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MonadRebelion
08-05-2014, 05:19 PM
I was listening to an old episode of DDOcast, and someone mentioned being demigods as end game. I think this could be a really cool possibility for endgame. Here are some ideas about how I think it could work.

Run a series of quests for a specific character to become a demigod.
While the character who finishes the quests becomes a demigood, the PC, which continues to be played, becomes an avatar of the demigod.
Since the PC is just a the demigod's avatar, there is no need to alter the abilities of the PC from what they already are, except maybe give the avatar a title, (i.e. no new buffs, just status change).
A PC who becomes a demigod can collect followers.
Being the follower of a demigod functions similar to how guild membership functions.
There could be further quest lines an avatar could complete to gain a few minor buffs, akin to ship buffs, for their followers. (One buff per quest line.)

Further suggestions:

Quest the series required to run to become a demigod could vary according to the PC's alignment/religion.
Maybe only allow one character per account to achieve demigod status.
Maybe require maximum favor to open quest chain that leads to demigod status.
Maybe require some form of completionist to open the quest chain to become a demigod.
Maybe add a new crafting system focused around the demigod. Followers could collect materials which the avatar could craft to make alignment-based items of some kind.

Why I think something like this could work:

My major reason for thinking something like this could work is based on the fact that in pnp game play is so outrageous at levels beyond 20 that you have to start inventing crazy scenarios to DM for the players have things to do without ruining your campaign world. Typically, as a DM you try engineering quests that force players to retire characters and be happy about it. These crazy scenarios sometimes turn into quests for godhood (this is a pretty natural transition to make for the imagination since the characters are already in the realm of demigod power). A positive effect of this, I think, would be that people who really enjoy pnp dnd would allow the folks who make DDO a bit more slack about how Monty Hall the game is. Most pnp players realize the rule system breaks down in these levels so DMs are required to make a lot more off the cuff rulings if they want the game to continue. By adding demigod quests as endgame I think more people would be OK with the creative addition of nontraditional rules, since that's what was going on in pnp games crazy enough to allow demigods anyway. These demigod quests could be much more difficult and could offer loot that trivialized the non-endgame quests/loot as long as they were kept rigorously separated. In this way, perhaps pnp conservatives and the mmo grinders could both be satisfied.

The_Human_Cypher
08-06-2014, 01:00 AM
I suggested something along these lines in several previous threads. Level 30 players would be required to complete a capstone quest that is part of a solo quest chain to fully unlock all of their abilities. I also suggested making religion more important in the game and granting more feats and abilities related to specific deities. Perhaps the demigod idea can be developed along with sentient weapons when this game feature is released in 2015.

MonadRebelion
08-06-2014, 01:24 PM
I suggested something along these lines in several previous threads. Level 30 players would be required to complete a capstone quest that is part of a solo quest chain to fully unlock all of their abilities. I also suggested making religion more important in the game and granting more feats and abilities related to specific deities. Perhaps the demigod idea can be developed along with sentient weapons when this game feature is released in 2015.

I don't know what the details of how you thought it should be implemented, but I'd only be in favor of it if was implemented in a way similar to my suggestion. I think the keys to making it work are (1) separate endgame and the powers of endgame characters from the rest of the world, and (2) allow endgame characters to play the game under a supplemental set of rules for since the dnd isn't designed for persistent game play after level 20. If it was implemented in such a way that endgame characters get powers that start effecting the way people level, we'd just end up further trivializing most of the game's content.

droid327
08-06-2014, 11:18 PM
What you're describing is essentially just Epic II. A separate gameplay mechanic just for players who "finished" the rest of the game, with greatly increased rewards, and a firewall between that and "normal" gameplay. Epic used to be one single standalone mode that played like "super heroic", but then eventually it fleshed out to just "part two" of the grind to endgame.

What would the future be for demigod characters? Eventually people would start clamoring to raise the demigod level cap, to add more demigod content, better demigod loot, to introduce Demigod TR and Demigod PLs...then you're back exactly where we are today, with someone proposing a "Full God" mode for those who maxed out their demigods already :)

Seikojin
08-06-2014, 11:49 PM
With level 30 being the end, they need to make class capstone feats and destiny capstone feats. You get the class one at 30 and the destiny at 29. The class one is based on the classes you have; won't matter the level. There would be X number of them; based off the enhancement trees for the class. So you would have a few playstyles to enhance. It would be nice if they were lvl 20 of one class required, however I think they could use this as a way to make capstones for flavor builds (twf ranger/cleric/monk 12/6/2 exploiter feat for example), as well as pure capstone feats.

The destiny ones are obvious since the destinies have specific trademarks for their role.

MonadRebelion
08-07-2014, 04:19 PM
What you're describing is essentially just Epic II. A separate gameplay mechanic just for players who "finished" the rest of the game, with greatly increased rewards, and a firewall between that and "normal" gameplay. Epic used to be one single standalone mode that played like "super heroic", but then eventually it fleshed out to just "part two" of the grind to endgame.

What would the future be for demigod characters? Eventually people would start clamoring to raise the demigod level cap, to add more demigod content, better demigod loot, to introduce Demigod TR and Demigod PLs...then you're back exactly where we are today, with someone proposing a "Full God" mode for those who maxed out their demigods already :)

The rewards ideally wouldn't be greatly increased. For the most part these quests should be played for the sake of challenge. Most of the rewards in my view should be conveniences, little account boons, status/renown type rewards. Since there are a lot of people who think better gear is what is amazing, I suppose it might be necessary to add something. So, if items were added they should just barely be more powerful than items you get from epics and they should be very narrow in what they a useful for. This way you could encourage some people to run these quests without producing a bunch of new ridiculously powerful new builds. Thus, the challenge of demigod quests would be preserved. Also, the benefits you get from running these quests should add up similar to the way favor does for normal quests. I don't see why there should be some kind of massive benefit for grinding these quests. The quests should be hard enough that you don't want to grind them. Adding mechanics that require grinding these quests would just make them tedious. These quests should not prepare characters for some newer more difficult content. (You seem to think this is what they function.) When people are done running these quests and developers decide to add more of these quests, more quests with roughly the same level of difficulty are added.

Oberon_Shrader
08-09-2014, 06:06 AM
With level 30 being the end, they need to make class capstone feats and destiny capstone feats. You get the class one at 30 and the destiny at 29. The class one is based on the classes you have; won't matter the level. There would be X number of them; based off the enhancement trees for the class. So you would have a few playstyles to enhance. It would be nice if they were lvl 20 of one class required, however I think they could use this as a way to make capstones for flavor builds (twf ranger/cleric/monk 12/6/2 exploiter feat for example), as well as pure capstone feats.

The destiny ones are obvious since the destinies have specific trademarks for their role.

Great suggestion! I have been wondering what kind of boost characters might get when the level 30 final cap comes around. Great idea!

Perhaps make only feats connected to your dominant class available (i.e., the class that gives you your in-party icon)? This might prevent people from taking advantage of a 2 level splash and getting some ridiculous synergy from it.