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bsquishwizzy
09-15-2014, 12:44 PM
I've got a toon dedicated to being a fighter. I'm thinking going Fighter / pally, THF, heavy armor. My initial thought was going Fighter 16, with 4 levels of paladin mainly for the LoH, saves, and smites.

Comments / suggestions / recommendations?

A few conditions:

1) No Bladeforged. I don't want to play around with Iconics.

2) No monk. If the case can be made for Fighter / Cleric (which I've already done), Fighter FvS, or something else I have no problem with that. But keep it to 2 classes only, no monk. It seems everyone splashes monk these days. I want something different.

3) My toon already has loads of heavy armor and great swords. That's the direction I want to take.

4) I already have a Paladin toon. This guy is my dedicated fighter. So fighter has to be the main class in the build.

5) I don't need a full breakdown of a class, just basic stats, what trees you'd hit, and why.

Loromir
09-15-2014, 12:53 PM
I've got a toon dedicated to being a fighter. I'm thinking going Fighter / pally, THF, heavy armor. My initial thought was going Fighter 16, with 4 levels of paladin mainly for the LoH, saves, and smites.

Comments / suggestions / recommendations?

A few conditions:

1) No Bladeforged. I don't want to play around with Iconics.

2) No monk. If the case can be made for Fighter / Cleric (which I've already done), Fighter FvS, or something else I have no problem with that. But keep it to 2 classes only, no monk. It seems everyone splashes monk these days. I want something different.

3) My toon already has loads of heavy armor and great swords. That's the direction I want to take.

4) I already have a Paladin toon. This guy is my dedicated fighter. So fighter has to be the main class in the build.

5) I don't need a full breakdown of a class, just basic stats, what trees you'd hit, and why.

I personally like 12/8 Fighter Cleric.

Max Str (+Level Ups)
Enough Wis to cast (No use building for DC's)
Good CON
Good CHR (Get this as high as you can without sacrificing CON)

Kensai/Warpriest for Divine Might, Ameliorating strike, Power Surge and Keen Edge.
Divine Crusader or Legendary Dreadnaught destiny.


This provides decent self Healing and pretty strong Melee Capability.

Xianio
09-15-2014, 02:27 PM
I've got a few options for you (not all exactly to spec but pretty close)

You could go 18/2 with a S&B build then twist in/go into Divine Crusader for Bane of Undeath (e.g. Divine Might). Doing this would let you get tons of strength bonuses Kensai, Stalwart Stance and Divine Might while also getting 'almost' the full benefit of Vanguards cores. All told, you'd hit like a truck, bash people with a shield -really- hard and with all those feats get glancing blows when using a Bsword/Daxe.

Plus you'd get a very solid bonus to survivability because of the tower shield's 2x bonus to MRR against reflex save spells. Finally, with all that strength, the kensai tree and the vanguard tree you'd have incredibly high stunning shield/blow DC's.

Otherwise you could go 12/8 or 14/6 for more spells and into the KotC tree for more 'on-hit' damage cores. Plus that would mean you could Tier 5 either class trees depending on how you like to play. Given that I don't think Kensai adds much to a class outside of tier 5 this may allow for some strong options.

Bridge_Dweller
09-15-2014, 02:29 PM
Pure 20 pally.

bsquishwizzy
09-15-2014, 02:46 PM
Pure 20 pally.

Got one of those.

Grailhawk
09-15-2014, 02:49 PM
Given that I don't think Kensai adds much to a class outside of tier 5 this may allow for some strong options.

Power Surge and 19% Double Strike are a lot. Kensai is a good tree and probably better then KotC if you just look at the trees and not the base class.

bsquishwizzy
09-15-2014, 03:00 PM
I've got a few options for you (not all exactly to spec but pretty close)

You could go 18/2 with a S&B build then twist in/go into Divine Crusader for Bane of Undeath (e.g. Divine Might). Doing this would let you get tons of strength bonuses Kensai, Stalwart Stance and Divine Might while also getting 'almost' the full benefit of Vanguards cores. All told, you'd hit like a truck, bash people with a shield -really- hard and with all those feats get glancing blows when using a Bsword/Daxe.

Plus you'd get a very solid bonus to survivability because of the tower shield's 2x bonus to MRR against reflex save spells. Finally, with all that strength, the kensai tree and the vanguard tree you'd have incredibly high stunning shield/blow DC's.

