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View Full Version : Opinions on 18 pally 2 ftr vs 2 rogue



adrian69
11-28-2014, 11:35 AM
Since U23, I’ve thought paladin would be a good place to sit at while I farm my gear for my sorc, and completionist lifes. I have been sitting at 28 for a while, and while it’s fun, it’s often to OP for most content and boring.
I’ve been running 18/ 2 ftr (to fit SB in for heroics, then cleave in for epics for LD—though neither are needed). However, I’ve been wondering if 18 ftr 2 rog stick build, for 15% attack speed and 25% double strike proc wouldn’t be worth it using TF staff or Sireth, or trading off situationally between the two wouldn’t be a better build.
Giving up fighter I’d lose
2 hit/1 dmg
30% haste boost
2 Feats

Rogue would give me
1d6 SA, better than +1 dmg, giving I'm flanking or in SA position
Constant 15% attack speed on staff
25% Doublestrike proc on staff.

I thought about taking a monk level, centering, and taking mithral for evasion, but I am liking heavy armor atm and never die. Don’t plan to do traps, so no point really either to use evasion, other than certain AoE bosses, but then again I have 100 MRR on top of the 129 PRR.
Opinions?

Also, I've yet to finish Unyielding Sent Destiny. I've thought about ETRing into a S&B build just to work on it.

Again, I'm just running Cannith Challanges, DQ 20x for Torc, and a few odds and ends. Just wanting to try something new in the meantime.

adrian69
11-28-2014, 11:36 AM
Reserved for serious updates: lol.

elcagador
11-28-2014, 01:37 PM
I have both, a Acrobat pally 15/rogue 5 with sireth that was from u20 and now im raising a S&B paladin 18/fighter 2,

Both builds are viable, now that Im lvl 24 on my S&B paladin, I can see that it becomes good with TF bastard sword/or dwarven axe with Gthf, im using vanguard core abilities that give a extra 15% attack speed and 10 meele power with tier 5 ability, also don't forget the double strike bonuses from shield mastery feats and legendary mastery twist that are a 15% extra double strike with the extra prr of course.

Both builds seems similar on dps, maybe the rogue can give a very little bit more dps but TF weapons favors a bit more bastard sword/dwarven axe over staffs due to the crit range/dmg, so it can become more even with high tier TF, also there are some good shields like madstone aegis or pdk shield that should help s&b dmg at higher levels. So I would flavor S&B a bit more for now but both are cool.

Blackheartox
11-28-2014, 01:40 PM
Keep in mind rogue also has haste boost, personally if stick build i would suggest 15 palie 4 rogue 1 fighter or 15 palie 4 rogue 1 monk.

Monk version has more dps since its in earth stance and you have enough feats to get gmaster earth, the fight one is with harmor and thus has more survival

JamesNiels
11-28-2014, 08:14 PM
Dude have u heard of the sacred defender capstone? It gives a heal for 250 affected by heal amp when u go below 0 hp. My pally friend has an unconscioussness range of -125 and he gets healed for like 800 by it. -125 may not seem like much but with 200 prr/mrr u will be immortal.

Ralmeth
11-28-2014, 08:36 PM
Dude have u heard of the sacred defender capstone? It gives a heal for 250 affected by heal amp when u go below 0 hp. My pally friend has an unconscioussness range of -125 and he gets healed for like 800 by it. -125 may not seem like much but with 200 prr/mrr u will be immortal.

Or don't let your HP fall so low so you have to rely in the Defender capstone, which isn't very good IMHO. Instead if you get in trouble use glorious stand...

Anyways, back to the OP, I think I would prefer the 2 ftr splash but either is viable. Do you what you think will be fun:)

unbongwah
11-28-2014, 09:04 PM
I thought about taking a monk level, centering, and taking mithral for evasion, but I am liking heavy armor atm and never die.
Mithril Body uncenters you, same as if you wore mithril chain on a fleshie monk splash.

adrian69
11-28-2014, 11:25 PM
Mithril Body uncenters you, same as if you wore mithril chain on a fleshie monk splash.

Yeah, my bad, was really meaning evasion on one line and centered on another somewhere, I think, because I know better from running both juggarnaut variants last year.

Anyways, I believe I'm going to flip a coin and ETR+LR in 1). pure paladin for capstone, or 2.) ETR+LR into a deeper MC for some variety; either I'll be going 18 2 rogue or 16 2 monk 2 rogue and picking up earth3 for +1x. I really fell like KotC core 5 is almost to strong to give up in a lot of situations to give up it feels like survivability going monk on a deeper splash. The only thing that seems nice would be being able to twist in Dance of Flowers.

