awesome for trash and orange names. Against red names, yes the dps is similar.

Glancing and cleave/great cleave/supreme cleave etc on a barbarian THF gives comparable trash clearing abilities in my experience. Maybe even a little better because dance of death is flaky on when it works and doesn't.

Xathris
03-07-2015, 12:13 PM
You take swf, then you take 2nd ranger level. Ranger 2 auto grants twf which bypasses the lock out.

Swf blocks twf, but swf does not block taking improved twf or greater twf, and twf blocks swf but not improved swf or greater twf.

To use both at once you must be in wolf form and using a single one handed weapon in main hand, and either nothing or an orb in offhand.

this also works with dance of death from tempest.

If you are looking for a melee build I would recommend 10 druid, 6 ranger, 4 fighter. gtwf and gswf, improved bludgeoning, quicken and empower heal. Heavy armor, stalwart defender for the bonus hp and movement rate and prr, tempest for dance of death, and enough in natures warrior to pick up fatal harrier.

Why do some people say you need to use a club or a scepter for a weapon? Thanks!

Lonnbeimnech
03-07-2015, 12:20 PM
Why do some people say you need to use a club or a scepter for a weapon? Thanks!

Probably thinking of the shillelagh spell, an extra .5w

I wouldn't worry about it. If you have a choice between a good hand axe and a meh club, i would go with the hand axe, or scimitar or long sword or dagger or whatever one handed weapon. You get all martial weapons with ranger and fighter.

Xathris
03-08-2015, 09:27 AM
You take swf, then you take 2nd ranger level. Ranger 2 auto grants twf which bypasses the lock out.

Swf blocks twf, but swf does not block taking improved twf or greater twf, and twf blocks swf but not improved swf or greater twf.

To use both at once you must be in wolf form and using a single one handed weapon in main hand, and either nothing or an orb in offhand.

this also works with dance of death from tempest.

If you are looking for a melee build I would recommend 10 druid, 6 ranger, 4 fighter. gtwf and gswf, improved bludgeoning, quicken and empower heal. Heavy armor, stalwart defender for the bonus hp and movement rate and prr, tempest for dance of death, and enough in natures warrior to pick up fatal harrier.

Doesn't heavy armor break the Druidic Oath? Do you mean heavy armor from the dragon scales?

PsychoBlonde
03-08-2015, 12:37 PM
Doesn't heavy armor break the Druidic Oath? Do you mean heavy armor from the dragon scales?

METAL armor breaks Druidic oath. The weight doesn't matter--so a chain shirt (light armor) breaks it while dragonplate armor (heavy) does not.

unbongwah
03-08-2015, 05:55 PM
Do you mean heavy armor from the dragon scales?
Correct: all dragonplate armor is non-metallic, so it's fine for a druid, as long as you have hvy armor prof, natch.

Xathris
03-09-2015, 05:43 PM
You take swf, then you take 2nd ranger level. Ranger 2 auto grants twf which bypasses the lock out.

Swf blocks twf, but swf does not block taking improved twf or greater twf, and twf blocks swf but not improved swf or greater twf.

To use both at once you must be in wolf form and using a single one handed weapon in main hand, and either nothing or an orb in offhand.

this also works with dance of death from tempest.

If you are looking for a melee build I would recommend 10 druid, 6 ranger, 4 fighter. gtwf and gswf, improved bludgeoning, quicken and empower heal. Heavy armor, stalwart defender for the bonus hp and movement rate and prr, tempest for dance of death, and enough in natures warrior to pick up fatal harrier.

So if I am going for Dance of Death, does this mean all the duel wielding Tempest enhancements will work?

unbongwah
03-10-2015, 09:13 AM
So if I am going for Dance of Death, does this mean all the duel wielding Tempest enhancements will work?
Here's where it gets even more complicated: DoD currently works with any combat style, not just TWF or wolf builds (this is probably a bug, since it's explicitly labeled a "dual wielding" atk, but I haven't seen official confirmation of that); but the other dual-wielding Tempest enhs require you to be, well, dual-wielding. I think this means they will apply if you have two weapons equipped in wolf form; but this means you're NOT getting the atk speed bonus from SWF feats. And in the long run, +30% atk speed is worth a lot more DPS than +4 dmg (Whirling Blades) and +10% offhand (Tempest lvl 3 core). So if you're going the TWF+SWF wolf route, that means you want to skip the dual-wielding enhs because they do nothing for you.