Otherwise you could go 12/8 or 14/6 for more spells and into the KotC tree for more 'on-hit' damage cores. Plus that would mean you could Tier 5 either class trees depending on how you like to play. Given that I don't think Kensai adds much to a class outside of tier 5 this may allow for some strong options.

I already have a S&B pally, and this one has a load of great swords, so that S&B route is out.

The 12/8 and 12/6 sound promising. I haven’t gone into Lamma land, so I have no idea what Vanguard is going to give me. At present I am looking to run up the Kensai tree to tier 5 (agreed, that after lvl 12 you sort of hit a point of diminishing returns), and right now I am looking at splitting the pally levels between SD and KotC mainly for extra smites and LoH. Can you explain to me what Vanguard will bring to the table?

Bridge_Dweller
09-15-2014, 03:05 PM
Got one of those.

it's still probably the best option for a THFing DPS pally. Maybe 18/2 if you really want to spend enhancement points on haste boost though you can get the same thing from Legendary Dreadnaught. i think the third 4th level spell is more useful over all.

TWFing has some other options.

Bridge_Dweller
09-15-2014, 03:06 PM
The 12/8 and 12/6 sound promising.

No :)

Holy Sword is that good.

Going Pure gets you Holy Sword, Zeal, and Cure Serious Wounds. It's why pure 20 looks like the best bet.

And human/PDK for the extra feat and hjealing amp.

Loromir
09-15-2014, 03:42 PM
No :)

Holy Sword is that good.

Going Pure gets you Holy Sword, Zeal, and Cure Serious Wounds. It's why pure 20 looks like the best bet.

And human/PDK for the extra feat and hjealing amp.

Except...he want a Fighter. He already has a Paladin.

Grailhawk
09-15-2014, 03:58 PM
I've got a toon dedicated to being a fighter. I'm thinking going Fighter / pally, THF, heavy armor. My initial thought was going Fighter 16, with 4 levels of paladin mainly for the LoH, saves, and smites.

Comments / suggestions / recommendations?

A few conditions:

1) No Bladeforged. I don't want to play around with Iconics.

2) No monk. If the case can be made for Fighter / Cleric (which I've already done), Fighter FvS, or something else I have no problem with that. But keep it to 2 classes only, no monk. It seems everyone splashes monk these days. I want something different.

3) My toon already has loads of heavy armor and great swords. That's the direction I want to take.

4) I already have a Paladin toon. This guy is my dedicated fighter. So fighter has to be the main class in the build.

5) I don't need a full breakdown of a class, just basic stats, what trees you'd hit, and why.

You have kind of hit the trifect of limitations No Monk, No Bladeforged, and Must use Greatswords aka no Dwarf. IMO the two good fighter builds coming out of U23 are 20 Fighter Bladeforged or 20 Fighter Dwarf with Throw Your Weight Around, neither of those meet your requirements nor do any of the Samurai style builds (Fighter/Monk/Paladin).

Given your restrictions 16/4 is as good as anything else. Only other recommendation would be the Kensei Warpriest type build you already dismissed.

bsquishwizzy
09-16-2014, 12:13 AM
You have kind of hit the trifect of limitations No Monk, No Bladeforged, and Must use Greatswords aka no Dwarf. IMO the two good fighter builds coming out of U23 are 20 Fighter Bladeforged or 20 Fighter Dwarf with Throw Your Weight Around, neither of those meet your requirements nor do any of the Samurai style builds (Fighter/Monk/Paladin).

Given your restrictions 16/4 is as good as anything else. Only other recommendation would be the Kensei Warpriest type build you already dismissed.

That's because I already went down the Fighter / Cleric road. Now I'm going somewhere else.

Secondly, I don't like playing iconics (don't like having to pay to play a toon), and everyone throws monk into everything. Which means it goes down the road of FotM.

I don't generally see many Fighter / pally builds. This may be because they are mediocre. It may be because people throw P2W Bladeforged and Monk into everything by default. So, exploring the possibilities based on the limitations I put in there.

If you don't like the limitations, then don't participate. Your reasons are duly noted.

bsquishwizzy
09-16-2014, 12:16 AM
No :)

Holy Sword is that good.