I don't know what they did with adamantine feat, but I don't remember ever being able to stand in traps like in Von3 EE before and just shrug it off. My evasion toon is still dying on a failed save there. Paladin takes 30-40 dmg. Decisions. Thanks.

goodspeed
12-08-2014, 10:23 PM
Since U23, I’ve thought paladin would be a good place to sit at while I farm my gear for my sorc, and completionist lifes. I have been sitting at 28 for a while, and while it’s fun, it’s often to OP for most content and boring.
I’ve been running 18/ 2 ftr (to fit SB in for heroics, then cleave in for epics for LD—though neither are needed). However, I’ve been wondering if 18 ftr 2 rog stick build, for 15% attack speed and 25% double strike proc wouldn’t be worth it using TF staff or Sireth, or trading off situationally between the two wouldn’t be a better build.
Giving up fighter I’d lose
2 hit/1 dmg
30% haste boost
2 Feats

Rogue would give me
1d6 SA, better than +1 dmg, giving I'm flanking or in SA position
Constant 15% attack speed on staff
25% Doublestrike proc on staff.

I thought about taking a monk level, centering, and taking mithral for evasion, but I am liking heavy armor atm and never die. Don’t plan to do traps, so no point really either to use evasion, other than certain AoE bosses, but then again I have 100 MRR on top of the 129 PRR.
Opinions?

Also, I've yet to finish Unyielding Sent Destiny. I've thought about ETRing into a S&B build just to work on it.

Again, I'm just running Cannith Challanges, DQ 20x for Torc, and a few odds and ends. Just wanting to try something new in the meantime.

rog would only be worth it if using a stick. Otherwise theirs no need as the fighter would give you haste boost much cheaper as well as action boosts and tactics if wanted.

Gnarkh
12-09-2014, 03:16 PM
Short version:

- Paladin 20 capstones are awesome now

- You're not really feat starved anymore as the Cleaves in KotC share cooldowns with the Cleaves from feats. And they are better.

- MRR together with paladin saves do the trick instead of evasion now, even in harder content.

So imho it's either evasion based or heavy armor based, with the pure paladin having better DPS and the splashed paladin having more well rounded defenses with evasion and light armor.

Staff based builds will surely be awesome now with a Sireth and Holy Weapon, but I'd probably splash deeper then.

4 or 5 rogue for all the quarterstaff goodies and 15 paladin for the basics there. (question is, which tier 5, KotC has the Greater Cleave on tier 5)

Thinking about, I'm not sure if Holy Sword stacks with Thief Acrobat Crit Profile. Probably it doesn't :)

So you might be ok with 14 paladin as well. Something like 14 paladin / 5 rogue / 1 druid. But I'm out of my depth now, these are tricky builds and I had to look more stuff up. :)

Hope that helps!

bennyson
12-10-2014, 03:32 PM
Something like 14 paladin / 5 rogue / 1 druid.

Huh?

You cant do Pally/Druid combo, Pallies MUST be LG while Druids MUST be of Neutral alignment.

adrian69
12-11-2014, 07:27 PM
Huh?

You cant do Pally/Druid combo, Pallies MUST be LG while Druids MUST be of Neutral alignment.

Yeah, this is correct, druids and pallies don't mesh due to alignment restrictions.

To further the conversation, I got tired of being just ridiculously OP and moving through EE content beating things to death without ever falling below half hps, and I missed having a lot of clicky buttons, and so I have TRd into a 20 bard PDK Swashbuckler. Having lots more fun now, with more buttons, though it's still easy sauce.

bennyson
12-11-2014, 08:59 PM
Yeah, this is correct, druids and pallies don't mesh due to alignment restrictions.

To further the conversation, I got tired of being just ridiculously OP and moving through EE content beating things to death without ever falling below half hps, and I missed having a lot of clicky buttons, and so I have TRd into a 20 bard PDK Swashbuckler. Having lots more fun now, with more buttons, though it's still easy sauce.

Well, we have Monster Champions now, so prepare to meet your maker...in a fun way...

Gnarkh
12-12-2014, 10:11 AM
Have fun with your new build :).

And you're guys are of course right, replace druid with fighter or anything really, it's just an old habit to splash a level on druid on anything with a big 'effin stick :).