This is why I think that DoD isn't worth it on a wolf build, because you have to spend too many APs on Tempest filler to take it. YMMV, ofc, and if you go the druid 10 / rgr 6 / ftr 4 route, you can experiment with your AP layout until you find what you consider optimal for your playstyle.

Xathris
03-10-2015, 09:44 AM
Here's where it gets even more complicated: DoD currently works with any combat style, not just TWF or wolf builds (this is probably a bug, since it's explicitly labeled a "dual wielding" atk, but I haven't seen official confirmation of that); but the other dual-wielding Tempest enhs require you to be, well, dual-wielding. I think this means they will apply if you have two weapons equipped in wolf form; but this means you're NOT getting the atk speed bonus from SWF feats. And in the long run, +30% atk speed is worth a lot more DPS than +4 dmg (Whirling Blades) and +10% offhand (Tempest lvl 3 core). So if you're going the TWF+SWF wolf route, that means you want to skip the dual-wielding enhs because they do nothing for you.

This is why I think that DoD isn't worth it on a wolf build, because you have to spend too many APs on Tempest filler to take it. YMMV, ofc, and if you go the druid 10 / rgr 6 / ftr 4 route, you can experiment with your AP layout until you find what you consider optimal for your playstyle.


Thanks, unbongwah, right now I am using the enhancements from your bear tank build, altered for wolf. SWF does seem more impressive than dual wielding, all in all. You think they would both have their own, distant advantages in certain situations, but it looks like SWF is just better.

Xathris
03-18-2015, 09:13 AM
Probably thinking of the shillelagh spell, an extra .5w

I wouldn't worry about it. If you have a choice between a good hand axe and a meh club, i would go with the hand axe, or scimitar or long sword or dagger or whatever one handed weapon. You get all martial weapons with ranger and fighter.

I read on another thread that a blunt weapon does add to your crit range, or something like that. Here is unbongwah's quote from that thread regarding using a blunt weapon in your main hand. Am I interpreting it right that it means that yiou do get 2 added to your crit range when wielding a blunt weapon (assuming you took IC:Bludgeoning)

"So I logged into test if Impact carried over to wolf form. I bought the cheapest Impact weapon (i.e., not handwraps) I could find, equipped it, and saw it listed "Improved Critical:Unarmed" on my feat list - in fact that was the only weapon listed under the "Improved Critical:Bludgeoning Weapons" section! And I was definitely getting crits on 17-18 rolls in wolf fom, so it was carrying over."

ValariusK
03-18-2015, 10:53 AM
Here's where it gets even more complicated: DoD currently works with any combat style, not just TWF or wolf builds (this is probably a bug, since it's explicitly labeled a "dual wielding" atk, but I haven't seen official confirmation of that); but the other dual-wielding Tempest enhs require you to be, well, dual-wielding. I think this means they will apply if you have two weapons equipped in wolf form; but this means you're NOT getting the atk speed bonus from SWF feats. And in the long run, +30% atk speed is worth a lot more DPS than +4 dmg (Whirling Blades) and +10% offhand (Tempest lvl 3 core). So if you're going the TWF+SWF wolf route, that means you want to skip the dual-wielding enhs because they do nothing for you.

This is why I think that DoD isn't worth it on a wolf build, because you have to spend too many APs on Tempest filler to take it. YMMV, ofc, and if you go the druid 10 / rgr 6 / ftr 4 route, you can experiment with your AP layout until you find what you consider optimal for your playstyle.

Here's the thing: I've played druid-10/ranger-6/fighter-4 recently and fighter-9/druid-9/ranger-2 recently as well. They're both strong builds but Dance of Death really IS all that. Its a little flakey but the trash slaughtering capabilities on the 1st are much much better. Alpha strike (the substitute on the 2nd build) was a pale replacement.
Also, in tempest you can get good mileage out of your filler points--6 points for sprint boost is priceless for zerging and quality of life.