Going Pure gets you Holy Sword, Zeal, and Cure Serious Wounds. It's why pure 20 looks like the best bet.

And human/PDK for the extra feat and hjealing amp.

Ummm...what part of "I already got that" didn't you understand.

And yeah ON MY DEDICATED PALADIN Holy Sword is going to be great. But I don't want a dedicated Paladin, I want a fighter. Otherwise, I would have posted under the section that deals with Paladins...not the one that deals with Fighters.

Likewise, your attempted troll is ham-fisted at best.

mezzorco
09-16-2014, 02:35 AM
You said you wanted something different, right? What do you think of a 20 fighter?

You want to make use of your greatswords, but why limit yourself when you can do more than this? :P

With all those feats you can be both a THF dps and a S&B tank/dps.
When using greatswords, you'll have 19% doublestrike from kensei and all other kensei goodies, plus, now that stalwart stance no longer requires a shield, you'll gain great survivability from stalwart tree (and an extra 6 STR too!).
You could switch between greatsword and bastardsword+shield as you pleasure, only resetting enhancements from kensei/stalwart to stalwart/vanguard. Heck, you could even reset only kensei tree keeping stalwart as it is!

19 feats if human, could be as follows (just an example): toughness, power attack, cleave, great cleave, THF, ITHF, GTHF, bastard sword proficiency, improved shield bash, shield mastery, improved shield mastery, weapon focus, weapon specialization, greater weapon focus, greater weapon specialization, improved critical, power critical, stunning blow, improved sunder.

EllisDee37
09-16-2014, 03:20 AM
It's possible druid might offer something interesting. I don't know druids, really, but it might be worth looking into.

Another option would be a fighter/wizard. The eldritch knight tree strikes me as super crappy, but hey, the devs spent a lot of time on it so it can't suck nearly as bad as I think it does, right? Maybe warforged so you can self-repair, or human and run in wraith form. Mmmmmm, wraith form. (EDIT: Actually, wraith would be off the table since that requires 12 wizard levels.)

Fighter/paladin is actually a pretty standard s&b tank type of build. It should work fine as THF now, and likely even better when U23 goes live.

Regardless what direction you go in, my advice is to have at least 12 levels of fighter to get the full "fighter-y" experience with power surge.

EDIT: I see the previous post suggests pure fighter. That's a solid idea with U23 making pure heavy-armor fighters much more viable, but if you want self-healing outside of sf pots / heal scrolls then I'd try to find a good /8 level splash to pair with 12 fighter.

bsquishwizzy
09-16-2014, 10:22 AM
You said you wanted something different, right? What do you think of a 20 fighter?

You want to make use of your greatswords, but why limit yourself when you can do more than this? :P

With all those feats you can be both a THF dps and a S&B tank/dps.
When using greatswords, you'll have 19% doublestrike from kensei and all other kensei goodies, plus, now that stalwart stance no longer requires a shield, you'll gain great survivability from stalwart tree (and an extra 6 STR too!).
You could switch between greatsword and bastardsword+shield as you pleasure, only resetting enhancements from kensei/stalwart to stalwart/vanguard. Heck, you could even reset only kensei tree keeping stalwart as it is!

19 feats if human, could be as follows (just an example): toughness, power attack, cleave, great cleave, THF, ITHF, GTHF, bastard sword proficiency, improved shield bash, shield mastery, improved shield mastery, weapon focus, weapon specialization, greater weapon focus, greater weapon specialization, improved critical, power critical, stunning blow, improved sunder.


Already went to pure fighter route. The biggest issue is a) You really can't get enough UMD to make a difference with self-healing, and b) mot self-healing in this game as it relates to straight melee basically sucks. I *could* reply on stuff I get from daily dice rolls, but that would wear out quickly. So, my thought was to mix with divine somewhere. I went the 12 / 8 cleric split, and that was interesting. This life, I thought I'd try something else. Fighter / Paladin seemed good with the LoH.

bsquishwizzy
09-16-2014, 10:30 AM
It's possible druid might offer something interesting. I don't know druids, really, but it might be worth looking into.

You know, I didn’t even think about that. Thanks for the suggestion.


I Another option would be a fighter/wizard. The eldritch knight tree strikes me as super crappy, but hey, the devs spent a lot of time on it so it can't suck nearly as bad as I think it does, right? Maybe warforged so you can self-repair, or human and run in wraith form. Mmmmmm, wraith form. (EDIT: Actually, wraith would be off the table since that requires 12 wizard levels.)

I’ve got an EK. The biggest problem with that as a splash is the fact that is MUST be a wizard in order to get Wraith. So that kills pure melee. So, at the bare minimum, you are left with Vampire (because Zombie is out of the question) which is nice offensively, but man do those light spells frickin’ hurt.

And that’s the second problem with EK in this instance – I’m dipping into PM for the valuable stuff.

As for maybe WF, I thought about it. I’ve got way too many heavy armors suiting around to just let them collect dust. So I figured divine was probably a better route.



Regardless what direction you go in, my advice is to have at least 12 levels of fighter to get the full "fighter-y" experience with power surge.

I think I might go 14 for fighter. I went 12 last time. It seemed slightly underwhelming.

Bridge_Dweller
09-16-2014, 10:31 AM
Ummm...what part of "I already got that" didn't you understand.

And yeah ON MY DEDICATED PALADIN Holy Sword is going to be great. But I don't want a dedicated Paladin, I want a fighter. Otherwise, I would have posted under the section that deals with Paladins...not the one that deals with Fighters.

As holy sword is better than kensai come U23, there really isn't much point in intentionally building a fighter. Especially when going fleshy as you'll be so far behind the curve on survivability it's not funny.

If you insist, fighter 20 for capstone and all that good stuff, heavy armor for PRR/MRR, and caccoon/heal scrolls to keep yourself alive. With the new damage mitigation it should be viable. Not strong, but viable.

The various 12/6/2 "Cetus" builds are also strong. Stronger as Bladeforged but still viable as Human.




Likewise, your attempted troll is ham-fisted at best.

I would never troll. You must have me confused for somebody else.

Grailhawk
09-16-2014, 10:36 AM
That's because I already went down the Fighter / Cleric road. Now I'm going somewhere else.

Secondly, I don't like playing iconics (don't like having to pay to play a toon), and everyone throws monk into everything. Which means it goes down the road of FotM.

I don't generally see many Fighter / pally builds. This may be because they are mediocre. It may be because people throw P2W Bladeforged and Monk into everything by default. So, exploring the possibilities based on the limitations I put in there.

If you don't like the limitations, then don't participate. Your reasons are duly noted.

Was saying all that to get a feel for how much wiggle room there is, clearly none as you didn't even like the Dwarf idea, just go with the 16/4 It will meat your needs, I would go with Human for the healing amp and would probably twist cocoon while running in DC, will be a bit of a struggle to get the SP you need for that might think of going 12/8 Fighter Paladin for more SP lose of 2 feat probably wont be a big deal. Another Idea might be 12/4/4 Fighter/Paladin/Ranger to fit in the bow feat if you are interested probably gets you more SP as well if you don't dump WIS.

unbongwah
09-16-2014, 10:59 AM
It's possible druid might offer something interesting. I don't know druids, really, but it might be worth looking into.
OP mentioned having a lot of hvy armor; I'm guessing most or all of them are metal, which is a no-go with druids.

The eldritch knight tree strikes me as super crappy, but hey, the devs spent a lot of time on it so it can't suck nearly as bad as I think it does, right?
No, it is super crappy, at least DPS-wise; Perma-Tensers and some doublestrike bonuses are a poor ROI on the APs you have to spend to get them. I like some of the defensive benefits, though, esp. Arcane Barrier, which is basically a free Radiant Forcefield which procs up to once every 90 secs. I've been trying to work out a BF pal 15 / wiz 3 / ftr 2 build: focused on KotC, but with survivability perks from EK & Sacred D. That's not relevant to the OP's request, though. :)

Fighter / Paladin seemed good with the LoH.
LoH scales with # of pal lvs: (10 + pal lvl) * CHA mod. With only, say, 4 pally lvls, you will quickly find it doesn't provide enough self-healing in the long term; esp. since LoHs don't regen until you pick up Endless LoH from US. :(

But you've already nixed making a pure pally and a ftr / cleric since you've done both, so I'm struggling to come up with a better solution. Maybe something like ftr 12 / FvS 4 / pal 4? Keen Edge, Power Surge, Div Might, Ameliorating Strike, Div Grace.

Xylathor
09-16-2014, 01:23 PM
I've got a toon dedicated to being a fighter. I'm thinking going Fighter / pally, THF, heavy armor. My initial thought was going Fighter 16, with 4 levels of paladin mainly for the LoH, saves, and smites.

Comments / suggestions / recommendations?

A few conditions:

1) No Bladeforged. I don't want to play around with Iconics.

2) No monk. If the case can be made for Fighter / Cleric (which I've already done), Fighter FvS, or something else I have no problem with that. But keep it to 2 classes only, no monk. It seems everyone splashes monk these days. I want something different.

3) My toon already has loads of heavy armor and great swords. That's the direction I want to take.

4) I already have a Paladin toon. This guy is my dedicated fighter. So fighter has to be the main class in the build.

5) I don't need a full breakdown of a class, just basic stats, what trees you'd hit, and why.

My build is not to your spec, but maybe it will give you something to think about. Right now I have a Bladeforged 12 Fighter / 5 FvS / 3 Pally build. FvS Warpriest for the Religious Weapon Enhancement. Pally for Bladeforged weapon feats. Fighter for Kensei. I went with 3 pally because I didnt have a +1 Lesser Heart Wood or Id probably go 15 Fighter / 5 FvS. Great greatswords bonuses and great self healing from Bladeforged.

bsquishwizzy
09-17-2014, 01:00 PM
As holy sword is better than kensai come U23, there really isn't much point in intentionally building a fighter. Especially when going fleshy as you'll be so far behind the curve on survivability it's not funny.

Yeah, ummm, great and all. I already have a pure Paladin. You act like my toons have to compete with one another and that this is some sort of contest.

Yeah Holy Sword is nice. And I’ll have that on my pure Paladin. But I don’t want another pure paladin as I already have one in my stable of toons. So please, try to understand this very *basic* concept.


If you insist, fighter 20 for capstone and all that good stuff, heavy armor for PRR/MRR, and caccoon/heal scrolls to keep yourself alive. With the new damage mitigation it should be viable. Not strong, but viable.

Yes, because asking about a Fighter / Paladin build means I want a pure lvl 20 fighter.

Did you not get the main topic of this thread?

The various 12/6/2 "Cetus" builds are also strong. Stronger as Bladeforged but still viable as Human.[/QUOTE]
There are 2 Cetus builds that apply to a fighter that I know of. One of them includes monk (a disqualifier), and another includes bladeforged (yet another disqualifier). Are there any others that you know of that I haven’t specified?


I would never troll. You must have me confused for somebody else.

At this point, claiming that you were trolling would make this post less disturbing…

bsquishwizzy
09-17-2014, 01:03 PM
My build is not to your spec, but maybe it will give you something to think about. Right now I have a Bladeforged 12 Fighter / 5 FvS / 3 Pally build. FvS Warpriest for the Religious Weapon Enhancement. Pally for Bladeforged weapon feats. Fighter for Kensei. I went with 3 pally because I didnt have a +1 Lesser Heart Wood or Id probably go 15 Fighter / 5 FvS. Great greatswords bonuses and great self healing from Bladeforged.

On the Fighter / FvS build, what did you go with as your main stats, and what were your main trees for both classes?

unbongwah
09-17-2014, 01:48 PM
To flesh out my ftr 12 / FvS 4 / pal 4 idea:

Stats: STR-based, obviously, with good CHA for Div Might + Div Grace bonuses. Strong CON too, ofc, rest is up to you.
Feats: the usual suspects - Power Atk/Cleave/GC, IC:Slash, WF/WS/GWF:Slash, THF x3. So that's 10 feats out of 14 (15 if human). I'd add in some tactics feats (Imp Sunder, Stunning Blow); if you're doing epics I'd want Emp Heal for ED abilities (Rejuv Cocoon etc.).
Enhancements: at lease 31 APs for Keen Edge & Power Surge and 22 APs for Div Might & Ameliorating Strike, leaving 27 APs free. Right now I would put at least 11 APs into SD for defensive stance; after U23 goes live, at least 13 APs for +6 STR (up to 24 APs for +20% HPs & Swift Defense as well).


Should have good DPS, high saves, and some self-healing; U23 will improve the defensive benefits of hvy armor as well as Gtr Stance bonuses.